Classic & Vintage - Which mid-level mid-80s Japanese bike to refinish?

Just did my taxes, and I have enough extra dough to get one (and only one) bike re-finished. Both these bikes need it badly. So, which one do I choose?

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p183/top506/Miyata512.jpg

'86 Miyata 512. STB tubing, Exage 500 group (mostly). New wheels, 7-speed w/indexed barcons.

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p183/top506/Ironmanbefore1.jpg

'87 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. Tange #1, full 105. Most likely would add Take-Offs. And no, I'd not keep the original paint plan!
Top

By refinish, do you mean upgrade? To me, both of these bikes look fine and don't need any work done to them; can you elaborate? Nice looking bike, by the way.

Miyata

Neither need upgrades; both need a down to the metal re-paint.
Top

Wow, both of those bikes look great to me. I see a spot on the TT of the centurion,but that's about it. What's the deal with the red on the forks of the Miyata? Is that original?

It's hard to answer the question without knowing why they need redoing. I'd say if all else is equal, the Centurion has an ugly color sceme so I'd do that one.

Centurion hands down.

Wow, both of those bikes look great to me. I see a spot on the TT of the centurion,but that's about it. What's the deal with the red on the forks of the Miyata? Is that original?

It's hard to answer the question without knowing why they need redoing. I'd say if all else is equal, the Centurion has an ugly color sceme so I'd do that one.

On the Centurion, there's a bigger scrape on the seattube, and the fork blade and seatstay and chainstay on the other side look as if they were dragged several miles and then left out in the rain.

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p183/top506/Ironmanbefore2.jpg
I won't argue about the color scheme. If I do re-paint that one this year I'll paint it the same as the Miyata.
On the Miyata, the red is primer. There's more of it on the fork crown, underside of the toptube, and top of the downtube.
Top

I think I would go for the Centurion, especially as you don't like the paint scheme.

East Hill

I'm going to vote centurion. :)

Paint it like mine. you'll stay true to the brand.

I think I would go for the Centurion, especially as you don't like the paint scheme.


+1

Honestly, neither. A decent paint job and decals is in the $200 range. You can get a brand new steel Italian frame for around $400 on eBay.

+1 on the Centurion, with a comment about the equipment. I've got an '86 or '87 mystery UJB ("Universal Japanese Bike") with all 105. The '86 SLR brakes and SIS indexed drivetrain with the 105 label are apparently pretty legendary ( I think Sheldon Brown says something about that on his site) and my experience is the same: great group.

Honestly, neither. A decent paint job and decals is in the $200 range. You can get a brand new steel Italian frame for around $400 on eBay.

I love both those bikes, but I gotta agree. Unless you're doing all the work yourself, just buy a new frame off of eBay and transfer over the parts.

If you paint the Centurion like the Miyata, you can do the Miyata fork for almost nothing at the same time. A little rubbing compound outght to get that primer off the rest of the bike and unless it's there for a reason you should be set.

Don't listen to the naysayers, why spend $400 on a new bike when you could do both of your bikes for that.

Cides, he says he only has enough to do one of them so he clearly doesn't have enough for a new frame.

If Top is going to do the painting himself, by all means - I vote pick one and have at it. I like the Miyata, but the Centurion is so ugly it NEEDS a repaint - so that's the one I'd choose (all things being equal).

All I'm saying is that if I were going to pay to have one of these painted by a professional, I wouldn't. I'd haunt eBay until I glommed onto a nicer frame (531?) than either of these two for about the same a professional repaint would cost, and transfer the parts over.

Or the other option would be to spring for a powder coat and get decals (if desired) from mswantak or somebody. That would be a good alternate and economical solution.

Do you ride these suckers? Are they bikes you love and adore? I'd say either paint the one you enjoy riding the most or paint the ugly one (Centurion) or some other option.

Centurion gets my vote Top.

Tom

The Centurion is actually a pretty good riding bike. I've secretly got my eye on a frame that was badly repainted by a friend of mine & coworker, then rebuilt up and sold to another coworker. If that coworker doesn't start riding it I'm going to find a way of aquiring it and stripping/painting and doing something with it. Just don't tell my wife. :D

Had an '86 Centurion Ironman until recently. The Tange 1 frame is a good one - I liked it as much as either of my 531 frames. Your '87 appears to have the sloping fork crown - much better looking than the TIG welded fork Centurion adopted in the late 80's. My vote is CENTURION.

Some answers to questions.
The Miyata is a bike I ride a lot, #2 in my 3 bike rotation. The primer is on the bike to cover bare metal, as some of the rust was worrying until I got into it. Mswantak is already working on the decals. It cost me $68.
The Centurion is a newer aquire, the result of a $50 local pick up only listing on the 'bay. Aside from covering up the damage to the finish getting rid of that paintjob would be a public service. I think that $250 total for a good Tange #1 frame hung with all 105 comps is a better cost-to-value ratio than what any new bike would get me.
Powdercoat is a viable option, but I can't find anyone within 1000 miles to do the job. Information leading to a shop in NE, eastern NY or PA would be most welcome.
To date, the score is Centurion-10, Miyata-1.
Top

If you're looking for any color suggestions on the Centurion, the '86 red/white paint scheme that I had is my favorite of Centurion's combinations. The seattube and headtubes were white, the rest red. Same (or very similar) decals as your '87. I put a set of red Vuelta Airline2 rims on it - they matched perfectly.

Some answers to questions.
.... I think that $250 total for a good Tange #1 frame hung with all 105 comps is a better cost-to-value ratio than what any new bike would get me.....

And I think you're right. But suppose you could get a NOS Italian frame with Campy dropouts for <$200 delivered, and hang your existing parts on it?

For example:
Frame 1 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150085342029&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=150085436753&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget)
Frame 2 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150085320907&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=150085436753&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget)

These are just quick examples - they may or may not be your size, but these kinds of frames are out there. Either way, though, you can't go wrong. And a "custom" Ironman would be cool!

I say powder coat both of them! around here powder coat is about 1/2 the cost of a standard one color paint job.

If the Centurian was left out in the rain, there may be unseen rust on the unpainted (interior) surfaces.

I'd go with the one you like/ride them most.

...Powdercoat is a viable option, but I can't find anyone within 1000 miles to do the job. Information leading to a shop in NE, eastern NY or PA would be most welcome.
To date, the score is Centurion-10, Miyata-1.
Top I Googled "Powdercoat Paint NH" and came up with this place in Greenland, NH which is on I-95.
http://www.powdercoatingsolutions.com/what.html
When I switched to "Maine" I couldn't find one. Personally, I vote for the Miyata, but it's a tough choice. Let us know how it turns out.

And I think you're right. But suppose you could get a NOS Italian frame with Campy dropouts for <$200 delivered, and hang your existing parts on it?

For example:
Frame 1 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150085342029&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=150085436753&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget)
Frame 2 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150085320907&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCC_Pr4_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=150085436753&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget)

These are just quick examples - they may or may not be your size, but these kinds of frames are out there. Either way, though, you can't go wrong. And a "custom" Ironman would be cool!


Yeah, neither of these examples would need a paint job;)
i say centurion, my commuter is a panasonic dx5000 with tange 1 and its rides as good
as my italian frames with columbus tubes, and, you don't even know what those ebay frames
are made of,and you will need a new headset since your japanese frames are probably jis and
a new bb if you bought the 55, all so you could have an ITALIAN frame, don't buy into the hype

i agree. if you love/ride one or the other more fix up that one. IF both are equal, I vote centurion. unless you want/need an "about town" beater bike cuz i'm not sure anyone'd steal it!

Yeah, neither of these examples would need a paint job;)
i say centurion, my commuter is a panasonic dx5000 with tange 1 and its rides as good
as my italian frames with columbus tubes, and, you don't even know what those ebay frames
are made of,and you will need a new headset since your japanese frames are probably jis and
a new bb if you bought the 55, all so you could have an ITALIAN frame, don't buy into the hype

I have an Italian bike-my beater Atala!;)
I don't like the paint on the 55cm either.
FWIW, I have a NIB 105 70mm BB I've been hording for a special project, and a ton pf headsets from take-offs.
Miyata-1, Centurion-13. Keep those cards and letters coming!:D
Top

I'm changing my vote to Miyata, if only because I may have to inquire about the Centurion at a later date and time (especially if its a 56cm which it appears it may be).

I don't like the paint on the 55cm either.....

Miyata-1, Centurion-13. Keep those cards and letters coming!:D
Top


Hey, that frame was just an example. The point is you can get a good, new frame with fresh paint for less than the cost of painting your existing one. That's all I was trying to point out. Give me a break guys ...... :)

Go for the Centurion - like you said, it would be a public service........;)

I vote the Centurion. Media blast it locally. Ship it to a powdercoater. Have it powdercoated OD green. Letter Centurion on the downtube with army stencils in white, and add the unit crest for the 506th to the headtube.

The Centurion is a great-riding bike.

I vote the Centurion. Media blast it locally. Ship it to a powdercoater. Have it powdercoated OD green. Letter Centurion on the downtube with army stencils in white, and add the unit crest for the 506th to the headtube.

You know, I kind of like that:D But I'd add black and white 'invasion stripes' to the downtube, a la ETO C-47.;)
My other idea is the usual Ironman two-tone in black and blue and have Mike tweak the graphics to make it a 'Ozzy Osbourne Ironman':rolleyes:
Top

Hey guys,
Im looking to repaint my new old mitaya. Does anyone know where i can get decales for it and which type of paint i should use for it.
Thanks

Hey guys,
Im looking to repaint my new old mitaya. Does anyone know where i can get decales for it and which type of paint i should use for it.
Thanks

Try

http://home.comcast.net/~velographic/VGcontact.htm

I'm working with Mike on some decals for my Panasonic.

[QUOTE=top506]You know, I kind of like that:D But I'd add black and white 'invasion stripes' to the downtube, a la ETO C-47.;)

If you don't use the idea, let me know. I thought about doing that one, and having a buddy who works in an auto upholstery shop sew me a carradice-style saddlebag out of a surplus shelter half with the US on the flap. Might have to pin some wings on it too.

Current plan on my Centurion is to finish steel-wooling it down to the metal and powder-coating it clear. Show the carbon fiber guys what steel looks like. :D So far it looks pretty good with the brass showing around the lugs.

(edit) looked up the invasion stripes and I think they would look great on the seattube. On the same site, I read this quote, "British pilots told the American P-51 drivers that the metal finish was a bad idea because the Germans would be able to spot them from hundreds of miles away. The Americans answered "good." They were flying the baddest buggy around and they wanted the Luftwaffe to come up for a scrap." I think I better improve my Centurion's engine. (/edit)

Paul
C-130 era