Commuting - Get Your Ass On The Sidewalk!!!

Yes, this is yet another thread about cagers yelling at me to my ass on the sidewalk. I was not expecting this until later in the year though. But it was yelled at me today on my commute home from work.

Here is what happened:

1. Distance into commute: About 2.8 miles.

2. Roadway: Singing Hills Blvd, a divided 4-lane, 35 mph, through a commercial area, both right & left turn lanes at intersections.

3. Parallel to Sing Hills Blvd: Multi-Use Path, or MUP.

4. City Ordinance: States if a MUP is parallel to a roadway cyclists are to use it rather then ride on roadway. This is never enforced & I have ridden with an off duty police officer on a roadway that parallels a MUP. I doubt the cager knows of this ordinance.

5. I was riding in the right half of the right lane, where I was legally allowed & supposed to be riding.

6. She was behind me for about a block maybe, but could not get around me because of a lot of traffic in the left lane. She had to turn right. Which means she had to merge into a right turn lane to do so, she had to wait until the start of the turn lane to merge into it. The right turn lanes start well before the intersection.

7. The light was red on approach to the intersection but turned green just before we got to it, she was in the turn lane, I was still riding in the right half of the right lane.

8. Just before she turns right I hear her yell, "GET YOUR ASS ON THE SIDEWALK!!!". To which I yelled, "THANK YOU FOR THE ADVICE I APPRECIATE IT!!!" We were both moving when this happened. As she was completeing her turn & I was continueing straigh through the intersection I saw her window go up. This tells me she put her window down to yell at me.

I am flabbergasted as to why a cager would put their window down to yell at a cyclist. That takes twice the energy. So why?

I used to yell something rather profane back & flip the bird, not anymore. I just yell what I did. I do not know what the look on her face was, but another motorist who was sitting at the red light on the cross street the cager who yelled at me turn onto, she was oncoming to him when she turned right, waiting to go straight saw & heard it first had this look of agreement on his face when she yelled at me, then a very confused look when he heard what I yelled. Again why?

So have any of you had anything like this yelled at you yet, or is it still to early in the season?

Do I understand this correctly -- if there is a MUP that parallels the busy road why not use that instead? Maybe that is why the motorist was upset?

Do I understand this correctly -- if there is a MUP that parallels the busy road why not use that instead? Maybe that is why the motorist was upset?

Because it is my legal right to use the roadway. I was excercising that right. I have ridden on this roadway for a couple of years now. I am not about to start riding on an MUP because some cager or JAM wants me to. I always ride on it as a VC. Meaning I am in the right half of the right lane, not hugging the gutter or curb line. When I am approaching intesections to stop I move to the middle of the lane to avoid a motorist from coming up beside me & to avoid a right hook in the area where there are no right turn lanes, or even where there are.

Another reason is because it is actually safer for me on the roadway vs. on the MUP. Where the MUP crosses certain intersections traffic is never on the look out for bike/ped traffic & it used to be at the intersections where there are medians on the cross roadways there were no cuts through the median to accomidate the MUP traffic. Which meant the MUP traffic had to go around the median putting them into traffic on the roadway that parallels the MUP.

Another reason is the MUP starts out on the east side of the roadway, it goes north & south, then goes under the roadway to the west side. Then it turns into a park further up & ends. I need to go further north then that.

I am sure this is why she was upset. To me she was nothing more then an ignorant cager who needs to be educated in the rules of the road.

Weren't you legally in the wrong then, if the city ordinace tells you to be on the MUP?

Besides annoying motorists to prove a point, was there actually a point to riding on the road?

MUPs are not for cycling. They're for strolling.

4. City Ordinance: States if a MUP is parallel to a roadway cyclists are to use it rather then ride on roadway. This is never enforced & I have ridden with an off duty police officer on a roadway that parallels a MUP. I doubt the cager knows of this ordinance.
I don't mean to be antagonistic, but doesn't your city ordinance read that you should have been on the MUP, since it parraleled the road? If you're waiting for motorists to be educated as to rules of the road regarding cyclists, don't hold your breath.

I got the sidewalk comment from a carload of adolescent JAMs on Saturday after work. A woman and I were riding two abreast, downhill on a four laner, taking up the right lane, and pulled up to a stoplight. kids honked behind us, I waved and gave the driver the stink-eye. then the passenger started ranting about 'there's the sidewalk' I rebutted. quite loudly, 'we're allowed to ride on the road. LEARN THE RULES.'

yeah, JAMs and the misconceptions. its not our inferiority complex, despite the cackles of the dogmaticly addled 'vc'- its the lack of respect from the JAMs.

Here's a little more clarification on the ordinance. It is for young kids mainly. Even though it does not specifically state as such, the fact that it has never been enforced when ever I have been passed by a police officer while riding on a roadway parallel to a MUP & when I have ridden with a cop on a roadway that parallels an MUP tells me I was not legally in the wrong.

So to answer that question, no I was not.

Weren't you legally in the wrong then, if the city ordinace tells you to be on the MUP?

Besides annoying motorists to prove a point, was there actually a point to riding on the road?

Yeah, it is safer. Read my comments above stating why.

Here's a little more clarification on the ordinance. It is for young kids mainly. Even though it does not specifically state as such, the fact that it has never been enforced when ever I have been passed by a police officer while riding on a roadway parallel to a MUP & when I have ridden with a cop on a roadway that parallels an MUP tells me I was not legally in the wrong.

So to answer that question, no I was not.
In that case, riding on the road in that particilar spot you're always going to be vulnerable to a verbal assault. It isn't right, but when a motorist sees a MUP along the road your slowing them down on, well, you see where it leads.

I'm getting a video camera and will start putting JAM footage up on a website I'm creating for that purpose.

It is easy to roll down the window with power windows, just one finger.

I like to respond with “Get on the freeway”.

Not to avoid the thrust of the op, I just hate intersections like thi:

"6. She was behind me for about a block maybe, but could not get around me because of a lot of traffic in the left lane. She had to turn right. Which means she had to merge into a right turn lane to do so, she had to wait until the start of the turn lane to merge into it. The right turn lanes start well before the intersection."

Something similar happened to me this weekend. I was hugging the right edge of the roadway. No traffic at all on the road except the pickup truck that was right on my tail for about 200 yards. Then I heard him rev his engine and blow past me. However, he would not cross into the other lane and he clipped me with his passenger side mirror. It didn't send me down though. Another 200 yards ahead was a "T" in the road where he had to make a turn (so right after he blew past me... he had to hit the brakes to slow down to make the turn - he has now saved himself all of 1.5 seconds.) He turned right, which goes into a mobile home park that has no outlet. so I followed him in, and waited for him to get out of his truck.

I asked, "are you in a hurry?" He said, "quit holding up traffic!" I said, "I am traffic - it was just you and I on the road!" He then told me, "you aren't supposed to be blocking the road." I told him, "I have just as much right to that road as you do." He then said I was full of S%#&.

I responded that we'll just call the police and see if that's really who is full of S%#&. I did. The police told me to wait for them at the entrance to the mobile home park. I did. It took them 30 minutes to get there. I gave my report. The cop wasn't really interested, other than he did not want me to go back and get into a confrontation with the cager. I said, that would be a welcome confrontation on my part. He said he would talk with the guy and then get back to me. Of course, I never did hear back from the cop.

Anyway, the cops don't care. I've been run off the road before and injured but couldn't get the guys plate cuz I was skidding on my head. I'm not too impressed with the Police around here. Every time I have been the victim of a crime or accident they've seemed disinterested and have never got back to me on any report. I'm ready to start taking things into my own hands. Looks like the cagers are willing to bump me around and leave me bleeding on the side of the road. If I follow them home, pound them unconscious and leave them - I doubt the cops will solve that either.

All this frustration is coming out after watching a cager talking on a cell phone run over a pedestrian that was in the crosswalk. Most of the drivers don't know the laws and are careless as hell about anything that isn't bigger than them.

NC- Did she try to hit you with her car? Throw something at you? Point a gun at you? If not then who cares what she said. You know you're right and she didn't endanger you in any way. Yeah I know it sucks putting up with ignorant attitudes, but don't let it ruin your whole day. How long have you been riding in traffic? This stuff happens, let it slide. :)

However, he would not cross into the other lane and he clipped me with his passenger side mirror.
[...]
The cop wasn't really interested,
[...]


Hooooold on there - isn't this a hit-and-run incident? Aren't they required to file something? Anything?

trailer park resident driving a pick-up truck? let the stereotyping begin NOW...


BTW, what's a JAM? pardon my ignorance of these american acronyms, and generalisations.

3. Parallel to Sing Hills Blvd: Multi-Use Path, or MUP.

4. City Ordinance: States if a MUP is parallel to a roadway cyclists are to use it rather then ride on roadway. This is never enforced & I have ridden with an off duty police officer on a roadway that parallels a MUP. I doubt the cager knows of this ordinance.


Did you consider for a second that the "sidewalk" the cager was referring to was actually the path?

Personally, i don't understand why cyclists who ***** about not having bicycle friendly roads don't use the paths when they are provided for the safety of the cyclist.

That being said: I did get the "ride on the sidewalk" myself once. But there was no path; just the road and the sidewalk. I later caught up to the dumbass cager and quoted the HTA (Highway traffic act in Ontario) to him and told him to expect a visit from the cops because of his dangerous driving. He the responded "your word against mine". The I pointed to the little black box in the middle of my handlebar... "Hey dipsh!t... smile for the camcorder." He got pissed and got out of the car, I simply turned the corner and lost him in the sidestreets and parks (GPS are useful for that!).

Got home, called the cops, filed a complaint, they came over, I handed them a copy ofthe MP4 file (Electronic video). They charged the driver based on the evidence on the video. About 8 months later I was subpoenaed to appear in court as a witness but I got a call the day before that the driver pleaded guilty to a lesser charge so I wasn't needed.

Moral of the story? DON'T GET MAD... GET EVEN!

MUPs are usually designed for recreation,
roads are usually designed for transportation,
when I am commuting I am riding for transportation,
Therefore I ride on the road unless the MUP is more convenient and safer.
There are a lot of idiotic local ordinances that most people including law enforcement ignore for the better.
Craig

Personally, i don't understand why cyclists who ***** about not having bicycle friendly roads don't use the paths when they are provided for the safety of the cyclist.


They're usually provided and designed for recreation, not transportation. They often aren't very safe, either. (Even less so after the idiot who designed those extending leashes.)

Ah yes.. those stupid leaches. I have to agree. But for me: I'd rather deal with some moron on a MUP with a long leash than with a road rager in a 4000lbs car on the street.

Killing myself is less likely to happen on the MUP.

Many drivers just hate bicyclists, period. You will never educate them, because they have already made up their mind that bikes should be on the sidewalk and notions like laws are certainly not going to make them change their little minds, so I rarely try anymore. I just make it clear to them not to f@ck with me and then ride on.

They're usually provided and designed for recreation, not transportation. They often aren't very safe, either. (Even less so after the idiot who designed those extending leashes.) +1.

Reasons why some side paths are more dangerous:
Cagers aren't looking for fast moving bikes as they turn into (or out of) driveways and side streets.
It's often hard for the cyclist to see traffic approaching on a driveway or side street, especially when there's signs and shrubbery.
The side paths often cross busy streets a few feet away from the intersection, where visibility is bad for both cager and cyclist.
The standards for paving and maintenance are usually lower on side paths. That means more bumps, cracks and debris than you'll find in the roads.
Walkers, leashes, skaters, etc. Y'all know what I mean!
Some paths are poorly lit at night.
Actually, I believe that highway standards now prohibit most side path designs, and very few new ones are being built.

I generally avoid "me too," but...um...me too. I get up to ride at 4:30 on weekdays, get in an hour while it's still cool and little traffic. I especially like riding down the middle of Main St. Then, I turn down US41, which is 3 lanes in each direction. I take the center of the right lane. I've got 2 headlights, 2 blinkie tail lights, reflectors and a scratched Pink Floyd CD in the pocket of my gear bag that really catches the headlights behind me. When traffic approaches from the rear, I make myself big and visable, weave (in my lane) and 99 out 100 cars move all the way to the left lane, leaving the center clear and me smiling. Except for that $*#% ($@%) CocaCola delivery truck, who every @#$% morning hugs the right lane and honks his horn at me. I realize he has to turn right at every C-Store on the road, but is his schedule and life so lousy that he's got to mess with my sole serene time of the day? It's been suggested I hold the center of my lane and MAKE him so around, but I don't want to be roadkill to prove a point. I've seen him loading up his colored toxic sugar water at 7-11, but figure if I confront him than tomorrows ride would be even more dangerous. There, I've vented, all better.

Part of my commute I ride on the road with a MUP about 10 feet away. Reason? I come down a hill going 25 MPH and there is no way to turn onto the MUP without almost coming to a stop. Staying on the road I can go about a mile at 25 MPH. I occassionally get impatient drivers behind me, but I'm legally entitled to ride on the road even though there is a MUP a few feet away.

Best responses for "Get on the Sidewalk!!"?

1. "Read the Law!"
2. "SIDE--WHAT?!"

You should have asked the cop for his business card and then followed up with a call to his Captain. If you didn't get any satisfaction, you should have called IAD and reported him for delreliction of duty.

Hooooold on there - isn't this a hit-and-run incident? Aren't they required to file something? Anything?

I guess in my community it's "no blood... no foul." I wish they would have sent a bike cop. He probably would have got there faster and would have issued a citation. You would think that drivers here would be more considerate and better educated considering that this community has heavily invested in bicycle lanes and MUP's. I think they like the bike lanes... they consider it "free roadside parking."

Hopefully things will get better. I was in the LBS the other day and the wrenches were putting the final touches on 4 bicycles the Sheriff just ordered to patrol a 35 mile MUP.

You have to be able to sit back and think about the driver of a car and the situation they're in.

Under normal conditions, when I drive, I'm paying attention to everybody else on the road. Now, as a cyclist, I pay extra attention to bikes on the road and try to give a little bit more leeway than most. But I'm going off on a tangant here...generally they're angry because they either aren't healthy due to their lifestyle or they've got 50 other things on their minds.

When I ride, I can clear my head and concentrate on me, even if I have problems to work out, they sort of just ebb away once I get my cadence up and enjoy the wind in my face, et al.

I'm not defending either side frankly, just realize that intolerance is really more a case of letting too many things collide internally while driving a 2 ton machine.

Personally, i don't understand why cyclists who ***** about not having bicycle friendly roads don't use the paths when they are provided for the safety of the cyclist.

Do you understand the cyclists who ***** about poorly designed/unsafe sidepaths being placed adjacent to streets and ***** about mandatory sidepath laws, who ride the street and advocate against such laws/facilities?

Al

A competent driver should be able to get around any slow moving vehicle in a reasonable amount of time on a multilane road even if traffic is busy/dense.

Competence includes being able to look ahead and plan accordingly instead of tailgaiting only several feet back while fuming about SMV instead of hanging well back looking for a gap in left lane (negotiate if needed) to accelerate into.

Al

Best responses for "Get on the Sidewalk!!"?

2. "SIDE--WHAT?!"

I love that one!

Car: "Get your ass on the sidewalk"
Biker: "Side-what?"
Car: "Get your ass on the sidewalk d!psh!t"
Biker:"Side-what?"
Car: "WALK... Side-WALK!"
Biker: "Do you see me WALKING numbnuts?"

They're usually provided and designed for recreation, not transportation. They often aren't very safe, either. (Even less so after the idiot who designed those extending leashes.)

Ah yes... this morning on my commute a guy was on the MUP with his two dogs... neither on a leash. I rang my bell.. no response, I yelled "on your left!".. no response from the walker but his dogs turned and as i passed the walker (i slowed way down) one chased and bit me on the ankle.. next dog - field goal into the fence! The walker yelled at me, "What do you think you're doing to my dog?" My response, "same thing I'm gonna do to you if I decide to turn around!"

Whutza "MUP"? sorry...

Whutza "MUP"? sorry...
MUP = multi-use path
JAM = jackass motorist

Aas i passed the walker (i slowed way down) one chased and bit me on the ankle.. next dog - field goal into the fence! The walker yelled at me, "What do you think you're doing to my dog?" My response, "same thing I'm gonna do to you if I decide to turn around!"

Classic :D

8. Just before she turns right I hear her yell, "GET YOUR ASS ON THE SIDEWALK!!!". To which I yelled, "THANK YOU FOR THE ADVICE I APPRECIATE IT!!!" We were both moving when this happened. As she was completeing her turn & I was continueing straigh through the intersection I saw her window go up. This tells me she put her window down to yell at me.

I look at it this way: If she yelled at you she damn sure saw you which is a victory in upon itself.

The I pointed to the little black box in the middle of my handlebar...


I sooo want to know what this setup is! What kind of camera? How is it mounted? How does it handle the abuse of commuting and rainy days? /threadjack

boog

Do I understand this correctly -- if there is a MUP that parallels the busy road why not use that instead? Maybe that is why the motorist was upset?
That's a good question; I was wondering the same.

In my case I also use the road. There is a community MUP for 1.5 miles of my commute. It is about 5 - 6 feet wide and the surface bulges from tree roots, is coated with acorns, tree branches, leaves, and mud. It meanders more than a stream and constantly surges up and down. Riding it would be hazardous to pedestrians, joggers, and the occasional young cyclist. I'd probably maintain 7 mph instead of 19 - 20 mph.

I sooo want to know what this setup is! What kind of camera? How is it mounted? How does it handle the abuse of commuting and rainy days? /threadjack

boog

It used to be a samsung scp-something. But i lost that camera on my boat. I was filming, got hit by a wave and it went overboard. oops!

Now I use a Canon powershot sd30 digital elph. With a fully charged battery and an empty 2GB SD card, i can film 640x480 for about 48 mins, more than my usual commute.

The mount is simply a metal bar a u-bolt and some other hardware. Doesn't really work well in adverse weather though.

I'm builing a new spring mounted bracket which will smooth the video a bit.

Yes, this is yet another thread about cagers yelling at me to my ass on the sidewalk. I was not expecting this until later in the year though. But it was yelled at me today on my commute home from work.

Here is what happened:

1. Distance into commute: About 2.8 miles.

2. Roadway: Singing Hills Blvd, a divided 4-lane, 35 mph, through a commercial area, both right & left turn lanes at intersections.

3. Parallel to Sing Hills Blvd: Multi-Use Path, or MUP.

4. City Ordinance: States if a MUP is parallel to a roadway cyclists are to use it rather then ride on roadway. This is never enforced & I have ridden with an off duty police officer on a roadway that parallels a MUP. I doubt the cager knows of this ordinance.

5. I was riding in the right half of the right lane, where I was legally allowed & supposed to be riding.

6. She was behind me for about a block maybe, but could not get around me because of a lot of traffic in the left lane. She had to turn right. Which means she had to merge into a right turn lane to do so, she had to wait until the start of the turn lane to merge into it. The right turn lanes start well before the intersection.

7. The light was red on approach to the intersection but turned green just before we got to it, she was in the turn lane, I was still riding in the right half of the right lane.

8. Just before she turns right I hear her yell, "GET YOUR ASS ON THE SIDEWALK!!!". To which I yelled, "THANK YOU FOR THE ADVICE I APPRECIATE IT!!!" We were both moving when this happened. As she was completeing her turn & I was continueing straigh through the intersection I saw her window go up. This tells me she put her window down to yell at me.

I am flabbergasted as to why a cager would put their window down to yell at a cyclist. That takes twice the energy. So why?

I used to yell something rather profane back & flip the bird, not anymore. I just yell what I did. I do not know what the look on her face was, but another motorist who was sitting at the red light on the cross street the cager who yelled at me turn onto, she was oncoming to him when she turned right, waiting to go straight saw & heard it first had this look of agreement on his face when she yelled at me, then a very confused look when he heard what I yelled. Again why?

So have any of you had anything like this yelled at you yet, or is it still to early in the season?

Ignore them unless they come at you with a 4 way then run like h3ll or use your Kung Foo moves and beat the ***** out of them

I sooo want to know what this setup is! What kind of camera? How is it mounted? How does it handle the abuse of commuting and rainy days? /threadjack


The cheap Oregon Scientific models were popular a year or so ago. 4-6 AAA batteries and a 1Gb SD card will get you an hour or so of slowish VGA video in a small package, and they come with bike mounting parts. Wrap it in some clear plastic food wrap to make it basically waterproof.

Personally, i don't understand why cyclists who ***** about not having bicycle friendly roads don't use the paths when they are provided for the safety of the cyclist.

The point I think is that in most cases, even though the paths are theoretically provided for the safety of the cyclists, they're not designed by people who are competent, and as a result they are actually less safe than the road, sometimes a LOT less safe.

Following mandatory sidepath laws when the path is less safe than the road is just leading to another case of being "dead" right. I'd rather be alive and "wrong".

It used to be a samsung scp-something. But i lost that camera on my boat. I was filming, got hit by a wave and it went overboard. oops!

Now I use a Canon powershot sd30 digital elph. With a fully charged battery and an empty 2GB SD card, i can film 640x480 for about 48 mins, more than my usual commute.

The mount is simply a metal bar a u-bolt and some other hardware. Doesn't really work well in adverse weather though.

I'm builing a new spring mounted bracket which will smooth the video a bit.


The cheap Oregon Scientific models were popular a year or so ago. 4-6 AAA batteries and a 1Gb SD card will get you an hour or so of slowish VGA video in a small package, and they come with bike mounting parts. Wrap it in some clear plastic food wrap to make it basically waterproof.


Thanks to both of you!:beer:

I think that Oregon Scientific one is the ticket for me, to lazy to build a mount for anything. Google here I come!

boog

You guys are too kind. I'd just ask to see his badge. If he doesn't have one he can go f*ck off.

F the cager.

F everyone who thinks the cager is right.

And F everyone else just for the F of it !


Thanks for the advice !

Cagers do some really stupid crap. Trying to figure out why they sometimes act like complete blithering idiots is a waste of time. Just go on and try to forget about it. You handled the situation correctly.

BTW-There are times when I avoid some of the bike paths around here (of which there are very few-bike paths that is). When people with dogs and small children start using the MUP I think they become more dangerous to cyclists than the roadways. Might as well try to do a crit in a mall parking lot on a Saturday around Christmas time.

Do I understand this correctly -- if there is a MUP that parallels the busy road why not use that instead? Maybe that is why the motorist was upset?


Personally, i don't understand why cyclists who ***** about not having bicycle friendly roads don't use the paths when they are provided for the safety of the cyclist.

Sometimes separated paths are provided with the intention of making cyclists safer, but in reality make cyclists less safe by putting us in places where we won't be seen-and-noticed by motorists when we approach driveways or intersections. Sometimes, using less-safe facilities is even mandated by law.


Weren't you legally in the wrong then, if the city ordinace tells you to be on the MUP?

It looks to me like N_C was violating a law by using the road, but without seeing the location ourselves it's difficult to judge whether the MUP was reasonable for N_C's use. If in fact N_C was violating a law that's ill-conceived and not enforced, we probably don't care that it was violated.

Cyclists can almost always safely use separated paths that parallel roads. But safe use of those paths often requires pedestrian-like behavior at driveways and intersections and that could lower your average speed by 1% or 50%, depending on how many times you have to stop or slow to a walking pace for intersections.

.....
I am flabbergasted as to why a cager would put their window down to yell at a cyclist. That takes twice the energy. So why?
.....
Don't knock it. Probably the most exercise she got all day.:p

Personally, i don't understand why cyclists who ***** about not having bicycle friendly roads don't use the paths when they are provided for the safety of the cyclist.

First, I really have no clue about MUPs as we don't have them around here. All we have are recreation trails which don't go anywhere and aren't suitable for transportation. My feeling is that many (most?) of the cyclists already in the road have no desire to ride on a path. Maybe I'm alone on this though.

It seems like paths, and many times bike lanes, are advocated by people who will not be using them on a daily basis. Things that are nice for a Saturday morning stroll with the kids often don't work so well on a Monday morning commute.

I know there are exceptions to the rules, and I am mainly speaking from a local perspective. If I were forced off my commute into a problematic bike lane or path I would resent it. What I am personally in favor of, however, are straight-line paths that parallel roads inaccessible to bicycles. For example, if there were a bike path along the main highways (interstate and beltlines) I could ride my bike to the major business park situation between several larger cities in my region. Without it, a car is the only way I could get to work in that area.

Don't knock it. Probably the most exercise she got all day.:p
Pushing a button is exercise? I'd be really scared if it was a crank down window.