Commuting - One for internal hub fans

Here’s an interesting concept for internal hub fans, though not the most pracitcal one.

http://www.bianchi.it/en/productsDucati/Street_Y7BD8.aspx

Personally, I’d prefer horizontal dropouts to the chain tensioner but I guess they’re thinking that they can use the same frame for derailleur bikes too. Don’t know if it will be brought to the U.S. as the Bianchi USA site has no information about the Ducati Corse line at all.

Regards,
Alan

If the chain tensioner hangs down as far as a derailleur, I don't get the point of using an internal geared hub.

If the chain tensioner hangs down as far as a derailleur, I don't get the point of using an internal geared hub.

For us internal hub junkies, a clean chain line is not the only reason to buck the norm. I don't need to look any farther than their dead reliability. Depending on how punchy ILTB is feeling, a whole list of their superiorities will be forthcoming.;)

No fender/rack eyelets, odd. With disk brakes clearance issues would be a lot more friendly.

--A

No fender/rack eyelets, odd. With disk brakes clearance issues would be a lot more friendly.
Yeah... I have no quarrel with internal gear hubs, but it looks like Bianchi chose style over practicality with this one. Why else would they use those stupid low seatstays that can't take a rack or fenders?

And furthermore, does anyone else think those are UGLY? I also think that gratuitously curved frame tubes are butt ugly. I don't know why anyone would want them on a beach cruiser, much less a bike for any other use.

I don't mind curved tubes, but I agree the low seatstays blow the lines. Pretty it is not.

Here’s an interesting concept for internal hub fans, though not the most pracitcal one.
Actually, it looks more like a concept bike for gizmo geeks. Chain tensioner? WTF is that supposed to add? As already pointed out by others, this wierd design, besides being butt ugly, seems to serve no purpose that is not better served by more conventional design. All it needs now is a $1k+ Rohloff Hub option.

I had to go back and read the specs...the minute I saw something hanging down I figured it was a miss link.:p I don't mind the curved stays but they aren't real practical for anything other than a cruiser.


Aaron:)

The bike manufactures just don't get it. Must have idiots in the styling department. One last time repeat after me " horizonal dropouts or ecentric bottom brackets for gear hubs and single speeds". Horizonal drops for rim brakes, lower cost, and simplicity. Ecentric bottom bracket and vertical drops for disc brakes and the ultimate smooth look although at at a slight price increase. Bianchi could have taken the new Alfine componets and put them on the San Jose and knocked a home run instead they come up with this genetic mistake and strike out.

http://www.sogreni.dk/Images/Bicycles_r5_c1.jpg (http://www.sogreni.dk/Bicycles.php)
Classic lines really are hard to beat.
There was a Trek at the LBS which fit all my criteria for a town bike. I don't know the model, but it had a lock over the rear brake that was intriguing.

--A

If Bianchi is trying to make an ideal bike to showcase the pluses of internal hub gearing, they need to go back to the drawing board.

The bike manufactures just don't get it. Must have idiots in the styling department. One last time repeat after me " horizonal dropouts or ecentric bottom brackets for gear hubs and single speeds". Horizonal drops for rim brakes, lower cost, and simplicity. Ecentric bottom bracket and vertical drops for disc brakes and the ultimate smooth look although at at a slight price increase. Bianchi could have taken the new Alfine componets and put them on the San Jose and knocked a home run instead they come up with this genetic mistake and strike out.
I like your ideas for rim vs. disc brakes. And heck, it's not just the styling department that's screwed up here! Horizontal dropouts and no chain tensioner would be a much better idea from a mechanical perspective as well: no chance of a dropped chain, and a quieter, more efficient drivetrain.

I think that horizontal dropouts must be hard enough to find these days that they choose this chain tensioner crap for cost reasons. The only production bike I know of with horiz dropouts is the Surly Cross Check, which costs $400 for the frame. I'm guessing that the big Taiwanese/Chinese places forging dropouts by the million must not be making horizontal dropouts anymore.

I don't mind the main frame to much but the stays need to back to the drawing board. I like curvy tubes as in old Ti Merlin frames/ early mtb cruiser conversions. It definatly is a cluster of components. All it needs is track or horizontal ends, they aren't as hard to come by as one would think, plenty of bike companies can access them. EBBs aren't a great idea IMO because of the constant creaking, at least that has been my experience w/ them on some makes regardless of how much I greased or adjusted it. Also how long they hold up to exposure to elements as in dirt and grime getting in the moving parts. That only aggrevated the creaking. Find the "magic" gears for perfect tension, use an Eno Eccentric hub, or cut out your vertical drops and weld in some track ends. Tensioners are good for conversions, and are not at all bad to me, but on a production bike? It looks like one of my rigs I slapped together from dumpster bikes.

I don't mind the main frame to much but the stays need to back to the drawing board. I like curvy tubes as in old Ti Merlin frames/ early mtb cruiser conversions. It definatly is a cluster of components. All it needs is track or horizontal ends, they aren't as hard to come by as one would think, plenty of bike companies can access them. EBBs aren't a great idea IMO because of the constant creaking, at least that has been my experience w/ them on some makes regardless of how much I greased or adjusted it. Also how long they hold up to exposure to elements as in dirt and grime getting in the moving parts. That only aggrevated the creaking. Find the "magic" gears for perfect tension, use an Eno Eccentric hub, or cut out your vertical drops and weld in some track ends. Tensioners are good for conversions, and are not at all bad to me, but on a production bike? It looks like one of my rigs I slapped together from dumpster bikes.
Certainly, track ends are easy to come by... lots of production fixies and SS MTBs come with them these days. But does anyone know of a production bike with traditional horizontal dropouts besides the Surly Cross Check?

The Eno hub costs about $120 retail, which makes it out of the question for a bike like this, and besides it doesn't come in an internal geared version. The "magic" gear combinations are not really a suitable solution since they make upgrades impossible and will lose their tension as the chain wears.

I agree that the chain tensioner looks very amateurish on a production bike, but more than that it partially negates the reliability that an internally-geared hub provides, because it makes it possible for a rough shock to throw the chain.

I'm guessing that the chain tensioner is to allow the use of a rear disc brake without an eccentric BB. Pretty stupid design decision, if you ask me. I'm suspicious of eccentric BBs for most internal gear applications - fork ends or horizontal dropouts seem much simpler and cheaper. This, along with the integrated headset, is my main beef with the Cannondale 50/50. If you're going to have a rear disc brake, though, the eccentric BB is the way to go. Absolutely anything else is a cludge.

What's really bad about it is that it's a double pulley chain tensioner, not a single pulley model like the Surly Singleator. Looks like Bianchi really hit it out of the park on this one, but they were playing in the Stupid Design stadium.

I think that might be a kid's bike. The frame sizes, 47-51-55, seem way too small. Maybe it's just me and my mutant six foot two ness. Also, I don't see the Ducati name plate appealing to adults that much. Maybe for kids who can't yet ride a motorcycle, but not for adults who could simply ride a real Ducati.

http://www.sogreni.dk/Images/Bicycles_r5_c1.jpg (http://www.sogreni.dk/Bicycles.php)
Classic lines really are hard to beat.
There was a Trek at the LBS which fit all my criteria for a town bike. I don't know the model, but it had a lock over the rear brake that was intriguing.

--A

Allen,
Was it one of those locks that kind of rotates thru the wheel? I have a Giant Excursion (European Utility Bike) that has one of those. I love it for the quick lock up where I can keep an eye on the bike. I have used it with a cable thru the wheels in a pinch when I left the mini at home:rolleyes:

Aaron:)

Certainly, track ends are easy to come by... lots of production fixies and SS MTBs come with them these days. But does anyone know of a production bike with traditional horizontal dropouts besides the Surly Cross Check?

Kona Sutra has adjustable dropouts... even better than horizontal, right?

I think that horizontal dropouts must be hard enough to find these days that they choose this chain tensioner crap for cost reasons. The only production bike I know of with horiz dropouts is the Surly Cross Check, which costs $400 for the frame. I'm guessing that the big Taiwanese/Chinese places forging dropouts by the million must not be making horizontal dropouts anymore.


Bianchi makes the Milano, San Jose, and Pista with hoizonal drops. They just need to look in their own parts department. Shimano is offering the chain tensioner option so gearhubs can easily be retro fitted to existing derailleur/vertical drop frames. But putting it on a new production frame was cheap and ugly.

If you're going to have a rear disc brake, though, the eccentric BB is the way to go. Absolutely anything else is a cludge.

Looks like Bianchi really hit it out of the park on this one, but they were playing in the Stupid Design stadium.


Couldn't agree more.

Bianchi makes the Milano, San Jose, and Pista with hoizonal drops. They just need to look in their own parts department. Shimano is offering the chain tensioner option so gearhubs can easily be retro fitted to existing derailleur/vertical drop frames. But putting it on a new production frame was cheap and ugly.
The Milano, San Jose, and Pista have track ends, NOT traditional forward-facing horizontal dropouts. Track ends are not so suitable for a geared bike with rim brakes, because it's hard to get the rear rim brake lined up.

i don't know all the details of the terminology yet. do you mean that the open end of the dropout faces forward? the open ends of the milano's dropouts face forward.

that bike is pretty terrible-looking, but one good thing about a chain tensioner would be that it'd probably keep the chain from clanging against the bike. my chain makes the greatest sounds slapping against my bike. i'm sure there are a thousand better ways to fix it than using a chain tensioner, but still! :)

Styling aside, the groupset on that bike is pretty interesting.

It is the Alfine groupset, a refinement of the 8 speed Nexus kit.

Apart from the ugly, ugly tensioner (Rennen Rollenlager is the only tensioner I will entertain) there is some pretty cool stuff. Namely an 8 speed internal gear hub with trigger shifter and disc mount and mechanical disc calipers that work with the cable pull of road levers. As well as a hydraulic disc aimed squarely at the commuter/hybrid market.

As for the frame, it looks like Bianchi has just ordered a large quantity of frames with a regular dropout. It was probably cheaper to spec the shimano tensioner and a off the shelf vertical dropout than it was to make frames with either kona unit style sliding dropouts or karate monkey style elongated disc mount holes.. If you don't like the look, then don't buy it. Send Bianchi an email asking if they have a cruiser frame with horizontal dropouts and disc mounts if it bothers you.

In the meantime, I will be fitting an Alfine disc hub to an old steel mtb frame that I had fitted with horizontal dropouts to make a new commuting weapon as soon as I can get my hands on one.

[QUOTE=moxfyre]The Milano, San Jose, and Pista have track ends, NOT traditional forward-facing horizontal dropouts. Track ends are not so suitable for a geared bike with rim brakes, because it's hard to get the rear rim brake lined up.[/QUOTE


Must be an optical illusion. I sure thought it had rim brakes, track ends, and a nexus gearhub. Maybe your sharp eyes and mechanical mind can figure it out and enlighten us. http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/bianchi-sanjos8/index.html

The Milano, San Jose, and Pista have track ends, NOT traditional forward-facing horizontal dropouts. Track ends are not so suitable for a geared bike with rim brakes, because it's hard to get the rear rim brake lined up.

The Milano has forward-facing horizontal drops. The Pista has track ends (it's supposed to be a track bike). I don't know about the San Jose but I would suspect that it has horizantal drops like the milano.

EDIT: Looks like from that photo that the SJ does have track ends. The Milano definatly has horizontal drops though (I owned one for a while).

In any case this bike is clearly a piece of half-assed crap. I'd argue that the Milano is too but this thing makes the Milano look like a great bicycle.

Bianchi makes the Milano, San Jose, and Pista with hoizonal drops. They just need to look in their own parts department. Shimano is offering the chain tensioner option so gearhubs can easily be retro fitted to existing derailleur/vertical drop frames. But putting it on a new production frame was cheap and ugly.

Not really the same parts deptartment...

... Those are all Bianchi USA bikes - none of them are available in Europe, no volpe, no san jose, no Milano. In fact I don't know of any of the taiwan made Bianchis being available in Europe...(The cheapest bianchi commuter bike I saw in a shop in Italy had a French built frame). So that sort explains why this bike is the way it is - they only have derailleur frames. I asked a Bianchi dealer in Milan why none of their city bikes used internally geared hubs. He told me that "Italians hate them" because they are so hard to fix. It's more likely a pride thing - there are no italian manufacturers of internal hubs. Other than the reparto corse track specific bikes, there are no horizontal drop/ track end bianchi bikes in Europe (correct me if I'm wrong - but I've never seen one.)

Not really the same parts deptartment...

... Those are all Bianchi USA bikes - none of them are available in Europe, no volpe, no san jose, no Milano. In fact I don't know of any of the taiwan made Bianchis being available in Europe...(The cheapest bianchi commuter bike I saw in a shop in Italy had a French built frame). So that sort explains why this bike is the way it is - they only have derailleur frames. I asked a Bianchi dealer in Milan why none of their city bikes used internally geared hubs. He told me that "Italians hate them" because they are so hard to fix. It's more likely a preide thing - there are no italiam manufacturers of internal hubs. Other than the reparto corse track bikes, there are no horizontal drop bianchi bikes in Europe (correct me if I'm wrong - but I've never seen one.)



In your above post I apreciate you for testifing to the fact that horizonal drops (actually track ends) are available in Italy on Bianchi Bikes. So I guess you really meant to say it is the same parts department.Since it is avalable for one it must be available for another. Bottom line is that I really don't care if it was made in Italy or Taiwan or by whoever. The Panigan is butt ugly and a cludge which is a shame because all the ingrediants where available to make a nice bike. I guess they could pull a Rollo Bell out of their parts department and install it then hire PeeWee Hermin as there spokesperson. Surely that would make it a sales leader. Hopefully some other bike manufacturer will build a decent bike to showcase the new Alfine Line.

In your above post I apreciate you for testifing to the fact that horizonal drops (actually track ends) are available in Italy on Bianchi Bikes. So I guess you really meant to say it is the same parts department.Since it is avalable for one it must be available for another. Bottom line is that I really don't care if it was made in Italy or Taiwan or by whoever. The Panigan is butt ugly and a cludge which is a shame because all the ingrediants where available to make a nice bike. I guess they could pull a Rollo Bell out of their parts department and install it then hire PeeWee Hermin as there spokesperson. Surely that would make it a sales leader. Hopefully some other bike manufacturer will build a decent bike to showcase the new Alfine Line.

Available yes - but only on TRACK bikes. I was attempting to explain that just because their are bikes here in the states called "bianchi" it does not mean that the europeans have access to them for their bikes. Go to Bianchi USA's website - any bike on their that is not "reparto corse" is a Bianchi USA bike, designed and manufactured for the USA only. This "Ducati" bike should have been a Bianchi (USA) Milano frame outfitted with the Alfine line. ....but there are no Milano bikes in Europe.

Available yes - but only on TRACK bikes. I was attempting to explain that just because their are bikes here in the states called "bianchi" it does not mean that the europeans have access to them for their bikes. Go to Bianchi USA's website - any bike on their that is not "reparto corse" is a Bianchi USA bike, designed and manufactured for the USA only. This "Ducati" bike should have been a Bianchi (USA) Milano frame outfitted with the Alfine line. ....but there are no Milano bikes in Europe.

And I am trying to explain to you that track ends are available on italian bianchi bikes and you agree in writing. Have you ever heard of shipping? It involves moving products from one location to another by trucks, airplanes,ships, or donkeys. Bottom line the parts are available and bianchi screwed up severely on this one. Maybe they will sell you a boat load of them at a discount since you seem to like them.

Bike looks cool,but the chain tensioner is just goofy. At first I thought it was set up like their Bergamo with a dual-drive rear. Is this an actual production piece,or just a concept bike?



In any case this bike is clearly a piece of half-assed crap. I'd argue that the Milano is too but this thing makes the Milano look like a great bicycle.

What's wrong with the Milano? Looks cool,has a Nexus hub,and rides like a rigid MTB.

And I am trying to explain to you that track ends are available on italian bianchi bikes and you agree in writing. Have you ever heard of shipping? It involves moving products from one location to another by trucks, airplanes,ships, or donkeys. Bottom line the parts are available and bianchi screwed up severely on this one. Maybe they will sell you a boat load of them at a discount since you seem to like them.

The only track bikes bianchi sells (in europe) are carbon fiber. And a CF fram is not going to help you build a commuter bike.

You are missing the point of my post :o - I was just trying to state that other than the Reparto Corse line of bikes in the USA (the ones actaully made in Italy)...the stuff we get here called "bianchi" has nothing to do with the bikes in Europe and vice versa. Bianchi is part of the "cycles europe" group....but surprisingly the Bianchi USA arm sells a lot of bikes that are designed ONLY for the USA market and come from Taiwan. It appears (wrongfully so) that the two branches really do not "talk" much. I agree its absurd that they don't share parts on their consumer level stuff - but that's the way it is. If you surf the actual Italian Bianchi site for their consumer level bikes...there is not a single internally gear bike -except for this Panigale. Again, as odd as this sounds, internally geared bikes are just not popular in Italy. I did not see a single new one in any bike shop I visited. Maybe they want to use the frame for more conventional drivetrains too - hence the normal drops? Also I see no indication of this line even coming to the USA? Don't get me wrong I want to see the Alfine line put on a great bike to.... its a head scratcher to me too that they are using a chain tensioner???

Here's the fancy Reparto Corse site http://www.bianchi.it/it/home/home.aspx where the Ducati line is listed.

Here is the Italian Bianchi site...the "cheap" bikes...it's loaded with cool commuter bike - but not a single one is an internal hub believe it or not.

http://www.cycleurope.it/

I almost brought this one back to the states with me for my wife:
http://www.cycleurope.it/data/runtime/images/cebianchiwww.cycleurope.it18778F474x282.jpg

I like this one... :D (one gear though, since Milan is pretty darn flat)
http://www.cycleurope.it/data/runtime/images/cebianchiwww.cycleurope.it19284F474x282.jpg

But does anyone know of a production bike with traditional horizontal dropouts besides the Surly Cross Check?

Bianchi's Volpe has horizontal dropouts (or at least, mine, a 2006, does). So does the Castro Valley (it's based on the Volpe frame). And yes, I mean forward-facing horizontal dropouts, not rear-facing track ends.

Bianchi's Volpe has horizontal dropouts (or at least, mine, a 2006, does). So does the Castro Valley (it's based on the Volpe frame). And yes, I mean forward-facing horizontal dropouts, not rear-facing track ends.
Cool! My coworker has a 2001 (?) Volpe and it has vertical dropouts. I'm glad they switched back to horizontal. It also appears that they switched to 1-1/8" threadless fork and headset for the last couple years, another good move.

The only track bikes bianchi sells (in europe) are carbon fiber. And a CF fram is not going to help you build a commuter bike.

You are missing the point of my post :o - I was just trying to state that other than the Reparto Corse line of bikes in the USA (the ones actaully made in Italy)...the stuff we get here called "bianchi" has nothing to do with the bikes in Europe and vice versa. Bianchi is part of the "cycles europe" group....but surprisingly the Bianchi USA arm sells a lot of bikes that are designed ONLY for the USA market and come from Taiwan. It appears (wrongfully so) that the two branches really do not "talk" much. I agree its absurd that they don't share parts on their consumer level stuff - but that's the way it is. If you surf the actual Italian Bianchi site for their consumer level bikes...there is not a single internally gear bike -except for this Panigale. Again, as odd as this sounds, internally geared bikes are just not popular in Italy. I did not see a single new one in any bike shop I visited. Maybe they want to use the frame for more conventional drivetrains too - hence the normal drops? Also I see no indication of this line even coming to the USA? Don't get me wrong I want to see the Alfine line put on a great bike to.... its a head scratcher to me too that they are using a chain tensioner???

Here's the fancy Reparto Corse site http://www.bianchi.it/it/home/home.aspx where the Ducati line is listed.

Here is the Italian Bianchi site...the "cheap" bikes...it's loaded with cool commuter bike - but not a single one is an internal hub believe it or not.




You are the one missing the point. What part of the parts are available to build a decent bike and the panigale is butt ugly is it that you don't understand?

What's wrong with the Milano? Looks cool,has a Nexus hub,and rides like a rigid MTB.


Nothing wrong with the Milano.

You are the one missing the point. What part of the parts are available to build a decent bike and the panigale is butt ugly is it that you don't understand?

Wow, I don't mean to continue this bacj-and-forth...but...I thought I was trying to thoughfully explain to everyone here that none of the frames they currently make have frames that will take internal hubs in Italy - it is just something they are not interested in. I know we have the Milano, volpe, san jose (all of which I really like) in the USA - HOWEVER Bianchi Italy does not have those bikes. Would it be easy for them to utilse the bikes from Bianchi USA in Europe? I'm not sure. The panigale is for the italian market and they simply don't make bikes (normally) with internal hubs (not sure why).

Is the panigale ugly? - god yes. Could Bianchi make the frame with track ends or forward facing horiz. drops? Sure. Did they? No. They also built it out of no name "alloy" tubeset. Right or wrong, generic steel in Italy is typically reserved for the very bottom of the market. The panigale is a very cheap frame by the looks of it - strangely cheap for the relatively costly alfine group they put on it. The bike is a real head scratcher. It makes no sense to put all of that stuff on a frame that requires a chain tensioner - especially since it seem to be a frame specific to this model. So why did they not put horizontal drop outs on it? I am guessing that since no other bike they make uses internal hubs maybe they eventually want to use this frame in other applications?

I thought I was taking the time to explain to everyone here that we can buy a lot of stuff that is marketed as Bianchi here in the USA that is not Bianchi in the rest of the world. It was not meant as an argument at all.

Wow, I don't mean to continue this bacj-and-forth...but...I thought I was trying to thoughfully explain to everyone here that none of the frames they currently make have frames that will take internal hubs in Italy - it is just something they are not interested in. I know we have the Milano, volpe, san jose (all of which I really like) in the USA - HOWEVER Bianchi Italy does not have those bikes. Would it be easy for them to utilse the bikes from Bianchi USA in Europe? I'm not sure. The panigale is for the italian market and they simply don't make bikes (normally) with internal hubs (not sure why).

Is the panigale ugly? - god yes. Could Bianchi make the frame with track ends or forward facing horiz. drops? Sure. Did they? No. They also built it out of no name "alloy" tubeset. Right or wrong, generic steel in Italy is typically reserved for the very bottom of the market. The panigale is a very cheap frame by the looks of it - strangely cheap for the relatively costly alfine group they put on it. The bike is a real head scratcher. It makes no sense to put all of that stuff on a frame that requires a chain tensioner - especially since it seem to be a frame specific to this model. So why did they not put horizontal drop outs on it? I am guessing that since no other bike they make uses internal hubs maybe they eventually want to use this frame in other applications?

I thought I was taking the time to explain to everyone here that we can buy a lot of stuff that is marketed as Bianchi here in the USA that is not Bianchi in the rest of the world. It was not meant as an argument at all.



You entered this thread by headlining your post that the parts are not available. You are wrong. If you want to talk about bikes go right ahead but do not try to tell me bianchi does not have trackends, horizonal drops, or any other part needed to manufacture a bike available to them. Have you figured out that the parts are available yet or are you going to keep dodging the question?

What's wrong with the Milano? Looks cool,has a Nexus hub,and rides like a rigid MTB.

If you want a rigid MTB, quit *****-footing around it and buy a rigid MTB.

The Milano is sold as a cruiser bike, which it is not. It is a rigid MTB with a hub in it.

I don't get it? Dodging what question? - I NEVER said the parts did not exist. The only bike that is part of the cycles europe/bianchi empire *and* has at least track ends is one of their carbon fiber track bikes.

I was (I thought) taking my time explaining the big differences in Bianchi USA and Bianchi. There were several posts here regarding - "oh the f-d up and could have used the Milano/volpe/san jose frame". I thought I was trying to be in the spirit of these forums and "share" some insight. Just because we (a bunch of forum sufing monday-morning quarterbacks - like me) think its "easy" doesn't mean we know what thier business orginization is capable of doing between divisions and between continents. The Panigale is for Europe....the Bianchi USA bikes are not available over there. Also as I said, for whatever reason, There are VERY FEW bikes on the market in Italy that use internal hubs. There is not one internally geared bike in all of cycles europe's brands. Cycles Europe is a huge company and could have done the bike right - but did not. Obviously they could have made a frame with track ends or front facing horiz drops.


I really hate to use wikipedia as a source...but its the quickest thing I can find right now....

[I]Bianchi USA is the United States division of Bianchi. Located in Hayward, California, they produce bicycles specifically (and only) for the American market, which are built in Taiwan and Italy. The design director for Bianchi USA is Sky Yaeger. The "Chick Designed" decal on some of the US bikes is a reference to her. In the United States, only the Reparto Corse range are still produced in Italy. Non-Reparto Corse models are not available elsewhere.

Do a web search for "Sky Yeager" and you start to understand the huge differences in the Bianchi USA bikes and the Bianchi europe stuff. If it was not for her, it sounds like there never would have been a Milano, Volpe, San Jose, etc. She really understood the USA market and the whole fixie/singlespeed/internal hub/steel-is-real trend in the USA. When you look at the dogs breakfast of a bike that Panigale is you can see she had NOTHING to do with it.

Bianchi USA is the United States division of Bianchi. Located in Hayward, California, they produce bicycles specifically (and only) for the American market, which are built in Taiwan and Italy. The design director for Bianchi USA is Sky Yaeger. The "Chick Designed" decal on some of the US bikes is a reference to her. In the United States, only the Reparto Corse range are still produced in Italy. Non-Reparto Corse models are not available elsewhere.

Do a web search for "Sky Yeager" and you start to understand the huge differences in the Bianchi USA bikes and the Bianchi europe stuff. If it was not for her, it sounds like there never would have been a Milano, Volpe, San Jose, etc. She really understood the USA market and the whole fixie/singlespeed/internal hub/steel-is-real trend in the USA. When you look at the dogs breakfast of a bike that Panigale is you can see she had NOTHING to do with it.

http://deephousepage.com/smilies/yawn.gifhttp://deephousepage.com/smilies/yawn.gifAre there any bike commuters who really give a darn about Sky Yaeger, or the provenance/availability of obscure Bianchi bicycle parts?

http://deephousepage.com/smilies/yawn.gifhttp://deephousepage.com/smilies/yawn.gifAre there any bike commuters who really give a darn about Sky Yaeger, or the provenance/availability of obscure Bianchi bicycle parts?

Yes. She designed the Pista, which as I just found out from a test ride, is a fun little bike.

Yes. She designed the Pista, which as I just found out from a test ride, is a fun little bike.
What is a Pista?

Pista is Italian for track, and it's a sweet looking bike.

Pista is Italian for track, and it's a sweet looking bike.
Any features that make it good for commuting?

Any features that make it good for commuting?
Uhm... not really. People like to ride track bikes because they're cool-looking, but they're really not too good for commuting.

They have twitchy handling, very low handlebars, poor tire clearance, and sometimes use bearings with no seals to keep out dirt and water (because they're meant for indoor track use). Also, most track bikes have to have the forks drilled to put on a front brake. And the rear-facing track ends mean that it's impractical to put a full fender on the rear wheel, because you won't be able to remove the wheel to change a flat without removing the fenders. Not that there any eyelets for rack or fender, or any water-bottle braze-ons for that matter :rolleyes:

I think a converted road bike is a better choice for riding a fixed gear on the road. Either that or something like a Surly Steamroller, which at least has more forgiving geometry, a drilled fork, and one set of water bottle braze-ons.

I don't get it? Dodging what question? - I NEVER said the parts did not exist. The only bike that is part of the cycles europe/bianchi empire *and* has at least track ends is one of their carbon fiber track bikes.

I was (I thought) taking my time explaining the big differences in Bianchi USA and Bianchi. There were several posts here regarding - "oh the f-d up and could have used the Milano/volpe/san jose frame". I thought I was trying to be in the spirit of these forums and "share" some insight. Just because we (a bunch of forum sufing monday-morning quarterbacks - like me) think its "easy" doesn't mean we know what thier business orginization is capable of doing between divisions and between continents. The Panigale is for Europe....the Bianchi USA bikes are not available over there. Also as I said, for whatever reason, There are VERY FEW bikes on the market in Italy that use internal hubs. There is not one internally geared bike in all of cycles europe's brands. Cycles Europe is a huge company and could have done the bike right - but did not. Obviously they could have made a frame with track ends or front facing horiz drops.


I really hate to use wikipedia as a source...but its the quickest thing I can find right now....

[I]Bianchi USA is the United States division of Bianchi. Located in Hayward, California, they produce bicycles specifically (and only) for the American market, which are built in Taiwan and Italy. The design director for Bianchi USA is Sky Yaeger. The "Chick Designed" decal on some of the US bikes is a reference to her. In the United States, only the Reparto Corse range are still produced in Italy. Non-Reparto Corse models are not available elsewhere.

Do a web search for "Sky Yeager" and you start to understand the huge differences in the Bianchi USA bikes and the Bianchi europe stuff. If it was not for her, it sounds like there never would have been a Milano, Volpe, San Jose, etc. She really understood the USA market and the whole fixie/singlespeed/internal hub/steel-is-real trend in the USA. When you look at the dogs breakfast of a bike that Panigale is you can see she had NOTHING to do with it.

Better Reread your original post and my post that you were replying to. I stated that the parts were available. You replied "Not Really". You are wrong. The parts are available. What part of your op is it that you can't decifer?

Any features that make it good for commuting?

Yes. It's fun.

Depending upon my mood, that may be enough for the day.

Yes. It's fun.

Depending upon my mood, that may be enough for the day.
Fair enuff. Of course that qualifies every single bicycle ever made as being good for commuting.

An interesting bike is something that Harris Cyclery puts together in Newton MA - they take the Bianchi San Jose, and replace the Rear hub with a shimano 8 speed internal hub, and call it a San Jos8 - If I were to look into getting a new commuter, I would look closely at that.

An interesting bike is something that Harris Cyclery puts together in Newton MA - they take the Bianchi San Jose, and replace the Rear hub with a shimano 8 speed internal hub, and call it a San Jos8 - If I were to look into getting a new commuter, I would look closely at that.


Good choice. There is a link to this bike in post #23.

Fair enuff. Of course that qualifies every single bicycle ever made as being good for commuting.


Does this include the Panigan too??? :) Might make a good commuter for a night shift worker. It would be dark so none of your friends would see you riding it. Surely nobody would steal it. Well maybe for the hub.