View Full Version : Coldest rides, are they really that challenging?
jakub.ner
12-12-06, 06:36 AM
Every year I find a sticky on the coldest ride etc. etc..
Personally I don't find cold to be that much of a deterrant or threat. The coldest I've ridden in is -25C or perhaps -30C: perhaps that's not cold enough. But that is by far much much easier than riding on a day from anywhere between +5C to 0C after a really heavy snowfall. You cannot get anywhere in melting snow. The front tire digs in. The rear tire slips no matter what tread.
I'm talking about stuff that has been packed down in parks by peds. When it's hard and the temperature is frigid this stuff is bumpy but you can ride it fast. When it starts melting you're pushing. And I mean fairly wide tires (26" Hakkas) on OK rims with low pressure.
Is the cold really a good metric of your perserverence? I'd argue the much less glamorous dirty melting deep snow is.
ghettocruiser
12-12-06, 07:35 AM
Hmm. London Ontario. Deep melting snow. Why do you bring this up. :D
I dunno. My take on those threads is that those who post to them are chest-thumping more than anything else. Bragging rights are have their place. Most of the people (in real life) that I talk with, even cyclists, seem to be more in fear of the cold or concerned with comfort factors. Those that make a big thing of it--either way--are probably comparing winter cycling to riding in a car that's been warmed-up for 20 minutes and has heated seats.
Somewhere in the middle are folks like us who just go out and ride. I don't really have a lot of choice in the matter. If I want to go to work, or grocery shopping or whatever, I can either stand in a snowdrift and wait for a bus to come along, or ride my bike. (Alternatively, I suppose I could spend big bucks on a cab.) Either way, I'm out in the same cold, so it's not a big thing for me.
That said, it's my first season cycling. I have fun, and face new challenges on every single ride--warm, cold, dry, wet or snowing--so I don't see it as any more or any less challenging than any other ride.
The coldest I've ridden so far is the coldest we've gotten so far, 14F, -10C. I preferred the road conditions that day to the melting on the following day, although the slop dripped off the bike faster on the melting day.
My biggest challenge has been staying cool enough. I'm still overdressing a bit. On that 14F day, I was dressed like I would have been for the bus in the mid-40sF, 5-10C. I'll get it figured out.
I never found bitterly cold commutes or other short rides all that challenging ... just a few minutes longer and a few extra clothes than other rides.
Cold centuries, however ... http://www.machka.net/brevet/Coldest_Century.htm
But, I think my second longest century was one in December in Winnipeg, right after a pretty heavy snowfall. All morning, I was walking the bicycle through huge snowdrifts until about 11 am when the road crews came out and cleared it. Then in the afternoon it warmed up to about +2, and there was slush everywhere ... I was soaked!
legot73
12-12-06, 02:15 PM
+1 on the chest thumping comment. There are too many variables to compare only temp such as length/duration of the commute, wind, road conditions, etc. Case in point, I don't think I would have been comfortable with my coldest ride so far if it took twice as long, and I certainly could have handled much colder (dressed that way) if the distance were cut in half. Either way, I could adjust clothing quite a bit to suit either case.
The biggest barrier IMHO is the sticky cables, which seem to be especially daunting on my internal hub shifting. As tsl said, it all gets better with experience. If the chest thumping is over ability gained by experience, then thump away and I'm all ears. If it's over pure bravado, then, well... I'm happy for you.
Ernesto Schwein
12-12-06, 02:17 PM
το τέλος αυτού
vger285
12-12-06, 02:32 PM
Well i dunno but if i can get out and get my heart rate up to 150+ ,suck in some fresh air and feel good about myself, yea, im gonna go for that! Course some of you might be better off at home in the recliner watching NFL or whatever, different strokes,(just go out and turn the crank,no crying towels permitted!)
BenyBen
12-12-06, 03:00 PM
Well, I'm fairly new at winter commuting, and last year was my first "serious" winter commuting year. I can say that cold HAS been challenging just in terms of finding the right combination of gear to wear with not too much money. Especially since I tend to sweat buckets, and then the cold seeps in.
That said, I'm not keen on thumping my chest after riding in the cold. I'm just saying cold can be a real pain (and even dangerous) if you ain't prepared.
Cosmoline
12-12-06, 03:22 PM
I fear the Chinook winds more than the cold. Ice and cold air are easy to deal with, but when all of it turns to slush it's almost impossible to get through.
rousseau
12-12-06, 05:19 PM
Especially since I tend to sweat buckets, and then the cold seeps in.
This, to my mind, is the key issue. This is my first winter of winter riding, and while I'm enjoying it immensely, all the sweat that otherwise would evaporate in the wind now gets collected underneath the so-called wicking material I'm wearing, and I'm soaked by mid-ride. Indeed, while today was a fairly nice day at 8 degrees (46F), I experienced a gunshot blowout near the end of my ride (tire rated for 100 psi, but I preferred the hardness of 120 psi--I've learned my lesson now!), and ended up in a pickup truck and then in the LBS while the guys examined my tire and wheel and replaced the tube for me. In that 1/2 hour of sitting and standing around I cooled right off, making the subsequent ride home something of a shiverfest. I'm surprised I didn't get pneumonia.
And while I really enjoyed the week of sub-zero temps we had a while back, I was only able to handle about a half-hour each time, tops. The fingers and the toes froze, while the core was steaming. All in all, I still prefer temps above 25! Give me Spain, I say!
jakub.ner
12-12-06, 05:51 PM
Cool , thanks for the responses. What a pleasure to read after looking at A&S :).
Machka, that's inspiring: the century.
I actually prefer the colder temperatures as the snow pack is harder and more consistent to ride on. The chance of falling is less I feel.
I suppose Challenging is dependant on the conditions at the time. If it's -32C and windy, it can be very challenging. However so can slushy snow at -2C
Every year I find a sticky on the coldest ride etc. etc..
Personally I don't find cold to be that much of a deterrant or threat. The coldest I've ridden in is -25C or perhaps -30C: perhaps that's not cold enough. But that is by far much much easier than riding on a day from anywhere between +5C to 0C after a really heavy snowfall. You cannot get anywhere in melting snow. The front tire digs in. The rear tire slips no matter what tread.
I'm talking about stuff that has been packed down in parks by peds. When it's hard and the temperature is frigid this stuff is bumpy but you can ride it fast. When it starts melting you're pushing. And I mean fairly wide tires (26" Hakkas) on OK rims with low pressure.
Is the cold really a good metric of your perserverence? I'd argue the much less glamorous dirty melting deep snow is.
You are talking about two different issues here. So you aren't bothered by cold. Good for you. You might agree that most cyclists fold up the tent at the end of warm temps and don't ride in the cold. So you might want to ask...."why?" There are a lot of reasons, but none of them is because riding in the cold is easy. It isn't. With all they extra hassle of getting dressed, learning how to dress, occassional discomfort etc., it simply isn't an EASY thing to do. That doesn't mean i consider it hard either, just not easy.
Your second point is that it is hard to ride in deep wet snow. Well, that's sort of a no brainer. Yes it is hard, almost impossible at times. but that has to do with physics and is not a mental issue. Sometimes riding in the cold IS a mental issue.
Sometimes riding in the cold IS a mental issue.
Very Much So :beer: When it's -30C out, dark and windy, sometimes you have to dig deep and put your game face on :D
slacker00
12-13-06, 06:14 AM
Why do people climb Mount Everest? The challenge? The technical aspects of dealing with thin air? Plain adrenoline & thrill? Bragging rights? All of the above?
Same with cold weather cycling. Everyone's got a different reason or combination thereof.
Thing is, the cold weather climates don't offer a lot of options for outdoor cyclists during certain times of the year. I'm glad I don't live in Sask. Bad enough I haven't seen highs above 45 F for the last month. It could be worse.
Still, I'm pretty impressed that I can handle the 10F-45F range without much trouble anymore. Just a matter of dressing appropriately & mindset, as well as some technical aspects of dealing with the unique conditions in and around the freezing point. Yesterday I rode 6 miles @40F in shorts & T-shirt feeling plenty warm enough, so a little toughness is also seeping into my skin. I couldn't/wouldn't have done that 4 months ago. Then again, 40F is the warmest I've seen in a month.
jakub.ner
12-13-06, 06:20 AM
You are talking about two different issues here. ....
Yeah, perhaps I didn't convey what I was trying to say fully. When I say deterrent/threat I mean to my commute. I am super impressed with people who--for pure pleasure--go out on their bike and ride; but I was thinking more of my commute. I.e. before going out, if it's cold out, no matter how cold, it will not change my route nor the time it takes me to get where I'm going. Not so with wet snow. I also tried to explain I'm not talking about powder that is melting, but the packed stuff people walked on after a big snow fall: the stuff that when it's frozen rock solid, even though it is bumpy, makes for a fast ride.
That was the gist of my message.
Oh yeah, and riding in the cold is not easy, but relativelly, not much of a deterrant from going to work instead of working at home.
Very Much So :beer: When it's -30C out, dark and windy, sometimes you have to dig deep and put your game face on :D
Darn right, I'll thump my chest and feel virtuous about it as well. And do I ever feel great at the end of a ride like that, which is why I embrace getting on my bike at 5 a.m. in the dark and sailing off in those conditions...you feel like the rest of the day you can go out and conquer the world.
I.e. before going out, if it's cold out, no matter how cold, it will not change my route nor the time it takes me to get where I'm going.
Your are the only person i know that doesn't take longer to get somewhere in winter.
Very Much So :beer: When it's -30C out, dark and windy, sometimes you have to dig deep and put your game face on :D
sigh
its so warm up here this year... this thread makes me realize that i'm _seriously_ missing the snow and cold. after 5 years of winter commuting, i think i even like the darkness.... i cant wait to commute in snow. i miss the unique "city silence", especially when big flakes fall...
big snowflakes... any kind of snowflakes...sigh...
damn local global warming. what's the job market like in Anchorage?
the coldest ride thread also bugs me this year, because i'm just plain jealous...
sigh
its so warm up here this year... this thread makes me realize that i'm _seriously_ missing the snow and cold. after 5 years of winter commuting, i think i even like the darkness.... i cant wait to commute in snow. i miss the unique "city silence", especially when big flakes fall...
big snowflakes... any kind of snowflakes...sigh...
damn local global warming. what's the job market like in Anchorage?
the coldest ride thread also bugs me this year, because i'm just plain jealous...
A true Canadian, we take pride in the ability to suffer through long, dark and cold winters :lol:
Goretex and Powershield are different fabrics. Goretex is waterproof, Powershield is water repellant. I'm not going to argue the "breathing" aspects of fabric because i don't by into that so much. I've never seen any fabric that breathes.
Goretex and Powershield are different fabrics. Goretex is waterproof, Powershield is water repellant. I'm not going to argue the "breathing" aspects of fabric because i don't by into that so much. I've never seen any fabric that breathes.
Are you in the right thread?
A true Canadian, we take pride in the ability to suffer through long, dark and cold winters :lol:
well, yes, i do like winter. but that being said, we currently get a lot of cold and/or freezing rain these days... a few less degrees and it would be nice flakes falling... i find it a lot easier to dress up and enjoy my ride in sub-zero/non-liquid precipitations...
i think we all prefer very cold and snow to cold and rain... no?
caligurl
12-14-06, 10:10 AM
+1 on the chest thumping comment.
+3
well, yes, i do like winter. but that being said, we currently get a lot of cold and/or freezing rain these days... a few less degrees and it would be nice flakes falling... i find it a lot easier to dress up and enjoy my ride in sub-zero/non-liquid precipitations...
i think we all prefer very cold and snow to cold and rain... no?
Yes, I prefer the -45C cold we get here in Saskatchewan, it's cold, but it's a dry cold :D
http://www.sasktelwebsite.net/fung1/winter04a.jpg
Are you in the right thread?
Nope. Sorry.
Yes, I prefer the -45C cold we get here in Saskatchewan, it's cold, but it's a dry cold :D
nice picture...
today it's +10C with 80% humidity in Montreal.... (12 to 15 degrees above max average...) we are supposedly breaking a 30 year old record as i write this... it's the warmest december 14 since 1941.
nice picture...
today it's +10C with 80% humidity in Montreal.... (12 to 15 degrees above max average...) we are supposedly breaking a 30 year old record as i write this... it's the warmest december 14 since 1941.
Thanks, it was actually only -32C when I took that picture. Following is the complete set. It has been warm here too. Normally we get a few weeks in January & February of bleow -40C for weeks on end. Last year I think we dipped in to -36C for 1 or 2 days only, other than that, it was a mild winter for us too.
http://www.sasktelwebsite.net/fung1/winter04a.jpg
http://www.sasktelwebsite.net/fung1/bess.jpg
http://www.sasktelwebsite.net/fung1/stjohn.jpg
[QUOTE=ViperZ]Thanks, it was actually only -32C when I took that picture. QUOTE]
does the river ever freeze?
Gojohnnygo.
12-14-06, 01:48 PM
sigh
its so warm up here this year... this thread makes me realize that i'm _seriously_ missing the snow and cold. after 5 years of winter commuting, i think i even like the darkness.... i cant wait to commute in snow. i miss the unique "city silence", especially when big flakes fall...
big snowflakes... any kind of snowflakes...sigh...
damn local global warming. what's the job market like in Anchorage?
the coldest ride thread also bugs me this year, because i'm just plain jealous...
Plus 1
does the river ever freeze?
Not completely... The west side always remains open due to the warmer water being released from the Queen Elizabeth Power station. I have seen years were it was almost frozen over, there was just a sliver of open water.
http://img79.imageshack.us/img79/3431/defride7rf5.jpg
Here I'm up river about 4 Km on east side of the river. You can see the Power station.
Plus 1
i would totally agree with your "Plus 1" IF my post about the fact that i like to bike in winter wasnt done in a forum called "winter biking". :) if people here dont agree with this, the're what? car owner wannabees? masochists? Machka escaped a psychiatric hospital???
so based on this logic, i'm a +0 or just a 0 if you wish but you are "Minus 1".
that being said, i've been commuting ~6000km a year on the same 12.85km of road for 6 years (to work), so any kind of change is also welcomed (that includes winter and less smog).
and dont worry, in february, i'll be impatient to be in summer again...
and while i'm at it, thank you all for posting to to the cold ride threads, it sure convinced me that it's never too cold to ride... (especially a guy from Anchorage (years ago)).
cheers,
jaysee
montreal "non-winter-like wheater" update:
today, it's +12C degres (another record) and we have thunderstorm (with _lightning_ (!), rain and winds up to 60 kmh...).
??!!
Gojohnnygo.
12-15-06, 12:28 PM
montreal "non-winter-like wheater" update:
today, it's +12C degres (another record) and we have thunderstorm (with _lightning_ (!), rain and winds up to 60 kmh...).
??!!
Just 60 miles south of you. We had hard rain but no thunderstoms.
Gojohnnygo.
12-15-06, 01:00 PM
Every year I find a sticky on the coldest ride etc. etc..
Personally I don't find cold to be that much of a deterrant or threat. The coldest I've ridden in is -25C or perhaps -30C: perhaps that's not cold enough. But that is by far much much easier than riding on a day from anywhere between +5C to 0C after a really heavy snowfall. You cannot get anywhere in melting snow. The front tire digs in. The rear tire slips no matter what tread.
I'm talking about stuff that has been packed down in parks by peds. When it's hard and the temperature is frigid this stuff is bumpy but you can ride it fast. When it starts melting you're pushing. And I mean fairly wide tires (26" Hakkas) on OK rims with low pressure.
Is the cold really a good metric of your perserverence? I'd argue the much less glamorous dirty melting deep snow is.
Riding refozen slope is very hard. I take it as one of the top winter issues winter cyclist have. like you said the cold is not as bad as most say.
balto charlie
12-15-06, 01:23 PM
I would trade our recent 'pea soup fog' for some of your serious cold weather. It's freaky riding in a thick mist AM and PM. Looks sunny right now but when I pedal home tonight the fog WILL be back. Global warming just ain't good.
Chinook like weather here yesterday +3C, what a mess!
I long for the -27C stuff, where the road is nice and packed, and dry compared to the wet slop.
http://img234.imageshack.us/img234/8505/winride2it5.jpg
BenyBen
12-16-06, 11:56 AM
That being said, i've been commuting ~6000km a year on the same 12.85km of road for 6 years (to work), so any kind of change is also welcomed (that includes winter and less smog).
Hey Jaysea, It's funny cuz this is exactly what I've been doing, about 12km round trip for more or less 6-8k per year. Only been 4 years though..
Like you, I was freaked out by that thunderstorm in the middle of december... A couple weeks ago I put on my studded tires after 3 days of temps under -5C, thinking that was it and we were gonna get winter, now I regret it.
What part of montreal are you in?
Ernesto Schwein
12-16-06, 04:48 PM
Just out of curiousity (and mid-december boredom) I ran numbers for some of the colder locations I could think of, these are the average highs and lows for each month of the year and then the yearly average as well as the record low for each month and the absolute all time low. All the data was from either the National Weather Service or Environment Canada, and in this table they are all in Centigrade.
32249
The coldest temperature ever officially recorded in the United States was -79.8 degrees Fahrenheit - rounded off to minus 80 degrees - observed at Prospect Creek Camp in the Endicott Mountains of northern Alaska on Jan. 23, 1971. This is not the North American low record. The North American low of -81.4 degrees F. was recorded at Snag in Canada's Yukon Territory, on Feb. 3, 1947.
The lowest ever recorded in the contiguous 48 States, was -69.7 degrees - rounded off to minus 70 degrees - at Rogers Pass, in Lewis and Clark County, Mont., on Jan. 20, 1954. Rogers Pass is on State Highway 200 about 40 miles northwest of Helena.
The coldest temperature ever recorded east of the Mississippi River was -55 degrees Fahrenheit in Couderay, Wisconsin, on Feb. 4, 1996.
Cool List, You can Add Saskatoon as well :)
Temperature: Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Year
Daily Maximum (°C) -12.3 -8.6 -1.8 10 18.4 23 25.4 24.5 17.7 11.1 -1.3 -9.8 8
Daily Minimum (°C) -22.9 -19.4 -12.3 -2.2 4.5 9.4 11.7 10.3 4.6 -1.5 -10.8 -19.8 -4
Extreme Minimum (°C) -48.9 -50 -43.3 -28.3 -12.8 -3.3 -0.6 -2.8 -11.1 -25.6 -39.4 -43.9
Ernesto Schwein
12-16-06, 06:06 PM
Cool List, You can Add Saskatoon as well :)
Temperature: Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Year
Daily Maximum (°C) -12.3 -8.6 -1.8 10 18.4 23 25.4 24.5 17.7 11.1 -1.3 -9.8 8
Daily Minimum (°C) -22.9 -19.4 -12.3 -2.2 4.5 9.4 11.7 10.3 4.6 -1.5 -10.8 -19.8 -4
Extreme Minimum (°C) -48.9 -50 -43.3 -28.3 -12.8 -3.3 -0.6 -2.8 -11.1 -25.6 -39.4 -43.9
. . .and wind-chill isn't included. But I suspect that when it gets around ambient -30C and lower wind is unusual , temperatures like that usually indicate a really stubborn high pressure air mass.
. . .and wind-chill isn't included. But I suspect that when it gets around ambient -30C and lower wind is unusual , temperatures like that usually indicate a really stubborn high pressure air mass.
Boy do you have that right, we usually get very high winds as well, that can make it very cold even if it's only -20C out.
I am super impressed with people who--for pure pleasure--go out on their bike and ride; but I was thinking more of my commute. I.e. before going out, if it's cold out, no matter how cold, it will not change my route nor the time it takes me to get where I'm going. Not so with wet snow. I also tried to explain I'm not talking about powder that is melting, but the packed stuff people walked on after a big snow fall: the stuff that when it's frozen rock solid, even though it is bumpy, makes for a fast ride.
Learning how to dress is the most important part. I will admit that after a while, I started going out in extremely cold conditions because it became a sort of game to me. What's the lowest temperature I can deal with? How cold -is- it when I ride across the lake? How far below 0 degrees F. -can- I go?
I started riding in cold conditions because I used to get picked on whilst riding the bus to school. I decided that I was going to avoid the situation entirely and would ride my bike to school, year 'round. My mom was cool with this, I learned how to dress, and was eventually riding 10+ miles, 'round trip, year 'round, on my BMX bike.
It's not that hard, riding in extremely cold temps. Learn your comfort range, learn your clothing, you'll be fine. My biggest tip is this;
Wind is a killer. Block the wind and you can be fine with -very- few layers. My Pearl Izumi Instinct jacket is the absolute -most- important piece of my riding gear. It blocks the wind and allows me to ride with three layers underneath it down to -30 degrees F. No lie.
Find good gloves, tights, pants, and a mask and you're golden.
What part of montreal are you in?
i live in rosemont (just east of the so called "plateau") and work in saint-laurent (40/decarie).
...
humm. the snow in all pictures from saskatoon is beautiful:) "Cold and dry weather" indeed...
speaking of snow, here is link to a map with the current snow accumulations...
http://www.meteo.ec.gc.ca/data/analysis/352_100.gif
humm. the snow in all pictures from saskatoon is beautiful:) "Cold and dry weather" indeed...
speaking of snow, here is link to a map with the current snow accumulations...
http://www.meteo.ec.gc.ca/data/analysis/352_100.gif
Thanks Jaysea :beer:
G. Bucci
12-24-06, 08:07 AM
You know some people use that line as a joke but it is true. I would rather ride in -25C and little humidity than -10C and high humidity. I find it easier to dress in cold dry weather too.
Anyone else share the opinion
Stay upright
Winnipeg, Canada
calbars
01-15-07, 12:14 AM
i live in rosemont (just east of the so called "plateau") and work in saint-laurent (40/decarie).
Hey, I live in Rosemont and do a 13 KM commute to work (St-Jacques, west of Marché Atwater)...
This is my 4th year doing this commute. And my first winter (if we can call it that) .
Enjoy tomorrow's ride: 15cm of snow! And then -24C on Wednesday night (I leave work at 10PM).
Tomorrow's gonna be my first outing in fresh snow. Time to see how my Schwalbe will behave.
Hey, I live in Rosemont and do a 13 KM commute to work (St-Jacques, west of Marché Atwater)...
Tomorrow's gonna be my first outing in fresh snow. Time to see how my Schwalbe will behave.
hello neighbor!
i've been commuting year round for 5 years, i guess we must have seen at least once?
hehe, that was a nice ride indeed. but the snow had just started... tonight will be fun though! so this will be your first outing in real snow? you'll see that its a pretty good exercise... you migth ask yourself "what i'm i doing here", but with time, you'll get addicted...
just curious, do you go through old montreal/downtown?
cheers
calbars
01-15-07, 09:53 AM
just curious, do you go through old montreal/downtown?
cheers
Yes. I ride south (De Lorimier, Marie-Anne, Parc Lafontaine, Amhearst) 'till I reach the Old Port and then west via Canal Lachine.
The snow is finally here. Let see if I regret my decision...
The snow is finally here. Let see if I regret my decision...
humm. finally. winter arrived! :)
and, well, give yourself a couple tries before judging anything... today is NOT easy since it just keeps snowing hard... the "hard packed snow" (by cars) is quite slippery (more than ice (with studded tires)). (last forecast is for 15-25 cm http://www.meteo.ec.gc.ca/warnings/report_e.html?qc67 all falling during work hours). and there's wind up to 55kmh...
i mean, once everything is plowed and what's left freezes in place (tomorrow) it will be _a_lot_ easier...
have fun!
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