Road Cycling - What steel frames do you like?

I've been looking into new road bikes to replace my old workhorse. It will be Durace or Ultegra $2500 - $3500. It will need to be race worthy and a good reliable trainer (Old work horse will be used on the mag trainer and rainy days). I cannot afford to have a bike just for racing. Besides if I am going to spend that much money I am going to ride the darn thing as much as I can. Here are some of the frames I have been looking at. I would appreciate your experience and suggestions. I'm just not sure if I want to go Carbon or AL at this point. I've lost weight 230 to 197 and plan to get to around 175 so I am not concerned about weight. I like the Eddy Merckx AL bikes, but have not had the opportunity to ride one yet. Tell me what you think.

Colnago Master X Light
GURU Steel
Waterford
:D

I'm a little confused, the thread title is for steel frames and you talk about AL. In any case, just something to consider if you are looking into steel frames, burley (the child trailer maker) is now making steel road bikes. You can buy them built up, or just the frame. My buddy just got one, the welds are very impressive and the steel is really high quality. He is really happy with the ride so far (he's had it for about two weeks now). So look into them if you can. (The frame price with carbon fork (no headset) is about $1200-1400 canadian. Good luck.

I ride an earlier version of the Colnago Master and like it alot. If the XL is an improvement in performance (I'm told it's stiffer in the BB) then it's a contender. In fact it would be hard to beat, imo. (I'm not too sure about Shimano on a 'Nago though)

Waterford as the true successor to the Schwinn Paramount would be a great choice as well. Do they use Reynolds 853? I haven't ridden such a frame yet but when I can finally talk the wife into a new bike I'm looking seriously at a LeMond in 853.

Don't know much about Gurus. May be a great bike but others will have to advise.

Either the MXL or the Waterford would be great for any riding except maybe loaded touring. Ride em and race em though with all that airbrushing on the Colnagos I'd just sit and cry the first time I threw it down the road.

check this out retails at about $1900.oo (Guru Strada)

Or this: retails at about $2800.oo

i like the steel from IF, Cherry, Steelman (which is what i ride). the welds are magnificent. i also like waterford. of course lemond and derosa.....

IMHO you cannot get a better frame than Waterford. Yes they use 853 they also use True Temper OX Platinum and the new S3 steel tubing.

Love the Colnago Crystal, take a look around some well established bike shops, they probably have a few kicking around.

Serotta CSi Serotta (http://www.serotta.com)
Richard Sachs (www.richardsachs.com)
J.P. Weigle (of the framesaver stuff)
Vanilla (www.vanillabicycles.com) (good price for custom)
Bianchi has some nice steel frames.

The Serotta, Sachs, and Weigle are expensive so
they may be out of the picture.
another very good steel frame
is Pegoretti, some on sale at
competitive cyclist (http://www.competitivecyclist.com/)
Marty

Good call! I totally forgot about Pegoretti, you'd be hard pressed to find a frame better built than theirs.

cervelo prodigy.

Give Seven a call.

If you want to save a few bucks, get the Surly Pacer. I have one and the thing is unbreakable (by road bike standards, of course).

Seven is a good choice, but pricey. Steelman cycles offers a great package. I haven't ridden a Steelman, but their bike received the bike of the year from Road Bike Review.

http://www.steelmancycles.com/

Bike of the year: http://www.roadbikereview.com/AWD_2493_2002crx.aspx

Seven's phone number $$$-$$$$$$$

IF all the way!

But the DeRosa Merack is a dam fine ride too, but it's not steel

Check out the Marinoni Piuma and Piuma Extra with the carbon rear triangle. I had a chance to test ride these bikes a few weeks ago and they are beautiful to ride. They like Guru are made in Canada.

Here is the site:

http://www.marinoni.qc.ca/

I also like the DeRosa Neo Primato. It is steel and wonderful.

If you want the "classic" look, go with the Waterford 2200. A nice steel-lugged frame. You can even get it with stainless steel lugs. Cool!

I'm partial to the Colnago and the Waterfords and the Cherry bikes are nice too. I used to stop in the shop down in Lafayette every so often when I was going to school there. The rear carbon on the GURU steel bothers me for some reason. Not sure why. I will get a carbon fork on a steel bike, but the rear just bugs me. I am going to look into the Pegoretti since I have never really seen many around. Oh so many to choose from. If I could only convince my wife I need to buy two.

Do the rear carbon really make that much of a difference?

Runyun,

I feel the same way, too. I had a chance to get my Serotta Legend Ti with the ST (i.e., carbon) seatstays. I guess my conservative (i.e., retrogrouch) side said "Stick with 100% Ti for the frame and don't bother messing with mixed materials in the frame."

SteveE

What steel frames do you like?Since you ask ;) I like ones with
fairly thin-walled tubes for a resilient ride, like Reynolds 853
a standard headset setup (not integrated, not ZeroStack), and I prefer threaded over threadless
a traditional diamond geometry instead of compact
lugs are nice
I prefer vertical dropouts since I've yanked a few wheels out of horizontal dropouts
No FD braze-on
Curved fork blades, not straight-blade

In actuality I have a '00 Paramount frameset in a box here that meets all the criteria except for the last two. It's a beauty, now if I just had money for parts... :(

Of the ones you mentioned, the Waterford catches my eye. But it's not for me, so get what you like best :D

All of the bikes mentioned are very nice. One of my favourite steels is the GIOS Compact Pro, which uses adjustable vertical rear drop outs. My ex girlfriend has one and it's just the most gorgeous bike. The geometry is nice and tight, making for a very responsive bike under acceleration. It's a little bit darty around corners, but anything would be compared to my relaxed Lemond. She also had a very short stem on it, which would alter the handling characteristics.

Excel Sports (http://www.excelsports.com) in Boulder are the importers in the US.

And here's one to gawk at :D

http://www.excelsports.com/image.asp?item=Gios%20Compact%20Pro%20Frame%20without%20Fork.jpg

Oh and to answer your question as to which steel frames do I like? Any of the EOM 16.5s are very nice. Especially Fondriest's Stratus Carb. Cue drooling :)

Waterfords are great-have several customers on them and they all swear by them. Great guys there too, which helps.
RunYun-you may be interested to know that they closed that shop. I don't know if Cherry is still there but when I was leaving school they were closing the shop down.