Maybe for the stupid people of NJ.

http://www.nj.com/news/ledger/jersey/index.ssf?/base/news-5/116132341699370.xml&coll=1

With lawyer lips, they are defeated already, how much more do you need.
And if a person can't close a QR, what makes you think they can attach a wheel with a wrench?

Stupid people should not breed.

Oh, brother. They already require that the QR AND the screw side have to be loosened to remove a wheel, which is a pain enough as it is. In the good ol' days you could just open the QR and pop off the wheel. Nowadays the dropouts are modified (widened) so that the wheel can't come off with just the QR skewer opened... you also have to loosen the screw end a few revolutions. And now they want to make it even more of a pain?

The fork dropout on my wife's Cannondale hybrid is so wide that there are barely a few threads left once it's been unscrewed far enough to allow the axle out. In fact, it usually comes off in my hand and more than once I've have to scrounge around on the ground for that conical spring. Huge PITA.

Since the proposed bill only applies to newly sold bikes, it seems to me that it would be cheaper, easier, and much more effective to require every purchaser of a new bike to be instructed how to properly use a QR, or sign a release that he or she already knows.

Oh boy I can't wait to see my first "locked" QR....lawd almighty make it stop.

A friend of mine is a consulting engineer who often serves as an expert witness for the defense (bicycle mfg's) in product liability cases. An enormous majority of those cases are quick-release related. Methinks that manufacturers of most inexpensive (sub-$500) bikes, and all bikes sold in department stores, should have nutted axles. Most buyers of cheap bikes don't know, don't learn, and don't want to learn enough about them to use a quick release safely. In the 1970's, Schwinn changed a couple of models from QR to nutted axles when their customer data revealed that the average buyer of a Continental was 12 years old. If manufacturers can't let go of this minor bell-and-whistle, they'll find the government doing it for them--and for all the rest of us! Bootleg quick releases from Canada, anyone?

*starts hording QRs for distribution south*

"...although some consumer advocates suggest the technology is flawed because riders can fail to reattach the wheels correctly."

Sheesh.

How about cars are fundamentally flawed because some people fail to back out of their driveways correctly.

Pretty soon you are gonna have release forms in public restrooms to limit liability should you fail to take a dump properly and fall.

And you think I am kidding.

We have already seen lawsuits because coffee is too hot, fast food is too fattening...

-D

to think litigation might be contributing to over population

Nowadays the dropouts are modified (widened) so that the wheel can't come off with just the QR skewer opened... you also have to loosen the screw end a few revolutions. And now they want to make it even more of a pain?
Oh, the horror, the horror...

Don't worry, just inform the legislators that QR's are dangerous only if equipped on bikes sold at dept stores and x-mart. Bikes at LBS are only sold by dedicated servants of the public to bicycle craftsmen.

The obvious solution: ban the sale of bikes from any outlet disapproved by the BF shop guys.

I would prefer they put the plain old nuts back on. It's a pain in the ass to have to take your bike apart and bring the pieces with you whenever you go somewhere.

Of course I never do that. I just leave my bike as is and hope it's still there when I get back.

Oh, the horror, the horror...

Don't worry, just inform the legislators that QR's are dangerous only if equipped on bikes sold at dept stores and x-mart. Bikes at LBS are only sold by dedicated servants of the public to bicycle craftsmen.

The obvious solution: ban the sale of bikes from any outlet disapproved by the BF shop guys.
I nominate this post for the A&S non-sequitor context.

I would prefer they put the plain old nuts back on. It's a pain in the ass to have to take your bike apart and bring the pieces with you whenever you go somewhere.

Of course I never do that. I just leave my bike as is and hope it's still there when I get back.
Right. Because bike thieves don't carry wrenches. :rolleyes:

A number of deaths have occurred recently when walkers have been led over cliffs by their boots. Assemblyman IMA Numpty has proposed that all hiker boots be equipped with a flashing sign on the toecap warning people of the dangers inherent in walking off cliff edges.

Opposition Assemblyman Wat Apillock stated that this did not go far enough. Those boots sold at Walmarts should have a picture of a typical cliff on the box and the purchaser should sign a form indemnifying Walmarts against its customers should they fall over a cliff.

Representative Alf Wit added a clause forbidding yachtsmen, sorry, yachtspeople, from wearing JordanAirs baseball boots on board, as several people have fallen overboard and drowned because of an inability to right themselves. \he further pointed out that, if there were 6' tall barriers round the deck edges of yachts, vry few peopl would fall overboard.

A subclause requiring notices being carved into decks, saying that water can drown you, was rejected on the grounds that free, independent and self responsible Americans had no need of such absurd legislation

I would prefer they put the plain old nuts back on. It's a pain in the ass to have to take your bike apart and bring the pieces with you whenever you go somewhere.

Of course I never do that. I just leave my bike as is and hope it's still there when I get back.

You can get these bolt-on skewers (http://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?category=135&subcategory=1175&brand=&sku=8197&storetype=&estoreid=&pagename=Shop%20by%20Subcat%3A%20Skewers) from Nashbar if you don't like QRs. Or you can always have a solid axle swapped in at the LBS. Of course, it still won't protect against a thief with a wrench.

Oh, brother. They already require that the QR AND the screw side have to be loosened to remove a wheel, which is a pain enough as it is. In the good ol' days you could just open the QR and pop off the wheel. Nowadays the dropouts are modified (widened) so that the wheel can't come off with just the QR skewer opened... you also have to loosen the screw end a few revolutions. And now they want to make it even more of a pain?

Total BS... guess these folks don't fully understand what QR really means.

Neither of my 22+ year old bikes that DON'T have lawyer lips have ever failed me, and no other bike that I owned before that, ever failed me. Seems to me the problem is not the mechanism... but something else... perhaps the user?

Lawyer lips! Never heard that. Love it!

Here's Sheldon's explanation:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_l.html#lawyer

Oh, the horror, the horror...

Don't worry, just inform the legislators that QR's are dangerous only if equipped on bikes sold at dept stores and x-mart. Bikes at LBS are only sold by dedicated servants of the public to bicycle craftsmen.

The obvious solution: ban the sale of bikes from any outlet disapproved by the BF shop guys.

Oh com'on this is a dumb consumer issue... if folks cannot take the time to learn that coffee is hot and quick releases mean "quick release..." jeeze how much babysitting of the American public do we have to do?

Next thing you know they will be complaining because the seatbelts are the wrong color... or worse, the release button "concept" is not universal.

RTFM folks.

How many dumb consumer issues have then gone on to drive changes to manufacturing simply to avoid litigation? Waaaay too many.

I nominate this post for the A&S non-sequitor context.

Seconded. And I do this with full knowledge of the ILTB&HH "feud."

Look, I just got through giving the "office loaner bikes" a minor tune up. One of them had a flat. These were purchased by our facilities manager for the occasional visiting engineer to use at their discretion. (we are close to a beach) The facilities manager asked if I could take a look at the bikes (she knows I am avid cyclist).

These things came from the x-mart store in such poor shape that my first suggestion was "throw them away."

Of course that didn't go over well. So I took a look, and the first thing I noticed was that the brake pads were worse than any old dia-comp brake shoes I personally had ever used. The brake pad compound was roughly equalivant to the eraser on a #2 pencil. On one of the bikes, the brakes were adjusted such that they NEVER worked. I replaced all the pads with Kool stop pads... then warned the facilities manager that one good stop would probably bend the "stamped" brake arms to the point that it would render the brakes unusable.

The shifters were an interesting mix of index and friction... the levers make clicking sounds, like an index shifter, but there are no real "stops," and the levers movement does not co-ordinate with the shifter... hence they are "clicking" friction shifters... now why would they do that? To "fool" the public, perhaps?

And of course these are fat tire bikes with knobby tires, and a printed warning on the downtube telling you that these bikes are "not for offroad use."

Shall I go on about the "quality" of the rest of the bike? Lets put it this way... if they were cars... you would tie ropes across your waist, to use as seatbelts and stop Flintstone style.

ILTB may have visions about the "quality" of x-mart bikes, but the reality is that these sucked. Period.

Perhaps their only redeeming quality is they did not have QR.

The QR thing seems odd to me. There are many (all?) parts of a bike that that can be dangerous if not used correctly. Why single out the quick release?

I think it's got something to do with the mental image of the front wheel rolling away.... :lol:

How do you screw up a QR? i'm kinda a noob but don't you point the lever straight out, or a little more obtuse, then tighten the nut as tight as you can, then press the lever in untill its in line with the fork? thats how i do it and no problems yet, oh and make sure the axle is all the way in the dropouts. perhaps someone should come out with super easy and powerful QRs, like just a button that goes "ka-ching!" and pops the wheel out like a slice of toast! hehe

I suggest that axles on all new bike be required by law to be welded to the fork. This also has the side benefit of ensuring all wheel and tire repair can only be done by a qualified technican at a bicycle shop with proper metal cutting and welding tools. After all front wheel tire failure from improper installation is a known cause of cyclist crash that can lead to death and serious injury.

Al

Here's my guess: Mom and Dad buy Kid an X-mart bike for his birthday. Kid, being a kid, takes it over a sweet jump. Because the QR wasn't properly closed, either by Kid, his Dad, or the X-mart bike assembler, the front wheel falls off. Kid loses his front teeth. Mom and Dad, upset at the thousands of dollars wasted on orthodontia (not to mention the scores of dollars wasted on the bike itself), look for someone to blame.

And who do they blame? Not Dad, not Kid, not X-mart bike assembler. No, they blame this man, this menace to society:

http://www.campyonly.com/images/cda_pass.jpg

Tullio Campagnolo, inventor of the quick release.

.....and when are the bar mounted air bags coming out?

How do you screw up a QR? i'm kinda a noob but don't you point the lever straight out, or a little more obtuse, then tighten the nut as tight as you can, then press the lever in untill its in line with the fork? thats how i do it and no problems yet, oh and make sure the axle is all the way in the dropouts. perhaps someone should come out with super easy and powerful QRs, like just a button that goes "ka-ching!" and pops the wheel out like a slice of toast! hehe


If you look at enough craigslist ads, you'll see that some folks think they are wingnuts.

I thought it was wingnuts that can't figure out a QR

.....and when are the bar mounted air bags coming out?
After the seatbelts.

you know it's gonna happen
http://img326.imageshack.us/img326/4355/airbaggoldwingzg6.jpg

It will embedded in our clothing similar to the inflatable crash suit Y.T. wears in Snow Crash, but she goes right off a cliff and bounces down to safety, so if I can get one of those I'm all for it. :lol:

How do you screw up a QR? i'm kinda a noob but don't you point the lever straight out, or a little more obtuse, then tighten the nut as tight as you can, then press the lever in untill its in line with the fork? thats how i do it and no problems yet, oh and make sure the axle is all the way in the dropouts. perhaps someone should come out with super easy and powerful QRs, like just a button that goes "ka-ching!" and pops the wheel out like a slice of toast! hehe

Actually, if you do it the way you wrote, and your hands are strong enough, you can trash your bearings. If you tightened the nut as tight as you could before you closed the lever, you'd be putting too much force on the bearings when you closed the QR.

With the lever straight out, turn the nut to the point it starts to get snug, then close the lever. It should take some effort to push down the lever, but not so tight you have to mash it.

I vaguely remember little stamped metal clips at one point on some bike that attached to fork end and went around axle to help retain. Is my memory playing tricks on me?

Al

I though it was wingnuts that can't figure out a QR

+10

I vaguely remember little stamped metal clips at one point on some bike that attached to fork end and went around axle to help retain. Is my memory playing tricks on me?

Al

Nah, they exist... they are on my son's heavy Haro bike, which has nutted axles anyway.

But I suppose there was some lawyer, somewhere... Sheesh...

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This product is meant for educational purposes only. Any resemblance to real persons, living or dead is purely coincidental. Void where prohibited. Some assembly required. List each check separately by bank number. Batteries not included. Contents may settle during shipment. Use only as directed. No other warranty expressed or implied. Do not use while operating a motor vehicle or heavy equipment. Postage will be paid by addressee. Subject to CAB approval. This is not an offer to sell securities. Apply only to affected area. May be too intense for some viewers. Do not stamp. Use other side for additional listings. For recreational use only. Do not disturb. All models over 18 years of age. If condition persists, consult your physician. No user-serviceable parts inside. Freshest if eaten before date on carton. Subject to change without notice. Times approximate. Simulated picture. No postage necessary if mailed in the United States. Breaking seal constitutes acceptance of agreement. For off-road use only. As seen on TV. One size fits all. Many suitcases look alike. Contains a substantial amount of non-tobacco ingredients. Colors may, in time, fade. We have sent the forms which seem to be right for you. Slippery when wet. For office use only. Not affiliated with the American Red Cross. Drop in any mailbox. Edited for television. Keep cool; process promptly. Post office will not deliver without postage. List was current at time of printing. Return to sender, no forwarding order on file, unable to forward. Not responsible for direct, indirect, incidental or consequential damages resulting from any defect, error or failure to perform. At participating locations only. Not the Beatles.

Nah, they exist... they are on my son's heavy Haro bike, which has nutted axles anyway.

But I suppose there was some lawyer, somewhere... Sheesh...
I just found this with an internet search...

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4103922.html

and
http://www.bikepartsusa.com/product_images/mfg_01/3/full_37113.jpg

Al

I just found this with an internet search...

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/4103922.html

and
http://www.bikepartsusa.com/product_images/mfg_01/3/full_37113.jpg

Al

Yup, exactly... and notice the threaded axle in the pic... nothing like a belt with those suspenders, eh?

I say let the QR slowly cull the herd.

Yup, exactly... and notice the threaded axle in the pic... nothing like a belt with those suspenders, eh?
I think the retaining clip needs a screw to hold it in place better. With a clip to prevent the screw from becoming undone of course.

Al

Gawd...... *covers his eyes*

Gawd...... *covers his eyes*
They would work with QR.

Release, unscrew enough to clear lawer lipos and give enough gap to laterally pop top tab of retaining clip from hole in fork, reverse procedure to put in.

Just be happy, at least the axle may not have to be welded to the fork!

If these were put on new bikes with QR, the only downside (and a big one for many) would be the hole in the fork, since after all one would not have to use the retaining clips, unlike lawer lips which are permanent.

Al

I've seen this kind of thing on kids bike's. The darned thing completely negates the QR if it's screwed on.

Oh and he's waved for a new wheel....this is going to be close if he doesn't get off quickly.....oh and the technician is having trouble with the little wheel hooky thingy and can't get the wheel off, this is gonna cost him in the overall standings. :lol:

My 1984 Centurion doesn't have any of this garbage (lips, clips) on the forks.

It actually makes me more thoughtful about ensuring I have the QR properly closed compared to my new Lemond with lips. (Which I still check, but am not as 'uptight' about checking)

Al

Stupid people should not breed.

My parents were both smart, yet here I am! :eek: :D

A number of deaths have occurred recently when walkers have been led over cliffs by their boots. Assemblyman IMA Numpty has proposed that all hiker boots be equipped with a flashing sign on the toecap warning people of the dangers inherent in walking off cliff edges.

Opposition Assemblyman Wat Apillock stated that this did not go far enough. Those boots sold at Walmarts should have a picture of a typical cliff on the box and the purchaser should sign a form indemnifying Walmarts against its customers should they fall over a cliff.

They could use this sign...

http://www.neebu.net/~khuon/albums/fort_casey/IMAGE_170.sized.jpg

post a sign and you are off the hook baby!!!!!

Lawyer lips! Never heard that.

You're kidding, right? Sheeat HH, I used to think you and I ran about neck and neck in the out-of-touch department, but I think you just edged into a clear lead! :p

My parents were both smart, yet here I am! :eek: :D
Given the direction the law of averages is pulling relative to where your parents were on the intelligence scale, that does not bode well for you... :eek:

Given the direction the law of averages is pulling relative to where your parents were on the intelligence scale, that does not bode well for you... :eek:

I'm quite proud of the fact that I get dumber with age, ignorance is bliss and I am approaching being at least comfortably numb. :D

They would work with QR.

Release, unscrew enough to clear lawer lipos and give enough gap to laterally pop top tab of retaining clip from hole in fork, reverse procedure to put in.

Just be happy, at least the axle may not have to be welded to the fork!

If these were put on new bikes with QR, the only downside (and a big one for many) would be the hole in the fork, since after all one would not have to use the retaining clips, unlike lawer lips which are permanent.

Al

I actually used to have a bike with a retainer like this. It was before the "Lawyer Lips", and it was a clip--one side of which slipped around the axle between the fork and the QR nub and the other side had a pin which slipped into the fender brazeon.