Commuting - Where to live?

So the wife and I have decided that we want to move out of California in the next year mostly because it is too expensive to buy a house. I am going to want to continue commuting by bike as much as possible. Assuming that my job can and will transfer me anywhere in the continental U.S., where should we move and why? I want a bike friendly community with a lower cost of living.

Front Range of Colorado for one. My sister builds homes near Boulder and is desparate to sell right now.

PDX and Seattle - both bike friendly, and theoretically cheaper then CA. Seattle can be depressing, though.

Portland. The real estate is cheaper than what you're used to in Northern CA and in Seattle, so you may well be able to afford housing in the inner core of the city. There is a strong culture of bike riding for transportation purposes, something that to me is almost more important than the actual bike facilities. We've also got a bit more sun than Seattle, although nothing like what you're used to. Our winters are mild - commuting year-round by bike is easy to do. People are also very civic-minded here, and so it's a friendly place to live.

I have lived in Kirkland, WA; Seattle, WA; Portland, OR; Vancouver, WA; Kingston, WA & now Olympia, WA. All are great for cycling but wind is a Winter factor in East Portland & Kingston. Summer heat is more frequent in Portland & Olympia. Seattle housing has gotten very expensive. I would probably choose Olympia for overall liveability, still has some affordable housing, low traffic & a bicycle friendly area. I am currently in the process of relocating to Stayton, OR which is a small town near Salem & Corvallis, OR. It appears to be reasonably liveable for the NW & cycle friendly to boot but not as good as Olympia & we are giving up a lakefront home to live closer to our kids & grandchildren. You should make a short list & visit each area then ask lots of questions. Don

I just moved to Madison, WI about six months ago. Great place for cycling, it is right in the middle of two lakes and is beautiful. Winter would probably be quite an adjustment for Californians though.

Seattle and Portland may be bike friendly, but they're rated with Chicago, NY and SF as the most over priced real estate markets right now, so, if you want affordability, not those places. Wisconsin is dirt cheap, cold as heck in the winter, hot and humid in the summer, but still beautiful. Madison is very bike friendly too.

as the Rancid song goes "I wish I was on the highway, back to Olympia(WA)" :)

Hard to beat Boulder (http://www.bicyclefriendlycommunity.org/Images/bfc_pdf_pages/boulder.pdf) except for the overpriced real estate. We are continuously improving and expanding the bike paths and bike lanes around here. Almost too much so, major construction snarl on one major street because they are making an underpass for a bike path so we don't have to cross the intersection. I moved here from Boston where I commuted for about six years so I feel guilty about how much easier it is to ride around here compared to that cold, wet, traffic-filled city. Lots of sunshine (300+ days), dry climate (high desert), mild winters, Bike-to-Work (http://www.ci.boulder.co.us/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5064&Itemid=311#BWDE), bike-racks on all public buses, lots of good bike shops (http://communitycycles.org/), Thursday night cruiser nights (http://www.boulderbicyclecommuters.org/thursday_cruisers.html), events, etc (http://www.ci.boulder.co.us/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5064&Itemid=311#CBME).

Not that cheap to live here though.

I think a manageable climate depends a lot on your personal metabolism. I can't fathom ever leaving the house in a place like central NY, biting frost or suffocating humidity (I know, interrupted by beautiful muddy spring and fall), yet at one point in my past I did it for 8 yrs.

Ah but you can get all that Boulder has to offer by checking out its neighboring cities: Longmont, Superior, Broomfield, etc. Heck, Denver and south (Englewood, Greenwood Village, Highlands Ranch) are very affordable. Denver-metro deserves some serious consideration. Denver has TONS of MUPs and designated bike routes, I've yet to see a dog get even flustered much less bark or seem aggressive (yeah, for you I just jinxed myself). and the city is very bike-friendly.

I bought my house (2br/1ba) a year ago in a (slowly) gentrifying neighborhood 5mi east of downtown for (well) under 200k. Low-mid 200s buys a lot here, especially in the 'burbs. State tax, yeah, but dirt cheap property taxes (mine are $800/year).

Big City? Little City? Small town?

Portland is bike friendly, but just don't plan on locking up an expensive bike outside. There's probably the best bike infrastructure of anywhere I've seen, but theft is a problem like any city, especially downtown.

Texas has a reasonable balance between house prices and job availability. I hear you about CA house prices. That's what prompted me to look for a way out.

I would say "Come to Tempe"... I love it here, but you've gotta be able to take the heat above 100 degrees for 5-6 months of the year. 6 months of great weather, though. and about 300 days of sunshine a year. Housing prices are rising, but still below those in CA. the 2200 sf house we bought ten years ago for $175,000 is now valued at 300,000...

I would choose based on affordability and then a lack of open-container laws.

How about some more details like weather, population density, etc.

I would say for my list
Minneapolis/St. Paul MN
Austin TX
Tucson, AZ
Denver, CO

No! Not Austin.
We've got too many people here already.

Stay away from Houston. :mad:

Stay away from Houston. :mad:

Gladly.

The average price of a home in Willits, a very progressive NorCal town, is less than $175K.

Look outside the big cities.

I live in Germantown, TN, it's quiet and safe. Bike lanes, nearby shopping for everything you could possibly need. Some of the houses are huge and expensive. Others are more reasonable.

Good water, good soil and TVA utilities which are very affordable.

You just have to be able to tolerate lots of fundies and hard core repugs.

My house in Vermont is for sale !!
:D

Someone mentioned Tucson....great desert scenery and mountains...horrible for water. Damn hot in the summer, and soon to combine with the great blob of Phoenix.

I'd avoid Tucson.

I would nominate, Portland, St. Paul, Burlington, and Santa Fe.

The Research Triangle Park area of NC (Raleigh/Cary, Durham, Chapel Hill/Carrboro). Raleigh is reportedly one of the 10 fastest growing cities in the U.S. Cary is very bike friendly. There are a number of LBS' in the area. Traffic sucks at times, but that also depends on what roads you're on. Housing costs are high for NC but probably very reasonable compared to CA, I bought a 2400sq ft, 13yr old, 4br, 2 story house on 1/3 acre on a cul de sac in a nice neighborhood in Cary for $255k in 2005.

I know nothing about the area, but in general it's nice to try to live either north, south, or east of work. If you live west, or have any westerly roads, you have to ride into the sun in the morning and in the evening.

I know nothing about the area, but in general it's nice to try to live either north, south, or east of work. If you live west, or have any westerly roads, you have to ride into the sun in the morning and in the evening.

that is a good point!

Ah but you can get all that Boulder has to offer by checking out its neighboring cities: Longmont, Superior, Broomfield, etc. Heck, Denver and south (Englewood, Greenwood Village, Highlands Ranch) are very affordable. Denver-metro deserves some serious consideration. Denver has TONS of MUPs and designated bike routes, I've yet to see a dog get even flustered much less bark or seem aggressive (yeah, for you I just jinxed myself). and the city is very bike-friendly.

I bought my house (2br/1ba) a year ago in a (slowly) gentrifying neighborhood 5mi east of downtown for (well) under 200k. Low-mid 200s buys a lot here, especially in the 'burbs. State tax, yeah, but dirt cheap property taxes (mine are $800/year).

I agree that the best bargains are outside of Boulder (could have had a house for what I paid for my condo but no car payments and about $600/year to insure two cars). I'd consider moving but I insist on living where I work so until I lose my job this is where I am staying. Less than six miles to work and almost all bike path.

I visit Austin regularly now thanks to my job and while it is a fun place it is so hot and humid down there that I have to salute the folks who ride through all that. I can't do it. It feels like riding in a sauna even for a one-mile jaunt down the street. This was just two weeks ago when everybody was telling me how 'cool' it was. Also riding on that Capital of Texas highway was one of the most terrifying experiences of my life and I have ridden through Boston rotaries. Tough hills too.

Ah but you can get all that Boulder has to offer by checking out its neighboring cities: Longmont, Superior, Broomfield, etc. Heck, Denver and south (Englewood, Greenwood Village, Highlands Ranch) are very affordable. Denver-metro deserves some serious consideration. Denver has TONS of MUPs and designated bike routes, I've yet to see a dog get even flustered much less bark or seem aggressive (yeah, for you I just jinxed myself). and the city is very bike-friendly.


Actually, you DON'T get all that Boulder has to offer by moving to the outer lying burbs. That's why prices are cheaper out there. You're in a good spot in Denver, but Wrongmont? No thanks. I commute through there by bike. Not bike friendly. Superior? Suburban hell. Broomfield? Is there a tree anywhere to be found out there? Again, no thanks.

Madison WI was voted best city for biking and for walking as well. We have bike paths everywhere and the streets keep getting ripped up and built with bigger bike lanes. Winter biking can get nasty at times but still possible. However, houses are very very expensive downtown! But I love it here, one of the best cities in the US i've been to.

sves: can I ask where else you've lived? Is there work in Madison?

+1 for Madison. Home prices here (http://www.wisconsinhomes.com/search/search_nocache.php?step=type&county=DANE) are not bargain basement compared with other mid sized Midwestern cities, but moving here from New York was still a “reverse sticker shock” experience for me.

The biking and quality of life factors here are great (rankings (http://www.visitmadison.com/visitorinfo/awards.php)). But you need to live with a 6-month biking season or else learn to brave the elements. Hey, I rode my bike to work today, and look at the weather we're having (http://www.crh.noaa.gov/forecast/MapClick.php?CityName=Madison&state=WI&site=MKX)!

I would nominate, Portland, St. Paul, Burlington, and Santa Fe.

I've heard rave reviews on all.

OK, can I just put aside all of this "affordable housing, good bike infrastructure, nice climate" stuff for a minute and go with my heart? Because goddamn, Brooklyn is a hell of a town. It has everything you need, every language, every kind of food, lots of public transportation, lots of culture, and if you don't mind avoiding the fancy/hipster neighborhoods, it's not even that expensive to live.

I know it's no Portland (where I lived for five years) in terms of livability, but on some level, we should admit that Brooklyn is the bomb. Oh, and it's great fun for biking, if you ask me.

Oh, believe me, Brooklyn is it. If only I didn't have to work in Manhattan.... And if only I didn't have three kids. Which is why a place like Madison, Wisc., seems so much better than those "almost Brooklyn" suburbs in New Jersey, like Maplewood.

Unless you've live in a cold clime before you are gonna get a big surprise :D

Portland? toooooooo much rain
Tx or Zona? Tooooooo much heat

New Yawk? Too many people AND too cold :D Boulder is nice but CO still get's nasty winters. I had 20 years of it and that's why I moved :D

I really can't think of anything weather wise that would be like Cal. At least on the coast. One place I fell in love with was Canon City Co. For whatever reason it stays pretty nice there year around.

What about the South?

I've lived in Boulder (Way too expencive) Austin (Too big) Santa Cruz(See Boulder) Seattle,Portland (Too Wet)New York,Washington Dc,Dallas,(Way too Much Real Crime) Denver,(Ok I guess but still too big) and I cant belive nobody here has Suggested Tucson!!! Very Bike Friendly,Crime istn as bad as other places,Hot in the summer but the winters Rock! Lotsa Biking(Mt,road,trail) good LBS (Ordianry Bikes On 4th Ave) Good nite life,University Of Aridzona, (Go Cats!) Great Cost of Living (My first Rental was 350 bucks,never spent more than $600) whats not to like?? (Ok mabey some of the roads have a "Bit" of traffic,but are easily avoided) Go take a Look!!

Hot in the summer

that's why ;)

YTS and Bklyn, you said it - gotta love Brooklyn. I lived on Dean Street and later on President Street. In fact I’ll be in Brooklyn this weekend visiting friends.

Looking forward to going to Tacqueria California on Bergen & Court. Their original burrito used to be the staple of my diet. Back then the Tacqueria was a tiny mid-block storefront on Bergen, next to the ironwork shop with the Mary icon. That was before Smith Street sprouted French bistros – in fact my first impression of Smith Street was … let’s just say, not a place you’d associate with fine dining.

I don’t recall seeing many cyclists outside of Central Park or Prospect Park – mostly delivery guys and messengers – but maybe times have changed. (I’m not that old, really … I don’t think …) Isn’t there a bike lane on one of the calmer east-west Brooklyn streets, like Dean (east of Smith) or Pacific? It always looked ignored and a little out of place to me. And isn’t there a nice around-Manhattan bike path in the works?

I quit cycling on New York City streets after I had one last close call involving a taxi and a pothole (that time was on Canal Street just over the Manhattan Bridge) and decided it was time to stop pushing my luck. I hope some enterprising biker liberated the low-end, pearl-gray lugged Peugeot I abandoned in a basement, locked to a radiator pipe.

You know, bike lanes, I mean, they're nice and everything, but not essential. I've had some serious run-ins with cars in New York (once on Atlantic Ave. in Brooklyn, when I was OK but the bike was totalled, once on Madison in Manhattan, when the bike was pretty much unharmed but my face was totalled), but it's a small price to pay for 24-hour access to ham-egg-and-swiss on a roll and a 22 of Corona. (Sigh - too bad I'm moving to Middletown, CT, in the fall.)

Also, to all you guys who keep rejecting certain cities because they're "too big," - what does that mean? I don't get it. How can a city be too big? Too spacious, maybe, too spread out, too many trees. These are complaints I understand. But "too big"? Big is the whole point, baby! (In other words, different strokes for different folks when it comes to places to live.)

Sadly, DC is probably not the place for you if you're interested in cheap and safe housing... you can have one but not the other. A few bike trails are nice, but the streets are in pretty poor condition.

Twin Cities. Great biking in town and surrounding areas. Pretty soon we'll have a 150-mile bike path from Twin Cities to Duluth. If you want out of the big city, move to the Brainerd or Lanesboro area. I have work mates who moved here from LA, San Fran, and Boston. All bought bigger houses.

Every once in a while, you train to Chicago or fly to a coast and spend mega bucks for acts that will make it to the upper midwest next year (where they'll be available at a fraction of the cost).

Oh ya, we have seasons. Buy some X-Country skis and ice skates for winter.

I cant belive nobody here has Suggested Tucson!!! Very Bike Friendly,Crime istn as bad as other places,Hot in the summer but the winters Rock! Lotsa Biking(Mt,road,trail) good LBS (Ordianry Bikes On 4th Ave) Good nite life,University Of Aridzona, (Go Cats!) Great Cost of Living (My first Rental was 350 bucks,never spent more than $600) whats not to like?? (Ok mabey some of the roads have a "Bit" of traffic,but are easily avoided) Go take a Look!!
Being of mostly Northern European descent and having the skin to go along with it would be why not for me. It may be rainy here half the year, but my skin sure likes it. There's also the little problem Tuscon is having with their water drying up...

Cities? Too big?

I suppose it's all a matter of personal taste, but I've had my fill of cities. Too much crime, dirty air, garbage and most of all, noise.

I prefer the quiet life of the country and small towns, only tolerating the small city I live in until my youngest is out of high school.

Life is too short to live in an apartment, essentially just a box, and miss the incredible beauty of the stars at night. Can't really see 'em in the city because of all the f-ing lights.

But again, it's a matter of personal preference. There's definitely something to be said for going to a Cubs game, visiting large museums and galleries and Broadway. But for everyday living, I prefer a slower pace, where I can walk out my door and be on a mountain trail and hike for twenty miles without ever getting in a car.

I fully understand the sentiments around Brooklyn. I love it there. I myself am originally from Stamford CT, and used to commute into Manhattan for work. Several of my colleagues lived in Brooklyn and used to rave about it. And I would be much closer to my beloved Mets if I were there instead of Boulder or Madison.

I've never tried winter riding, since I didn't decide to commute by bike until I moved here 3 years ago, but I've certainly spent some time in the elements. My wife used to swear we were moving to Madison, but now she seems stuck on Albany NY. I have spent some time lobbying for the Denver Metro area, but I love the mountains ever since I spent my freshman year in Gunnison.

Size and population aren't really important to me right now, I just wanted to get a feel for where my fellow BFer's live or would want to live and why. I am really looking for a place that is affordable, bike friendly and I wouldn't mind my kids growing up there.

+1 on Tucson. It's a great town - big enough to have everything you need, but small enough to still have some small-town feel to it.

Albuquerque has a lot of the same appeal, and it has the advantage of being further from Phoenix :p. Summers are hot but dry, winters are not bad (most days it's above freezing for at least part of the day, and it's not unusual to see warm spells of 50+ days even in the winter). You have to love the sun, though (300 sunny days a year) and be able to tolerate the wind, though. Best of all, I can get on my bike and be in the mountains in 20 minutes. :)

I'd say New Mexico, but I'd wager you'll end up here anyhow...more specifically Rio Rancho with all the other Californian expatirats. ABQ is ranked as one of the best bike commuting towns. I know that rankings don't always tell the most realistic story, but we do have some great trails here. Also great for touring and (not the best) mountain biking.

Or you could wait about 6 months for the west coast housing bubble to pop and pick up one of the 100,000's of repo's that will be on the market for cheap.

I am in a similar situation to the OP. Live in so-cal and the wife wants out. I have lived in Las Vegas, Seattle- Tacoma (hated the weather) and in the midwest. We are actually going to Tucson in a couple of weeks to check things out. Other possible choices are: stay here and never own anything larger then the condo we do now, Tucson or maybe Albuquerque. This is what I have come up with so far. We need to be in a bigger city because of our jobs. Phoenix is out as I am really not a big fan and Flagstaff and Santa Fe seem to small. I grew up not being able to go outside 6 months out of the year so I would like to avoid the freezing winters and snow.

I would like to be able to commute to work on a bike (bike friendly city) and have nature (hiking, MTB) very close. If anyone has any further insight please share. :beer:

what about San Antonio?

Also great for touring and (not the best) mountain biking.

At least Albuquerque is 200 miles closer to Moab than Tucson is. :D

I love the trails in Albuquerque, but I can't really compare them to anywhere else - the only other place I've biked much was Springfield, MO when I was growing up.