A mixte with the sloping toptube, like
http://derbyking.com/Detail/?n=71
?
Gotta love the ride with cromo forks.
Yes - same design, but lower model so no cromo. :(


I agree, no reviews of the new Cadenza, or of the Lockjaw hinge. The new Cadenza is tempting (as in move all the parts on the M.K'denza to the new frame) .... but in each rehash of the an '07 Cadenza scenario, I quickly come to the fact that after folding/unfolding several times a day in mixed mode Tokyo, I would soon be cursing the hex key.
I definitely agree with you in regards to mixed-mode commuting! The '07 does not seem to be the bike to take if you want a quick-fold. But if you're not in a rush, it looks like a great ride, pending good lockjaw reviews.

I just got a Curve SL yesterday. Going out for a spin soon.

The SA 5 speed hub shifts fine - not quite as silky smooth as a Nexus, but far better to deal with than a derailleur, IMO. It helps to briefly pause your pedalling when shifting but as with any hub, shifting while stopped is easy. The gearing is plenty high enough for me. 1st gear is great for riding on sidewalk with pedestrians so I can keep spinning while going slow. I could imagine it being a bit tough going up a steep hill, but a steady climb at moderate grade is fine. For speed, 5th is plenty high - even 4 seems faster than I'm usually going to need. And the increments between are not too large.

The handling is way better than I expected. The Big Apple tires really do provide significant suspension. The bumps in the road have felt about the same to me as on a full size bike. I feel surprisingly little twitchyness. I love the nimbleness of it.

More to come....

Excellent! Looking forward to your updates.. After a long hassle with my "local" dahon dealer (finally had to order it online). My SL will finally be here on the 9th. Can't wait.

Excellent! Looking forward to your updates.. After a long hassle with my "local" dahon dealer (finally had to order it online). My SL will finally be here on the 9th. Can't wait. Cool. Good to communicate with someone else whose getting the same.

Before adding to my descriptions of the Curve SL, I will provide some contextual information so that the readers of this forum may better understand the circumstances in which I am riding it.

My Situation:
I live 1 block from an elevated subway in western Queens which plops me in Midtown Manhattan in about 15 minutes. I live on a fourth floor walk up, so I have to carry the bike down 4 flights, then walk a block, and then walk up about 4 flights to get to the train platform. I intend to use my Curve SL largely as a compliment to the subway. The fold makes the bike easy to take on the subway, and the subway makes it easy to rapidly get to far flung destinations. Thereby teleported sort of speak, I can then use my folder to scope out local neighborhoods in Manhattan and the other boroughs.

My Riding Style/Philosophy:
I envy the situation bikers have in places like Amsterdam and Copenhagen. I don't wear a helmet to go out for a walk, and I should'nt have to wear one to ride a bike either. IMO, American bicyclists are completely bitc*-slapped by the dashboard perspective. If people want to ride in the street, they are forced to ride much faster than is natural for a bike, to adapt to the start/stop pattern of fossil fueled traffic marching to the beat of the traffic signals. To do this, bicyclists here dress in all kinds of ridiculous lycra spandex outfits, with high performance tennis shoes, toe clips, and alien-shaped helmets hunched over their handlebars as they neuter themselves (only the guys) on their razor thin saddles just to be speedy and aerodynamic enough to avoid being run over by the indignation of car culture. In doing all these things for the sake of speed, IMO, too much of the joy of biking is sacrificed. What good is speed if it comes at the price of continuous paranoia over a potentially life threatening collision? And getting doored is only a matter of time if you think you can cruise in the bike lanes.

Don't get me wrong though - I am generally on the side of anyone who rides a bike rather than a car, regardless of whether they wear a helmet or not. To each his/her own. I am merely explaining the philosophy that underlies my riding style. If someone riding in the street sees me riding on the sidewalk, they might think, "What a wimp". While I see them in the street, I'm inclined to think, "He's putting an awful lot of trust in cars considering they can run you over and it's treated like a speeding ticket".

Hidden Strengths of 16" Wheels in a Big City:
As long as car culture runs roughshod over pedestrians and bikers (even in this - the greatest single transit hub in the Western Hemisphere), I find my 16" wheel folder to offer a good means of adaptation. While it easily goes fast enough to ride on most streets, I'd rather stay on the sidewalk 90% of the time. This is a hidden advantage of the small wheel. The 16" wheels of a folder are far less intimidating to pedestrians than the 26-27" wheels of a full size bike. Pedestrians are therefore, much more tolerant of folders and willing to share the sidewalk, with an implicit understanding that the biker is far less dangerous to them than cars would be to the biker in the street. This I find to be the case, as long as I am willing to slow my speed in direct proportion with increasing densities of pedestrians.

The only caveat I would add to my current preference for sidewalk riding is that in a lot of American cities, many neighborhoods are teeming with thugs who can easily jack you if you ride on the sidewalk. I only moved to NYC this year so I have a lot to learn, but compared to Baltimore, it is a great deal safer.

Since I live close to the subway, there's no way to beat it for year round efficiency and convenience at only $76/month 24/7. So I don't need my folder for commuting to work. Having said this, I could try riding to work in comfy clothes and then change there to my dress clothes. But this is only practical when the weather is nice and even then, it would take about the same time. The fuss of dealing with rain, cold and heat would more than cancel out the economic benefits.

Getting back to the Curve SL:

Fit:
FYI - I'm just under 6' tall, and weigh 165 lbs. I'd say Dahon's recommended max height of 6'2" is pretty on. The bike feels plenty big enough for me. The reach is long enough that I had to move the saddle forward an inch. The resulting position is more upright than hunched over which is how I like it. Raising the saddle to allow near full leg extension, I have it extended such that it is about 1-2 inches below my handlebars. At this height there is some flex in the stem but not an undue amount. The flex is even welcome as it provides a degree of suspension. If I got tired from hours of riding I could still raise the handlebars an inch or two as long as I rode less aggressively.

Handling:
What I notice about the 16" wheels that's new to me is that when the back wheel rides over a significant sized rock, the wheel tends to move to the side which results in a very slight sensation of being thrown from the bike. But if your riding on paved surfaces such is pretty unlikely even at high speeds.

Last night I found a big parking lot and used the straightaways to get up to maximum flat ground speed in 5th gear and the result was quite fast without feeling overly worried about instability or loss of control.

Frame Stiffness:
The frame feels quite sturdy to me; since the main tube is in a curved I-beam shape, the maximum stresses hit in the plane in which the tube shape is strongest. I imagine this is better than the small crosspiece used on the Presto Lite and Piccolo models.

Gearing:
The Sturmey Archer 5 speed hub is a good balance between weight and range. Unless you live in a very hilly city such as San Francisco or Pittsburgh, the gearing should be plenty wide. You don't want to be too obsessed with always maintaining maximum effeciency in your candence. Sometimes I might find myself still in low gear while going down hill or on a long straightaway. But not to worry. The 8-speed nexus would be nice, but the weight differential above the 5 speed is not worth it, for all but the hilliest of cities IMO. You could also easily get a larger chainring instead, if you need more granny gears. If you need more speed, you might as well get a full size bike, but the Curve SL goes pleeeenty fast for my taste.

Breaking:
Extremely efficient.

The Fold:
The folding process is quite easy and takes only a few times to master. The ingenious round magnets that hold it together remind me of the knobs that protrude from Frankenstein's neck. Unfolding takes a bit more time only because you have to dial in the precise height for the seatpost and height and alignment for the handlebars. I have yet to use tick marks because I'm still learning where I like things set and these preferences may even change during the course of a long ride.

Weight:
The paradox of folding bicycles is that while they weigh somewhat less than full size bikes, and get substantially more compact, their folded size generally results in a package that has to be carried in one hand rather than two as with a full size bike. The folded size is too awkward to carry with both arms, whereas a full size bike has to be carried with two arms (it's elongated shape makes this less awkward) to prevent the front wheel from twisting akimbo. But when brought on a subway, commuter train or bus, there is no doubt that the full size bike is rather unwelcome compared to a 16" folder, unless there are few passengers - which is seldom the case in NYC. People react quite differently to a parent with a baby stroller than a person with a full size bike.

So even though I outweigh the bike by over seven times, and am of medium build, it is still not something I want to carry in one arm for more than a couple blocks. This suggests to me that the 20" folders or any folder for that matter weighing 25lbs+ is really more ideal for those who want to haul it in their car somewhere. Even if you've got a 10 mile ride just to get to your local commuter train station, dragging a 30lb lb folder on and off the train would not be fun on a daily basis.

Fenders and a rear rack would add unneccessary weight for my purposes. Once I find the right wrench, I will detach the kickstand, which should significantly lighten the weight of the bike when I carry it folded up.

Aesthetics:
The frame shape is rather eye pleasing. I think the one straight tube shape of many other Dahon folders is kind of awkward looking as though they were constructed from disparate parts with form as an afterthought. By contrast, the basic curved shape which Dahon is using on the MU and Curve models looks as though the design was conceived as an integrated whole from the start. The blue gray color appears sleek without drawing unwanted attention.

One rides the Curve SL with the feeling that the design is in a new evolutionary direction that is more utilitarian than the road, mountain and track bikes of recent decades, but without ignoring the technological advances that have come since the days of 3 speed steel beach cruisers that weigh a ton. One rides it not as a kid doing stunts on a bmx, nor a young messenger making deliveries on a fixed wheel, nor an old lady on a dutch step-thru with flowers in a front basket, nor a spandex speed freak on a 27-speed track bike thin as a pancake. Rather, one rides it with a feeling that it expresses something new in the world about which no standard stereotype seems apropos for someone who would ride such a bike.

Weaknesses thus far:
_The quick release for the telescoping part of the stem tends to fold down in such a way that it scrapes the back part of the frame a little.
_The detachable pedals require long fingernails to easily remove the yellows rings that will allow you to remove the pedals. Folding pedals might be more practical for quick compression on public transit.
_The Sturmey Archer 5-speed hub experiences some crunchyness when you shift down to 1st gear about 1/3 of the time - but this is only briefly, and then it quickly settles down. I still use this gear quite a lot especially for sidewalk riding with lots of pedestrians. Not a big deal at all.

Overall, very pleased so far.

Tomorrow, I plan to fold it and take it on the subway - getting off at various areas to ride around Manhattan for the first time. I should have some more obvservations to share after that.

Glad you're enjoying your Curve SL.

In regards to height, I'm 6'1" with longish legs, and when I test-rode the Curve D3, the seat wouldn't go high enough for the leg extension I'm used to (slightly bent knee). Also, the handlebars wouldn't go high enough for the upright commuting position I wanted. The bike rode well, and felt both solid and fun at the same time. But it would have required some mods (e.g. a Butt Buddy or telescoping seatpost, etc.) to make it fit me properly.

When I tried the 20" Dahons, I found that they fit me much better. And their fold wasn't much bigger, so I eventually went for the Mu P8, which is the Curve's big brother frame-wise.

BTW, I also tried a bunch of other 16" folders, including the Brompton, and they all felt just too small for me. The Birdy was the only sub-20" folder that fit, but it was way more bike than I needed. At least, that's what I kept telling myself.

For the carrying bits, just alternate hands and think of it as your upper-body workout each day. ;)

. . .

Breaking:
Extremely efficient.

. . .

Must suppress urge to make sarcastic comment. :D

Seriously, glad to read a review of the 5 speed version. I've got the 3 speed, and like it a lot, the braking, among other things, is quite efficient. Do let us know, though, how you get on with riding on sidewalks in New York. My understanding has been that the police are quite serious about keeping bikes off the sidewalks and on the streets. I don't live there, though, and visit rarely.

The performance losses come from the internal hub. There is only 1 efficient gear (2nd) in a three speed hub and you'll feel a huge performance loss with 3rd gear.
Actually, Frank Berto and Dr. Chester Kyle, surely two of America's foremost authorities on bicycle gearing, tested a number of drivetrains for efficiency and found broken-in, oil-lubricated Sturmey and SRAM 3-speed hubs compared favorable with an upmarket Shimano derailleur drivetrain.

Sturmey SRF3 hubs (a.k.a. S30 a.k.a. AW-NIG) with fittings and shifters are available in the USA for under $55USD+shipping. The 8-speed with shifter is available for under $125USD+shipping.

Best,
TCS

TCS, do you know the ETA for the iMotion-9 in the US?

Glad you're enjoying your Curve SL.

In regards to height, I'm 6'1" with longish legs, and when I test-rode the Curve D3, the seat wouldn't go high enough for the leg extension I'm used to (slightly bent knee). Also, the handlebars wouldn't go high enough for the upright commuting position I wanted. The bike rode well, and felt both solid and fun at the same time. But it would have required some mods (e.g. a Butt Buddy or telescoping seatpost, etc.) to make it fit me properly.

When I tried the 20" Dahons, I found that they fit me much better. And their fold wasn't much bigger, so I eventually went for the Mu P8, which is the Curve's big brother frame-wise.

BTW, I also tried a bunch of other 16" folders, including the Brompton, and they all felt just too small for me. The Birdy was the only sub-20" folder that fit, but it was way more bike than I needed. At least, that's what I kept telling myself..... ;)
Fit is somewhat subjective. It must be my neanderthal proportions (short extremities/long torso) that allow me to fit on the 16" Curve.
My understanding has been that the police are quite serious about keeping bikes off the sidewalks and on the streets. I don't live there, though, and visit rarely.
I guess I will see. I'll start by sticking to the waterfront greenway path that circumnavigates much of Manhattan. I certainly won't attempt sidewalk riding on the major cross-streets and avenues. I'm hoping I can get away with it though on the lesser streets.

When after a few hours of riding I need to relieve myself, my hope is that I can roll to the nearest McDonalds, fold up, walk in carrying the bike, and use the facilities as if I'm going to buy an extra value meal afterwards. Then flush, split, unfold and roll on. I'll stick to the outskirts of the island at first, and then as I grow less timid, I'll try penetrating the more congested innards. After a while, I'll fold up again, hop on the subway and take it to another neighborhood, get out, unfold and explore some more.

Didn't get to it today, but I should by this weekend. In Queens though, I can already tell that sidewalk riding is very doable on a 16" folder.

TCS, do you know the ETA for the iMotion-9 in the US?

No, darn it. :) SRAM said they could build ~200,000 iM9s per year, and it seems all of the first year's production was absorbed in the EU. On paper this hub looks great, and I'm hoping the carbon shell no brake version isn't silly expensive.

Best,
TCS

I agree, esp. about the CF version knocking some mass off the quoted 2.4 kg for the coaster brake version.

Somone thought it might be somewhere around $400? Cheapest I've found it over here is the equivalent of $980. Ouch!

Somone thought it might be somewhere around $400?
If it works well, it'd be reasonable to price the iM9 at some upcharge over the Nexus 8/Alfine because of the extra gear, greater over-all range and much more even steps. It's made in one of the most expensive manufacturing locations on the planet, though, and there's a posibility it will not be cost competitive in N.A.

Best,
TCS

Well I got my Curve yesterday. So far pretty happy. Already had my first flat.

PRESTA VALVES !, these are going to be tough to find. Where do I get 16 inch presta valve tubes that doesn't charge $9 for shipping??

Any tips would be great.

A more detailed review to follow.

I ordered a Curve D3 today, so I'll be joining you all later this week. Next weekend, I'll probably try sidewalk riding in Chicago. I don't care what they say, the street is no place for bicycles, unless there is a dedicated (and heavily enforced!) bike lane. Ever been to Madison, WI? It is bloody brilliant.

I also ride a 150 mph 1300cc motorcycle, and a 125cc 60 mph scooter. I feel MUCH safer on them than I do on a bike in the street with these !#$%^ cagers yacking on their cell phones and just generally being inattentive. Then, there are the guys (they're always male) who try to show you how 'in control' they are of their cars by passing me as closely as possible without actually clipping me. If I get ticketed for sidewalk riding, I'll go to court & fight like a cornered tiger.

Chicagoans are typically more friendly than New Yorkers, so I don't expect much flak, since I'll mostly be there on weekends when there isn't as much sidewalk traffic. (except in heavy shopping zones)

PRESTA VALVES !, these are going to be tough to find. Where do I get 16 inch presta valve tubes that doesn't charge $9 for shipping??
That's a complete joke on Dahon's part, esp. when Schraeder valves are much more prevalent.

Maybe if you contact Thor, he'll give you some sort of BF discount if he sells them; Gaerlan is also pretty reasonable when it comes to shipping. Otherwise it seems you may need to order more bike parts to make that shipping charge count! :D

Well I got my Curve yesterday. So far pretty happy. Already had my first flat.

PRESTA VALVES !, these are going to be tough to find. Where do I get 16 inch presta valve tubes that doesn't charge $9 for shipping??

Any tips would be great.

A more detailed review to follow.
Take it to the LBS, ask them to drill the valve hole to Schraeder. Piece of cake. To use Presta, use an adapter.

Well I got my Curve yesterday. So far pretty happy. Already had my first flat.

PRESTA VALVES !, these are going to be tough to find. Where do I get 16 inch presta valve tubes that doesn't charge $9 for shipping??...
Bummer. Maybe you hit some glass. I think the bottle deposit states of CA, CT, DE, HI, IA, ME, MA, MI, NY, OR, and VT are inherently far more kind to bike tires. Many a bum can feed themselves on the money they earn performing the useful public service of bottle recycling.

Hope you get rolling again soon.

I ordered a Curve D3 today, so I'll be joining you all later this week. Next weekend, I'll probably try sidewalk riding in Chicago. I don't care what they say, the street is no place for bicycles, unless there is a dedicated (and heavily enforced!) bike lane. Ever been to Madison, WI? It is bloody brilliant.

I also ride a 150 mph 1300cc motorcycle, and a 125cc 60 mph scooter. I feel MUCH safer on them than I do on a bike in the street with these !#$%^ cagers yacking on their cell phones and just generally being inattentive. Then, there are the guys (they're always male) who try to show you how 'in control' they are of their cars by passing me as closely as possible without actually clipping me. If I get ticketed for sidewalk riding, I'll go to court & fight like a cornered tiger.

Chicagoans are typically more friendly than New Yorkers, so I don't expect much flak, since I'll mostly be there on weekends when there isn't as much sidewalk traffic. (except in heavy shopping zones)
Glad to know there are others who find American streets inhospitable to life on a bicycle. I haven't been to Madison, but I have been to Portland, and riden in enough typical bike lanes to know it is unwise to assume they are safe.

It only took 3 blocks of sidewalk riding in Manhattan yesterday before a cop car spotted me and at least politely informed that I have to be in the street. I then asked if kick scooters are ok, and he said they are "a grey area". He also said they get a lot of complaints from shop owners about bicycles on the sidewalk. There were hardly any peds on the UES side street, and I was going fairly slow. Perhaps that's why I didn't get a ticket, which I heard can be $50. It's looks as though I'll have to stick mostly to the Greenway if I want to elude the scourge of cars, riding on minor streets here and there where necessary.

To a point, I can understand concerns about bikes on sidewalks. The recklessness of callow youth pretty much ruin it for the rest of us. But to force bikes into the street is basically saying the cops (or the Property Interests that control them) only care about cars and pedestrians, cause a struck bicyclist is treated with the nonchalance of roadkill. You're either behind the wheel of a half-ton fossil fueled vehicle or on foot - there's just no in between in their view.

Good luck to you JeremyZ, and stay out of trouble. I wouldn't provoke the cops, but at the same time, there is maybe some potential that this is the sort of issue that can be changed through social action. I think a case can be made that given the dangers to cyclists in the street, and the illegality of sidewalk riding, local government needs to create dedicated/protected bicycling lanes.

Who knows if we'll ever have legal MJ like Amsterdam, but maybe if we scream bloody murder enough every time a cyclist is treated as roadkill, we can harness enough knee-jerk guilt to force local government to adopt some of the bike-friendly Dutch culture. The bike lane trend is encouraging, but we've still got a long way to go.

Bummer. Maybe you hit some glass. I think the bottle deposit states of CA, CT, DE, HI, IA, ME, MA, MI, NY, OR, and VT are inherently far more kind to bike tires. Many a bum can feed themselves on the money they earn performing the useful public service of bottle recycling.

Hope you get rolling again soon.



You are correct, broken glass is a big problem here. It put a pretty big gash in my tube and now my poor big apple is sliced a bit. I did a quick patch job on the road. I didn't remove the rear tire (which probably ended up being faster. I located the hole and because of the size, I used 2 parks glueless patches to seal it (one on top of the other, I've found in the past that if the hole is bigger than pin size the parks patches can't handle the pressure). I also put a patch on the tire where the injury was and that really seems to help. It held up well until I got home and pulled the wheel, I discovered another small whole right by the big one, and patched it too. The pressure has been holding ever since. I'm going to see if my LBS can order be some tubes without the shipping cost.

I rode to work this morning and everything went well. There was really no difference in speed between the curve and my Speed, although, I have more gearing options with the speed, which gives me an advantage. One thing I don't like about the Curve is that the the tolerances around the chain are very tight, making it very difficult to impossible to add a larger front chainring. I tried a 53 and it caused the chain to rub on the chainstay. I might be able to get a 50T in there which would give me the slightly taller gears that I need. I think I'll keep it stock though for a little while, I like the cranks that came with it, and I really like the chain (looks like it will hold up to rust very well).

Right now that is about my only complaint. I'm getting used to the seat, it's different than my other one but I think It will be just fine. Now I know why everyone raves about them, the big apples are nice. They make the bike very comfortable, but still allow it to roll quickly.

Luckily road riding isn't a problem for me, the traffic isn't bad in my neck of the woods. I just have to watch out for the glass.

I was thinking about ordering one from my local dealer until he said that if I was thinking of folding it each day, then the hinge is the weakness and they recommend without fail a Brompton.

How much of this is sales talk (£) and how much is honesty?

Anyone got a photo of one folded next to a Brompton?

Jeremy,

I'm in Chicago and have a Curve too. Are you using it to get downtown? If so, I've learned to take the 1 way roads. Most of them have bus only lanes on the right that aren't congested. I speed along pretty good in them unless some taxi is picking up a fare.

Kevin

I was thinking about ordering one from my local dealer until he said that if I was thinking of folding it each day, then the hinge is the weakness and they recommend without fail a Brompton.

How much of this is sales talk (£) and how much is honesty?

Anyone got a photo of one folded next to a Brompton?

I'll soon be putting this to the test. All I can say, is that the hinge/folding mech is a huge improvement on my new curve over my 2003 Speed Pro, and I've had no problems with the hinge on my Speed pro. I weighted about 230 lbs when I started riding my speed, I'm now 185. I didn't fold the Speed every day, but with proper maintenance I don't see a problem. I will be folding the curve everyday.

No doubt the bromptom has a nicer more compact fold, but I'm not going to worry about the hinge being weak (whatever that means).

Here are some pictures comparing the sl to a brompton, from a danish site.
http://www.cykelportalen.dk/index.php?system_page_id=8&module_page_id=2&item_id=46

Loch

That's a great help, thanks v much. I prefer the looks of the SL but if only the Brompton was more compact. Come on Dahon!

I was thinking about ordering one from my local dealer until he said that if I was thinking of folding it each day, then the hinge is the weakness and they recommend without fail a Brompton.

How much of this is sales talk (£) and how much is honesty?

Anyone got a photo of one folded next to a Brompton?
IMO, it's probably mostly sales talk. If anything I've heard more complaints about the Brompton's rear triangle hinge getting out of whack than Dahon-style frame hinges.

Here are some side by side pics:
http://bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=274922

Rafael (the guy who made that thread) buys and sells bikes like mad. He's owned several Bromptons and a Curve D3. Rafael, care to comment on the Brompton vs Curve hinge? For that matter, Rafael, why did you replace your Curve D3 with a Brompton? You said you loved the Curve D3.

Thought you might all appreciate some pictures.

Here's my curve. Yes, I had to add a stem, and I added a straighter carbon fiber handlebar to get a little more reach. Took off the chainguard (-100gr and show off that beautiful chain :D) added some bar ends. Fit is perfect for me.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v86/vanloch/Curve%20SL/curveslvl.jpg

As you can see it folds just fine.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v86/vanloch/Curve%20SL/curveslvlfold.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v86/vanloch/Curve%20SL/curvslfoldtop.jpg


Here's a bad picture, but shows what a 5'11'' 185lb person looks like on the SL. And the reflectiveness!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v86/vanloch/Curve%20SL/100_0386.jpg

Loch

That's a great help, thanks v much. I prefer the looks of the SL but if only the Brompton was more compact. Come on Dahon!

Ya or, I wish Brompton would make a 5 speed, 22lb folder with big apples, that cost ~$600.

Superb!

Very, very tempted, although it would need the mudguards kept on as the weather is rubbis!

Just have to hope that it would fit on a train. Any UK owners able to comment?

Superb!

Very, very tempted, although it would need the mudguards kept on as the weather is rubbis!

Just have to hope that it would fit on a train. Any UK owners able to comment?

Yes, another gripe, did not come with fenders which I will eventually have to add when the weather gets worse (the UK version might come with them though).

They seem to come with m/guards here but they are pricey at £500/$1000. Then again, nothing compared to a Brompton :)

Just have to find a dealer than got's one in stock, as well as a Brompton.

Very impressive bike. If it wasn't for the very poor asfalt conditions that I plan to ride on, I would have kept my Curve, such a nice bike!

Very impressive bike. If it wasn't for the very poor asfalt conditions that I plan to ride on, I would have kept my Curve, such a nice bike!

So was it the rear suspension that made you switch back to a Brompton?

Yes, another gripe, did not come with fenders which I will eventually have to add when the weather gets worse (the UK version might come with them though).

Loch - According to Dahon's website, the D3 comes with mudguards and the luggage rack w/ bungee strap. I don't know if this is the case with the 5 speed version, or if it is even the case with the D3. I will find out probably tomorrow.

Find the bike, then click on the Accessories tab. The D3 shows that the mudguards (fenders) and rack are included.

Loch - According to Dahon's website, the D3 comes with mudguards and the luggage rack w/ bungee strap. I don't know if this is the case with the 5 speed version, or if it is even the case with the D3. I will find out probably tomorrow.

Find the bike, then click on the Accessories tab. The D3 shows that the mudguards (fenders) and rack are included.

You're absolutely right on that one. I was misled by the picture and didn't read carefully enough. Still would have got it though It just would have been a nice gesture to include a little extra something with a $600+ bike. Those fenders are spendy too :eek: .

So was it the rear suspension that made you switch back to a Brompton?

It was the longer wheelbase from the brompton. The wheels from the Curve are really close to each other for a more aggressive, urban ride.

The luggage rack included with the D3 is a boat anchor. It is too heavy to be worth anything, in my opinion.

The SKS mudguards are extremely light weight.

Just to add another opinion on the rack, I've got one on my D3 and find it very useful, although only for putting stuff on top. The sides don't seem substantial enough for panniers even if I wanted them. I haven't taken the rack off to see how much weight it adds to the total, but I'd consider the combined weight with bike, fenders, and rack, to be acceptable. And, then, I added a front basket, but that's another story.

Perhaps with the SL, though, they thought that fenders and rack wouldn't go with the image they were aiming for.

DaFriMon,

I think you will be surprised to find out how much your rear luggage rack weighs, if you ever decide to take it off.

I agree that it is a handy design, if it were made out of aluminum or something light weight, I would have kept it on my D3.

You're absolutely right on that one. I was misled by the picture and didn't read carefully enough. Still would have got it though It just would have been a nice gesture to include a little extra something with a $600+ bike. Those fenders are spendy too :eek: .

They probably don't include them on the Curve SL because the fenders and rack probably account for most of the weight difference between the D3 and the SL. So if they included them the SL wouldn't be very SL.

14R: You ditched the Curve? Shocking. It was just 2 months ago you were singing its praises.

Too bad that old Curve thread is lost. It had a lot of info on it. In any event my D3 is working for me. At $360 bucks it was worth jumping into the folding bike world. I don't know if I would have done it for much more than $500.

Is the D3 perfect, no but I think its sorta like Old Navy clothes. Somethings just aren't worth a premium.

Now for a question, I've noticed a knock through my crank when under load. Its hard to test for when I'm not riding but I think its coming from the rear S&A gear box. Its like a slip or something. Any ideas?

14R: You ditched the Curve? Shocking. It was just 2 months ago you were singing its praises.

Yes, I sold it for a good price after I realized the wheelbase is very short for bad asfalt sprints in mid-traffic like I do in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil.

It's a very nice bike. I still recommend it.

Anyone weighed a Curve SL? The SL reviewed by AtoB recently which had mudguards but no rack was 10.8kg instead of the claimed 9.9kg. Unless the quoted weight does not include the removeable pedals this seems a large error.

Robin

I don't feel too bad about not having a rack, I'm sure I would have taken it off. The fenders would have been nice to have (they looked cool enough for the web photos). I went ahead and ordered some (there goes another $30).

Still haven't found tubes. My LBS says they can order some for me for $3-4 a peice so I'm starting there. If that doesn't work, I'll probably get some from schwalbe $4.75 each +$9 shipping for 4.

The Parks glueless patches pooped out on me and the tire went flat the other day. Repaired it this time with two layers of vulcanizing rubber patches, so far so good.

Regarding the weight. I'm not sure if the rack and fenders make up the majority of the difference in weight between the D3 and SL. The SL has the aluminum fork, very narrow rims (like 14mm), I-beam seat post and saddle, and probably lighter crankset. Course the hub adds about 250g. Who knows, someone tell me the weight of a D3 without fenders and rack. Shucks, I really needed the 5 gears though, I use every one of them.

Anyone weighed a Curve SL? The SL reviewed by AtoB recently which had mudguards but no rack was 10.8kg instead of the claimed 9.9kg. Unless the quoted weight does not include the removeable pedals this seems a large error.

Robin

Rarely are quoted weights accurate, this is one of my huge gripes. Dahon usually is closer than most.

My curve when it was stock. No fenders no rack but with pedals was right around 22.6lbs (10.25 kg), so the wieght must be without pedals. Like, who needs pedals :rolleyes: .

14R: You ditched the Curve? Shocking. It was just 2 months ago you were singing its praises.
No offense to 14R, but sometimes I wonder if people around here talk up their bikes to try to increase the resale value. This forum is probably the defacto source for folding bike info and 14R isn't the first to sing the praises of a bike shortly before selling it off.

Too bad that old Curve thread is lost. It had a lot of info on it.
Which thread? This one?:
http://bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=274922

Hot dang, where'd you find it? I searched but the folding bike forum only stored 4 pages of threads and I though it was dropped.

Update: My bad, I had my show thread settings (lower left) set to display only the last month of posts.

... My bad, I had my show thread settings (lower left) set to display only the last month of posts.

Oh, wow, me too. Thanks for pointing that out. Amazing, the stuff one misses.... --R

Thought I'd throw in a little video for fun. Folding and unfolding the Curve SL in 30 seconds.

Let's see if this works. My goofy 2 year-old son in the background.

I've added a stem to my Curve. If you have your handlebars set high enough than you should be able to fold faster, but if you have to raise the handlebars each time you fold than it will be slower.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16HxaI0hLv0

I really like this bike.

[QUOTE=makeinu;4832272]No offense to 14R, but sometimes I wonder if people around here talk up their bikes to try to increase the resale value. This forum is probably the defacto source for folding bike info and 14R isn't the first to sing the praises of a bike shortly before selling it off.

When I first read this it seemed like an odd combo of aggressiveness and illogic.
1. Why would the gente in Rio be reading bike info in English? Why do we assume that any place we are is the important place for everyone else?
2. Why would anyone assume that 14R, who is a prolific and obviously somewhat obsessed poster (by forum standards, then, a regular person), would falsify his generous sharing of experience to gain some tiny increment on a potential sale of a single bicycle? Or that other similar folks would?
3. Wouldn't it be better if, instead of the wave of the hand of "no-offense", we could think through things a little more carefully and phrase them more precisely to avoid unnecessary offense?

But on re-reading I saw more clearly makeinu's implicit theory that capitalism deforms human relationships by destroying trust. (Heilbroner (I think) wrote that this aspect, more than the creation of a mass proletariat, would undermine the necessary conditions for capitalism's survival - but my sense is the coming energy collapse will make Heilbroner's theory seem overly subtle). I don't think its fair in this particular case. But I'm glad it was posted - I prefer a good theory that is probably wrong in a particular case to a poor theory that might be right in a particular case.

I'm not sure if this has been posted...
But here is a overly detailed review of Dahon's Curve SL.
Grab a cup of coffee for this one.

http://www.foldsoc.co.uk/Mike/curve.html
>>>>

[quote=makeinu;4832272]No offense to 14R, but sometimes I wonder if people around here talk up their bikes to try to increase the resale value. This forum is probably the defacto source for folding bike info and 14R isn't the first to sing the praises of a bike shortly before selling it off.

When I first read this it seemed like an odd combo of aggressiveness and illogic.
1. Why would the gente in Rio be reading bike info in English? Why do we assume that any place we are is the important place for everyone else?
2. Why would anyone assume that 14R, who is a prolific and obviously somewhat obsessed poster (by forum standards, then, a regular person), would falsify his generous sharing of experience to gain some tiny increment on a potential sale of a single bicycle? Or that other similar folks would?
3. Wouldn't it be better if, instead of the wave of the hand of "no-offense", we could think through things a little more carefully and phrase them more precisely to avoid unnecessary offense?

But on re-reading I saw more clearly makeinu's implicit theory that capitalism deforms human relationships by destroying trust. (Heilbroner (I think) wrote that this aspect, more than the creation of a mass proletariat, would undermine the necessary conditions for capitalism's survival - but my sense is the coming energy collapse will make Heilbroner's theory seem overly subtle). I don't think its fair in this particular case. But I'm glad it was posted - I prefer a good theory that is probably wrong in a particular case to a poor theory that might be right in a particular case.

Were you looking for the 'Philosopher's Forum when you fell by chance upon this one?

Why comment upon the mannerliness of Makeinu's post and then describe 14R as an 'obviously somewhat obsessed poster'? That strikes me as pretty insulting in itself. 14R is a considerable resource here, for your information.

Rather than posting irrelevant comment on capitalism, the manners of posters and philosophy in general, go and look up this abbreviation and put it into practise -> STFU.

. . .
Rather than posting irrelevant comment on capitalism, the manners of posters and philosophy in general, go and look up this abbreviation and put it into practise -> STFU.

Southern Tenant Farmers Union (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Tenant_Farmers_Union)? :D

No, don't bother to explain, I know. ;)