Commuting - Internal Hub Thoughts

I'm a bike messenger here in SF. With my commute from Marin to SF plus riding for work, I've been averaging over five hundred miles a week on my work bike. Needless to say, my bike is a money pit with new chains and cassettes every month... I am seriously thinking about putting together a bike with an internal hub (Shimano Nexus 8). My hesitation lies in the lifespan and durability of this hub specifically, and internal hubs in general. I would be comfortable relacing a new hub every six months I suppose.


Can someone give me an idea of how many miles I can get out of a Shimano Nexus 8 hub before it wears out? Or possibly any info on the durability of other Shimano internal hubs? I realize that there is a significant weight penalty with internals, in fact the Nexus 8 hub weighs as much as my current wheelset, but I would get used to it eventually.

Thanks

I've got about 10,000 miles and four years on my Nexus-7. It works exactly as it did when I got it.

Paul

8sp hubs haven't been around long enough to get long-term results. So far, so good though...

I agree with LWaB that the 8 speeds haven't been around that long. But I feel in the long run they will prove to be even more reliable than the 7 speeds. Besides adding that extra gear shimano improved the shifting, bearings, and decreased the internal friction. The 8 speed red-band nexus is ultegra quaility. The shimano Alfine which is already being sold in Europe should be even better. Of course the Rohloff Hub is the best, but with a $1000 price tag it is out of most people's budget.

Googles what brand and model of drive train are you wearing out so fast? Riding that many miles will require a bunch of chain lubing.

I agree with LWaB that the 8 speeds haven't been around that long. But I feel in the long run they will prove to be even more reliable than the 7 speeds. Besides adding that extra gear shimano improved the shifting, bearings, and decreased the internal friction. The 8 speed red-band nexus is ultegra quaility. The shimano Alfine which is already being sold in Europe should be even better. Of course the Rohloff Hub is the best, but with a $1000 price tag it is out of most people's budget.

Googles what brand and model of drive train are you wearing out so fast? Riding that many miles will require a bunch of chain lubing.

I use Shimano LX mountain cassetttes on my road bike, with Ultegra RD, Dura ace FD, Ultegra Chain, Ritchey Compact Cranks-with Ritchey chainrings. Doing 2000 miles a month is enough to wear out a drive train. You can get away with this level of wear on the flats, but my cassette will start skipping gears on the climbs we have. I am vigilant about lubing and cleaning and actually don't mind maintaining the bike, its just the amount of money that is required...

The shimano Alfine which is already being sold in Europe should be even better.
Sadly the Alfine is not yet being sold in Europe. As of now it's only being sold as an OEM part. I wrote to Shimano and they couldn't tell me when it would be released to the general public.

I used a shimano 8 earlier in the year no a San Jose, it was a nice ride, but a bit heavy in the end. There were never any shifting problems...and the gear range was good using a 42 on the front. I went back to a 9 speed (More to tinker with :) ) .

I am seriously thinking about putting together a bike with an internal hub (Shimano Nexus 8). My hesitation lies in the lifespan and durability of this hub specifically, and internal hubs in general. I would be comfortable relacing a new hub every six months I suppose.


Can someone give me an idea of how many miles I can get out of a Shimano Nexus 8 hub before it wears out?
Why are you so hung up on Shimano brand internal hubs or an extra pound of weight, given that you are not in a race? I have over 25,000 trouble free miles on a Sachs/SRAM 7 speed hub with coaster brake.

I use Shimano LX mountain cassetttes on my road bike, with Ultegra RD, Dura ace FD, Ultegra Chain, Ritchey Compact Cranks-with Ritchey chainrings. Doing 2000 miles a month is enough to wear out a drive train. You can get away with this level of wear on the flats, but my cassette will start skipping gears on the climbs we have. I am vigilant about lubing and cleaning and actually don't mind maintaining the bike, its just the amount of money that is required...


These are quality components you're wearing out. I don't know if a Nexus 8 will survive if the ones you listed only last a couple of months. I have never seen one bike messenger in New York City use a Nexus hub. Not one! Then again, you really don't have to shift in New York since it's flat. Still, I think the reason you don't see messengers using this hub is due to reliability.

However, the Nexus hub is heavy and there is only one cog you have to worry about. That cog would probably wear out about as fast as your LX cassettes if you're hard on the equiptment. I don't know about the punishment the hub will get from hard city riding but only time will tell.

If you end up going with an internal hub, the chain issue may be resolved with a Hebie Chainglider (http://www.velorution.biz/?page_id=1087). The chainglider acts as a chainguard that literally sits on the chain.


I'm a bike messenger here in SF. With my commute from Marin to SF plus riding for work, I've been averaging over five hundred miles a week on my work bike. Needless to say, my bike is a money pit with new chains and cassettes every month... I am seriously thinking about putting together a bike with an internal hub (Shimano Nexus 8). My hesitation lies in the lifespan and durability of this hub specifically, and internal hubs in general. I would be comfortable relacing a new hub every six months I suppose.

I would think a major issue with an internal hub for a messenger would be the PITA that I have heard it is to change a rear tire with the internal hub installed. This is one of the reasons I have chosen to not yet go with an internal hub. Could someone with some experience with these hubs comment on this?

I would think a major issue with an internal hub for a messenger would be the PITA that I have heard it is to change a rear tire with the internal hub installed. This is one of the reasons I have chosen to not yet go with an internal hub. Could someone with some experience with these hubs comment on this?

Although not as quick as changing rear tire without int. hub, it may not be as difficult as you think, just different. Mainly a matter of getting through the learning curve. Check out this thread for some good suggestions.

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=250562

Best Wishes
Green Bear
:)

Although not as quick as changing rear tire without int. hub, it may not be as difficult as you think, just different. Mainly a matter of getting through the learning curve. Check out this thread for some good suggestions.

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=250562

Best Wishes
Green Bear
:)

+1 Chaining the rear tire with the Nexus 8 is only slighty more difficult than and very similar to changing the rear tire on my Schwinn Stingray when I was a kid. It seems that many people tend think in "racing " terms when the Internal hub subject comes up. If the the OP want to experiment I would reccomned using a Sturmey Archer 3 speed hub. Provided the gear range is wide enough. They are cheap, plentiful, need very little service, reliable and have 60 years of real world testing. If it does not work you will not be out big $'s.

I'm a bike messenger here in SF.

And you're not riding fixed? I'm tellin'. ;) :p

That cog would probably wear out about as fast as your LX cassettes if you're hard on the equiptment.

Yes, but one thing to consider is that you may be able to get away with just letting the chain and sprocket run beyond where you'd normally have to replace a chain on a derailler setup. The single sprocket can not skip gears like a derailler can. And since it's the one-and-only sprocket running on that chain, they can wear out together and it won't make any difference until it gets so worn out that the teeth are hooked.

Of course, it will be messing up the chainring, but to a much lesser extent.

Why are you so hung up on Shimano brand internal hubs or an extra pound of weight, given that you are not in a race? I have over 25,000 trouble free miles on a Sachs/SRAM 7 speed hub with coaster brake.

Dude,try some decaf.

Maybe the OP doesn't know of any internal hubs other than Nexus. I can think of prolly a dozen models with stock Nexus hubs(own one),but can't think of any off the top of my head that are running SRAMs. Just because your particular brand wasn't mentioned,doesn't mean he was dissing you.

I would think a major issue with an internal hub for a messenger would be the PITA that I have heard it is to change a rear tire with the internal hub installed. This is one of the reasons I have chosen to not yet go with an internal hub. Could someone with some experience with these hubs comment on this?

It's really no big deal. Biggest thing is to remember to shift into 1st or the shifter cable will be too tight. There's just one cable on either side. You'll have to carry a couple wrenches for the cables and axle nuts,but that's it.


http://www.sheldonbrown.com/nexus8/

Thanks to Greenbear, Fender and Dyna for the information. I was seriously considering this and was discussing it with my LBS mechanic when he brought up the issue of tire changes, and I appreciate that he did. But, it is nice to get a different perspective. I am ok right now, but I may consider going to an internal hub in the future.

http://www.sram-imotion.com/

click on usa, then on I-motion, then I-motion9. They also have I-lights, generator hubs. The 9 speed hub
is only available in coaster brake now, others available soon. They have a quick release option for the hub
instead of bolts, and quick release shifter cable. Seems like a good option to the nexus. I even saw a
carbon hub I-motion9.

And on the 20th post, someone said...Rohloff!
14 speed internal hub.:D

Just a thought...back to sanding...;)

I'd love a Rohloff, can I get a grant from ya?

I've never seen a bike messenger with a Rohloff. Some will go through 3 or 4 bikes a year because of theft.

This guy's a messenger in SF:
http://www.blackbirdsf.org/

His bikes:
http://www.blackbirdsf.org/bikes/

Note particularly this bike:
http://www.sandsmachine.com/a_syc_r1.htm

Hub gear. 125,000 miles. Pretty cool website to boot.

This guy's a messenger in SF:
http://www.blackbirdsf.org/

His bikes:
http://www.blackbirdsf.org/bikes/

Note particularly this bike:
http://www.sandsmachine.com/a_syc_r1.htm

Hub gear. 125,000 miles. Pretty cool website to boot.

That's incredible.

I had no idea the SA 3 speed hub could take that kind of abuse since it's not made for those who stand on the pedals. I have a feeling he recently put that hub on and it was not the original spec.

I'm still impressed.

That's incredible.

I had no idea the SA 3 speed hub could take that kind of abuse since it's not made for those who stand on the pedals. I have a feeling he recently put that hub on and it was not the original spec.

I'm still impressed.
I read the blog, the bike was DESIGNED around the S-A hub...so yes it does have that kind of miles on it...doesn't say what his maintenance regime is or if the hub has had to be rebuilt. I have one much abused S-A hub that has over 15,000 documented miles and possibly 10,000 undocumented miles on it. It was run with out oil for a period of time, I pulled the hub down a couple of weeks ago and it showed very little sign of wear, thorough cleaning, new oil and it rides as good as ever.

Aaron:)

Honestly I don't see why an internal hub shouldn't be able to thousands of miles. It's just a transmission. They go for tens and hundreds of thousands of miles in cars and other vehicles. And bike/rider combos don't have the weight or torque of motor vehicles.

Googles--Are you operating in a lot of rain or wet weather? The quaility of drivetrain you are running should be lasting much longer than you are getting. My mix of LX front XT rear has between 7 and 10 thousand miles with nothing replaced other than the chain. I don't ride in much wet weather however. I am now on the 3rd chain. Be sure you lube the shift cables every now and then. If they get a bit stiff you will have a lot of shift problems.

A internal hub has a straight chain line versus a cassettes constantly changing angles so given equal treatment the chain and sprockets on a internal hub should last much longer.

I feel a properly maintained internal hub system will outlast a cassette system, but I feel you should be getting a much longer servicelife out of your componets.