Classic & Vintage - Who knows about Triumphs?

I just picked up a late '60s Triumph 10-speed -- lightly used, very pretty. I've been trying to find out more about the brand, like model names and such. I already knew it was one of Raleigh's second-line marques, but haven't found a lot more about them on the web. Not much luck dating the one I got, either. No date on the BB spindle; just a Raleigh Industries logo and

16GC

P

whatever that may mean.

Triumph was an English make. My mother used to have one. They began with bikes, just like rover, bsa and humber, and moved on to motorbikes and cars. In fact, we used to have a triumph car too, a 1973 triumph 2000. Very nice! (They were also behind the slant four engine in the saab 99).
Don't know too much more about the bikes.
Triumphs old (car) factory was in coventry. Very much a midlands company.

I'll give a shot at this one, it's a subject very near and dear to my heart: Triumph was started by a German, Sigfried Bettmann in 1885 making bicycles. First motorcycle in 1902, first automobile in 1923 (I believe, I know I'm not more than a year or two off). Made all three for the next 13 years, almost wasted by the Depression. Big reorganization in 1936: Bicycle side sold to Raleigh, not sure when they quit producing Triumph branded bicycles, would expect that it petered out during the mid/late 70's. I know the brand was disappearing at the time I dropped to part-time work at the shop.

Automobile side either sold to or combined with Standard to form Standard-Triumph, later combined with BMC to form British Leyland, the ultimate British horror show/soap opera. Last Triumph car in 1984 or thereabouts, essentially a rebadged Honda Civic.

The motorcycle side went up and down, is currently very up as they've just shamed the devil out of all the Japanese four cylinder 600cc sportbikes with the Daytona 675 triple. This company is not a re-pop trading on an old name as is so popular with motorcycles nowdays - it has the direct historical roots to 1902 and 1885. The current owner bought the company in bankruptcy in 1984.

That 10-speed you've got is kinda uncommon - if you look at the specs (other than frame) it's virtually a Raleigh Record. The Record sold for $100.00, the Triumph for $95.00, which is why my boss never bothered carrying the Triumph. I'm, fairy certain the only time we saw those at the shop was when we were supposed to get a shipment of Records, but got Triumph's instead. Merle was annoyed enough when that happened that I assumed there was less than $5.00 difference in his cost, but have no figures to back it up.

Syke
Deranged Few M/C

Great condensed history of Triumph, thanks Skye, now where's our resident Raleigh expert? The only thing I can add is that I owned a Triumph built (?) Raleigh that was sold as a frame-only by the shop in Ames, Iowa that got to liquify the remaining stock of UK Raleighs after Derby (?) got the rights to the name for USA, would have been around 1984. Mine had the Raleigh Heron badge and everything, was all 531...nice bike when built up, no indication that it was "second tier" to a Real Raleigh, and appears they were still using the Triumph name in mid '80s.

I was already up to speed on the automotive and motorcycle histories; I've owned a Trophy 500, a couple Bonnevilles, and had the poor judgment to own three Tridents. I'm mainly curious to know if there are any consumer catalogs or literature of that sort floating around. I've seen Triumph middleweights, but this is the first lightweight I've come across. The components are indeed just like a Record of the period; Nervar crank, Huret Allvit mechs. Apparently they saved the $5.00 by using Phillips brakes and levers, and not striping the lugs. The geometry has a real roadster look; long chainstays, lots of rake and trail. I'll post a couple pics later.

Here's a crummy flash picture, but it gives the general idea.

http://home.comcast.net/~mswantak/wsb/media/1477/site1467.jpg

I used to have a Triumph 3 speed called an "all steel" because the bottom bracket shell was steel rather then cast iron. It had rod gears and original paintwork, probably worth something to a US collector now but I bought and sold it for peanuts.

I was already up to speed on the automotive and motorcycle histories; I've owned a Trophy 500, a couple Bonnevilles, and had the poor judgment to own three Tridents. I'm mainly curious to know if there are any consumer catalogs or literature of that sort floating around. I've seen Triumph middleweights, but this is the first lightweight I've come across. The components are indeed just like a Record of the period; Nervar crank, Huret Allvit mechs. Apparently they saved the $5.00 by using Phillips brakes and levers, and not striping the lugs. The geometry has a real roadster look; long chainstays, lots of rake and trail. I'll post a couple pics later.

Another masochist with a former fondness for T150 Tridents! I had a '72, all that wonderful unreliability plus the 'comical hub' front brake. When it ran right . . . well, imagine you're a 20 year old on a reasonably recent Jap 600 whose getting burned by this guy older than your father in Rocker leathers and Davida helmet. But boy, one degree off from those kind of nights and you were pushing a 500lb boat anchor. I finally sold it off cheap after admitting I was way in over my head mechanic-wise - and I'm reasonably competent with a 650 Bonneville.

Contrast that with my other Trident - a 95 900, with 90,000+ miles on it, and it puts to shame any other bike I've ever owned, starting with ever BMW I've had. Absolutely amazing the way that company has turned itself around.

I'd love to have one of those old Triumph 10-speeds, if only for the uniqueness. They'll never become valuable, but in my eyes this is one of those bikes that justifies a Masi-like anal restoration, because they weren't common. Given the struggle to produce enough bikes during the 70's bike boom, I often wondered why Raleigh made them in the first place. I would think that every Triumph made was space for one less Raleigh Record on the production line, and Lord knows we could never get enough Records.

Syke
Deranged Few M/C

By the way, upon second glance I notice the rear derailleur in that picture has been changed to a Shimano Lark. A very period, very worthwhile, upgrade. That derailleur was always a good one, its only negative being totally by association - it was the preferred derailleur for Murray, Huffy, Iverson, etc.

It was the only good component on those bikes!

OK, it was a bit heavy, but still lighter than a SunTour V-GT. A club buddy of mine used to carry one of those in a sock, to use against belligerant dogs.

Syke
Deranged Few M/C

Actually it's a Chinese knockoff of a Lark. It had a knackered Suntour GT when I got it. I put the 'Rark' on because it looked more like the Huret Allvit.

http://www.jackedinger.net/images/triumph.jpg

Heheh -- well, now we know there were two, anyway.

Well, I am fairly new here, but seeing as I also own a Triumph I feel reasonably secure in saying something...

Mine is newer, built in 1984 (according to the Raleigh-pattern S/N.) It is built with 531c tubing, with really neat long point lugs with cutouts. It came with 6-speed 105 bits installed, one of the first indexing groups, apparently.

It's a sweet ride, but then I haven't really owned enough bikes to have a good basis of comparison.

Based on what my 10-speed weighs, I'm pretty certain it's made from solid bar stock.