View Full Version : Critical Mass Mob Attacks Van
tomcryar
04-04-07, 05:09 PM
Apparently, the police and the mayor are more than willing to let them have their way, so they win. I understand it's hard to pinpoint the real agressors in the middle of that type of chaos, but somebody should be arrested for trashing the womans van. I'm pretty sure someone there had a camera and recorded most, if not all of the incident. What they do once a month is certainly not advocacy in any shape or form. One of the people who wrote about the ride said their anniversary is coming up soon. I suggest the police blanket the area, and surround all exit points. Start detaining and handing out tickets one by one. Leave them nowhere to go but into an officer. Also, if they try to run, arrest them for fleeing. Cycling advocacy incorporates some grey areas where the law is concerned, but blatant disregard for cut and dry laws is infuriating when it comes to trying to get people to respect cycling.
zeytoun
04-04-07, 05:14 PM
Hilter and the concentration camps
And this thread is officially over....
Blue Jays
04-04-07, 05:19 PM
Hi Łem in Pa-
What is a 'real' cyclist ?
Real cyclists are courteous, law-abiding ambassadors to the sport who don't use performance-enhancing drugs or intentionally inconvenience innocent motorists by randomly causing traffic jams. I can say with confidence that the techniques employed by Critical Mass doesn't help the vast majority of cyclists on the street. Motorists will remember how their typical half-hour commute somehow became a two-hour ordeal because a leaderless, directionless, and confrontational group was *somehow* trying to make a point about bicycles. They don't speak for the average man or woman in lycra who just wants to elevate their heartrate for a couple hours in order to become a faster racer, lower their heartrate, lower their cholesterol, commute to where they're going, and generally lead a happier and healthier outdoor lifestyle in the meantime. That's what I mean by the term "real" cyclist.
~ Blue Jays ~
Real cyclists are courteous, law-abiding ambassadors to the sport who don't use performance-enhancing drugs or intentionally inconvenience innocent motorists by randomly causing traffic jams. I can say with confidence that the techniques employed by Critical Mass doesn't help the vast majority of cyclists on the street. Motorists will remember how their typical half-hour commute somehow became a two-hour ordeal because a leaderless, directionless, and confrontational group was *somehow* trying to make a point about bicycles. They don't speak for the average man or woman in lycra who just wants to elevate their heartrate for a couple hours in order to become a faster racer, lower their heartrate, lower their cholesterol, commute to where they're going, and generally lead a happier and healthier outdoor lifestyle in the meantime. That's what I mean by the term "real" cyclist.
~ Blue Jays ~
Many cyclists don't consider their use of bicycles 'sport', so your analysis is flawed from the get-go. The lycra-clad 'sport cyclists' are a distinct minority here in PDX, and IMO aren't really any better ambassadors for cycling than your average dressed down utility cyclist or Critical Mass participant. In fact, the lycra crowd can be distinctly annoying and disruptive when racing up and down the local MUP in pacelines at unsafe speeds. You'd do just as well using the John Forester definition of a 'real' cyclist.
:rolleyes:
Apparently, the police and the mayor are more than willing to let them have their way, so they win. I understand it's hard to pinpoint the real agressors in the middle of that type of chaos, but somebody should be arrested for trashing the womans van. I'm pretty sure someone there had a camera and recorded most, if not all of the incident. What they do once a month is certainly not advocacy in any shape or form. One of the people who wrote about the ride said their anniversary is coming up soon. I suggest the police blanket the area, and surround all exit points. Start detaining and handing out tickets one by one. Leave them nowhere to go but into an officer. Also, if they try to run, arrest them for fleeing. Cycling advocacy incorporates some grey areas where the law is concerned, but blatant disregard for cut and dry laws is infuriating when it comes to trying to get people to respect cycling.
They already tried this in 1997 (http://www.brasscheck.com/cm/) :rolleyes:
Burrito Eater
04-04-07, 05:30 PM
And this thread is officially over....
Why? Bringing the Holocaust into this duscission is perfectly reasonable. :rolleyes:
I am a gainfully employed, college-educated, married cyclist who rode with critical mass last week in a Southern California city. My wife, who is a public school teacher, also attended. Our group was much smaller then the one in SF. However we obeyed all traffic laws and even used the old hand signals I had not used since the age of ten. The most antagonistic thing that I heard during the ride was some teenage girl yelling from the sidewalk "you're not a car" which made little sense.
Anyway, to paint all CM participants as "urban terrorists" who you would "kick the crap out of if they ever did this to you" allows you to brandish your gigantic e-penis but does not do anything to further the cause. As someone who rides in a dense urban area daily I find that anything that increases awareness of cyclists is a good thing. No publicity is bad publicity.
So even if CM ties up the commute once a month they are still doing their job. Like that person in this thread said they started taking that Friday off because the commute was so bad. So that's one less car on the street. :p
Blue Jays
04-04-07, 05:33 PM
I noted "commuters heading to where they're going" in my definition. If you want to describe that type of riding as "average dressed-down utility riding" it's cool with me.
CommuterRun
04-04-07, 05:44 PM
I'd still be cleaning hippy off my windshield.
:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:
I'm beginning to wonder if CM is why 4x4s come with skid plates.;)
...and since no one is "responsible" for CM the lucky owner of the van gets to deal with the trauma laid onto their children and the cost of the insurance deductible and the eventual rise in their annual insurance rates. Those CM riders taught her! Now she's surely going to advocate cycling! :rolleyes:
As a parent with a scared child and no idea what this mob would do to her or me I'd have no problem mashing the gas to get out of the situation to save my kid. If cyclists got in the way then tough cookies! My daughter is more important to me than a crazy mob. I'd feel sorry for them later on but at that moment my only thought is my child's safety. Maybe I'd think differently if I wsn't a parent but I am and that's what I feel.
Furthermore, if the rider that was hit was not hurt, nor was his bike damaged then there was no reason for an attack. It seems to me that there was a lot of miscommunication on the part of the mob. A guy gets accidentally tapped, someone else sees it as well and says to his buddy, hey that van hit that rider... then the guy next to him overhears and tells his buddy that the van ran over a rider... then the next person that overhears tells his buddy that the van blantantly ran over that bicyclist... and so on... so it stirs anger amongst the crowd and one guy decides to pound the van, and the next guy follows and so on until it's mass hysteria... I bet that's how it started!
...and since no one is "responsible" for CM the lucky owner of the van gets to deal with the trauma laid onto their children and the cost of the insurance deductible and the eventual rise in their annual insurance rates. Those CM riders taught her! Now she's surely going to advocate cycling! :rolleyes:
As a parent with a scared child and no idea what this mob would do to her or me I'd have no problem mashing the gas to get out of the situation to save my kid. If cyclists got in the way then tough cookies! My daughter is more important to me than a crazy mob. I'd feel sorry for them later on but at that moment my only thought is my child's safety. Maybe I'd think differently if I wsn't a parent but I am and that's what I feel.
Furthermore, if the rider that was hit was not hurt, nor was his bike damaged then there was no reason for an attack. It seems to me that there was a lot of miscommunication on the part of the mob. A guy gets accidentally tapped, someone else sees it as well and says to his buddy, hey that van hit that rider... then the guy next to him overhears and tells his buddy that the van ran over a rider... then the next person that overhears tells his buddy that the van blantantly ran over that bicyclist... and so on... so it stirs anger amongst the crowd and one guy decides to pound the van, and the next guy follows and so on until it's mass hysteria... I bet that's how it started!
It looks like you and your ilk on this thread are the ideal target audience for the article, which was an editorial propaganda piece, and not a news report, as already pointed out above. Congratulations, sucker!
Blue Jays
04-04-07, 06:03 PM
We here on BikeForums at least know what Critical Mass allegedly is and what they allegedly represent. Can you imagine being a person who hasn't ridden a bike in twenty years and being instantly swarmed by thousands of riders? Do you think any of the Critical Mass riders turned to her as the van driver and said something along these lines,
"...Excuse me, ma'am. It appears that you've found yourself amidst our Critical Mass bicycle protest. Our goal is to bring attention to the plight of cyclists via civil disobedience. My name is Albert A. Aaardvark and I'm the local coordinator of this event. We'll help you move to the side so you can take an alternate road on which we're not riding....I would suggest 38th Street and make a left on Blaumann Avenue to get back to the highway..."
infernobutterfl
04-04-07, 06:04 PM
Why? Bringing the Holocaust into this duscission is perfectly reasonable. :rolleyes:
I am a gainfully employed, college-educated, married cyclist who rode with critical mass last week in a Southern California city. My wife, who is a public school teacher, also attended. Our group was much smaller then the one in SF. However we obeyed all traffic laws and even used the old hand signals I had not used since the age of ten. The most antagonistic thing that I heard during the ride was some teenage girl yelling from the sidewalk "you're not a car" which made little sense.
Anyway, to paint all CM participants as "urban terrorists" who you would "kick the crap out of if they ever did this to you" allows you to brandish your gigantic e-penis but does not do anything to further the cause. As someone who rides in a dense urban area daily I find that anything that increases awareness of cyclists is a good thing. No publicity is bad publicity.
So even if CM ties up the commute once a month they are still doing their job. Like that person in this thread said they started taking that Friday off because the commute was so bad. So that's one less car on the street. :p
Note... I dont condem CM everywhere. I just said that what happened in SF was wrong. those who want to support cycling should stop trying to justify what the mob of cyclist did to the van. If your CM is civil and not destructive, all power to you. Actually, I would love to join in you that ride. I understand that their might be some "bending" of the law and slight disruption to traffic that day. That is fine. What is not fine is to attack a family and try to justify that you had every right to do that. There is a difference between a protest that demonstrates civil disobedience and and act of mob violence and aggression. Simple?
KrisPistofferson
04-04-07, 06:09 PM
I'm glad those that don't like CM, or activists in general, have found a thread were they can have a feeding frenzy, (as long as we're talking about mob mentality,) but nobody finds the completely lopsided journalism in the OP troubling in any way? No sources cited, and none of the CM riders interviewed. That's not journalism, that's blogging.
A lot of you claim there is "no excuse" for the cyclists actions, and I would agree with that, but these things tend not to happen in a vacuum, she might've road raged herself into a bad situation for all we know. Again, there is, of course, "no excuse" for smashing windows with kids in the car, however, there is also no excuse for acts of road rage comitted with children in the vehicle either, if that is what in fact happened,( I have been a cyclist, truck driver and average motorist for enough years to know that many road-ragers don't give a crap whether their children are in the car or not.)
The truth is we don't know, (<-rational people are capable of actually admitting this,) but this baldly partisan bit of news is certainly pointing us in only one direction with some fairly dishonest tactics. But those of you who like to pick and choose facts to fit your presuppositions, and don't like to have both sides of a story, can feel free to keep posting, in between Glen Beck and The O'Reilly Factor.
john bono
04-04-07, 06:09 PM
Many cyclists don't consider their use of bicycles 'sport', so your analysis is flawed from the get-go. The lycra-clad 'sport cyclists' are a distinct minority here in PDX, and IMO aren't really any better ambassadors for cycling than your average dressed down utility cyclist or Critical Mass participant. In fact, the lycra crowd can be distinctly annoying and disruptive when racing up and down the local MUP in pacelines at unsafe speeds. You'd do just as well using the John Forester definition of a 'real' cyclist.
:rolleyes:
And nothing says "I'm a cyclist, respect me" than ignoring traffic signals, running down peds, and terrorizing soccer moms and preteens. I'm glad I ride 3000 miles away from the circus in SF.
However we obeyed all traffic laws and even used the old hand signals I had not used since the age of ten.
Wow, you mean you rode like I do everytime I ride? What exactly do you mean "old hand signals?" I use those things every time I ride, does that make me some form of personal critical mass?
While I certainly do not agree with the direction that CM has taken, I am also quite frustrated that motorists still do not "get it" with respect to sharing the road with anything other than 4 wheeled boxes. Even in the case of the latter, "sharing" is far from a descriptive term.
No, this event did nothing to forward the cause of cyclists...
Blue Jays
04-04-07, 06:11 PM
The police will be able to share details of the hundreds, if not thousands, of emergency 9-1-1 calls in response to the crazed female driver hitting the innocent cyclist. Oh, wait, you mean nobody else called the police?
deputyjones
04-04-07, 06:13 PM
It looks like you and your ilk on this thread are the ideal target audience for the article, which was an editorial propaganda piece, and not a news report, as already pointed out above. Congratulations, sucker!
randya, I am intrigued by your response here because I typically find myself agreeing with you on most A & S matters, but do you think these cyclists were justified in some way or that the facts of this incident were misconstrued to the point of dishonesty?
I am always one to give the benefit of the doubt (I'm a union rep :D), but even if we have some compassion for the cause and the people fighting for it we eventually have to sit back and say that they really screwed up regardless of how much we wish they had not. Trust me, I end up doing this a lot.
Burrito Eater
04-04-07, 06:13 PM
Note... I dont condem CM everywhere. I just said that what happened in SF was wrong. those who want to support cycling should stop trying to justify what the mob of cyclist did to the van. If your CM is civil and not destructive, all power to you. Actually, I would love to join in you that ride. I understand that their might be some "bending" of the law and slight disruption to traffic that day. That is fine. What is not fine is to attack a family and try to justify that you had every right to do that. Simple?
It is simple. However, large groups of people can get out of hand. It probably happens at least once somewhere in the world daily. Not to excuse the behavior of anyone who damaged that van, but to think this behavior is unique to CM rides it a bit simplistic. The tone of the article bothers me the most because it is so anti CM. If this woman had bumped another car in traffic and the driver of said car jumped out and destroyed her van with a bat I seriously doubt that there would be op-ed pieces written about it. It would just be another case of road rage with property damage. There are a-holes everywhere, both cyclists and non-cyclists.
Burrito Eater
04-04-07, 06:15 PM
Wow, you mean you rode like I do everytime I ride? What exactly do you mean "old hand signals?" I use those things every time I ride, does that make me some form of personal critical mass?
Yes-you are raging against the machine every time you ride without even knowing it.:D
infernobutterfl
04-04-07, 06:16 PM
It is simple. However, large groups of people can get out of hand. It probably happens at least once somewhere in the world daily. Not to excuse the behavior of anyone who damaged that van, but to think this behavior is unique to CM rides it a bit simplistic. The tone of the article bothers me the most because it is so anti CM. If this woman had bumped another car in traffic and the driver of said car jumped out and destroyed her van with a bat I seriously doubt that there would be op-ed pieces written about it. It would just be another case of road rage with property damage. There are a-holes everywhere, both cyclists and non-cyclists.
agreed.. :)
deputyjones
04-04-07, 06:18 PM
According to police, Ferrando had allegedly tapped one of the cyclists' tires.
BTW, there is a lot of assumption here that this event triggered the reaction from the CM riders, but that is not even implied in the article. If, it happened it may have happened while the van was surrounded and the frightened soccer mom was trying to get away.
KrisPistofferson
04-04-07, 06:22 PM
The police will be able to share details of the hundreds, if not thousands, of emergency 9-1-1 calls in response to the crazed female driver hitting the innocent cyclist. Oh, wait, you mean nobody else called the police?Dude, those guys are all off-their-medication, Moslem-loving, anarchist, Marxist sodomites with HIV, they don't even carry cellphones! :eek: :rolleyes:
celticfrost
04-04-07, 06:22 PM
Hah!
It looks like John Forrester is right after all!!
How much would the American Dream coalition have to pay a single mother to do this? CM should consider that. As well as the possibilty that thier beloved symbol, (sign?), be usurped and turned against them.
You're venturing into tin foil hat territory.
Dchiefransom
04-04-07, 07:07 PM
They just covered this on the news on TV. They said that when the woman was suddenly there with all the cyclists, she tried to go around them. This is supposedly when she bumped one of them. They said she did, she says she didn't. I'm wondering how many on this board would react if they were suddenly surrounded by that many screaming people. Would any of them be understandable? If I'd been the one hit, I'd have stayed around to file a complaint.
The story also showed taxis trying to get through intersections on the green light while they were blocked by dozens of cyclists. These were videos from previous rides. If there isn't a parade permit, then when the light changes it's time to clear the intersection and let other traffic go.
Burrito eater.
I believe the person who said they would respond to violence with violence was talking about protecting his family, not being delayed in traffic. As far as my commute, I'm the one who took the last Friday of the month off, I commuted on a motorcycle. So, it isn't one less car;)
But, your comment reveals that you apparently do not see CM as a way to advocate for bicyclists, but rather against motorists.:eek: These two issues are not the same.
Michael
EnigManiac
04-04-07, 07:29 PM
Can you write a report somehow showing that Hilter and the concentration camps were a GOOD thing in history because I have never heard of anything positive from it. Perhaps I, too, have been fooled by the media all that time. Darn the media for making the story so negative and one sided.
The report did include the side of the cyclist. They were having their usual, unplanned, unauthorlized CM. A cyclist was tapped. He was not unjuried nor was his bike damage. The mob gained up on the Van as a result. The facts themselves are no neutral because it is pretty clear that what the mob did was wrong. Hence, the report could not have been neutral.
After I stop laughing at your response I'll reply...hold on...not done yet...almost over...okay...I think that's the last of it.
Setting aside your classless reference to the holocaust---how you can insert and equate a dark chapter in human history with a CM ride is both over-exagerration and vulgar---propgaganda is propaganda and the article was propaganda. It's representation of the cyclists side was curt, perfunctory and hardly positive or fair. The police and the Mayor both were sure to qualify their statements about the allegations with 'if true,' etc. Too bad the reporter had to feel it incumbent upon him/herself to convict the cyclist unilaterally.
I'm not condoning the violence, if it occurred nor siding with CM, and if the violence occurred the way it was reported, then those reponsible should be held accountable. But the journalist should be fired.
It looks like you and your ilk on this thread are the ideal target audience for the article, which was an editorial propaganda piece, and not a news report, as already pointed out above. Congratulations, sucker!
I guess I am the ideal target. I live and work in San Francisco and have seen Critical Mass firsthand. And although I believe in cyclists rights I also believe that you do not have to resort to violence to get your point across. I'm not saying to be Ghandi or MLK, but there are right and wrong ways to assert your point. Bashing in a van and terrorizing people is not the right way. Neither is a blatant disregard for the law.
And if you've seen the CM's of late you would have seen riders drinking beer and doing other illicit things not cohesive with what CM started out to be in the first place. There are too many people that ride in CM these days that don't even know what CM is supposed to be about. And that's where we lose out on what used to be a cause for cyclists.
I just think that there are more positive and constructive ways to handle cyclists rights.
MasterHalco
04-04-07, 07:49 PM
"We sit there and they just go right through the red lights,'' Sgt. Callejas said. "What else can we do? Arrest one rider while 500 keep going?
Huhhhh you're supposed to enforce the law... mob mentality is very bad.
You can arrest them but they'll get off. It's called selective prosecution.
carlfreddy
04-04-07, 07:51 PM
Just out of curiousity, has the other side of the story surfaced yet?
I have to say that if I were a cyclist (how about if I was the supposed "victim" cyclist) I would be eager to get the word out and let everyone know what happened to me.
And it is pretty far-fetched for anyone to say that the typical Critical Mass participant is the type of individual who abstains from using modern technology (i.e. the internet). Seriously, how many urban-dwelling people do you know that do not participate in some sort of list-serv, email-group, or other online community?
I was not there so I can't comment about the way the event really transpired, but I can say that it is rather unfortunate that the only publicity cyclists are receiving from this is negative; especially considering the original mission of Critical Mass.
sbhikes
04-04-07, 07:59 PM
This is why I don't participate in critical mass. I don't believe anything good can come of it in the end.
I just wander how many of the San Francisco CM riders only ride their bikes once a month. Probably too many.
Would anyone on this forum take their bike and throw it against a van. I know I would not commite such violance against any of my bikes.
I just wander how many of the San Francisco CM riders only ride their bikes once a month. Probably too many.
Would anyone on this forum take their bike and throw it against a van. I know I would not commite such violance against any of my bikes.
uh, yeah! I had this thought too.
Dchiefransom
04-04-07, 08:16 PM
I have to say that if I were a cyclist (how about if I was the supposed "victim" cyclist) I would be eager to get the word out and let everyone know what happened to me.
.
He had a good chance to do that. He could have identified himself to the police and, with all the witnesses, filed a complaint against her if she'd done wrong. He chose not to give his name, and disappeared.
slagjumper
04-04-07, 08:20 PM
I remember in 1978 after Super Bowl XIII when Pittsburgh beat Dallas 35 to 31. I looked on from on top of a library as 1000 people burned an effigy of a Cowboy. Then too a hapless motorist was trapped at the intersection, car bounced by the crowd, almost to the point of flipping. Must have been pretty frightening.
No arrests.
I guess that unless there are several hundred police in riot gear they just cant control a crowd of that size.
As far as hurling bikes, that is pretty common in some circles.
See, traditionally, in a fender bender, you get out, exchange information, file a report, etc.
When was the last time you got into a fender bender and the other guy got out of his van with his 11 buddies and beat the sh*t out of your car?
Better yet, you're driving along when you honest to god accidentally bump into a cyclist, but then before you can get out and get his information he disappears and hundreds of people proceed to start bashing your windows in? mind you your kid is in the back seat scared for her life with the potential of glass (or the entire pane) flying into her face?
Honest to god, you think these coward CM riders would've done that to a ford explorer full of armed gang members? Right about now, we'd be dragging tens (if not more) of cyclists off the streets in body bags.
There are always a couple of people who ruin it for the rest of the 3,000 people.
I think of it more as "there are always 3,000 people who ruin it for the rest of the 300,000."
KrisPistofferson
04-04-07, 08:43 PM
People who are familiar with the anarchist's circus which is the SF CM, and who are familiar with the past acts of vandalism, random property destruction, etc. do not find the article hard to believe at all.Does this in some way change the fact that it is crap journalism? Be honest. We've got a hung jury based on a blog entry and an obviously skewed thread title. This does not make me foam at the mouth for some reason.
It always bothers me to read negative stories of any kind coming out of SF. It is such an organized, well run, efficient bastion of socialism. I just can't believe that bad things happen there.
Most of these rides are invaded by students hell bent on finding a cause or a reason to sample anarchy. They could give a fat rart about what the original intention of the entire movement was about. For that matter the world around them beyond their own campus or zip code.
:roflmao: :roflmao: :roflmao:
I'm beginning to wonder if CM is why 4x4s come with skid plates.;) OR
cow/roo catchers :D
carlfreddy
04-04-07, 08:58 PM
Does this in some way change the fact that it is crap journalism? Be honest. We've got a hung jury based on a blog entry and an obviously skewed thread title. This does not make me foam at the mouth for some reason.
Are you playing devil's advocate simply because you can? There is nothing wrong with that if you are, nothing sucks more than one-sided discussion.
I think we've all established that any comment on the intricacies of the incident is nothing more than supposition.
However, let's not forget that past behavior is usually a good indicator of future (and present) behavior.
people ask me why I'm not down with CM, and **** like this is exactly why
with "friends" like these, who needs enemies?
WORD....
Everyone needs a bunch of buddies who think a good time is spending the night in jail. It's 2007, use your $ and your key board. Basically, it's a big party for the followers now. Been there, done that.
KrisPistofferson
04-04-07, 09:28 PM
Are you playing devil's advocate simply because you can? I have been known to do that, but in this case, no. There is nothing wrong with that if you are, nothing sucks more than one-sided discussion.Exactly, and this thread was obviously meant to bash Critical Mass using most logical fallacies one can think of.
I think we've all established that any comment on the intricacies of the incident is nothing more than supposition.Really? Most people have been posting based on one of two conclusions:
1. Innocent soccer mom is assaulted by barbarian, anarchist hordes of trustafarian CMers.
2.Cager-tool breeder is given her comeuppance for trying to mow down cyclists.
My only beef is with the sh!tty, Rush Limbaugh-style tactics of mr.mensa, both in his OP and title, as well as some of the unfounded speculation being engaged in based on a pre-concieved notion of activists in general.
Look, I've done my part on the activism front, and yes, some of them are socialist/anarchist looooons. But I've also been a driver and cyclist for many years, and many soccer moms are road-raging nutjobs just waiting for an excuse, as well.
Based on the quality of journalism in this thread, which of these drastic stereotypes should I rant about? Neither.
However, let's not forget that past behavior is usually a good indicator of future (and present) behavior.Maybe, but make sure you remember your "evil cager" stereotypes, too. Many drivers are good and polite, many cities have CMs that are likewise. The OP was meant to inflame passions towards a certain group of strawmen. It seems a great deal of you are stupid enough to fall for it.
(Sorry to get too cerebral on your right wing circlejerk, guys. Next time y'all murder an abortion doctor[or whatever you guys consider "activism",] I'll be sure to post a completely one-sided thread to, y'know, balance things out.)
This is why I don't participate in critical mass. I don't believe anything good can come of it in the end.
agreed
nothing like demonstrating your rights to the road like breaking all the rules of it
same roads, same rules, right? ... erm, wait a minute....
The Critical Mass rides seem to be nothing more than garbage. Nothing good can come from them anymore, and as far as I can see, nothing good HAS come from them in the past. I'm glad we don't have them around here.
slagjumper
04-04-07, 10:00 PM
Crowd mentality. Hillary would have it pretty bad if she found her way into a Young Republicans ralley. I have ridden in CM on several occations, but not in several months. Around here it is benign.
Perhaps there are economic and demographic reasons that things are heating up in SF. I have to congradulate the police in their handling of the situation. The elected officials seem reluctant to talk bad about CM. I see that as sympathetic to CM
Burrito Eater
04-04-07, 10:01 PM
I'm glad we don't have them around here.
If you are really from Detroit this is the funniest thing I have ever read. :D
The critical mass rides SEEM to be garbage? I am glad you are able to form such a stong opinion by reading some crap posted on the internet rather then participating in a ride then making a decision on your own.
carlfreddy
04-04-07, 10:08 PM
The critical mass rides SEEM to be garbage? I am glad you are able to form such a stong opinion by reading some crap posted on the internet rather then participating in a ride then making a decision on your own.
To be honest, I'd rather be a key-board activist on this one.
I wouldn't want to participate in one of these rides (if I really were interested in taking action on raising awareness in regards to cyclists' rights) for fear of being "guilty by association" thanks to the behavior of individuals who have apparently lost (or were maybe never aware of) the purpose of Critical Mass.
Tapeworm21
04-04-07, 10:18 PM
If you are really from Detroit this is the funniest thing I have ever read. :D
The critical mass rides SEEM to be garbage? I am glad you are able to form such a stong opinion by reading some crap posted on the internet rather then participating in a ride then making a decision on your own.
Fine, I'll speak. I live in Berkeley. It IS garbage. What now?
If you are really from Detroit this is the funniest thing I have ever read. :D
The critical mass rides SEEM to be garbage? I am glad you are able to form such a stong opinion by reading some crap posted on the internet rather then participating in a ride then making a decision on your own.
From Detroit, no. But I have lieved here for the better part of the last 7 or 8 years and have never heard of them happening here. Why would that be funny to you?
And yes, they SEEM to be garbage to me. Just like at first reading you SEEM to be a stuck up prick. It doesn't mean that you are, but it sure is how you have come off on your little blurb to me.
And I'm not making my decision off this one single thread. I've been on these boards for a few years, and am smart enough to research a subject further if I deem it necessary. But these rides no longer serve a useful purpose, unless that purpose is to break laws and cause problems.
Tell me sir, what GOOD do they serve for the community as a whole and not just for one persons desire to be disrespectful??
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