Living Car Free - Any Solutions

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r8ingbull
02-15-07, 11:09 AM
Seems the folks on this board can come up with ideas for any car-free circumstances. How about this one:
Every Saturday April-November I work 1/2 mile from home until 1:00, I have to be 25 miles away with 800-1000lbs of equipment by 2:00 for another job. Nearest rental location is 30 miles away. No trains, and only one local bus. I have to transport myself and an employee. Equipment cannot be left at point b, it must be transported every week.
What is the exact nature of this 800-1000 pounds of equipment?
LandLuger
02-15-07, 11:43 AM
I'm reminded of those classic word problems in grade school.
I'm reminded of those classic word problems in grade school.True, the problem seems to have been carefully stated to foreclose any carfree solution. However it does present an opportunity to discuss and illuminate the issues.
r8ingbull
02-15-07, 11:57 AM
What is the exact nature of this 800-1000 pounds of equipment?
8-20 cases paintballs (300lbs)
2 CO2 bulk Tanks (200lbs)
40 paintball guns (160lbs)
40 Tanks (120lbs)
40 masks (80lbs)
+more
Equipment can't be left as it needs to be maintained and/or replaced every week.
LandLuger
02-15-07, 11:58 AM
I would definitely have to challenge the assumptions.
r8ingbull
02-15-07, 12:01 PM
True, the problem seems to have been carefully stated to foreclose any carfree solution. However it does present an opportunity to discuss and illuminate the issues.
It was intended in this manner. I always see post here about someones difficult situation and the same old replies everytime. "rent a car", "flex-car" "take the bus" etc
To be clear, it is a 100% true situation. It is the only reason I am not car-free. I ride/walk everywhere except one day a week 8 months per year.
I would definitely have to challenge the assumptions.
What assumptions?
I would definitely have to challenge the assumptions.If that means you think the problem has to be transformed or changed in some way to allow a carfree solution, I'd agree with that.
LandLuger
02-15-07, 12:08 PM
How about using this:
http://www.zapworld.com/ZAPWorld.aspx?id=4136
Not car-free per se, but oil free.
To be clear, it is a 100% true situation. It is the only reason I am not car-free. I ride/walk everywhere except one day a week 8 months per year.Good onya!
One thing we can speculate about is, how much would you have to change the situation for a carfree solution to work? You might have to back up all the way to framing the issue in terms of how would people get together on weekends for group recreation in a carfree world. I think in a carfree world it would be very important to pay attention to location and logistic support for recreational group activities.
r8ingbull
02-15-07, 12:29 PM
How about using this:
http://www.zapworld.com/ZAPWorld.aspx?id=4136
Not car-free per se, but oil free.
While I would love to see many of these types of vehicles, they still don't solve many of the problems associated with cars. You're still paying taxes, insurance, maintenance etc. Also it is using a 2000lb machine to move two occupants and equipment totaling 1200lbs. A bike weighs 30 and can easily move 300.
The problem is so much more involved than one action will ever solve. It involves land use issues, profit over ethics, transportation and soo much more.
r8ingbull
02-15-07, 12:41 PM
You might have to back up all the way to framing the issue in terms of how would people get together on weekends for group recreation in a carfree world. I think in a carfree world it would be very important to pay attention to location and logistic support for recreational group activities.
I agree. Where in the US can a car-free individual go with great outdoor/indoor recreation, good cultural activities and bars/restaurants. Sometimes these things seem exclusive of one another, or two can exist but not the third.
noisebeam
02-15-07, 01:09 PM
Your looking to make a business/job car free. That's a bit different than not owning a personal motor car.
Part of your job is transporting 1200lbs for 25 miles.
Some businesses can not be successful and car free by their very nature. Others may require motor vehicle support that may be more effective if the support was owned/run by business.
Al
Where in the US can a car-free individual go with great outdoor/indoor recreation, good cultural activities and bars/restaurants.Well, as a provider of a specific form of outdoor recreation, you have more specific constraints. The original puzzler might be solvable if somehow the location of the paintball event were close to your house and the suppliers you deal with.
Carfree consumers of have more flexibility. I try to make maximum use of local resources when it comes to recreation and leisure. Some activities are admittedly just plain out of carfree reach for me. Take fishing as an example. It's technically possible for me to fish locally here in urban Austin, but in practice it's not worked out at all well. Among other problems, unleashed dogs go after the bobbers and the last thing you want to do is to hook someone's pet. So I don't even try to fish locally any more. But I have other choices. Cycling has to be the single greatest recreational opportunity for the carfree.
LandLuger
02-15-07, 01:19 PM
While I would love to see many of these types of vehicles, they still don't solve many of the problems associated with cars. You're still paying taxes, insurance, maintenance etc.
If there were no cars, the govt would taxes bicycles or other aspects of our lives. The only reason we don't have to pay to tag a bicycle is that there aren't enough of us on the radar. Make no mistake they will get their money one way or another. Furthermore, vehicles like this are much, much more efficient than typical gasoline equivalents and require vastly less maintanence. My ebike is based on almost exactly the same technology and the only motor parts designed to wear out are the wheel bearings (near lifetime) and the battery--compare that to the infinitely more complex modern IC engine. I'd say getting people into these would be a big step towards solving our nation's problems.
Also it is using a 2000lb machine to move two occupants and equipment totaling 1200lbs. A bike weighs 30 and can easily move 300.
Yes, at 5 MPH, but this doesn't meet your stated performance demands: twenty-five miles in one hour. Look despite what we might hope or dream in a wealthy society there will always be heavy vehicles on the roads for applications like this. What we must do is divorce ourselves from the pollution and national security risks that come with oil-based vehicles. Free--ok, inexpensive/renewable--energy is literally all around us; just look at how many years of the worlds energy demand can be satified by a minute of sunlight that reaches the earth. These vehicles are future proof; all they need is a source of electric energy that can come from a myriad of sources.
The problem is so much more involved than one action will ever solve. It involves land use issues, profit over ethics, transportation and soo much more.
Oh, was this was the point of the thread?
LandLuger
02-15-07, 01:21 PM
. . . unleashed dogs go after the bobbers and the last thing you want to do is to hook someone's pet.
Hilarious. What a mental picture.
If you need a truck for your business, then get a truck for your business. If you use it only for business, have it titled to your company and take the deductions for it. Try to minimize usage, and use a clean and efficient machine. This will save you money and minimize environmental damage.
You know what? It is going to be at least 100 years, or more likely never, before all motorized vehicles are rendered useless. Someday we may develop sustainable motor transport for freight. But don't hold your breath.
Meanwhile, using dwindling petroleum supplies for commercial vehicles only (or at least mainly) will conserve those fuel supplies, and also reduce the environmental harm done. I don't object to the use of commercial vehicles, at least until an alternative comes along. What I object to is the totally unnecessary squandering of resources, wasted on on the personal transport of people who could easily travel by some other means.
makeinu
02-15-07, 03:22 PM
8-20 cases paintballs (300lbs)
2 CO2 bulk Tanks (200lbs)
40 paintball guns (160lbs)
40 Tanks (120lbs)
40 masks (80lbs)
+more
Equipment can't be left as it needs to be maintained and/or replaced every week.
1. What exactly needs to be maintained and why can't it be maintained on site before/after the event?
2. What exactly needs to be replaced and how does it get to your home? For example, if you have CO2 delivered to your home then have it delivered at the site instead.
3. Is there any way to give yourself a little more time? 25 miles/hour is going to be tough with that much equipment. If you can take off from your first job at 12:30 and postpone the event until 2:30 then you could get one of these quadricycles:
http://worksmancycles.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/media/WTC4x4.jpg
It holds 500 pounds and you can order it with a 7 speed hub. You can get an optional trailer to hold more (I'm not sure how much the trailer will hold, but you could always get two quads and have your employee ride one of them). Alternatively if you could shed some pounds via #1 or #2 then you might be able to just use 1 quad. There are also other quads from other manufacturers such as this one:
http://www.rhoadescar.com/goboy1.jpg
Holds 1,000 pounds and can be ordered with 6-36 speeds.
4. If you really can't budge on anything then you'll, gasp, have to do your own homework and call around. There is this double quad (two people, four wheels):
http://www.rhoadescar.com/4w2plf-g.jpg
However, I don't know how much weight it holds and what kind of gearing is available. It might be possible to do 25 mph with two people. If not then you might try contacting different quad manufacturer's to build a custom design for you. Even a custom design would probably be cheaper than your motorized truck.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadricycle
However, I think it's a little unreasonable to say that you can't budge on your requirements. All forms of transportation have their limitations. You have to be a little flexible when switching between any two forms of transportation. What if you didn't have a drivers license? Would you say, "I can't wait a month to get a driver's license"? No, you would make yourself a little more flexible.
Try to minimize usage, and use a clean and efficient machine. This will save you money and minimize environmental damage.
You could even use a diesel truck and run it on waste oil. In warm/hot weather diesel vehicles apparently run fine on filtered waste oil that has not been converted to biodiesel.
wahoonc
02-16-07, 05:30 AM
Personally I think I would look for something like an electric truck Tiger Truck (http://www.tigertruck.com/electric/star/index.html) is one that comes to mind. Or possibly an electric assist for a cargo trike? They have some advantages over an infernal combustion engine. Only issue I can foresee would be licensing and road use. They are restricted in many areas and our right banned in others. In those cases the electric assist on a Bike/Trike would be the way to go.
Aaron:)
r8ingbull
02-16-07, 06:24 AM
1. What exactly needs to be maintained and why can't it be maintained on site before/after the event?
2. What exactly needs to be replaced and how does it get to your home? For example, if you have CO2 delivered to your home then have it delivered at the site instead.
3. Is there any way to give yourself a little more time? 25 miles/hour is going to be tough with that much equipment.
4. If you really can't budge on anything then you'll, gasp, have to do your own homework and call around.
However, I think it's a little unreasonable to say that you can't budge on your requirements. All forms of transportation have their limitations. You have to be a little flexible when switching between any two forms of transportation. What if you didn't have a drivers license? Would you say, "I can't wait a month to get a driver's license"? No, you would make yourself a little more flexible.
1. Equipment is in use until sunset. We have several hours of cleaning/maintenance that requires light and water.
2. Supplies are picked up before leaving town.
3. Schedule is fixed. Using this schedule I can make as much in one long day as the rest of the week.
4. To be honest this question was more of a conversation starter than a specific question that I expect a solution to. As a previous poster stated, it's a commercial use of a vehicle, the business more than pays the cost to own and operate a car.
makeinu
02-16-07, 09:46 AM
1. Equipment is in use until sunset. We have several hours of cleaning/maintenance that requires light and water.
This only precludes you from doing it the same day. It does not preclude you from doing it on site. On whatever day you do the cleaning/maintenance at home you can do it at the site instead.
2. Supplies are picked up before leaving town.
Because it is most convenient to do so. If you didn't have a truck then it would not be most convenient to do so. You could bring the supplies another day (perhaps the same day that you do the cleaning/maintenance).
3. Schedule is fixed. Using this schedule I can make as much in one long day as the rest of the week.
How much money is an extra hour really going to cost you? I doubt it would be more than the amount you would save in insurance, gas, etc.
4. To be honest this question was more of a conversation starter than a specific question that I expect a solution to. As a previous poster stated, it's a commercial use of a vehicle, the business more than pays the cost to own and operate a car.
I. The business may pay your cost to own and operate the car, but does it pay the total cost to humanity?
II. So what if the business covers your car expenses? Those are lost profits. That money could be in your bank account instead of be burned in the engine.
I agree that there are some situations and some businesses where motorized transport will be necessary. However, this is not one of them.
I-Like-To-Bike
02-16-07, 10:41 AM
I. The business may pay your cost to own and operate the car, but does it pay the total cost to humanity?
:rolleyes:
"Oh, the Humanity!"
-- Herb Morrison, WLS Radio, May 6, 1937
You're being pretty vague for a non-hypothetical situation.
That your home and job are 25 miles apart is the #1 problem. If you didn't want to drive, they wouldn't be.
r8ingbull
02-16-07, 12:06 PM
You're being pretty vague for a non-hypothetical situation.
That your home and job are 25 miles apart is the #1 problem. If you didn't want to drive, they wouldn't be.
My home and "job" are 8 blocks apart. Unfortunately land near to town is so expensive that outdoor recreation is almost impossible unless using government land. I understand this to be true in most towns/cities.
r8ingbull
02-16-07, 12:12 PM
This only precludes you from doing it the same day. It does not preclude you from doing it on site. On whatever day you do the cleaning/maintenance at home you can do it at the site instead.
Because it is most convenient to do so. If you didn't have a truck then it would not be most convenient to do so. You could bring the supplies another day (perhaps the same day that you do the cleaning/maintenance).
How much money is an extra hour really going to cost you? I doubt it would be more than the amount you would save in insurance, gas, etc.
Location is visted one day per week. Also I would challenge anyone here to haul 1000lbs 25 miles, ride the return trip, and be able to function in any form of a practical way afterwards.
An extra hour would cost $300-600 or more in certain instances.
I agree that there are some situations and some businesses where motorized transport will be necessary. However, this is not one of them.
What is necessary? Food, Water, Air? What else? Corporate profits? Who are any of use to judge the validity of someone elses resource use? Everyone uses and waste resources.
Have you considered 3-4 guys on bikes with bike trailers? Of course, the distance is a tough one, especially in the time you have available. To be honest, in your position I wouldn't sweat it. If you're only using a small high-milage truck once a week, you're still doing way better than most people. It's not like you're driving a Hummer all over town in search of puppies to run over.
makeinu
02-16-07, 01:50 PM
Location is visted one day per week. Also I would challenge anyone here to haul 1000lbs 25 miles, ride the return trip, and be able to function in any form of a practical way afterwards.
I'm well aware that the location is visited one day per week. You are asking us how to do the job without a car and one possible partial solution is to visit the location more than one day per week.
If you can't visit the location more than one day per week then that is one thing, but simply declaring that "I won't visit the location more than one day per week" is like saying "I won't park at the location". If you want to ride a car then you have to park and if you want to ride a bike then you'll have to make more than one trip. Thems the breaks. Obviously you can construct whatever rules you want to make the situation as difficult as possible to accomplish without a car (or even impossible). I'm just pointing out that there are plenty of solutions. You are just choosing to arbitrarily exclude those solutions.
There is no reason why you should have to haul half a ton 25 miles. Realistically, you could probably get that down to less than 500 pounds, which should be doable between two people (once you get in shape).
An extra hour would cost $300-600 or more in certain instances.
Oh! That changes everything! Since you're making $600 an hour I suggest you simply hire 20 day workers to carry it for you. :)
What is necessary? Food, Water, Air? What else? Corporate profits? Who are any of use to judge the validity of someone elses resource use? Everyone uses and waste resources.
When I said "necessary" I meant that there are some situations which would be impossible to accomplish without a car and there are some business situations which would be impossible to accomplish without a car while still making a profit. However, this is not one of those situations.
The whole discussion is backwards.
I could go get a weekend job tomorrow 30 miles away, then say "well, I have to drive because it's 30 miles away".
25 miles is a long way. There's absolutely no long closer? People wouldn't pay more if they didn't ALL have to drive 50 miles to play?
Out of curiosity... what is your motivation for wanting to do this without a car? It's obviously the easiest solution. You've stated that the business covers the expense.
Keep ignoring people's suggestions, and they'll start ignoring your questions!
r8ingbull
02-16-07, 03:02 PM
Keep ignoring people's suggestions, and they'll start ignoring your questions!
The first two posters in reply understood the question as a conversation starter. Many of the "solutions" have been crazy. Like I said, I challenge anyone on here to actually ride a load that heavy those distances and be worth a damn when done. Some posters came up with the rational idea of moving the event closer to home which is what we've done. Lease is signed with expected opeing dates of May 1st. Even still a car is the most practical method of transport
I see many new posters come here looking for ideas and help and they get the same BS responses. "flex car" "BUS" "cargo trike" "move closer to work" "etc". I will say the electric trucks were cool and I had never seen those. After the poster states counter reasons it oftens turns to "you don't really want to be car-free", as this post has.
Oh! That changes everything! Since you're making $600 an hour I suggest you simply hire 20 day workers to carry it for you.
It's not so much $600 an hour as one hour lost changes the schedule to only allow 1/2 as many guest. Very tight timing to get it done. I wish I could get some cheap reliable help:)
r8ingbull
02-16-07, 03:04 PM
25 miles is a long way. There's absolutely no long closer? People wouldn't pay more if they didn't ALL have to drive 50 miles to play?
Out of curiosity... what is your motivation for wanting to do this without a car? It's obviously the easiest solution. You've stated that the business covers the expense.
While I would love to actually do this without a car, it isn't going to happen.
Also most of our guest come from 25 miles north-northwest of the location. I come from 25 miles east. location is centrally located.
I-Like-To-Bike
02-16-07, 05:03 PM
Who are any of use to judge the validity of someone elses resource use? Everyone uses and waste resources.
On this thread, it is easy to identify who is a self righteous judge.
While I would love to actually do this without a car, it isn't going to happen.
Also most of our guest come from 25 miles north-northwest of the location. I come from 25 miles east. location is centrally located.
Yea, it's hard to get a mental picture. There's always issues that we can't understand.
Having "good intentions" not to drive in a world built around the automobile is tough.
LandLuger
02-16-07, 06:56 PM
Paintball, Speedball, etc. is a niche sport; born of a mature, wealthy society with lots of time to burn. Don't get me wrong the sport definitely has its merits--it is tremendously physically demanding for one, but I think its years are numbered. It will not be practical in the nearing future as the cheap energy disappears and our citizens are faced with more pressing issues--like putting food on the table. There isn't going to be a "soft landing" as some have suggested; I can't even get my neighbors to screw in an energy efficient light bulb much less bike to work. Even when investors go out on a limb and produce products like the Xebra PK and Tiger truck, business owners won't buy them because they only have a forty mile range (even though that accounts for 99% of their trips). In the OP's case I would probably side with Roody as his advice is practical and thought through as usual; it is just unfortunate that there are not more individuals willing to look past the $$$ of the moment to the metaphorical "train wreck" approaching right around the bend.
makeinu
02-19-07, 11:50 AM
The first two posters in reply understood the question as a conversation starter. Many of the "solutions" have been crazy. Like I said, I challenge anyone on here to actually ride a load that heavy those distances and be worth a damn when done. Some posters came up with the rational idea of moving the event closer to home which is what we've done. Lease is signed with expected opeing dates of May 1st. Even still a car is the most practical method of transport
After the poster states counter reasons it oftens turns to "you don't really want to be car-free", as this post has.
The solutions have not been crazy at all. You just ignore all of them except the ones that weren't serious. For example, I don't realistically expect that anyone would actually ride a load that heavy those distances. The only reason I mentioned that was to show that it wouldn't be impossible.
The most practical solution is to simply leave the equipment on site and on the day you usually do maintenance ride a regular road bike to the site to do maintenance at the site. If there are a few maintenance tasks which are for some reason particularly troublesome then take those few pieces of equipment with you. You have many options on what will be the easiest way to do it. You could get one of those quads and carry those extra few pieces of equipment on maintenance day so that you aren't slowed down on event day (then you could take a regular road bike on event day) or you can carry half on maintenance day and half on event day (making extra time for yourself on event day as previously discussed).
You haven't stated any counter reasons to the many suggestions offered. In fact, every time you are pressed for counter reasons you keep reminding us that this thread is only for conversation purposes. Doesn't that mean that many viable solutions have been offered, but you won't be implementing them because "you don't really want to be car free"? I mean, when you say this thread is for conversation only doesn't that mean, "I don't want to be car free, but if I did want to be car free what would be the best/easiest way for me to do it"? If not then I am completely misunderstanding what you mean when you say this thread is "for conversation".
It's not so much $600 an hour as one hour lost changes the schedule to only allow 1/2 as many guest. Very tight timing to get it done. I wish I could get some cheap reliable help:)
I didn't suggest a 1 hour change to the event schedule. I suggested 30 min off the event schedule and 30 min off the day job.
Also, you don't have to even do 30 min. I offered a whole host of solutions which are quite amenable to partial application. For example, you could start the event 15 minutes later and leave half the equipment requiring maintenance at the site, but you refuse to accept any solution that involves more change to your current methodology than replacing the gas pedals on your truck with a crank (Fred Flintstone style). Hence the comment that you don't really want to be car free.
Why is it so hard for people to admit that they just don't want to be car free? I freely admit that I could very well keep a car here in the city if I wanted to. I could buy a parking spot. I could get insurance. I could sit in rushhour traffic. I could move to the subburbs. I could drive a car, but I don't want to.
On this thread, it is easy to identify who is a self righteous judge.
Yep, like the poster to which I'm replying right now.
makeinu
02-28-07, 07:27 AM
Here is a trike recumbent with a flatbed rated up to 700 pounds:
http://www.catoregon.org/hpm/trihaul.htm
It looks comfy and fun to ride. In fact, if I had somewhere to store it then I would consider buying one...maybe once they release the pedicab attachment.
Christof H
02-28-07, 10:01 AM
Okay, you want speed, since you are dealing with a lot of distance.
You want carrying capacity, since you are dealing with a lot of stuff.
You are dealing with a social sport, so there is opportunity for a social network game in this.
I'd suggest, if you want a real solution, assuming we don't have mountains involved, electric/human hybrids. The electric isn't there because a person can't shift the load, but to get you 18-24mph cruising speed. if you target 25mph, the commute becomes relaxing in a way.
2 people isn't quite enough, I'd try for 4 or even 6, with some form of social interaction as a binding for the group.
Mechanically, you want 600 watts at 36 volts, with larger battery packs and 20 or 24 inch drive wheels. Or, just go for 48 volt upgrades on 26 inch wheeled diamond frame bikes and call it good. add trailers, go.
There are even trailers with the hub motors in the trailer. I've ridden a dozen odd electric and human/electric bikes, never tried a trailer. I'm guessing it would take a touch of getting used to.
On a baw trailer, with a decent NIMH setup and brushless motors.... it would take sme work for me to get the total price tag under $1500 per bike/trailer (assuming 200 to 400 pounds cargo capacity per trailer)
goingbent gives you a real efficiency advantage, and if I could blue sky it I'd set up a dual motor tadpole bent trike with a medium baw trailer, dual 24 volt higher speed motors... on the flats you could go forever even using small SLA batteries because your amperage draw would be so low, in fact, with a tadpole bent pullingno more than 200 pounds per rider, electric might not even be worth it, you should be able to maintain 20-25mph easy in flatland
Christof H
02-28-07, 10:08 AM
I see many new posters come here looking for ideas and help and they get the same BS responses. "flex car" "BUS" "cargo trike" "move closer to work" "etc". I will say the electric trucks were cool and I had never seen those. After the poster states counter reasons it oftens turns to "you don't really want to be car-free", as this post has.
Fantastic. Really. Good solutions and fresh thinking are important.
The answer to SOME situations IS to move closer. Obviously, not every case.
The zaps are cute, we have some in Davis, and a lot of GEMs. Still cars, so I don't tend to count them as solutions :)
Cargo carrying bikes, by and large, suffer from a design problem right now. Aside from trailers and the limits of the xtracycle, most of the stuff doesn't look like anything I'd want to spend 15 miles on.
cycleric
02-15-08, 08:44 PM
After reading this thread it seems to me the best solution would be the aforementioned "greasel" engine. While not strictly a car-free solution, it makes sense because it satisfies most of your goals both environmentally and economically. Break it down like this:
Goals for being car-free:
become environmentally sound, use sustainable energy alternatives, create better social atmospheres, reduce unneccessary consumption, spending, and waste, improve health
Goals for running a business:
turn a profit, provide useful goods and/or services that are in demand, maximize efficiency for best return on investments
These two practices need not be mutually exclusive, but incorporating both is a formidable challenge. I like all of the ideas that were suggested, (especially the work trikes, trailers, and electric assist motors) but it seems going car-free in this particular situation is impossible without giving up some of the basic assumptions presented to begin with. Consider these options and check how many of the goals each method satisfies:
Gas-power pros & cons:
Pros - fast, loadable, far ranging, not physically exhausting, highly profitable (at the moment, at least)
Cons - high cost of purchase, operation, and maintenance, harmful emissions, noisy, uses lots of space, promotes sedentary lifestyle
Human power pros & cons:
Pros - low cost of purchase, operation, and maintenance, zero harmful emissions, healthy, socially amicable, space-efficient, also can be very profitable
Cons - limited carrying capacity, speed, and range, physically exhausting
Veggie oil power pros and cons:
Pros - low cost of operation, zero harmful emissions, fast, loadable, far-ranging, not physically exhausting, highly profitable
Cons - high cost of purchase and maintenance, noisy, uses lots of space, promotes sedentary lifestyle
So human power satisfies all the goals of being car-free and sometimes the business goals. (depending on the circumstance) Gas power has no merit for being car-free (duh) but can satisfy business needs quite well. The Veggie oil hits two major goals in each pursuit; they are environmentally friendly AND it costs less to operate. So, I think that would make the best solution for a tough problem like this one. I think we should try as hard as we can to be independent from automotive consumerism using all those good ideas that came earlier in this thread, but if thats simply not going to cut it, at least we can make a better decision than what we are currently doing.
Artkansas
02-15-08, 09:50 PM
I agree. Where in the US can a car-free individual go with great outdoor/indoor recreation, good cultural activities and bars/restaurants. Sometimes these things seem exclusive of one another, or two can exist but not the third.
Palm Springs isn't bad. Neither is San Diego or Santa Barbara.
This is a funny thread. To the OP, here are some questions. It would be nice to get some honest answers. First off, for my own honesty, I am neither car free nor car lite. I am a consultant and by nature have many clients in many areas, which necessitates my use of a car. This is my choice and I am not asking how it could be made car free.
But for you, I have the following thoughts/questions.
1. Is there any storage capabilities at the 2 locations? If not have you ever looked into the possibilities of obtaining storage at the 2 locations (even gov't property does sometimes allow this, I know).
2. You stated earlier in the thread that you only visit each site once per week. Is this by choice? Or are you otherwise prohibited?
The thing I would consider is not how to transport that much gear. But how to stop needing to.
How much is your vehicle costing you per year. Ownership, licensing, registration, insurance, maintenance etc. If you got rid of all those expenses, would they give you enough to outfit each location with the necessary gear, that you could then leave in place?
-D
StephenH
02-15-08, 11:43 PM
The only solution I see with the terms stated is to move close to the paintball place, and ride the 25 miles back into town. That would get you some major exercise, would also get old, especially in bad weather.
Yeah, there's trikes and stuff that can haul all that, but you'd be doing good to make 10 miles an hour with that much weight- and that would be if it was perfectly level the whole way.
Rent one of those U-Haul vans. I've seen 'em everywhere with $19.99 plastered all over them. Probably $19.99 for the day, plus insurance. If you're only going 25 to 50 miles, you probably wouldn't incur any other costs besides taxes.
Couldn't you just store the heavy stuff near where you'll be using it? I imagine storage costs something, but probably not as much as a truck you rarely use. Maybe one of the paintball participants who lives nearby would let you store stuff on their property.
Or you could move the paintball site nearer to where you live.
mfennell
02-20-08, 09:39 AM
You're running a business that causes dozens (hundreds?) of people to make (approximately, given the info you provided) 50 mile roundtrip drives each Saturday from April-November. I would argue that your personal driving or not is completely in the noise.
Newspaperguy
02-20-08, 01:42 PM
For the original poster, I have a few random thoughts.
The way I see it, there are a couple of factors here. The distance from the site, the time you have to travel from one to the other and the amount of equipment you have to haul will all affect the options open to you.
The equipment alone is significant. Is it possible to have a steel storage box on the property for the stuff? In some cases, this is possible while in other cases, because of regulations or for other reasons, it is not possible.If your stuff is at the site, you may be able to arrive a little later and still have enough time for the set-up work. And your take-down time might also be shorter.
Your distance is a little too long for your timeline, or at least it is in my world. I'd need a lot more than an hour to go 25 miles. Is there a way to give yourself more time? This would allow you to cycle the distance, cool down and clean up and then open the site.
Considering your present needs, you might want to look at getting a cheap but reliable vehicle and using it for your hauling needs. This is not a car-free solution, but it's very much car-light. This would be my own preferred option. The car is now a work-related item, not a pleasure item. That changes things dramatically.
donrhummy
02-20-08, 04:43 PM
I think the only way to do this is to build an aerodynamic pedal-powered vehicle. It's the wind drag, not really the weight, that is really killing a pedal powered option. Of course, you'd need electric assistance for tough uphills too. The cost of making such a vehicle might be too much, but maybe you could contact one of those people who built the pedal-powered-speed-record vehicles because they might want to try building it as a challenge. They seem to like crazy challenges like that.
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