Fifty Plus (50+) - Where does my logic break down?

I could carry a cell phone in my saddlebag,

...or...

I could carry a bike pump, some inner tubes, a few patches, perhaps some CO2, and a few tools.

Given that I ride exclusively in the city, I opt for the cell phone. There are taxis everywhere. I'm not a weight weenie -- I would just rather fix a flat in the comfort of my own living room. So what's the flaw in my logic, if any?

If there is always a cab nearby, I see your logic except for one thing, a puncture will always end your ride.
By carrying a spare tube, patch kit, tire levers and pump or co2, you decide when to end the ride.

Makes sense to me. :D

So what's the flaw in my logic, if any?
I'm a firm believer in riding the way you want to ride, and if fixing a flat out on the road doesn't appeal to you, and you have alternatives, then go with that. One thing you can to is use tire liners to help minmize flats. I've been using these...

http://www.rivbike.com/webalog/tires_tubes/10088.html

...and they are very light. So far no flats...although it will take a full year to get a real sense of their effectiveness.

There are a few drawbacks to not carrying flat-fix gear. One is, as Louie mentioned, you might not want to shut down your ride for the day. The other is that you may HAVE to fix a flat for some unimagined reason...maybe you can't get a cab in a reasonable amount of time or your cell is down, or whatever. The third is you can't help anyone else who's in a jam that you may encounter...including incredibly attractive single women. The first time you pass that waitress you saw at Hooters in Pacific Beach the day before -- the one who couldn't take her eyes off you -- and she's got a flat and asks for your help, and you come up goose eggs...all I can say is, that's going to be one hell of a thread the next day in BF!


But, I say go with feels right to you.

Were you a Boy Scout?

The real question, Gary, is to always have protection, or not to have protection? Will a cell phone give you enough protection? I don't think so! ................................................................................................ There they are, all shiny, bright and polished, just waiting to burst from the apartment stable, but you rein them in and keep them racked to the wall? Now that's a sorry state! Go with the best protection possible! Go prepared! Go ready! You never know what might come your way in S. Diego. We are talking tires and tubes, right?
(edited for more appropriate content LOL)

Pastorbob!

:eek:

It must have something to do with the way BF is making us post!

:o

East Hill

Gary,

Will cabs carry your bike?

It generally takes less than 10 mins to replace a tube. Unless of course it's one of those things the LBS still has to do.......

I carry cell phone and spare stuff. I can fit it all my stuff in a mini saddle bag: Cell phone, 1 spare tube, 2 tire levers, 1 or 2 CO2 cartridges, adaptor and patches.

Or maybe you're using tubulars?????

Oh I get it, it's like walking on the beach with a puppy-attracts all the females. Pushing a bike attracts females in convertibles looking to help.........Good move!!

"Where does my logic break down?"

You have logic?

I always carry at least a pump (generally full-sized frame-fit), a spare innertube, a patch kit, and, on the road bikes, tire levers. I can repair a puncture and be back on the road in 10 minutes ... flat.

If you call a cab, they will throw the bike in the trunk, and you can expect your bike to get scratched up. Better to take a pump, levers, and a patch kit.

Your logic fails because you clearly need a bigger saddlebag! Then you could carry the phone for true emergencies, and fix a flat on the road as well. Somehow, in my own admittedly feeble mind, the thought of calling for a ride because I had a flat is distasteful to say the least. Part of cycling is freedom, and self reliance to me. Taxi's, we don't got no taxi's. we don't need no stinking taxi's!

A cellphone is fine, just don't forget the wallet also if you want to call a cab.

...or...

There's the flaw in your logic.

Either one can provide different forms of benefit. Since you aren't a weight weenie, why not have both?



Why patch a flat on the road? Well, as long as you are rich and have time on your hands, Call a cab and then wait for 15-30 minutes for it. That's more than ample time to have patched the flat, and then you get to pay a lot of money to get you and your bike home; more than the cost of a new tube. And as another poster said, your ride is over. Since you spent all your money and haven't gotten all your exercise, a slice of pie is very unlikely.

But a cell phone is good. Should a spoke break and your wheel do a minor taco, it would be great to have a ride back so you don't destroy the wheel by riding, that is if the bike is still rideable. Or if you see two SUVs collide with each other and roll into a canyon, then you can call 911 and be the hero.

think outside the box, gary

would a girl with a convertible rather see:

a. a rider sitting on a curb, on the phone, with his bike laying on the sidewalk, most likely calling his wife

...or....

b. a rider bent over fixing a flat with his tight ass and calf muscles glistening in the late afternoon sun?

doesn't it make you wanna go...hmmmm?

+1 on the carrying both.
The flaw in the logic is in only allowing an either/or answer.

Ah, Grasshopper, you make the mistake of thinking that there is only one true path. There are many ways to complete your travel, each with it's own rewards and risks. To be one with the bike you must be in communion with the bike to know what the bike wants. Does your bike like exposing it's inner self to others who may be watching as you remove parts? Does your bike like to ride in a taxi? It is at the spot when you are in harmony with your needs and the bike's need that you transcend logic and it no longer is of concern.

The first time you pass that waitress you saw at Hooters in Pacific Beach the day before -- the one who couldn't take her eyes off you .

There is no logic here......Gary is talking about fixing FLATS, not HOOTERS. Hooters don't need fixing. Of course, in some cases, hooters are flats that have already been "fixed".


Personally, I've always liked that feeling (far from reality) of being self-contained and able to get back in on my own. Most of us have come in proudly using a piece of road trash for a tire boot or whatever. Fixing flats, while it detracts from the rhythm of your ride is a "time honored" cyclist thing. Besides, the more of them you fix, the less thought and time they take. More besides, sometimes fixing a flat is an enforced break that let's me really look at my surroundings and stand there being a part of things. Of course, when your friends wave goodbye with a "So long, dude"-- not so good.

I carry a patch kit and a few hex wrenches, a piece of tube for a boot, and a coupla handiwipes among the other junk in my bag.

Its not that I object to either/or, in fact I like the cell phone help call, especially when I'm cold and wet. What I fear is being far enough into the woods that the cell phone says "no service-----fix your own or walk"

The middle ground is to take your cell phone, a small CO2 inflator, a couple of tire levers, and a little pack of patches. All combined this would take very little space and add little weight. This is what I do. I haven't gotten around to carrying a larger pump or spare tubes yet.

Ah, Grasshopper, you make the mistake of thinking that there is only one true path. There are many ways to complete your travel, each with it's own rewards and risks. To be one with the bike you must be in communion with the bike to know what the bike wants. Does your bike like exposing it's inner self to others who may be watching as you remove parts? Does your bike like to ride in a taxi? It is at the spot when you are in harmony with your needs and the bike's need that you transcend logic and it no longer is of concern.

WOW! :)

So, basically, the argument is that I should carry the materials and be eager to change any flats, because that makes me "one" with the bike, and keeps a time-honored tradition going?

With that logic, shouldn't I drive a standard shift automobile, changing my own spark plugs when they need it, and check the oil with every fill-up. I should probably throw away my road side assistance coverage, as well, right? :D

No the arguement is to be able to deal with common situations that may arise. For the small cost of carrying a pump, spare tube and patch kit, you will be able to continue riding if you get a flat. You can still call for a ride home if you wish, but you can't use a phone to fix a flat.

When there is a cell tower or network outage, when your battery dies, when there is no answer, when you are exposed to bad weather, when you are in an area where hanging around waiting for a ride isn't even all that good of an idea....

Those are the ones that I can think of off the top of my head that I have experienced in my city riding.

Just keep at it with your approach and I'll guarantee you that you will discover others.

The third is you can't help anyone else who's in a jam that you may encounter...including incredibly attractive single women. The first time you pass that waitress you saw at Hooters in Pacific Beach the day before -- the one who couldn't take her eyes off you -- and she's got a flat and asks for your help, and you come up goose eggs...all I can say is, that's going to be one hell of a thread the next day in BF!

But don't forget, that Hooters waitress may be the daughter of a friend, a person you used to carry in one arm when they were a baby. I know a Hooters waitress in Dallas like that. :p Certainly you'd help a friend's daughter.

So, basically, the argument is that I should carry the materials and be eager to change any flats, because that makes me "one" with the bike, and keeps a time-honored tradition going?

With that logic, shouldn't I drive a standard shift automobile, changing my own spark plugs when they need it, and check the oil with every fill-up. I should probably throw away my road side assistance coverage, as well, right? :D


Yes.

I carry what I do just to give me an option, should something happen. I take my cell phone so that I can call my wife with the minivan to come and get me. In your case, your backup is a taxi, which will cost a few bucks. If you have the mini-kit that I suggested, then if you have a flat you could decide if you want to try to fix it or just call a cab.

If you think you will call a cab every time, without doubt, then just take the cell phone. My mini-kit of the simple CO2 inflator, Bell tire levers, and pack of 5 patches cost me a grand total of $15. I may throw in a $3-$4 tube but haven't decided as yet.

Oh, and a big YES on that standard transmission. I went to standard a couple of years back with a nice little Acura Integra 5-spd hatchback. It's a blast to drive and with the back seats folded down, a bike fits inside!

Ah, Grasshopper, you make the mistake of thinking that there is only one true path.
Actually, grasshoppers are a viable alternate to fixing flats!

If you flat, find a grasshopper along the side of the road, then have him inspect the tire for the punctured area...

http://www.jasystems.com/100_macro/Hopper/hopper_6_74hi_std.jpg

Then, when he's done fixing your flat, ask him to true up your spokes...

http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/835560/2/istockphoto_835560_grasshopper_on_my_bike_too.jpg

Paulie spake wisely. . .

>>> I'm a firm believer in riding the way you want to ride

I'll add that each ride is also unique. Fast spins around a short radius locus. . .it’s CO2, tire levers, and a multi-tool. . .I can walk it back to the centre if there’s a serious mechanical failure. At the other end of the spectrum, long loops with potential heavy weather, I and the rig are well over “Clydesdale” status: pump, fluid, food, raingear, the whole nine yards. About the mobile; tho’ the anti-technology [former professional slave thereto] voice in me hates the Infernal thing, I find myself packing it more often, but primarily for emergencies. Over the last three years, I’ve called in accidents, injured deer on the highway, and deer poachers [real-time] on National Park land.

If you call a cab, they will throw the bike in the trunk, and you can expect your bike to get scratched up. Better to take a pump, levers, and a patch kit.

+1 Have you actually used a cab that you hail or call from the street to carry your bicycle or is that just a hypo? How about one of the cabs that have a propane tank, a tool box, an old battery and other misc junk alreading in the trunk when they pull up? Maybe he will have a rope also to tie the trunk down on your bike or just force fit the bike in the trunk and slam the lid. I suggest carrying bubble wrap stuffed in your cycling jersey to use to protect the frame and wheels while in the cab.

Logic???? :rolleyes:

Oh, and a big YES on that standard transmission. I went to standard a couple of years back with a nice little Acura Integra 5-spd hatchback. It's a blast to drive and with the back seats folded down, a bike fits inside!

I've only owned a couple of auto tranny vehicles in my life. The PT cruiser that hauls me and my bike around would be an absolute turd with an auto, but with a 5-speed it zips around pretty good.
And that goes for my bikes too. All my road bikes have friction shifters.

And the amps I use to amplify my harmonicas all have the nice warm glow of vacuum tubes. I guess I am a bit of a retrogrouch.

DG: I get crap from my brothers all the time because I don't do the oil changes, tune up, and other stuff on my car. But, I didn't buy my car to be a mechanic. I bought it to drive it. And, I love driving it. On the other hand, I do almost all of the work on my modest group of bikes, because I like doing it. We only get one shot at this life, and I try not to live mine according to what other people think I ought to do. You want to carry a cell phone because it makes sense to you? Then by all means do so. You like fixing flats in your home instead of the road? Then go for it. The "self-sufficiency" police will probably not like that view, but what the heck, it's not their life. Despite what many might think, your life really is about you. I carry a cell phone and on the day my rear chain stay snapped, I was darn glad I did. I carry a spare tube, but I've had rides where I went through three tubes and had to walk home. Who knows how it will all work out? You live in an area where help is usually close by. If you were in a remote area where the possibility of help anytime soon was not likely, then you might make a case for a higher level of caution. I know a guy who never carried a pump, tube, patch kit, or cell phone, and he rode sew-ups! When he had flats, he was self-sufficeint in a different way. He had to be inventive and resourceful to get his bike and him back home. However, he always managed to get home.

So, basically, the argument is that I should carry the materials and be eager to change any flats, because that makes me "one" with the bike, and keeps a time-honored tradition going?

With that logic, shouldn't I drive a standard shift automobile, changing my own spark plugs when they need it, and check the oil with every fill-up. I should probably throw away my road side assistance coverage, as well, right? :D


I thought everybody already did that??? What year is it anyway!!

So what's the flaw in my logic, if any?

Yet another posting for us to decide on the Fate of DG- and the future it doesn't hold as this post will get no reaction- From DG.

To be a complete cyclist you have to look the part. Tight Lycra and lurid tops get you noticed when you are at the side of the road. Bike upside down and the wheel out will also get you noticed - by other cyclists. We are a helpfull lot and will always help a maiden in distress so wear a short Skirt and a Flowery top, Oh and a shave might help aswell. This infornmation also helps the girls aswell.

I've only owned a couple of auto tranny vehicles in my life. The PT cruiser that hauls me and my bike around would be an absolute turd with an auto, but with a 5-speed it zips around pretty good.
And that goes for my bikes too. All my road bikes have friction shifters.

And the amps I use to amplify my harmonicas all have the nice warm glow of vacuum tubes. I guess I am a bit of a retrogrouch.


I've driven PT Cruisers with both auto and manual, and it makes a BIG difference. The stick models are much more responsive and fun to drive.

I also have some vacuum tube gear. I have two tube amps and two tube preamps in my audio systems.

I have given up on my own oil changes ... got tired of splashing oil all over me and then trying to environmentally dispose of it.

I also pedal my bikes, no electric or gas motors. No "mo-peds"

All I can add for DG is whatever floats your boat. I don't have the choice riding on country roads. No cabs, no cell phone. Haven't had a flat since I started riding in June 2004. Often rode with just the bottle of water. However DG's thread has reminded me I maybe pushing my luck. A spare tube and changing bars fit in left jacket pocket, kleenex in right. Strapped pump to top tube with rubber bands. But alas, rode 27 miles today and still no flat.

As to cars, I used to do everything to the Volvos I owned. But since I went Japanese its just the oil change. And thats a case of convience for me. Change on my schedule, no waiting and costs me just $8. I return the used oil to local Pepboys auto shop. They sell oil, so by law (at least here in PA) they have to take back used oil. Don't know if law says no charge, but that's what it is.

I don't have a cell phone, pretty weird, huh? I've never had the misfortune to not finish a ride, except the time I crashed in 1987, and the time I bailed on a tour in 1990. A flat is a minor stop, a few minutes, usually. I was with a lady on a century when she had 6 flats, 3 on each wheel. Now I've thoroughly jinxed myself and I'll break the stem off on my next flat.

I have never seen anyone fix a flat with a cellphone nor have I ever seen anyone being able to call with their pump! Bet that will be the next invention for cyclists: a cellpump!
Stay tuned . . .

Gary,
As your ancestors in tha 1800,s trecked the Oregon Trail to Cal-a-forn-iaa,did they stop to telegaph a repair for a broken wagon wheel?If they followed your phone-call logic,you future genetic make up would have been lost out on the prarie.Show the same pioneer spirit,buy the $30 dollar road survival kit,and let no cabbie have to rescue the COMFORT ROAD WARRIOR!

I prefer to fix flats at home too and Slime allows me to do just that. I can usually ride home on one or two pump ups. I do carry levers and a patch kit, but I've never had to use it on the trail. bk

Gary, there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING wrong with your logic.

It's simply a different choice than many of the other posters might make. You do what you think's best for you and I'll do what I think is best for me.

I agree, whatever choices work for you are great. Personally, I don't carry any tools or do any maintenance work. The guy in the bike shop does that, and his billing rate is lower than mine.

Paul

Gary, there is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING wrong with your logic.

It's simply a different choice than many of the other posters might make. You do what you think's best for you and I'll do what I think is best for me.

yep!

As long as you're not concerned with weight, and you most likely do not consider yourself into racing, then why not try a backpack where you can have more stuff rather than a saddle bag?

I recently bought a backpack for biking. No, its not from a bike shop nor REI. They're way too expensive and over complicated. Mine cost me $15.00. There is a local vendor near my house, Bags USA, and I stopped by one day and found my ideal backpack. The only thing I need to do is to add some high density foam to gain some breathing room between the pack and my back during the warmer season.

As long as you're not concerned with weight, and you most likely do not consider yourself into racing, then why not try a backpack where you can have more stuff rather than a saddle bag?

I recently bought a backpack for biking. No, its not from a bike shop nor REI. They're way too expensive and over complicated. Mine cost me $15.00. There is a local vendor near my house, Bags USA, and I stopped by one day and found my ideal backpack. The only thing I need to do is to add some high density foam to gain some breathing room between the pack and my back during the warmer season.

I've thought about backpacks from time to time. I hesitated because I thought they'd be a bother on my back. Maybe I'll rethink that.

The middle ground is to take your cell phone, a small CO2 inflator, a couple of tire levers, and a little pack of patches. All combined this would take very little space and add little weight. This is what I do. I haven't gotten around to carrying a larger pump or spare tubes yet.

Assuming you have a place to put it, a frame-fit pump takes up very little space and adds very little weight. (My mountain bike has a pump peg for a Mt. Zefal pump on the BACK of the seat tube; works like a champ.) Carry a spare innertube because not all punctures can be patched.

Simple: if you carry patches, CO2, etc., you probably won't get a flat. However, leave that stuff home and you for sure will be thumbing a ride.

But wait, there's more: if you're prepared, you can flip a spare CO2 cartridge to the guy wearing tights on the side of the road trying to reach someone on his cell phone.

P.S., I bring a spare tube so I can fix a flat at home too and it all fits in a small container that's made to fit in a waterbottle holder. Got it at Nashbar.

I like having both options. I will normally change the tube and get rolling again; however once in the rain got a flat and said "what the heck am I doing", call the wife who of course sent one of the kids to pick me up but nonetheless got of of the rain and cold and fixed the tire in the warmth and comfort of my family room.

With respect to the Hooters girls, given our ages I'd stay away from that quagmire, go with wisdom and maturity.

Here is where your logic fails. The cell phone option eliminates self reliance. Self reliant people are good decision makers, and tend to choose things that support more self reliance. I always carry tools, patch kit and pump. I can get home on slime and the pump and never have patched one of my flats on the trail. But I notice that many on our trail ride without these things, and often need them. I lend a hand regularly. They aren't all newbies either. Levers, patch kit, 4,5 and 6 mm allens, a small 2 way screwdriver and tweezers are enough. Twice I've patched people up, so pack a first aid kit too. Get with it you guys. bk