General Cycling Discussion - St. Louis-area cyclist assaulted by student in school bus

-- found this on the Missouri BikePed website--
http://mobikefed.org/news.html


St. Louis-area cyclist assaulted by student in school bus
Wednesday, February 12, 2003

A bicyclist was assaulted yesterday by a St. Louis public schools student who leaned from a school bus window and struck the cyclist with a broom handle. The assault was accompanied by a roar of laughter from students in the bus.

St. Louis police have issued a complaint number for assault in the third degree. The police indicated that officers assigned to the St. Louis public schools will work to identify the students involved.

The attack is reminiscent of a series of recent attacks in northern Colorado, in which teenagers drove by cyclists and struck them with a baseball bat. The teenagers involved in that incident have been apprehended and charged with a variety of crimes, included felony assault.

That link has some intersting stories. Here's another one:
One of my brothers friends was riding home from school on a Friday night (unfortunately wearing headphones as well), and was hit bit a pickup that ran a red light. Incredibly, he managed to hold on to the grill and tried for a distance to get the driver's attention by yelling and trying to climb onto the hood. He eventually managed to fall off to the side, narrowly missing the tires. Several witnesses saw him get hit, so that spot is known. He was A MILE AND A HALF away. Fortunately, he recovered fully, but the worthless drunk who hit him was never apprehended.
Yes, it really was 1.5 miles that he was dragged by the truck. Confirmed by witnesses and is in the police report.

:mad: This is very,very sick,Just one more thing to look out for on the road.(bicycle boxing)It sounds like that old one from the 80's mail box baseball.But harmless to human life.I hope they prosecute to the fullest.

Yet another reason why some people should not be allowed to breed. Personally I hope they throw the punk kid in prison, and sack the bus driver for (apparently) doing nothing about it.

I was assaulted once by a pedestrian while on the bike. Worst bike accident to date -- went to the hospital. Have a scar and a mustache to cover it now. Never caught perp.

In my heart, I forgave him. But listen: assault someone on a bike or on foot, it's all the same. Assault and battery, make no mistake, bro.

It's difficult to believe that people do that kind of ****, children or not. But they do. Obviously, that kid doesn't have a very strong sense of empathy. I feel pity for that loser kid.

I have had kids hang from the bus windows and holler about what kinds of recreational sex they'd like to try with me...unfortunately one day this is gonna happen when I'm already in a foul humor and there will surely be some surprised kids and one driver when I get on board at the next stop.
Man some of the stuff kids are getting away with just pi$$es me off. If I had said ANYTHING like that to a stranger when I was a kid, my parents would have slapped the teeth out of my head.

Originally posted by psycholist
If I had said ANYTHING like that to a stranger when I was a kid, my parents would have slapped the teeth out of my head.

Same here and my boys know the same would happen to them :eek:

If it were my kid, I would probably beat the hell out of him with a belt.

You guys are soft.

Why I'd disembowel my child if he did that, because if life has shown me anything, violence is the best way to teach your children appropriate behavior :rolleyes:

My parents and grand parents and aunties had no problem giving me a whacking when I needed it, with a hand or belt. It was never a beating, just one sharp hard slap across the bum. I learnt pretty quick, it hasn't turned me into some violent homicidal maniac either. Discipline is what is missing in most children's lives these days. Hit your kid today and you could end up in jail.

I have seen kids skate boarding and doing tricks on the state war memorial. In days gone by an adult would grab these kids and tell them to learn respect. Try that today and the little brats will have you arrested and sue you. Ironically there is a brand new skate park 1/2 a mile down the road. Why aren't they riding there? because it is legal, that's why.

Luckily I don't have any kids, if they were my kids skateboarding on the memorial......

sorry for the thread drift.

CHEERS.

Mark

Originally posted by Dutchy
I have seen kids skate boarding and doing tricks on the state war memorial. In days gone by an adult would grab these kids and tell them to learn respect. Try that today and the little brats will have you arrested and sue you...

Yes, and any adult who assaults any other human being (child or adult) like that should be arrested. What they're doing is wrong. But you don't have the right to physically assault someone when your or someone else's immediate physical safety isn't in danger.

If you want play cop, become a cop. But you don't teach 'respect' by offensively assaulting someone else's body like that.

Originally posted by jatkins679
Yes, and any adult who assaults any other human being (child or adult) like that should be arrested. What they're doing is wrong. But you don't have the right to physically assault someone when your or someone else's immediate physical safety isn't in danger.

If you want play cop, become a cop. But you don't teach 'respect' by offensively assaulting someone else's body like that.

Ditto.

Hmmm... Interesting subject drift.

Compare this -

My parents and grand parents and aunties had no problem giving me a whacking when I needed it, with a hand or belt. It was never a beating, just one sharp hard slap across the bum. I learnt pretty quick, it hasn't turned me into some violent homicidal maniac either. Discipline is what is missing in most children's lives these days. Hit your kid today and you could end up in jail...
To this -

Yes, and any adult who assaults any other human being (child or adult) like that should be arrested. What they're doing is wrong. But you don't have the right to physically assault someone when your or someone else's immediate physical safety isn't in danger...
I think the former approach (that's not disembowelment or slapping teeth out) is much more beneficial to individuals and society than the latter.

The latter approach basically teaches you to respect only The State, but not people. The latter approach is why there are now so many people with no sense of consideration for other people. It has spawned a self-centered society that encourages individuals to thumb their nose at everybody else and say "catch me if you can".
The former approach teaches people to be more considerate of... people. The parent/grandparent/aunt earned respect by (among other things) being fair and appropriate with a wayward kid, not by going too easy or to hard in the discipline department.

Our prisons are filled with men who were not disciplined as children and hence never learned respect for themselves or other people. The only discipline they ever had was from adults that did basically nothing (because spanking will turn them into criminals!) or from adults who went ballistic and beat/abused their kids with rage, but no real sense of purpose (discipline without discipline).

Society has become way too paranoid about child abuse and basically outlawed any physical form of discipline. I hope to see the discipline pendlum swing back towards the center.

greg360...perfectly stated.

By the way, "slapping out teeth" is just a colloquialism folks...maybe to be more PC I should have said "jerked a knot in my tail, tanned my hide" , etc., but I hate PC so screw it.

For the record, my mother never EVER slapped me or my sister. When we pushed things too far we got our butts blistered and usually the lesson did not have to be repeated. I do not recall getting a single spanking that I didn't have coming to me. Hmmmmm. Must be my memory repression mechanism kicking in from all that emotional scarring.


I do not have children but if and when I ever do, they will get the same love and discipline that I had at their age.

Originally posted by cycletourist
-- found this on the Missouri BikePed website--
http://mobikefed.org/news.html


St. Louis-area cyclist assaulted by student in school bus
Wednesday, February 12, 2003

A bicyclist was assaulted yesterday by a St. Louis public schools student who leaned from a school bus window and struck the cyclist with a broom handle. The assault was accompanied by a roar of laughter from students in the bus.

St. Louis police have issued a complaint number for assault in the third degree. The police indicated that officers assigned to the St. Louis public schools will work to identify the students involved.

The attack is reminiscent of a series of recent attacks in northern Colorado, in which teenagers drove by cyclists and struck them with a baseball bat. The teenagers involved in that incident have been apprehended and charged with a variety of crimes, included felony assault.

I'm not surprised, student's on school buses are the biggest idiot's on the road, they are really brave when the bus is moving, they give people the finger, yell and scream, and basically harass people. If this ever happened to me,I would follow the bus, and then when the bus stopped to let some students out, and the door opened, I would climb on the bus, and find out who did what, I would get names, the school bus drivers, the kids, and I would get some action.

Originally posted by Crazy Cyclist
I'm not surprised, student's on school buses are the biggest idiot's on the road, they are really brave when the bus is moving, they give people the finger, yell and scream, and basically harass people. If this ever happened to me,I would follow the bus, and then when the bus stopped to let some students out, and the door opened, I would climb on the bus, and find out who did what, I would get names, the school bus drivers, the kids, and I would get some action.
You don't even have to do that. Just make a note of the school district painted on the side and get the bus number - school busses almost always have a big number painted on them. The school will know who was driving and who typically rides the bus.

John

Originally posted by HalfHearted
You don't even have to do that. Just make a note of the school district painted on the side and get the bus number - school busses almost always have a big number painted on them. The school will know who was driving and who typically rides the bus.

John

You got that right. If you climb on a school bus uninvited nowadays, you'll find yourself in the "Big House"! :eek: And the brat wins again! :mad:

Yep, get the bus number. The schools are usually pretty serious about this kind of thing. I am pretty sure that if you try to climb onto the bus the driver will take it as an act of aggression towards the kids and who knows what will happen.

This incident reminds me of: 1) a car "dooring" of a female triathlete in La Jolla (broken pelvis, etc.); and 2) a couple of Silicon Valley disk jockeys who jokingly advocated dooring of bicyclists and motorcyclists. Whatever happened to personal responsibility and mutual respect/concern for others?

By the way, as the father of two relatively trouble-free teenage sons (13 and 18), I do not believe that any particular parenting style can be proven to yield "bad" or "good" results -- there are too many individual variables. A parent needs to set a positive example in his/her own life, to establish high-but-realistic expectations, and, within reason, to avoid sheltering the child from the natural adverse consequences of his/her misdeeds. Corporal punishment is not an essential part of parenting, and if it is used, it must be deployed very responsibly and calmly, never abusively.

If you want play cop, become a cop. But you don't teach 'respect' by offensively assaulting someone else's body like that.

I never said that these kids should be assaulted. What I said was "In days gone by an adult would grab these kids and tell them to learn respect."

I said tell them to learn respect ie. Go and skate somewhere else, you do realise this is a war memorial. NOT teach them respect by assaulting them.

CHEERS.

Mark

Originally posted by Dutchy
I never said that these kids should be assaulted. What I said was "In days gone by an adult would grab these kids and tell them to learn respect."



So '(grabbing)' someone isn't assaulting them in this sort of situation. OK, whatever.......

Look, getting physical with someone when your or someone else's immediate physical safety isn't being threatened is assault, period. And you don't teach respect for law when you break the law yourself. The ends don't justify the means.

Get a life jatkins679 I'm only 26 and if I had pulled something that stupid and disrespectful I damn sure would have been tossed over my father's knee. These days thanks to ol' Doc Spock and an army of spastic social workers a simple slap on the hand is child abuse. Child abuse is a terrible thing. However, taking away a parents duty and obligation to discipline their child is no less evil.

I wasn't a 'bad' kid, I was a typical kid...and when I acted up it usually got me a spanking. For the most part discipline was doled out by mom, but if things were really over the top then the deed fell to my dad, which was bad because he had BIG HANDS.

Joking aside, what was worse to me than any physical contact (or 'abuse' as some of you seem insistent on calling it) was the shame that I felt when I REALIZED I HAD DISAPPOINTED MY PARENTS. Even as a kid I knew what expectations they had for me AND my behavior and I respected that. In some cases seeing their sad faces was much worse than the spanking that followed.
This is what seems to be missing these days.



My god this discussion is making me feel so OLD...

ai yi yi!!!! I think we need to stay off the topic of discipline/child abuse.

A few weeks ago, I was on my way to school, and I was passing by a bus stop where there was a little kid, he couldn't have been older than 6, sitting around waiting for his parents(I assume). When he saw me coming, he picked up this big stick ran out into the middle of road, right into my path, and then flung the freakin stick at me!!!! Lucky for me, he wasn't really strong enough to throw the stick hard or accurately and I was able to dodge. I proceeded to ask the kid where he lived, well, he didn't know. So I asked him where his mom was...he didn't know. I immediately realised he was a lying butthead and I wasn't going to get anywhere with him. So just let him know how bad he could have hurt me, and then left.

What gets me is, what made him think of throwing a stick at me?? If I had been in a car or walking he probably wouldn't have thrown anything. What inside his head told him, "hey look, a dude on a bike, throw a stick at him!!"

Originally posted by Raiyn
Get a life jatkins679 I'm only 26 and if I had pulled something that stupid and disrespectful I damn sure would have been tossed over my father's knee. These days thanks to ol' Doc Spock and an army of spastic social workers a simple slap on the hand is child abuse. Child abuse is a terrible thing. However, taking away a parents duty and obligation to discipline their child is no less evil.

Wow, you need to take a chill. You're babbling about people taking away a parent's right to discipline a child. I never touched upon anything like that. I'm talking about assaulting a stranger.

I for one can personally attest to the fact that I would have very likely been in jail had it not been for the appropriate use of corporal punishment on the part of my parents. I do NOT advocate slapping, beating, punching, kicking, or otherwise abusing one's children, but a spanking applied to the buttocks is an effective deterent to undesireable behavior. Ironically, I have never had the need to punish my own daughter in this fashion, as a harsh look is usually all thats required. Fortunately, she seems not to have inherited my rebellious streak.

Yup, I have NEVER been assaulted by an adult.

I have NEVER been assaulted by a kid when a pedestrian either.

But when cycling kids have thrown rocks, tennis balls, and snowballs, screamed at me, told me they were gonna kill me, ran out in front of me, etc.

I have NEVER assualted another person for no reason, but when I get assaulted by a youngin' I'd personally like to beat it to within an inch of it's life.

Please don't give me the crap about they are young and don't understand, they FULLY understand what they're doing. What if I were to tell you that my mother, who is a grade 4 teacher has seen kids become sexually aroused when they beat on another kid? Or those that have spit on her, kick her, punched her, thrown feces at her (which they removed from they're own butts) and other stuff too horriffic to name. This by the way is not an American school but a eastern Canadian.

When cycling I watch out for the teenagers in the cars and the younger kids on the side of the road. I steer clear, chances are I will get something tossed at me. Fortunatly I can restarin myself from grabbin the little s*@t because I'd be the one tossed in jail which will seriously cut into my cycling time.

Digger