Utility Cycling - Bring back the English 3-speed

It's too bad you can't bring yourself to ride a "girl's" bike chicagobent. Step-through Raleighs show up on craigslist all the time for well under $100. I just picked up a '78 sports up in McHenry for $40. I'll put another $50 into it to get it back on the road.

Much superior to anything you can find at bikesdirect. Diamond-framed Ralieghs go for about $100 more.

Ok, do I get a bikes direct oxford three speed for $299 and add a rear rack or do I get a khs green from the LBS for $329 + tax? I think the green is heavier and high tensile versus lighter and chromoly for the oxford, but it comes in a smaller size frame more appropriate for my 5'4" height. I can't bring myself to ride a girl's bike (mixte), so don't suggest it.

Get the one that fits, but I agree with amesja...get a real Raleigh, even if it is a step through. FWIW I am a 6'-2" 220# male and ride step through and mixte frames, along with the regular diamond frames. My grocery getter for a couple of years was a step through, now my DD has it out in Seattle...still hauling groceries.:lol:

Aaron :)

http://inlinethumb47.webshots.com/40814/2683444210066886751S600x600Q85.jpg

BikesDirect just released some decent looking 3-speeds.

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/city_bikes.htm

The Oxford and Oxford Deluxe.

BikesDirect just released some decent looking 3-speeds.

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/city_bikes.htm

The Oxford and Oxford Deluxe.

My biggest beef with them and most of the other manufacturers is that they stop at the Large size...those from BD are 22" frames, I ride a 25". I know that most Raleigh Sports were made in 21" and 23", however they did produce some in 19" and 25". Just a lot harder to find.

I will be interested to see how well the BD bikes and some of the others stand up to daily use. I have a 1972 Raleigh Sports Standard that has well over 30,000 miles on it and has spent most of it's life outdoors. Still chugging along nearly 40 years later.

Aaron :)

I haven't been impressed with the quality of bikesdirect bikes. In fact, when you consider the (low) quality they deliver, their prices aren't especially good.

Those are very nice bikes by BikesDirect. If I didn't buy my Torker Graduate, that would have been an excellant choice.

The specs do not state the number of teeth on the Sturmey Archer Cog. I really would like to know the gear inches of each gear. I left a message with BikesDirect but did not get a response. Does anyone know the size of the SA cog?

BikesDirect contacted me and said the three speed cog is a 22T!!! This is excellent and the gears are just pefect, the way a 3 speed should be designed. These are the ratios for all three gears.

39.6 1st Gear
54.0 2nd Gear
73.7 3rd Gear

Not bad at all. I'm surprised BikesDirect got it right. Give them credit on this one.

$745usd...that is over a month's take home pay for a minimum wage person in the US. Not affordable in my book. For comparison my dad bought a 1962 Raleigh Sports for $48 in 1962. In 2005 dollars that would be about $295. Which would work out to about 1/3-1/2 the monthly take home pay of someone employed full time at minimum wage. There are bikes for sale in that price range out there but many of these people never consider a bicycle as a viable form of transportation and given our road systems I am not surprised.

Aaron :)

Perception of worth is just that...perception. What a person considers to be worth a purchase is relative to that person. Therefore, it's more of an issue of paradigm than it is expensive-ness. People don't want to be without cars, the average cost of which is FAR more expensive than any average bike. Why is this acceptable? Because it's worth the cost to the average person to get to where they need to go quickly, have some sort of status symbol to cling to, be comfortable while traveling, etc.
Making bikes less expensive wont get a significant number of people on bikes. Paradigm will, and it usually takes a life changing event to change paradigm, e.g., $10.00/gal gasoline. Necessity breeds change, not expense.

And right below that we learn why Pie-Plates are present on all new derailleur bikes.

They are required by law for any new bike sold. After that point the consumer is free to take it off if they wish.

But I have to disagree with the OP of this thread at the very beginning that blames MTB's as the cause of the demise of the everyday bicyclist. That was killed in the 70's bike boom fad by the drop-bar road bike. Sure, they were a fad -but drop bars are super-uncomfortable for daily riding and are best left for those who like the lycra and speeding along in a training group. For your everyday person they killed riding around town.

I think the MTB actually revived riding for many people as they saw the relaxed riding position as a godsend to the racer crouch of the drop-bar bike. MTB's exploded as the new default for bike sales and from there the cross bike evolved that has a MTB seating position but with light-duty components to be lighter. Too bad they still have the uncomfortably high bottom-bracket, and the difficult for joe-public to maintain derailleurs. In the end most derailleur bikes end up so badly adjusted and mangled that the bike is destined for the back of the garage or the junk because the perception that getting it fixed is going to cost more than the bike is worth. I think this is the genesis of the fixie craze. No derailleurs to maintain and adjust. For us regular riders it's not that big of a deal but your average person isn't up to it. Mehanical aptitude is at an all-time low as humanity descends into Idiocracy.

As IG hubs make a comeback you are going to see more of them on the road. But these kinds of bikes aren't cheap and don't readily adapt to cheap bike manufacturing like the MTB's did. The Raleigh 3-speeds of yore were not (and still are not) cheap bikes. My dad paid as much for his Sports in 1954 as a good used car cost. In order to bring the price down and stay competitive Nottingham cut more corners every year until they were having serious issues with reliability and their consumer image by the '70's. It still wasn't enough because people wanted CHEAP bikes and the cheap "10-speed" department-store drop-bar bikes of the bike boom killed them -even if they were a "fad" and were uncomfortable for most people's needs.

Blaming the MTB for the death of the comfort 3-speed is totally wrong. In fact, it might have been the spark that will eventually bring it back.

Drop bars aren't uncomfortable; their placement is however. My wife and both commute daily on drop bar road bikes, but we both use Kalin riser stems and the wife has cycloX levers on the flats. I don't think the drop bar fad (it's lasted many decades now...is that considered a fad?) killed popular cycling; popular cycling just evolved into the road racing scene that we have today, which brings far more $$$ to bike shops than selling 3 speeds. People don't ride drop bar road racers because it is specific to that niche of the biking community...or at least that's what most people would see when they look at it from the outside. If a person were interested in commuting by bike, but only saw either a) your typical road biker with flashy graphic-laden lycra and the latest carbon fiber super bike and b) someone on a cheap xmart special mtb, who appears to be putting much less effort into riding, then where do you think that person is going to gravitate to? Unless he just really wants the lycra, chances are he'll gravitate either back to his vehicle, or to the nearest xmart to pick up the $99 special.
So then, in this case the cause isn't that road bikes are uncomfortable, it's that the industry evolved to make money in the racing scene, and people's lack of cycling knowledge tends to perpetuate the lack of cycles you see on hybrids, 3-speeds, etc.

Perception of worth is just that...perception. What a person considers to be worth a purchase is relative to that person. Therefore, it's more of an issue of paradigm than it is expensive-ness. People don't want to be without cars, the average cost of which is FAR more expensive than any average bike. Why is this acceptable? Because it's worth the cost to the average person to get to where they need to go quickly, have some sort of status symbol to cling to, be comfortable while traveling, etc.
Making bikes less expensive wont get a significant number of people on bikes. Paradigm will, and it usually takes a life changing event to change paradigm, e.g., $10.00/gal gasoline. Necessity breeds change, not expense.

$10 gasoline is going to be quite disastrous for the above mentioned minimum wage slave. Every item we buy has a hidden transportation, manufacture, and retail markup charge laid upon it. There is no getting around basic economics and the costs of doing business and energy and transportation costs are a big part of every product. This is true from the instant the raw materials are brought up out of the ground, the labor and energy to work them into products (and the transportation that labor consumes getting back and forth to work) oftentimes in multiple stages as sub-assemblies are brought from different areas to build even more complex products), the transportation as those parts are shipped around and then to the retail establshiment.

Energy is put into everything and the more energy costs the more EVERYTHING costs. Taxing energy is taxing EVERYTHING and everybody who buys anything and it is the most regressive tax since it hits those with the least amount of money but still need to eat, wear clothes, and find shelter (much less heat said shelter).

$10/gallon fuel is going to put this country into a depression that is going to make the 1930's seem like the good old days...

$10 gasoline is going to be quite disastrous for the above mentioned minimum wage slave. Every item we buy has a hidden transportation, manufacture, and retail markup charge laid upon it. There is no getting around basic economics and the costs of doing business and energy and transportation costs are a big part of every product. This is true from the instant the raw materials are brought up out of the ground, the labor and energy to work them into products (and the transportation that labor consumes getting back and forth to work) oftentimes in multiple stages as sub-assemblies are brought from different areas to build even more complex products), the transportation as those parts are shipped around and then to the retail establshiment.

Energy is put into everything and the more energy costs the more EVERYTHING costs. Taxing energy is taxing EVERYTHING and everybody who buys anything and it is the most regressive tax since it hits those with the least amount of money but still need to eat, wear clothes, and find shelter (much less heat said shelter).

$10/gallon fuel is going to put this country into a depression that is going to make the 1930's seem like the good old days...

I meant that as a hypothetical example, but yes you speak correctly.

$10 gasoline is going to be quite disastrous for the above mentioned minimum wage slave. Every item we buy has a hidden transportation, manufacture, and retail markup charge laid upon it. There is no getting around basic economics and the costs of doing business and energy and transportation costs are a big part of every product. This is true from the instant the raw materials are brought up out of the ground, the labor and energy to work them into products (and the transportation that labor consumes getting back and forth to work) oftentimes in multiple stages as sub-assemblies are brought from different areas to build even more complex products), the transportation as those parts are shipped around and then to the retail establshiment.

Energy is put into everything and the more energy costs the more EVERYTHING costs. Taxing energy is taxing EVERYTHING and everybody who buys anything and it is the most regressive tax since it hits those with the least amount of money but still need to eat, wear clothes, and find shelter (much less heat said shelter).

$10/gallon fuel is going to put this country into a depression that is going to make the 1930's seem like the good old days...

I've been saying on the "Car Free" forum for years that the only way to mitigate these future costs is to eliminate your second highest item in the budget. Your car! The government is looking to cut tens of thousands from the payroll and this does not include states and cities who will follow. This has been a jobless recovery with people making less than years ago and companies no longer giviing raises or cost of living increases. The news stated that 5.3 million homes went into forclosure with another 1.8 million to follow this and next year. When is this insanity going to stop???

If you want to cut corners, look no further than this thread. Human powered transportaton is the only way to save money today. You can cut coupons, stop buying junk and wear last years clothes but nothing put more money in your pocket than not having to cut checks for monthly car payments and insurance.

My car probably costs me about $500/year to own/operate. After fuel, the single largest cost is taxes/registration. Insurance is nothing. Maintenance is nothing. Last year was the biggest yearly maintenance cost in almost a decade. Had to put new struts in the back. $185, as I did them myself.

I spend WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more than that on bikes...

---

I should amend that above statement to say "outside of fuel" although lately I haven't been using much of that either. But a car is what it is, for longer trips. For short trips I use a bike. But I don't feel like riding my bike between Madison and Chicago on a regular basis. There are things that a bike just can NOT do.

My car probably costs me about $500/year to own/operate. After fuel, the single largest cost is taxes/registration. Insurance is nothing. Maintenance is nothing. Last year was the biggest yearly maintenance cost in almost a decade. Had to put new struts in the back. $185, as I did them myself.

I spend WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more than that on bikes...

---

I should amend that above statement to say "outside of fuel" although lately I haven't been using much of that either. But a car is what it is, for longer trips. For short trips I use a bike. But I don't feel like riding my bike between Madison and Chicago on a regular basis. There are things that a bike just can NOT do.

Valid point, good sir.
To elaborate, I include fuel costs in my statement for the reason that a car cannot operate without it. Furthermore, I would not put someone like you in the "average" category; average to me is someone who is making payments on their vehicle, whether on a loan or as a lease. Also, I wrote that assuming my own budgetary standards, which do not allow for an exuberant amount to be spent on my bike...I build everything myself with sale/clearance components.
Of course, the person who does all his own car maintenance, has super low insurance costs, always buys inexpensive used vehicles, etc etc will always have grounds to refute everything I have to say on the issue, however that kind of thrifty person is definitely not average; any analysis on the debt that the average American carries can confirm this.

I've been saying on the "Car Free" forum for years that the only way to mitigate these future costs is to eliminate your second highest item in the budget. Your car! The government is looking to cut tens of thousands from the payroll and this does not include states and cities who will follow. This has been a jobless recovery with people making less than years ago and companies no longer giviing raises or cost of living increases. The news stated that 5.3 million homes went into forclosure with another 1.8 million to follow this and next year. When is this insanity going to stop???

If you want to cut corners, look no further than this thread. Human powered transportaton is the only way to save money today. You can cut coupons, stop buying junk and wear last years clothes but nothing put more money in your pocket than not having to cut checks for monthly car payments and insurance.

It will not stop; it will be a steady ride into financial ruin...oh wait that's already happening. I do agree that human powered transportation is a saving option, but the bottom line is that the general public, as evidenced by the absurd burden on health care as a whole due to POOR HEALTH, is not an acceptable option.

There are two kinds of people in this world, net debtors and net earners. Life is hard and expensive when you have to pay other people to do mundane and everyday-frequent jobs.

The cost of keeping up a modern high-tech derailleur bicycle for the average non-mechanical person isn't cheap either. They would probably be better served with a dead-simple and reliable IGH or single-speed bike without brakes.

I also build my bikes with parts I shop around for to get the best price/value. My issue is that I just can't stop tinkering so I've begun to rebuild and flip. I sold 2 bikes just today. Both were enjoyable and I sold them to two very nice people who I am sure will love my bikes. There isn't a lot of profit in it and I figure I'm laboring for about $2/hour but I am having fun in my hobby -not "working" for a living. I can't complain if I'm actually making money doing my hobby even if it is peanuts.

The money I make is getting rolled back into my next project. I'm hoping to see a nice 7-speed hub and wheelset arriving someday paid for in a round-about way through my bike-flipping. So in the end I'm really not out much money ;)

No loans for me. My '94 Camry has been paid of over 250,000 miles ago :-D And still gets nearly 30MPG mixed driving (I miss real gas as the MPG was so much better according to my fuel records).

It will not stop; it will be a steady ride into financial ruin...oh wait that's already happening. I do agree that human powered transportation is a saving option, but the bottom line is that the general public, as evidenced by the absurd burden on health care as a whole due to POOR HEALTH, is not an acceptable option.

I agree with this as well. We are going to see a very strange future. Cheap used bikes are going to become a commodity and those who are able to scrounge and fix them will be in demand. I've already begun to stash bikes, parts, and tools around planning for the new crazy world ahead. But like you said, it'll be long slow decline probably instead of a quick crash.

snip
But I have to disagree with the OP of this thread at the very beginning that blames MTB's as the cause of the demise of the everyday bicyclist. That was killed in the 70's bike boom fad by the drop-bar road bike. Sure, they were a fad -but drop bars are super-uncomfortable for daily riding and are best left for those who like the lycra and speeding along in a training group. For your everyday person they killed riding around town.
snip

Blaming the MTB for the death of the comfort 3-speed is totally wrong. In fact, it might have been the spark that will eventually bring it back.

I have little different take on this.... it was neither the mountain bike, nor the 10 speed fad that put biking in the US on the wrong path. No it was the chopper bike, the Schwinn Orange Krates and their clones that started the decline. Why, because these bikes were simply all style, and very little efficiency and practicality, essentially a toy, not a tool. think about it, prior to the choppers comeing out there were basically 2 types of bikes in common use in the US, the single speed coaster bike and the english 3 speed. These bikes were used to get around, deliver papers, bring groceires home, pull a wagon with a lawnmower in it. Many kids had baskets in front so could carry things. Everyone had fenders and chain guards, at least until they fell off. The bikes were simple and worked. Sure there were style and prestige issues within these types of bikes..... being able to afford a schwinn was a big deal. English racers were exotic, cool and fast. But the bottom line the bikes were suited to a lot of general use, and were used that way. When the choppers came out they were sold and market like Mattel did toys, targeting kids. This was succesful so the same approach was used for 10 speeds. Mountain bikes started as a bunch of dirt bag renegades scaring horses, hikes, small children....but then marketing took over. Most of us here have escaped the cycle and cylcle. The best thing we can do is help others get on bikes, without making it scary....ie you have to be able to carry home a side of beef and case of beer to be a utility biker. Most people will be practically served by a bike that that can carry some stuff in..... whether it is in a cute wicker basket in the front or folding walds in the back.

I had a 3-speed Huffy banana seat bike from the time I was about 8 years old and rode it non-stop from then until my teens. It was a great ride with the 20" tires and the flaming red and orange paint. I abused the heck out that bike and put thousands upon thousands of miles on it, wearing out many tires and sets of brake pads. It was indestructible almost other than the top-tube shifter got messed up and my unmechanical young self decided to just lock the Shimano hub perpetually in first gear. Later on I figured out how to fix that and the hub still shifted like the day it was new.

The bike was a fine bike for putting miles on and took me to and from school for half a decade and rarely gave me any trouble. I wouldn't say the banana -seat chopper was all that unusable of a bike for a smaller kid -even the ones with the smaller front tire that Raleigh made were decent bikes.

i had one! 14th b-day i got one from sears. i put a brazilian miles on the original tubes/tires. pedals got replaced (ones with rubber platforms), eventually the front axle broke due to lack of bearings and flopping side/side.

dad wasn't a teacher and probably had no idea how to fix anything (i never did see him fix anything). and no money for a bike shop. it was awful, but until it terminated i rode absolutely everywhere. got wire baskets for christmas one year, an el-cheapo pump and a light which came with a battery, but no money for replacement batteries. on occasion i could pony up 25 cents to have a flat fixed at a (real) service station. they used monkey grip hot-vulcanised patches, guaranTEEEEEED to outlast the tube.

I have little different take on this.... it was neither the mountain bike, nor the 10 speed fad that put biking in the US on the wrong path. No it was the chopper bike, the Schwinn Orange Krates and their clones that started the decline.

I don't think that you're correct. I think that there have been a couple of factors:


The demise of unstructured "free" time for kids. Back in the early Jurassic, when I was a kid, on summer days, I was expected to be home at breakfast and dinner. As long as I stayed out of trouble (or didn't get caught :) ), my parents didn't particulalry know or care where I was all day. My bike was my way to extend my range of activities.
Many of the jobs that kids used to do are now done by adults - mowing lawns and delivering newpapers being among them.
Kids are much less likely to engage in physical activity today. I think there are also several factors contributing to that: the rise of ever more organized sports had palced even more emphasis on winning and hence tended to exclude mediocre playes, and the rise of video games have given those mediocre players a new outlet. I was a mediocre athlete, but played sand lot baseball because that's all we had to do in the summer. If there had been video games around in those days, I would much rather have been doing that.
The rise of "throw away" consumer goods means that we don't repair as many things. The corner gas station where one poster mentioned getting flats fixed probably isn't there any more - it's been replaced by a self-service gas station that doesn't do any kind of repairs. That also means that "repair it" skills are dying out. I fixed almost everything on my bike, and like working on it almost as much a riding it. It never once went to the shop for repairs. In fact, I don't know for sure that there was a bike shop. The bike was bought at a department store, and was mine to repair if I wanted to keep riding.


BTW, I am noting what I think are factors - not reminiscing about the "good old days". I am not convinced that that these changes are necessarily bad.

For example, I do not mourn the rise of video games. As a mediocre/poor athlete, there was a cost to having only physical activities - at which I was bound to perform poorly - as an energy outlet. Participating in activities at which you have some natural skills is probably more healthy psychologically than only participating in activities where you are bound to fail.

At any rate, I liked my 3 speed when I got it. :)

From the comment above about taxing energy: of course we should tax energy. That will make things more efficient. One of the big problems in the U.S. now is that we have a false price on oil products. If we had taxed energy at the real cost, we would have public transportation and bikes everywhere. Gasoline would be at least $15 a gallon and electric cars could compete as well as solar and wind. Groceries would not be shipped halfway around the world, foreign manufacturing wouldn't be so cheap since it would have to be shipped, etc. We have a false economy now and we have gone to war (very costly) because of that false cost. We are still paying those prices just in different taxes that are NOT so honest.

crackerdog, I'm in violent agreement with you. Petroleum is cheap because we're borrowing from our ancestors (billions of years to create it) and from our descendants (by charging too little for it, we're stealing it from them).

mike, there were always books. And music and TV and games and fantasy, etc.

On the decline of bicycles as every day adult transportation... just look to the suburbs and suburban sprawl that almost every large North America city suffers from to understand why the car has become the dominant means of transportation.

crackerdog, I'm in violent agreement with you. Petroleum is cheap because we're borrowing from our ancestors (billions of years to create it) and from our descendants (by charging too little for it, we're stealing it from them).

mike, there were always books. And music and TV and games and fantasy, etc.

Yeah, I was dark near compulsive reader - but reading isn't like being able to play a video game with your buds. If there was fantasy (role playing) around in the early 60s, I didn't know about it.

On the decline of bicycles as every day adult transportation... just look to the suburbs and suburban sprawl that almost every large North America city suffers from to understand why the car has become the dominant means of transportation.

Which came first...the chicken or the egg? :P

I agree that sprawl is a major contributor to the problem, but sprawl did not come into being until the car became commonplace. Take a look at the older ring suburbs of any major NA city, they called them streetcar suburbs for a reason. Unfortunately it will be a massive undertaking as well as an uphill battle to overcome the last 70 years of poor suburban/urban planning.

Aaron :)

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/761774-Linus-Roadster-Sport-any-thoughts

Some of the bikes mentioned seem much like English 3-speeds.

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/761774-Linus-Roadster-Sport-any-thoughts

Some of the bikes mentioned seem much like English 3-speeds.

I think that when you compare the price of these to a nicely refurbished Raleigh Sports, the raleigh is the better deal and is a bike that should hold it's value more than the Linus, which is a decently made bike.

Sold a gorgeous '64 ladies Sports at the co-op the other day for $150.00 and it had been fully tuned up and fitted with new Delta Cruisers and was a rarer silver and white model.

Have a gorgeous '75 Raleigh here with hand built Mavic wheels and new deltas selling at a price that is still far below a new Linus and would much rather have the classic Raleigh if I was looking.

I think that when you compare the price of these to a nicely refurbished Raleigh Sports, the raleigh is the better deal and is a bike that should hold it's value more than the Linus, which is a decently made bike.

Sold a gorgeous '64 ladies Sports at the co-op the other day for $150.00 and it had been fully tuned up and fitted with new Delta Cruisers and was a rarer silver and white model.

Have a gorgeous '75 Raleigh here with hand built Mavic wheels and new deltas selling at a price that is still far below a new Linus and would much rather have the classic Raleigh if I was looking.

You'll get no argument from me. My main bike is a Raleigh Sports, or "World's Greatest Bicycle". I would have suggested that, but the OP on that thread seemed hung up on a Chromoly frame.

Some of the debate centered over the cost of setting up a BD bike vs. a LBS bike, and how much was that worth. One respondent thought that a BD bike was a better deal because one could assemble, tune, and wrench on it and save. If one has those skills, though, why not just get a Raleigh, overhaul with new grease, build up some alloy wheels, koolstop pads, and enjoy the ride?

For those who want a new bike, though, the Linus Roadster looks like a decent bike.

Veloria, author of the Lovely Bicycle (http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/) wrote a very convincing article on how you get the most from your money with an old English 3-speed. Oddly, she used the $500 price point. What's that you say? English 3-speeds don't sell for $500? True, but read the article:

Lovely Bicycles on a Budget: Vintage vs Modern (http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/2010/10/lovely-bicycle-on-budget-vintage-vs.html)

She makes great points, and she's such a good writer!

You'll get no argument from me. My main bike is a Raleigh Sports, or "World's Greatest Bicycle". I would have suggested that, but the OP on that thread seemed hung up on a Chromoly frame.

Some of the debate centered over the cost of setting up a BD bike vs. a LBS bike, and how much was that worth. One respondent thought that a BD bike was a better deal because one could assemble, tune, and wrench on it and save. If one has those skills, though, why not just get a Raleigh, overhaul with new grease, build up some alloy wheels, koolstop pads, and enjoy the ride?

For those who want a new bike, though, the Linus Roadster looks like a decent bike.

I don't sell many bicycles but of the older roadsters I have sold over the past 2-3 years have asked $275.00 -$375.00 for fully serviced and guaranteed roadsters and have yet to see one come back because someone was not absolutely in love with the bicycle.

I miss my 1948 Rudge and sold it with a buy back provision in case it's owner should find it no longer suits her.

Sold my mint Superbe for $275.00 and know it's owner quite well... the Raleigh has been his primary commuter for two years and it as about as gorgeous as it gets as he added Brooks bags and the bike is always gleaming. he could get his money back in a heartbeat here for a bicycle in this kind of shape.

Ride a new bike for two years and your new $500.00 bicycle is worth $250.00 - $300.00 if it is kept in excellent shape.

My old Rudge, if it has been well kept, is probably worth more now than when I sold it as prices have been creeping up for bicycles like this that are in fine condition.

Veloria, author of the Lovely Bicycle (http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/) wrote a very convincing article on how you get the most from your money with an old English 3-speed. Oddly, she used the $500 price point. What's that you say? English 3-speeds don't sell for $500? True, but read the article:

Lovely Bicycles on a Budget: Vintage vs Modern (http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/2010/10/lovely-bicycle-on-budget-vintage-vs.html)

She makes great points, and she's such a good writer!

I've run into a few women who want Pashleys or Dutch bikes and I send them there. There recently was someone on Bike Forums who spent a large sum on a Oma Fiets and had trouble with the weight; now is selling it. Too bad she didn't see that Lovely Bicycle! post first.

I know the thread is entitled "Bring Back the English 3-Speed," but there are so many still available, one could argue that bringing them back means refurbishing and updating them and sending them back out on the road.

Bump.

Just wanted to thank all the posters on this most excellent of threads after finally finishing reading thru all 40 pages of posts and gleaning TONS of useful information.

All-in-all, I'd say that this thread is about as good as it gets insofar as useful and germane information being shared.

Amongst all of that great info, the article and chart by Matthew Cole is, IMO, the crowning jewel: http://www.uscoles.com/threespeedgearing.pdf

BTW, anyone know what happened to Sianelle? She really put some good stuff on here!

Bump.

Just wanted to thank all the posters on this most excellent of threads after finally finishing reading thru all 40 pages of posts and gleaning TONS of useful information.

All-in-all, I'd say that this thread is about as good as it gets insofar as useful and germane information being shared.

Amongst all of that great info, the article and chart by Matthew Cole is, IMO, the crowning jewel: http://www.uscoles.com/threespeedgearing.pdf

BTW, anyone know what happened to Sianelle? She really put some good stuff on here!

I agree this thread went on for almost 5 years! So much great info was invested and shared in this thread. Sianelle was in poor health in 2007 and would not surprise me if she passed on. Quite a unique person in my opinion and very rare to find someone so knowledgable on old 3 speed bicycles.

Sianelle was a lovely person and have been meaning to drop her a note... she was taking holy orders and think that this was the reason for her departure from Bike Forums.

Sianelle was a lovely person and have been meaning to drop her a note... she was taking holy orders and think that this was the reason for her departure from Bike Forums.

Tell her we miss her if you do! Poor health but I am sure she is still rolling. She`s got the same health issues I have andfor sure I am not dead..

It seems a little odd that a subject that is obviously near and dear to our hearts and take up 40 pages are the bikes that we see the least of. These 40 pages have been a very good and informative read.

I have recently bought an old mixte which I wanted to strip. What I really needed was a front wheel which I wanted to get from this oldie (I got it for like 12.5$). As it turned out after some cleaning, lubing etc. I started riding this instead of another mountain-like bicycle I own. It's fantastic for commuting and trips around my city. This mixte came with a set of 2x5 gears. I rarely use more than 3-4 of those and I decided to turn it into a 3-speed with recently acquired (old SA). I guess this will take some time as I've never done this but with the help of this forum I stay positive with my thinking. Will post after it's done;)

I have recently bought an old mixte which I wanted to strip. What I really needed was a front wheel which I wanted to get from this oldie (I got it for like 12.5$). As it turned out after some cleaning, lubing etc. I started riding this instead of another mountain-like bicycle I own. It's fantastic for commuting and trips around my city. This mixte came with a set of 2x5 gears. I rarely use more than 3-4 of those and I decided to turn it into a 3-speed with recently acquired (old SA). I guess this will take some time as I've never done this but with the help of this forum I stay positive with my thinking. Will post after it's done;)

Looking forwards to pix. I converted an old (80`s) Nikishi for my son this autumn. Came built up as a touring bike but I think it has to short chainstays to be built as a tourer originally (must go to the CV forum and look up the framenumber).

I converted it to a SA3 since my son is not fond of downtube friction shifters plus he loves SA hubs. This is his winter commuter. Since he is still growing I am afraid I just got hold of a rattlecan spray in the same colour and did some "touch up" just by spraying.

The paint on the frame was quite bad. It used to belong to my friend but was stolen and then I found it 7 months later. It was quite messed up, both wheels and fenders so the owner did not bother. I built it up from scratch. Maybe I`ll have it repainted if he does not outgrow it or ditch it for another bike.

Hey do you have any pics of your '76 Schwinn SLT 12.2?

I have one of those bikes that is, except for brake pads, bone stock and I love it.

Never could afford a Paramount...

Hey do you have any pics of your '76 Schwinn SLT 12.2?

I have one of those bikes that is, except for brake pads, bone stock and I love it.

Never could afford a Paramount...

Here is a picture of my '76 Schwinn SLT 12.2 bike. All original except for new tires.
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i19/cutacroshorty/Bicycles/P5240010.jpg

Here is a picture of my '76 Schwinn SLT 12.2 bike. All original except for new tires.
http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i19/cutacroshorty/Bicycles/P5240010.jpg

The blue is nice; probably kinda rare too; mine's silver.

Is that the original saddle? I have an aftermarket Serfas on mine and it works out pretty well but she's probably going to have a Brooks on her when all is said and done.

Hope to put a pic up soon; right now I am working on a '75 Raleigh LTD-3 that I picked up in Augusta, GA last month for $75. Might have a few "shop" questions to post here about getting her back up to snuff but she's in pretty good overall shape to begin with and appears to have led a mostly-sheltered life.

Here's something I came across that may be of interest to those following this thread.

Raleigh [of Canada] still produces a facsimile of the "classic" English 3-speed bicycle.
The "Sprite" model: http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/bikes/sprite.html (http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/bikes/sprite.html)

I had a bi-lingual friend conversant in English and French do some calling around and it appears that these bikes go from $300 to $350 in U.S. dollars.

Dealers: http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/dealerlist.html#on-e (http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/dealerlist.html#on-e)

The blue is nice; probably kinda rare too; mine's silver.

Is that the original saddle?

I'm pretty sure it's original. I don't remember ever changing it. I just replaced the original tire a couple of years ago.

ON NORTHROADS-TYPE HANDLEBARS:

I will be pointing friends who are getting back to bicycling as adults to this thread because I believe that these bikes are the real deal for most people.

There are a number of variations on what I call Northroads handlebars and there is another thread on this excellent website that discusses those variations pretty well.

Here's the link to that thread: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/584089-Which-handlebars-should-I-get?highlight=northroad+handlebars

Here's something I came across that may be of interest to those following this thread.

Raleigh [of Canada] still produces a facsimile of the "classic" English 3-speed bicycle.
The "Sprite" model: http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/bikes/sprite.html (http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/bikes/sprite.html)

I had a bi-lingual friend conversant in English and French do some calling around and it appears that these bikes go from $300 to $350 in U.S. dollars.

Dealers: http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/dealerlist.html#on-e (http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/dealerlist.html#on-e)


It is like the new Raleigh Superbe which is just that, a facsimile of the classic... having seen quite a few can say they seem to be nicely spec'd and come in at a good price point although they are all Asian made and equipped and the only English thing about them is their name.

It is like the new Raleigh Superbe which is just that, a facsimile of the classic... having seen quite a few can say they seem to be nicely spec'd and come in at a good price point although they are all Asian made and equipped and the only English thing about them is their name.

You know, I'm not certain that they aren't made in Canada. Someone on another thread pointed out that the same model of bike is being sold in the U.S. as a "Classic Roadster".

Check out this link and tell me whatcha think: you'll see the icon/link for the Sprite model right in the middle: http://www.raleigh-canada.ca/heritage.html

Another thing, the "ad copy" on that page says: When you own a Raleigh heritage steel bike, you are purchasing a bike for life. Every frame is hand-welded from Reynolds 520 custom-butted Chromoly tubing, renowned for it's resilient ride and stiff sprinting ability.

BUT, when you clik on the Sprite button and the specs pop out it says that the bike has a Hi-Ten frame and a Hi-Ten fork....

Then, to further confuse matters, the same bike in U.S. specs indicates a Hi-Ten frame with a cromoly 4130 fork: http://www.raleighusa.com/bikes/hybrid/classic-roadster-12/

Go figure...

Back in September ...


I think that when you compare the price of these to a nicely refurbished Raleigh Sports, the raleigh is the better deal and is a bike that should hold it's value more than the Linus, which is a decently made bike.

Sold a gorgeous '64 ladies Sports at the co-op the other day for $150.00 and it had been fully tuned up and fitted with new Delta Cruisers and was a rarer silver and white model.

Have a gorgeous '75 Raleigh here with hand built Mavic wheels and new deltas selling at a price that is still far below a new Linus and would much rather have the classic Raleigh if I was looking.

Veloria, who writes the Lovely Bike blog, wrote an article about that. If you have $500 to spend, you're best off finding an old Sports and fixing it up than buying a new bike. One key point of hers is the steel fenders and their attaching hardware: they're more reliable than modern stuff.

Back in September ...

Veloria, who writes the Lovely Bike blog, wrote an article about that. If you have $500 to spend, you're best off finding an old Sports and fixing it up than buying a new bike. One key point of hers is the steel fenders and their attaching hardware: they're more reliable than modern stuff.

I agree with her for the most part. Indeed, my first reading thru this thread, including the links to her blog, which I did read and digest, were invaluable.

I'm down South, and if you are a discriminating buyer, you can do a lot better than that price [$500 net] point. 3 weeks ago I did a loop from Greenville to Columbia to Augusta and back and came back with a Firestone [Ross] women's in brown, a Miyata women's in blue and a Raleigh LTD-3 men's in black. All 3-speeds, the Ross and Miyata with Shimano; the Raleigh with SA.

The Ross and the Raleigh were $75 each; the Miyata $60. The Miyata is the best bike with the Raleigh a close second. [Miyata has such features as stainless steel Northroads handlebars etc. - typical Japanese uber-hi-Quality!]

I've done nothing to the Raleigh except clean it up, it didn't even have rust on the steel rims...

The Ross I have begun to rejuvenate; the only parts needed were a new set of brake pads and one brake cable.

The Miyata I haven't touched yet; I am saving it for one of my daughters. It's pretty much mint.

So you see, on the one hand, while we don't have as many bikes extant as you do in NJ, NE, and the upper Midwest, we don't have the knowledgeable people either and that drives prices wayyyy down for 3-speed bikes...

I have watched this bike go down from $800 to where it is now [$600] and have forced myself not to go see it because I fear that I'd wanna swap a rifle for it if I did: http://greenville.craigslist.org/bik/2839979606.html

This thread is old-ish but it discussed a lot of handlebars. Some of the links may be dead:

http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/422506-Alternative-Handlebars!?highlight=swept+back+handlebars