Road Cycling - HELP !! My shoes hit the front wheel.

Hello eveybody. I have a problem with my new Lemond bike. It is a small size frame 49 cm center to center, and my shoes hit the front wheel really bad when I try to take a turn. This only happens of course when the pedals are in the foremost 3' o clock position. I used SPD pedals and tried to adjust them to the position where the shoes are as far back as possible but they still hit the front wheel quite bad. I tried Speedplay pedals too and the problem got a little better but still serious. The cranks are 170 mm Shimano Ultegra.
What can I do? I do not want to ride like this, since it is very dangerous. I can not really take a steep turn when at the same time I pedal.
Thanks for any help.

That is a problem that all of us (well...at least ones with smaller frames) must deal with

You can always go with smaller wheels (i think)
When you're turning, try to learn how to 'lean' into the turn

I have a 57, and my toes hit the front wheel. I have 175 cranks, though

BTW, it is a Lemond

How bad is the toe overlap? If its only a CM or so, I wouldnt worry about it. A small change in your riding habbit should solve the problem. If its much more, I would look into it further.

170mm cranks sound large for a 49cm size. You may want to look into crank length. If you are a shorter rider, you may be better off with a 165 or 167.5.

i think you just have to get used to not turning the steering wheel so sharply
i agree with kenneth that you should try using body lean to steer, so you don't turn the handlebar as much
but yeah 49 is a small frame size (i have a 50) so it's something you have to learn to live with

Any way you can bring it back to the bike shop for a slightly larger frame (seeing as though it's still new and all)?

Koffee Brown - I don't think it's a matter of the bike being too small for him that's causing the rubbing problem - I think the issue is just that small frames tend to have shorter wheelbases and so your feet are closer to the rear of the front tire.

That's why alot of the ultra-small bikes use 650c tires instead - easier to give rider adequate standover clearance without akward changes to geometry

The toe overlap is a lttle more than an inch. It is quite bad. True, it only happens when I turn really sharp but I do not feel safe riding like that.
What is the best pedal-shoe combination to minimize and if possible solve the problem?

This sounds like a truly boneheaded engineering flaw to me. Did lemond even investigate the geometry and how it will work with an actual rider? I'd be getting another bike and a refund If I were you.

Before you suggest he take it back for a refund and haul off and tag Lemond with the problem. If you read his earlier posting you'd know this was a frame he built up himself.

Sounds to me like two issues.
1. You're all correct - smaller frames are prone to have some trouble with this based on the geometry.
2. I'd ventrure that the crank size on that 49cm frame is too big. If I had a chance to take anything back - I would look into the crank. All the shoe/pedel combinations in the world won't help if the pedel itself is nearly hitting the wheel in a turning situation.

Perhaps someone out there has a 49cm Lemond (check model)
who could measure their crank and suggest a correct size for him?

even steep turns taken at speed shouldn't require more than a few single-digit degrees of deflection in the handlebar, if you're leaning enough. Maybe you're turning real slow and tight? My shoes will ALWAYS rub my front tire if i turn the handlebar 20 degrees or more. But I never do that... I think you just need to get used to that fact, and you will with time on the bike.

i don't think there is ANY pedal-shoe combination that can solve that. you can try to get a fork with more offset, but even that has its own problems.

you might feel like it's "unsafe"... but people say the same exact thing about clipless pedals.... once you get used to using them, it's like second nature

I have a 54cm Fuji Roubaix and have the same issue. I have a "Small" Specialized Sirrus Sport (which I'm trying to sell, BTW) and have the same issue. I think this is an issue with a lot of bikes.

You just have to learn to put the inside pedal down and lean your body as you turn......Meaning if you're going to turn right, put your left pedal at 6 o'clock and lean right.

I think this becomes a much bigger issue if you ride slowly in the city where you have to negotiate heavy traffic.

The slower you move, the sharper you can turn.....and the greater the possibility of having toe overlap (and falling and getting runned over by taxis).

It's just a fact of life really. Small frames equal shorter wheelbases which leads to less clearance. Not much can be done about it. It isn't like Lemond can just go off and lengthen the front end up to take care of it, then the bike would be way to long for you. Best thing to do is just to be aware of it.

Welcome to the small-stature cycling club... I've never owned a 700c road bike "that fit" and that didn't have a toe overlap issue. Just accept the fact that unless you're willing to go to a 650c wheeled bike you'll always have some toe overlap on a very small 700c bike.

I'll second what others have already told you regarding the probability of having a problem; it's low and avoidable -- don't fart around doing figure 8's in parking lots, etc..

Remember, man figured out how to shoot machine guns through spinning propellers...

The smaller distance between the wheel and the front of the crank arm is 42 mm. I have the front wheel turned slightly to the left to obtain this clearance.

I have the same thing with my road bike..My MTB is no problem, but it has a longer wheel base. I tried out a 58 cm road bike and still have toe over-lap, so I figured I'd get a small frame instead since a big frame didn't fix the toe-overlap issue.

The only time it's a problem is when I'm going real slow and need to turn sharp. But I practiced ratcheting in that situation rather than pedalling a full stroke, and that solved the sharp turn problem for me.

The problem is that for such a small frame, there is no way the wheel-base can be long enough without being a wierd geometry.

Toe-clip overlap is not such a problem on racing bikes, since you cant turn the bars far when riding at high speed, but for town riding and touring, it can be dangerous. Most times you can remember to get your pedal out of the way, but when your brain has to deal with a corner, a pothole AND a bad driver, something gets forgotten.
TCO is quite avoidable if small frames were designed with small wheels and small cranks, ie smaller versions of medium sized bikes.
If you want to solve the problem on this frame, you could start with shorter cranks (ie the correct size for your shorter legs).
In the UK, toe-clip overlap is not permitted on production bikes (but is on custom frames). Check your consumer bike law, and if TCO is illegal, return the bike.

Lets get back to basics here.
Greekboy can you provide the following details please.
metres would be prefered

your height
your inseam
your foot size
your sternum notch height (height from the floor to the top of your sternum.
current crank length
Are the cleats positioned as far forward as posible?

An inch overlap sounds too much.
There are things you can do to minimise it.

1) Get a fork with more rake. This will increase trail and make the bike harder to turn
2) Shorter cranks
3) smaller wheels
4) surgically have your toes removed and cryogenically frozen for reattachment at a later date
5)

I have the same issue on my road bike. Being my first, I just assumed it was a problem inherent with road geometry.
The overlap is approx. three quarters of an inch. the bike is a 58cm, % 175mm cranks, and I wear a 44.5 shoe. I've learned to live with it. So it has never been an issue, nor ever caused me any problems. :D

funny

I ride a 52cm cdale and I only have about a quarter of an inch overlap

I would've thought that smaller frames w. the same 700CC wheels would have greater overlap than larger frames.

Jeez. I don't like the idea of having the toe overlap outlawed.

Add me to the "it's a fact of life" group. During an occasional brain seizure, I will fail to move my foot out of the way of the wheel. Thus reminded, I angle the offending foot tippy-toe, allowing the wheel to clear.

Fubar and Roadbuzz have it right. I would thing most people have this problem. I have a 62cm Trek and if I turn to sharply with my pedal at three o'clock I know that I am going to hit the tire. So, I have learned to not have my foot there except in the middle of a mind fart. Also how often does this happen, I cannot safely move my handlebars that far except at a very slow speed.

I just investigated to see if my toe would ever touch. I found that my 59cm LeMond also allows the front tire to intercept my toes. I didn't know this however, because it has never happened to me while riding in the last 4 years I've had the bike. My point (as others have mentioned): you can obviously ride without any problems - and it can become an unconscious habit.

My small Giant TCR Comp doesn't do this but the bike I had before does (80s TREK). Maybe it's a compact frame thing or as a woman my shoes are shorter. Always thought it was a pain changing slow turn styles between mountain and road.

I have a 2002 Apollo RD Z2000 and it is a 23" (57/58cm?) and size 47 shoes. I am about 5' 11"? I have about an ENTIRE INCH of clearance :p

Brendon
:beer:

That's very common on small framed bikes. The issue is that people who need a short seat tube also need a short top tube. That pulls the front wheel closer to the crank.

The alternatives each have their own set of problems. You can design a frame with a very upright seat tube or a very layed back head tube, but either of these will upset the geometry and balance of the bike. One solution is to build a bike with smaller diameter wheels. Georgena terry has built a reputation on building bikes with small front wheels especially to fit women.

The good news is that toe overlap only becomes a problem at very low speeds. You'll ride all day and never have an issue. The bad news is that it'll bite you in the parking lot at the end of your ride while everybody is looking.