Not me. I've got a truck. A two-wheeled pick-up truck.
I sold my car this spring after realizing that I'd put gas in the tank a handful of times within the previous year. Then a friend reminded me of the Xtracycle -- a bolt-on rear triangle that moves your rear-wheel back about 15 inches and supports their proprietary huge panniers. I remembered seeing one in action in Massachusetts and that I had wanted to try it out just to see how it handles.
In June, I added the free radical to my 1980's (my very first) mountain bike, and its carrying capacity has convinced me that I really don't need a car.
http://www.nicomachus.net/images/bikes/pickup.jpg
Three months into riding it, here are some thoughts --
First, since I mounted the free radical to a chromoly frame, I expected a lot of frame flex. While it does flex, it's not as much as I had anticipated. In fact, it's hard to tell precisely whether some of the fluidity of movement is frame-flex or the front suspension. Either way, it makes for a comfortable ride.
Second, the bike "tracks" like nothing I've ridden before. Maybe it's due to the length of the wheel-base or maybe there's some frame flex/sag in the middle that causes it. Whatever the cause, the bike likes to ride in a straight line. Turning requires a little more effort than the bike did before the extension. The "tracking" is great for commuting -- I hop on the rail-trail I take to work and cruise.
I've even ridden it off-road and, as long as you get lined up right, riding over skinnies and teeter-totters is pretty easy. You have to be conscious of the new front-to-back center or gravity for teeters, but other than that, the bike handles singletrack real well. Over all, it's a lot easier to control than I originally thought it would be.
Third, (and probably most obvious) the turning radius is increased. This makes it difficult to turn around in driveways without putting a foot down. It also requires you to be a little more conscious of the rear when taking corners. I've clipped the panniers more than once on rocks and curbs by leaning too soon into curves.
Fourth, since the seat and cranks are closer to the middle of the wheel-base than a regular upright bike (on which the seat and cranks are closer to the rear wheel), the rider's weight is more evenly distributed throughout the frame. For a bike with a suspension fork, this means that the fork carries more of the rider's weight at all times than would a "normal" bike. If you have a sophisticated fork, just crank down the pre-load and it all evens out. If you have a crappy one like me, then just learn to accept more squish in the fork. So far, the additional squish hasn't affected handling. It's just something to be aware of.
Even when I'm not carrying a giant package or cases of bulk-ordered groceries, the bike attracts attention. Patrons of bars, seated outdoors, have called out how much they like the look of the bike as I ride past. While walking through the local farmers' market, more than a few people have stopped me to ask about it. I feel like it attracts even drivers' attention while I'm on the road, though I still ride assuming that drivers are blind and I'm invisible -- aggressively defensive.
There's no denying that the Xtracycle is well thought-out. It performs as well loaded down as when the panniers are empty, the free radical is strong and lightweight, and it's even elegantly designed.
I'll say one more thing about the Xtracycle. The founders recognize that privileged, pro-bike activists like myself are not the only market of need for their creations.
On the Xtracycle website, the owners state that profits from sales of Xtracycle products "support Worldbike Foundation (formerly X-Access Foundation), a non-profit organization that seeks to make our technology available to all who need it. We are committed to creating a new model of business that adds to the natural wealth of humanity and the planet." Rock on; that's the kind of business I want to support.
ctxcrossx
09-14-06, 09:52 AM
Excellent review. I haven't made the jump yet since I have a bob trailer, but I hope to get one in the next few years. I hear only positive things about the xtracycle.
Chris
Dahon.Steve
09-14-06, 01:49 PM
I wonder if the top of the Xtra Cycle can be fitted with a large Army Duffle bag? I think that would fit more groceries than the four open slots
lyeinyoureye
09-14-06, 03:48 PM
On the Xtracycle website, the owners state that profits from sales of Xtracycle products "support Worldbike Foundation (formerly X-Access Foundation), a non-profit organization that seeks to make our technology available to all who need it. We are committed to creating a new model of business that adds to the natural wealth of humanity and the planet." Rock on; that's the kind of business I want to support.
I would suggest caution wrt this statement. Even if they do, which they may or may not, the effective capabilities of many non-profits are dwarfed by operational costs, and ultimately become very wasteful. Furthermore, if the xtracycle is really non-profit and patented, why aren't there plans/part lists for someone who wants to build their own on the site? Maybe there are, but I haven't found them.
nicomachus
09-14-06, 04:35 PM
I would suggest caution wrt this statement. Even if they do, which they may or may not, the effective capabilities of many non-profits are dwarfed by operational costs, and ultimately become very wasteful. Furthermore, if the xtracycle is really non-profit and patented, why aren't there plans/part lists for someone who wants to build their own on the site? Maybe there are, but I haven't found them.
Hmmm. I'm not sure what you're talking about. Read it more closely... what they're saying is that Worldbike is the non-profit (not Xtracycle, which is a different company -- the one that developed the design and, I would think, holds the patent). More, it says they support Worldbike... it doesn't say that Xtracycle gives all their profits to Worldbike.
What do you have against non-profits anyway?
lyeinyoureye
09-14-06, 05:06 PM
Hmmm. I'm not sure what you're talking about. Read it more closely... what they're saying is that Worldbike is the non-profit (not Xtracycle, which is a different company -- the one that developed the design and, I would think, holds the patent). More, it says they support Worldbike... it doesn't say that Xtracycle gives all their profits to Worldbike.
What do you have against non-profits anyway?
Oh god you're right, I thought it was all Xtracycle profits. A portion of the Xtracycle profits could be god knows what... Seems like marketing more than anything else. Generally, I think there are two things wrong with most non-profit organizations
-Operating costs compared to how much they actually influence their cause. If a large porportion of the donated resources goes towards running the organization, it may be that the impact is minimal, or not even worth the implementation versus other methods of helping whatever cause.
-Marginalization. Giving to non-profits results in an individual "feeling" they've done something. lets say the charity is dedicated to helping out third world families, so as a nation we give however much, and depending on implementation, those families get some fraction of this. Now, if there are corporations who we buy crap from down there exploiting the worker, we may be causing more harm by buying products that promote crappy/maginal living conditions than we are by donating a bit of cash. If an individual feels strongly about an issue then they should research it thoroughly so they can determine the best course of action wrt influencing the issue in a positive manner. Non-profits are generaly not the most effective way to influence issues.
yes
09-14-06, 06:30 PM
Nice review and pics. For the diyer, you can just get the frame for about $220 or $240 or something. If you want to diy the rest, it's pretty obvious from the pics. You'd of course need some skilz.
i'd get the whole package, though, if I were to take the plunge.
crtclb
09-14-06, 06:46 PM
Oh man I want one of those! But the wife would have my head on a plate... maybe if the tax return is big enough next year :)
Philatio
09-14-06, 07:29 PM
If I had some money to throw around, it would absolutely be on my list. but with drop bars.
fuerein
09-15-06, 09:22 AM
I would suggest caution wrt this statement. Even if they do, which they may or may not, the effective capabilities of many non-profits are dwarfed by operational costs, and ultimately become very wasteful. Furthermore, if the xtracycle is really non-profit and patented, why aren't there plans/part lists for someone who wants to build their own on the site? Maybe there are, but I haven't found them.
Umm, you do realize that if it is patented, then to build the same thing for yourself even if you were not selling it but only building it for your own use, would be infringing on patent protection afforded. Therefore your arguement really doesn't make sense.
Roody
09-15-06, 11:44 AM
How much?
nicomachus
09-15-06, 12:45 PM
How much?
$400 for everything you need to convert an existing bike.
http://www.xtracycle.com/freeradical-hitchless-trailer-convert-your-bike-p-2.html
lyeinyoureye
09-15-06, 02:02 PM
Umm, you do realize that if it is patented, then to build the same thing for yourself even if you were not selling it but only building it for your own use, would be infringing on patent protection afforded. Therefore your arguement really doesn't make sense.
Read my next post, my assumption was that all the profits went to whatever non-profit, so why not host the plans for it? But I was wrong... Only a portion goes to that non-profit, which could be whatever, and is most likely nothing more than marketing. As for building something for personal use...
At the very worst the infringer could claim they built the same thing seperately and it would be up to the patent holder to prove they stole their idea, which is next to impossible. I'm guessing the individual being sued would be forced to dissassemble the device? In any event, the bad press that may result is probably not worth the hassle for most business'.
It's also illegal to jaywalk, or ride a bicycle on the sidewalk, but we still get away with it daily. Oh noes. ;)
swwhite
09-15-06, 06:21 PM
Thank you for the review. That item is on my shopping list, but the list is long and the money is short.
geeklpc1985
09-17-06, 06:17 PM
I would never get that, I would lose too much cargo space. With my back painniers. With my burly nomad and cargo rack, I have a lot more space. Sides they are not that great in the winter time.
Philatio
09-17-06, 06:36 PM
Sides they are not that great in the winter time.
why not?
The Human Car
09-18-06, 06:55 AM
I would never get that, I would lose too much cargo space. With my back painniers. With my burly nomad and cargo rack, I have a lot more space. Sides they are not that great in the winter time.
With your set up I’ll agree that it’s nice leaving all your cargo space at home when you don’t need it, but I like having all that cargo space around with the Xtracycle in case I need it with minimal penalty of extra weight and drag. But I don’t agree that you’ll lose cargo space; the Burley Nomad has 4.6 cubic feet and panniers have about 1.5 cubic feet per pair; the Xtracycle has 10.4 cubic feet within the side straps and you can load additional stuff up on top for even more capacity. Here are some pics of a shopping run and note the sides are not full and that I have two more duffle bags that I could use to store stuff on top.
24721 24722 24723
Now if you really want a lot of cargo capacity this is a nice setup:
24726http://www.bikesatwork.com/
The only winter issue I have with the Xtracycle is going down a steep icy grade unloaded (going up is fine) as too much weight gets transferred off the back wheel.
atman
09-19-06, 10:21 AM
geeklpc, one of my most common 'cargos' is my wife. Can't carry her in a Burley Nomad. :-) I've loaded a full shopping cart of groceries with wife in tow, I've carried shop vacs, and I can go anywhere in the city with my tabla, djembe, and fire spinning gear. Heck, last weekend, I picked up a date to go to my wife's show, then put my wife on the back, dropped off the date and went home. Helps that my city is kinda flat, but I can do a couple miles with two smaller folk on the back. Xtracycles are fantastic...oh, and I don't even have Wideloaders, which up the capacity substantially.
I haven't had my Xtracycle through the winter, but I do know that I'd rather have brakes on all my wheels in the wintertime than be pushed around by a cargo trailer, which sounds like a recipe for jacknifing in low-traction conditions. I have nothing against cargo trailers, I just don't know of anything anyone actually does with one that an Xtracycle can't do, and trailers can't carry cute girls around, or much of anyone else out of elementary school. The notion that you would be giving up cargo capacity is simply misplaced.
cranky
09-19-06, 10:31 AM
There's a really nice xtracycle build on bikehugger (http://bikehugger.com/2006/09/the_bettie_download.htm)
jimisnowhere
09-24-06, 04:07 PM
I think if you wanted to go berzerk, you could keep your panniers, attach the trailer to the xtracycle, and end up with 18 cubic feet of storage plus a wife with her backpack! Then you could add front panniers, a big basket on the handlebars, sidecar....
I got an old specialized I'll be converting into an xtracycle soon, I'll probably put aside 50 bucks a week, and go cruising in Salem on Halloween.
jim
geeklpc1985
09-24-06, 04:51 PM
why not?
With the longer wheel base it's harder to control then a standard wheel base bike. Also with the back wheel farther back there is less weight on it, then a standard bike. Also, then you have to have waterproof bags.
geeklpc1985
09-24-06, 05:01 PM
geeklpc, one of my most common 'cargos' is my wife. Can't carry her in a Burley Nomad. :-) I've loaded a full shopping cart of groceries with wife in tow, I've carried shop vacs, and I can go anywhere in the city with my tabla, djembe, and fire spinning gear. Heck, last weekend, I picked up a date to go to my wife's show, then put my wife on the back, dropped off the date and went home. Helps that my city is kinda flat, but I can do a couple miles with two smaller folk on the back. Xtracycles are fantastic...oh, and I don't even have Wideloaders, which up the capacity substantially.
I haven't had my Xtracycle through the winter, but I do know that I'd rather have brakes on all my wheels in the wintertime than be pushed around by a cargo trailer, which sounds like a recipe for jacknifing in low-traction conditions. I have nothing against cargo trailers, I just don't know of anything anyone actually does with one that an Xtracycle can't do, and trailers can't carry cute girls around, or much of anyone else out of elementary school. The notion that you would be giving up cargo capacity is simply misplaced.
With the burly cargo rack, you can whole a full figured girl without a problem. I have never jackknifed my bike while riding. Trying to back the bike and trailer yes. Still working on that. With disk brakes and a fully loaded bike and trailer no stopping problems, but I have studded tires in the winter time.
Caspar_s
09-24-06, 08:59 PM
Heck, last weekend, I picked up a date to go to my wife's show, then put my wife on the back, dropped off the date and went home.
Wait a minute - you had a date AND your wife?
I gotta get an Xtracycle!!
BAH
10-03-06, 02:35 AM
With the burly cargo rack, you can whole a full figured girl without a problem. I have never jackknifed my bike while riding. Trying to back the bike and trailer yes. Still working on that. With disk brakes and a fully loaded bike and trailer no stopping problems, but I have studded tires in the winter time.
I propose a burly/xtracycle load duel! My money is on the xtracycle. :D
atman
10-03-06, 08:39 AM
With the longer wheel base it's harder to control then a standard wheel base bike. Also with the back wheel farther back there is less weight on it, then a standard bike. Also, then you have to have waterproof bags.
This is an assumption made by a non-xtracycle user, and is not true. The longer wheel base means that the xtracycle handles with more stability at low speeds, and having more of your weight on the front wheel makes it easier to recover from skids. The turning radius, of course, is higher, and this takes some getting used to, but a well installed xtracycle tracks excellently.
Rather than less weight on the back wheel, think of it as more weight on the front wheel, making it less likely to skid and dump you over the front handlebars. :D
As for waterproof bags...well, yes. I was going to pick up a couple of those IKEA yellow bags that are huge and cost a buck for wrapping anything that I can't load into, say, my waterproof dry sack. The FreeRadical is not designed to protect anything, it's like a rack not a pannier.
atman
10-03-06, 08:42 AM
Wait a minute - you had a date AND your wife?
I gotta get an Xtracycle!!
I recommend it highly!
geeklpc1985
10-05-06, 11:23 AM
This is an assumption made by a non-xtracycle user, and is not true. The longer wheel base means that the xtracycle handles with more stability at low speeds, and having more of your weight on the front wheel makes it easier to recover from skids. The turning radius, of course, is higher, and this takes some getting used to, but a well installed xtracycle tracks excellently.
Rather than less weight on the back wheel, think of it as more weight on the front wheel, making it less likely to skid and dump you over the front handlebars. :D
As for waterproof bags...well, yes. I was going to pick up a couple of those IKEA yellow bags that are huge and cost a buck for wrapping anything that I can't load into, say, my waterproof dry sack. The FreeRadical is not designed to protect anything, it's like a rack not a pannier.
What you said it true, but here in Wis. we have hills, ice and snow. Try riding up a icy hill, your going to miss that weight on the back tire. There are many reason for waiting your body weight on the back tire. Since it is the drive wheel, your going to lose power when you lose the weight. Also it is good at low speeds, true, but who wants to go slow?
Michel Gagnon
10-05-06, 09:34 PM
I don't have an Xtracycle, but I have a tandem and often ride it by myself. Same issue, only even more so.
I find the stokerless tandem as easy to ride as the single bike except in a few situations:
– Steep downhills need to be taken with more care, especially if the road is bumpy. There is very little weight on the rear wheel, so don't brake too hard while you jump a bump or the rear wheel will skid! That,s especially important if the road is likely to be slippery, because at that time, one should favour the rear brake.
– Climbs in the snow. Actually, that's a welcome challenge. My pedal stroke has become much more even because of that. Call that a year-round benefit.
tfahrner
10-06-06, 01:05 AM
Try riding up a icy hill, your going to miss that weight on the back tire. There are many reason for waiting your body weight on the back tire.
On a regular bike, climbing a very steep grade usually means getting out of the saddle and standing on the pedals, to keep from lifting the front wheel as well as more torque. This shifts your weight forward, unweighting the rear wheel while your likely somewhat choppy standing pedal strokes test the limits of traction. On an Xtracycle, you remain seated to keep the center of gravity nearer the rear wheel for maximum traction, and spin more smoothly up, or pull on the bars as hard as you need for torque; you won't lift the front wheel except in the most extreme cases.
It's true that hard braking on the flat can cause the rear wheel to skid much more easily than with a typical bike. So you learn to go easy on the rear brake: problem solved.
geeklpc1985
10-07-06, 02:07 PM
On a regular bike, climbing a very steep grade usually means getting out of the saddle and standing on the pedals, to keep from lifting the front wheel as well as more torque...
How I go up steep grades, is gear down a little, stay seated, and pump evenly. You will learn fast not to stand up, with ice and snow, with out the weight, your going no ware fast.
guruguhan
10-08-06, 03:42 PM
What advantages do you see an xtracycle specific frame (Big Dummy) having over a converted bike? Vice versa?
How many of you have debated between an xtracycle and extrawheel? The extrawheel seems pretty good, and I like that it can be removed/added as needed. I don't know how it compares in the load category though. I've never ridden with one either....
The Human Car
10-09-06, 01:26 AM
What advantages do you see an xtracycle specific frame (Big Dummy) having over a converted bike? Vice versa?
My understanding is the main advantage of the Xtracycle specific frame is that people can walk into a store see it, buy it and then ride it home all in one day.
How many of you have debated between an xtracycle and extrawheel? The extrawheel seems pretty good, and I like that it can be removed/added as needed. I don't know how it compares in the load category though. I've never ridden with one either....
The Extrawheel looks good as do a lot of one wheel trailers but if you want to max out your carrying capacity and still have a single wheel track nothing comes close to an Xtracycle. Keep in mind with an Xtracycle you not only have the two side areas to load but you can load things on top as well.
A story just to show the possibilities of an Xtracycle; I took a trip with my son and some of his friends on the C&O and we thought bringing real food would be fun so besides the regular camping/touring gear I also brought a cooler filled with ice and food stuffs on my Xtracycle. During the trip one of the kids racks breaks so I ended up just putting his panniers and sleeping bag on top of my Xtracycle and we kept going. My guess is I had something like 110-150lbs of gear I was caring.
The way I look at it is most single wheel trailers give you enough capacity as a large extended trip backpack. If this capacity will fit your needs and you like the convenience of taking it off then go for it. If you are after something as a car replacement or something like a deluxe RV in the world of bike touring then the Xtracycle rocks.
I used to have a Yakama trailer (similar to the BOB.) While this was a great trailer it had a limit of what it could carry that was way less then what I could haul. I will not go back to using one after having tried an Xtracycle. But to answer your question, I looked at a lot of trailers before I decided on getting the Xtracycle and there really is nothing else that comes close but then again caring over a 60-80lbs of stuff on a bike is not everyone’s cup of tea either so it can be over kill for some people.
catatonic
10-09-06, 05:42 AM
Getting out of the seat is for racerboys. Do enough adverse terrain conditions, and you learn to stay in the saddle, since your butt now becomes a stabilizer of sorts...it keeps the bike aligned properly in the vertical plane to avoid washouts.
I don't see much evil from this on hills though, especially growing up in a hilly area. the added forward weight will allow you to hammer on the hills, instead of waste energy trying to keep the front wheel in place.
I'd like to see if two freeradicals can be mounted to each other.....kind of a bicycle-bus of sorts.
turtle77
10-09-06, 08:45 AM
My two cents:
I'm going to get an Xtracycle. The reason - I'm normally not going to want to cruise around with an empty trailer clangin' behind me, so I'll take it off. Then, inevitably, I'll end up somewhere without my bob trailer, or whatever and I'll realize that I want to haul something home and I'll not have my extra cargo space with me. That will never be an issue with an Xtracycle.
cerewa
10-09-06, 08:50 AM
I'd like to see if two freeradicals can be mounted to each other.....kind of a bicycle-bus of sorts.
I bet you could, and i bet you'd also wind up breaking something because the more distance you put between the wheels, the more stress you put on the middle of the bike.
atman
10-09-06, 09:03 AM
It's true that hard braking on the flat can cause the rear wheel to skid much more easily than with a typical bike. So you learn to go easy on the rear brake: problem solved.
I should maybe not confess this, but I've come to use the skid to 'rudder steer' in tight places like between lanes of traffic. I run skinny tires and when I have a light load I can easily push the wheel a little, more than making up for the high turning radius of the bike, because my rear brake (kool stop fwiw) will reliably skid the wheel.
I simply don't have experience running in the winter yet, but I'll be putting some phatty tires on and trying it out soon enough. I'll let y'all know how it goes: we have plenty of ice and snow here, if not so many hills. I already sense, having ridden both types extensively, that the long wheelbase of an xtracycle is more the kind of balance I want on marginal terrain, and I already "get" how to lean into the rear wheel for more traction where needed.
catatonic
10-09-06, 11:34 AM
I bet you could, and i bet you'd also wind up breaking something because the more distance you put between the wheels, the more stress you put on the middle of the bike.
Ture, but I figured a good DH hardtail would be a suitable frame for this kind of abuse....just get a rigid fork long enough and have at it. Those things take insane levels of abuse.
nebben123
10-10-06, 06:27 AM
How long did it take you to get your Xtracycle? I ordered mine a week and a half ago and they still haven't shipped it (even though they charged my credit card). I also can't seem to get an answer on their 1-888 number.
Ben
The Human Car
10-11-06, 02:37 AM
The 700c kit has been out of stock for a while and should be in now or soon (I also have (another) one on order) so they are probably swamped right now trying to get orders out.
Try emailing info@xtracycle.com if you can’t get through on the phone.
guruguhan
10-11-06, 06:53 PM
A backrest for the extracycle (since they have the footsies, seems like a good addition) would be nice. Something simple and lightweight.
edit: errr, I mean xtracycle (sorry guys!) :)
nebben123
10-11-06, 09:47 PM
It turns out that the Xtracycle people are swamped with orders AND they had some kind of "system failure" -- not sure if they meant with their computers, or their suppliers, or what. But they told me that usually they ship out next day. My order has been 10 days in the queue so far, and they swear it's shipping out tomorrow.
Ben
The Human Car
10-11-06, 11:14 PM
A backrest for the extracycle (since they have the footsies, seems like a good addition) would be nice. Something simple and lightweight.
Not a bad idea but I’m looking for a good padded snap deck first then I'll consider a backrest.
atman
10-12-06, 07:15 AM
How about just getting a stadium seat and putting it on the snapdeck, with the weight of the passenger holding it in place? I've had no problems padding the snapdeck with a piece of fleece...
Nice that the xtracycle phenomenon is finally blowing up. The Surly frame will be another major step in that direction.