Road Cycling - Titanium or Carbon

I'm thinking about my next bike, leaning towards Serotta, but still have an open mind. I've been upgrading my Specialized Allez with higher end components that I intend to use to on a new frame. I'm not sure of the pro and cons of titanium and carbon. I could use some imput and some recommendations on frames or complete bikes to consider.

Serotta's are awesome bikes, but I ended up going with a Calfee:
www.calfeedesign.com
Feels like every ounce of effort goes right to the drive train, stiff, yet VERY comfortable. The Ti was also very comfortable, just felt like the all carbon bike wants to shoot forward with every pedal stroke!

I'll put in my vote for Aegis (http://www.aegisbicycles.com/). My Aro Svelte rides incredibly smooth and responds instantly to a sprint. It doesn't feel "dead" like most people would describe your typical (is there such a thing?) carbon frame. I'm not sure if it's because of my frame's size (48cm) but I notice no flex when I'm hammering. It's not the lightest of carbon frames but it's certainly pretty durable and it comes with a lifetime crash replacement guarantee.

As far as Ti goes, that would be my next choice of material along with a high-quality steel frame. Serotta makes very nice bikes. I don't think you can go wrong with a Serotta ti frame but I have no long-term experience with them... only a much too short testride... and a deep longful lust for an Ottrott with the optional carbon seatstays.

itshris,

Check out the Calfee and Serotta Phorums here (http://www.hydromedia.com/phorum/index.php). for opinions of current owners. Calfee or Serotta, you can't go wrong. Just make sure you get fitted correctly. I decided on a full-Ti frame w/CF fork because I figured it would be more durable in the long-haul than a CF frame. Besides, I always lusted after a Serotta ever since he built the bikes for the Motorola team (even 'tho the bikes said "Huffy" on them).

Steve "Serotta Legend Ti" E.

I went Ti. But I'm a big guy and things have a tendency to die when I play with them.

Originally posted by khuon
I'll put in my vote for Aegis (http://www.aegisbicycles.com/). My Aro Svelte rides incredibly smooth and responds instantly to a sprint. It doesn't feel "dead" like most people would describe your typical (is there such a thing?) carbon frame. I'm not sure if it's because of my frame's size (48cm) but I notice no flex when I'm hammering. It's not the lightest of carbon frames but it's certainly pretty durable and it comes with a lifetime crash replacement guarantee.

As far as Ti goes, that would be my next choice of material along with a high-quality steel frame. Serotta makes very nice bikes. I don't think you can go wrong with a Serotta ti frame but I have no long-term experience with them... only a much too short testride... and a deep longful lust for an Ottrott with the optional carbon seatstays.

you also didn't mention the other factor...that the Aro Svelte is the sexiest bike ever made...that curved seat tube is so incredibly cool.

Originally posted by Phatman
you also didn't mention the other factor...that the Aro Svelte is the sexiest bike ever made...that curved seat tube is so incredibly cool.

Well yeah... there's that. I just wanted someone else to say it. :D

Can't let this one pass..the first sexy bike I recall with an curved seatpost is...TAA DAA... a Schwinn Paramount...from 1974 I believe!! Had the chance to see one in action at last years RAGBRAI. Of course, the frame was steel, so this is like way off subject, but I couldn't pass up the chance to metion a Paramount! :) And, since carbon and aluminum are both more or less disposable frames, I would go with carbon.

Nah, you guys are both wrong, the Aegis Swift is the sexiest bike ever made. A lot of men really admire it! Better yet, it's probably to small for you, which makes it really special.

And don't forget Khuon how well they handle on the downhills, so smooth and stable.

BTW, I saw a Svelte in the store the other day, it's pretty good looking too.

Kathi

Giant Composite, can't beat the ride for the money. $3800, Dura/Ace, Kyserium SL=15.6 pounds in medium. $4600 Record Carbon, Nucleons, probably a tick lighter.

Originally posted by lovemyswift
Nah, you guys are both wrong, the Aegis Swift is the sexiest bike ever made. A lot of men really admire it! Better yet, it's probably to small for you, which makes it really special.

Yep, the Swift is also a very sexy bike. What makes it even sexier (at least to me and probably most males) is that Swifts are usually ridden by the fairer sex. You have to consider the whole package afterall. ;)



Originally posted by lovemyswift
And don't forget Khuon how well they handle on the downhills, so smooth and stable.

Yep... even at 55MPH my Svelte rides and corners like it's on rails. I admit I love taking those long downhills at speed. I deserve it afterall... I worked my butt off to get to the top. :D

However, on one organised group ride, I was flying down a hill at about 45MPH totally absorbed in the thrill, tucked in tight and aero, when I noticed that there were no riders near me anymore. None in front... none behind... I took out my route map and noticed there was supposed to be a turn at the bottom of the hill but I didn't remember seeing any turnoff. Looking up ahead, I saw an intersection so I rode on figuring that's where the turn was supposed to be. After getting to the turnoff and taking a right, I still didn't see any riders. Then I glanced to the side and saw a road paralleling mine going across the valley with a bunch of cyclists. Oops. After back-tracking a couple of miles, I came across a group of riders at the intersection I had missed. They claimed they were yelling at me and waving their arms but I went by too quickly.

I'm a big fan of Ti, especially over carbon. The 5200, KG381, and Colnago C40 I've ridden all felt a bit unresponsive to me. That's not to say that all carbon bikes ride this way, of course. I ride an aluminum bike, so what do I know anyway?

Thanks to everyone for your insight. I'm surprised no mentioned Kestrel. Are they considered to be more brand then quality? I did check out Calfey's site yesterday and like what they have. Because I'm 260, I'm stuck with the higher dollar range of anyone's line I think. Even after I eventually lose more weight, I'll still be 230 or so with all the muscle mass I carry. Is TI just going to be better suited to me?

I am not as heavy as you, 185lbs. I don't like the ride of TI for bigger riders. I have tried the Lightspeed, Merckx, and the Merlin, all had too much flex for my liking. Yes, carbon feels a little dead compared to TI but it as light and much stiffer.

"Yes, carbon feels a little dead compared to TI"

"Dead" is about the last word I would use to describe the ride of my Calfee...more like"lively" or "spirited" :D

Serotta Ti


.

Originally posted by itschris
I'm surprised no mentioned Kestrel.

As I understand it, Kestrel was formed by a bunch of ex-Aegis folks. As the story goes, there was a dispute in manufacturing principles between two camps within Aegis and the other camp went off to form Kestrel.

At anyrate, I don't think many people are going to dispute Kestrel's quality. I've never ridden one of their frames but 90% of the people I have talked to who ride them have been pretty happy with them. I did once ride a bike with some Kestrel components. Nothing much to be said about the handlebars other than they felt stiff enough for me and made a little bit of creaking noise as all CF bars will tend to do. However their forks are top-notch... rode very smooth and tracked nicely even over rough pavement.

Ti - can't really go wrong, but I'd choose Litespeed (wait a minute, I did choose Litespeed)
CF - would have to be a Look frame

One other thing to consider with CF is whether or not to go lugged. To me a lugged frame (such as on the Calfees) construction's biggest advantages are that they're repairable (to an extent) and they can accomodate custom sizing. Due to the way frames like my Aegis are made, custom sizes would be prohibitively expensive to produce and if they're damaged you can't just unjoin a tube and replace it... certain things are repairable but most of the time you have to scrap and replace the whole frame.

how is it repairable? Those are permanent bonds!

Originally posted by RacerX
how is it repairable? Those are permanent bonds!

I remember reading somewhere that carbon fiber lugged frames could be repaired. I'll see if I can dig up the source.

Well... I haven't been able to find my source. There's some information out there about patching a CF frame but that's not the same thing. This was about actually debonding the tubes from the lugs and replacing the damaged tube. I recall the argument as going something like this:

"Unlike lugged frames of other materials, you can't repair carbon fiber."
'Yes you can... and here's how...'

Sound similar? Maybe the person was sniffing too much epoxy or maybe I was. :D