Taylor
05-16-07, 07:20 PM
Hey, from anyones personal expierience which is an overall better investment, SRAM X.O components or Shimano XTR? What ar ethe advantages and disadvantages of each?
Mountain Biking - SRAM X.O or Shimano XTR
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05-16-07, 07:23 PM
x.0 looks like it could beat XTR in a fist fight...
santiago
05-16-07, 07:53 PM
x.0 looks like it could beat XTR in a fist fight...
I agree but XTR has a better singing voice.
I agree but XTR has a better singing voice.
free_pizza
05-16-07, 07:54 PM
wait till Raiyn sees this thread.....
mtnbiker66
05-16-07, 07:56 PM
I agree but XTR has a better singing voice.
I say we have a XO vs XTR death match.
I say we have a XO vs XTR death match.
mikejo
05-16-07, 07:58 PM
Either you are just trying to start a discussion or you really don't know what to get. If it is the later, then you should go with XT or X.9 at the most. With all due respect, people who buy XTR or X.0 don't ask questions like that.
santiago
05-16-07, 07:59 PM
I say we have a XO vs XTR death match.
It's X.0 and not "hugs and kisses XO", but yes a death match would finally settle this once and for all.
It's X.0 and not "hugs and kisses XO", but yes a death match would finally settle this once and for all.
alumrock12
05-16-07, 08:08 PM
With all due respect, people who buy XTR or X.0 don't ask questions like that.
well said
well said
Taylor
05-16-07, 08:10 PM
Either you are just trying to start a discussion or you really don't know what to get. If it is the later, then you should go with XT or X.9 at the most. With all due respect, people who buy XTR or X.0 don't ask questions like that.
I am only trying to learn. Honestly, I don't care to start a discussion, I was just curious. I always hear of the two and wanted to knwo the differences. As you all know each of their websites will only state that theirproduct is the best, at least I know enough to not listen to such advertising.
I am only trying to learn. Honestly, I don't care to start a discussion, I was just curious. I always hear of the two and wanted to knwo the differences. As you all know each of their websites will only state that theirproduct is the best, at least I know enough to not listen to such advertising.
never
05-16-07, 08:12 PM
Hey, from anyones personal expierience which is an overall better investment, SRAM X.O components or Shimano XTR?
Depends on which you prefer, Shimano or SRAM.
What ar ethe advantages and disadvantages of each?
Advantages: top of the line performance and light weight
Disadvantages: cost
This applies to both.
Depends on which you prefer, Shimano or SRAM.
What ar ethe advantages and disadvantages of each?
Advantages: top of the line performance and light weight
Disadvantages: cost
This applies to both.
Raiyn
05-16-07, 08:22 PM
wait till Raiyn sees this thread.....
Too late. I saw it prior to anyone else posting. Just held off so as not to blast the noob
X.0 and XTR are both the top of their respective brands line ups. Do I think either one of them is worth the premium? No I've stated it a dozen times or more that the highest I'd go on any of my bikes would be XT, (X-9) on a MTB or Ultegra (Chorus or SRAM's Rival) for the road. Leave the race stuff to the wannabe's, sponsored riders, and the guys who have more money than brains.
Too late. I saw it prior to anyone else posting. Just held off so as not to blast the noob
X.0 and XTR are both the top of their respective brands line ups. Do I think either one of them is worth the premium? No I've stated it a dozen times or more that the highest I'd go on any of my bikes would be XT, (X-9) on a MTB or Ultegra (Chorus or SRAM's Rival) for the road. Leave the race stuff to the wannabe's, sponsored riders, and the guys who have more money than brains.
Minesbroken
05-16-07, 08:24 PM
I want sram x9 so I can go back to grip shifts :p
Minesbroken
05-16-07, 08:35 PM
evening pete
misterC
05-16-07, 09:27 PM
Too late. I saw it prior to anyone else posting. Just held off so as not to blast the noob
X.0 and XTR are both the top of their respective brands line ups. Do I think either one of them is worth the premium? No I've stated it a dozen times or more that the highest I'd go on any of my bikes would be XT, (X-9) on a MTB or Ultegra (Chorus or SRAM's Rival) for the road. Leave the race stuff to the wannabe's, sponsored riders, and the guys who have more money than brains.
What if all of a sudden shimano tripled the prices of all their parts, would xt then not be worth the "premium"? I'm just wondering if its just the price that offends you so much.
And for the record (no pun intended), Chorus is the equivalent to Dura Ace.
X.0 and XTR are both the top of their respective brands line ups. Do I think either one of them is worth the premium? No I've stated it a dozen times or more that the highest I'd go on any of my bikes would be XT, (X-9) on a MTB or Ultegra (Chorus or SRAM's Rival) for the road. Leave the race stuff to the wannabe's, sponsored riders, and the guys who have more money than brains.
What if all of a sudden shimano tripled the prices of all their parts, would xt then not be worth the "premium"? I'm just wondering if its just the price that offends you so much.
And for the record (no pun intended), Chorus is the equivalent to Dura Ace.
Minesbroken
05-16-07, 09:32 PM
I say if you can afford it then why not...If you ask me wich is better I dont know, Havent ridden with either one. My bike has XT and it works pretty well although I'm sure that the xo or xtr would be better. I want to change to x9 anyway so I can use the xo gripshifts. sram and shimano from what I understand use different indexing
probable556
05-17-07, 04:56 AM
My theory is it will just weigh less. I just built my new bike with a LX drivetrain and XT shifters and after all adjustments it works perfect. How can something do more than you ask it to? If my bike weights a few ounces more, BFD. Untill I have 10% bodyfat there is no sense in caring about a few onces on a bike.
I would rather spend the cost differences on better tires, handlebar streamers, or burritos.
To answer the OP: Sram is for hippies and troublemakers. Always keep an eye on those hooligans.
I would rather spend the cost differences on better tires, handlebar streamers, or burritos.
To answer the OP: Sram is for hippies and troublemakers. Always keep an eye on those hooligans.
scrublover
05-17-07, 05:45 AM
I want sram x9 so I can go back to grip shifts :p
You realize you can get Grip-Shift/twist shifters that work with your Shimano stuff, right? (http://sram.com/en/srammountain/compatibleshifters/attack/twistshifter.php)
Or, just spend the money to get the whole SRAM setup and sell off you old Shimano stuff.
You realize you can get Grip-Shift/twist shifters that work with your Shimano stuff, right? (http://sram.com/en/srammountain/compatibleshifters/attack/twistshifter.php)
Or, just spend the money to get the whole SRAM setup and sell off you old Shimano stuff.
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 05:50 AM
You realize you can get Grip-Shift/twist shifters that work with your Shimano stuff, right? (http://sram.com/en/srammountain/compatibleshifters/attack/twistshifter.php)
Or, just spend the money to get the whole SRAM setup and sell off you old Shimano stuff.
I was under the impression that sram works on a 1:1 index and shimano works on a 2:1 index. so that the sram gripshifts wouldnt work with the rear shimano derailler....however it should work with the Lx front that I have. Of course I'm still not sure and I've heard many different things.
Or, just spend the money to get the whole SRAM setup and sell off you old Shimano stuff.
I was under the impression that sram works on a 1:1 index and shimano works on a 2:1 index. so that the sram gripshifts wouldnt work with the rear shimano derailler....however it should work with the Lx front that I have. Of course I'm still not sure and I've heard many different things.
scrublover
05-17-07, 06:01 AM
I was under the impression that sram works on a 1:1 index and shimano works on a 2:1 index. so that the sram gripshifts wouldnt work with the rear shimano derailler....however it should work with the Lx front that I have. Of course I'm still not sure and I've heard many different things.
Go and read the link that I posted above...:rolleyes:
Go and read the link that I posted above...:rolleyes:
willtsmith_nwi
05-17-07, 06:48 AM
What if all of a sudden shimano tripled the prices of all their parts,
Then SRAM would take over the manufacture of all MTB components. I have to agree with Raiyn on this one. The top pricepoint are typically all weight reductions and no mechanical performance advantage.
Then SRAM would take over the manufacture of all MTB components. I have to agree with Raiyn on this one. The top pricepoint are typically all weight reductions and no mechanical performance advantage.
Bike Lover
05-17-07, 07:42 AM
According to my LBS last years SRAM X.0 Grip Shift shifted much quicker/immediately than the X.9. IIRC, this years X.9 is last years X.0 with this years X.0 being lighter. I was impressed with the grip shift (last years X.0) when I tried it. It almost made me want to switch.
Being more traditional though, I stuck with what I'm familiar with and have the Shimano XTR on this bike. I like the XTR and have not had any problems with it. IMHO, the XTR is much prettier than SRAM and shows in specific areas in attention to detail. One advantage to the XTR is you can either push towards the front or back of the bike to shift gears (on the forward lever only). I like doing both with my thumbs so I push towards the front of the bike. IIRC, the SRAM trigger is forward for both directions as well but does not have the option of toward the back of the bike.
Also, if it matters to you, SRAM is an American company. This is another reason I almost switched this year. Now that I'm writing this, I probably should've went with SRAM...
I think those are the basic differences. Weights, you can research on your own.
Being more traditional though, I stuck with what I'm familiar with and have the Shimano XTR on this bike. I like the XTR and have not had any problems with it. IMHO, the XTR is much prettier than SRAM and shows in specific areas in attention to detail. One advantage to the XTR is you can either push towards the front or back of the bike to shift gears (on the forward lever only). I like doing both with my thumbs so I push towards the front of the bike. IIRC, the SRAM trigger is forward for both directions as well but does not have the option of toward the back of the bike.
Also, if it matters to you, SRAM is an American company. This is another reason I almost switched this year. Now that I'm writing this, I probably should've went with SRAM...
I think those are the basic differences. Weights, you can research on your own.
misterC
05-17-07, 08:42 AM
Then SRAM would take over the manufacture of all MTB components. I have to agree with Raiyn on this one. The top pricepoint are typically all weight reductions and no mechanical performance advantage.
You missed my point.
My point is, why do I have to justify my purchase of a high dollar part to satisfy someone else's price-tagery?
Just because you and Raiyn can't afford it, doesn't mean I shouldn't buy it.
You missed my point.
My point is, why do I have to justify my purchase of a high dollar part to satisfy someone else's price-tagery?
Just because you and Raiyn can't afford it, doesn't mean I shouldn't buy it.
aikigreg
05-17-07, 09:00 AM
Had shimano and got irritated, and dropped big bucks to go to x.0 last year. It was a sigh of relief....a thousand times better.
bsyptak
05-17-07, 09:02 AM
As scrublover says, SRAM Attack and Rocket Grip Shifters work with Shimano rear derailleurs. All SRAM grip shifters work with either SRAM or Shimano front derailleurs because the pull is the same. Looks like they killed off the Rockets though for 2007. Probably because it was painted a different color and sold for more $. Pricepoint has the 06 Rockets for $50. I got some new Attacks off Ebay for about $20.
C Law
05-17-07, 09:08 AM
Just because you and Raiyn can't afford it, doesn't mean I shouldn't buy it.
Relax there richie rich
Relax there richie rich
wheelhot
05-17-07, 09:10 AM
If you like a company that innovates a lot (good or bad) go for Shimano, if you like things that have been proven and worked, go for SRAM :D
misterC
05-17-07, 09:11 AM
If you like a company that innovates a lot (good or bad) go for Shimano, if you like things that have been proven and worked, go for SRAM :D
I think you have this backwards.
I think you have this backwards.
wheelhot
05-17-07, 09:15 AM
Hmm, I dont think so, so far I always see Shimano releasing new concepts and new designs. SRAM practically stays on a concept and just improve it as time needs it
crash13
05-17-07, 09:44 AM
I just installed the new XTR shifters and derailleurs...I must say...a huge improvement over my XT/LX setup. Upshifting with your thumb feels good. I'm glad Shimano added this feature. Its nice to have a choice between pull and push with the thumb. I use my thumb when descending and my finger when climbing...this seems to work well. The shifting doesnt feel as firm and mechanical as the X.0. The lever pull on the XTR feels quite a bit softer than the X.0 Shifters. However, the levers are not adjustable like the X.0 levers. This is a great feature that SRAM built into the X.0 product that I wish Shimano would have.
Raiyn
05-17-07, 06:25 PM
What if all of a sudden shimano tripled the prices of all their parts, would xt then not be worth the "premium"? I'm just wondering if its just the price that offends you so much.
It's not the price at all. It's the value. Sure the XTR might be a smidge lighter, but it's not THAT much lighter, nor is it that much smoother. It's a half step at best, and that doesn't make it worth the extra cash.
My point is, why do I have to justify my purchase of a high dollar part to satisfy someone else's price-tagery?
Just because you and Raiyn can't afford it, doesn't mean I shouldn't buy it.
:lol: Didn't we just do this with Chris King headsets? Nobody said I can't afford XTR parts, I just don't see the value nor do I think that everyone who comes onto a board like this should have the illusion that if they don't run XTR (or a King for that matter) they ain't worth ****. XTR doesn't give you a better warranty, it might make the bike a touch lighter (not enough in the real world), but if you're not racing what does that matter? The main things XTR does do well is lighten your wallet, give your buddies something to ogle and inflate your ego.
It's not the price at all. It's the value. Sure the XTR might be a smidge lighter, but it's not THAT much lighter, nor is it that much smoother. It's a half step at best, and that doesn't make it worth the extra cash.
My point is, why do I have to justify my purchase of a high dollar part to satisfy someone else's price-tagery?
Just because you and Raiyn can't afford it, doesn't mean I shouldn't buy it.
:lol: Didn't we just do this with Chris King headsets? Nobody said I can't afford XTR parts, I just don't see the value nor do I think that everyone who comes onto a board like this should have the illusion that if they don't run XTR (or a King for that matter) they ain't worth ****. XTR doesn't give you a better warranty, it might make the bike a touch lighter (not enough in the real world), but if you're not racing what does that matter? The main things XTR does do well is lighten your wallet, give your buddies something to ogle and inflate your ego.
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 06:36 PM
Go and read the link that I posted above...:rolleyes:
Open mouth and insert foot here :o
Open mouth and insert foot here :o
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 06:41 PM
It's not the price at all. It's the value. Sure the XTR might be a smidge lighter, but it's not THAT much lighter, nor is it that much smoother. It's a half step at best, and that doesn't make it worth the extra cash.
:lol: Didn't we just do this with Chris King headsets? Nobody said I can't afford XTR parts, I just don't see the value nor do I think that everyone who comes onto a board like this should have the illusion that if they don't run XTR (or a King for that matter) they ain't worth ****. XTR doesn't give you a better warranty, it might make the bike a touch lighter (not enough in the real world), but if you're not racing what does that matter? The main things XTR does do well is lighten your wallet, give your buddies something to ogle and inflate your ego.
I like my xt rear...and my cane creek headset...not top of the line but works great...But I dont think that buying top of the line parts is just stroking your ego if you can afford it...one thing is true in my line of work and I believe its true nomatter what your talking about...you get what you pay for. I can afford xtr its just not important to me right now. I just want to ride my bike.
although you make a valid point...it should go both ways...nobody should think there riding crap if they dont have xtr but people also shouldnt think there posers if they are.
just ride
ride....
:lol: Didn't we just do this with Chris King headsets? Nobody said I can't afford XTR parts, I just don't see the value nor do I think that everyone who comes onto a board like this should have the illusion that if they don't run XTR (or a King for that matter) they ain't worth ****. XTR doesn't give you a better warranty, it might make the bike a touch lighter (not enough in the real world), but if you're not racing what does that matter? The main things XTR does do well is lighten your wallet, give your buddies something to ogle and inflate your ego.
I like my xt rear...and my cane creek headset...not top of the line but works great...But I dont think that buying top of the line parts is just stroking your ego if you can afford it...one thing is true in my line of work and I believe its true nomatter what your talking about...you get what you pay for. I can afford xtr its just not important to me right now. I just want to ride my bike.
although you make a valid point...it should go both ways...nobody should think there riding crap if they dont have xtr but people also shouldnt think there posers if they are.
just ride
ride....
Raiyn
05-17-07, 07:01 PM
I like my xt rear...and my cane creek headset...not top of the line but works great...But I dont think that buying top of the line parts is just stroking your ego if you can afford it...one thing is true in my line of work and I believe its true nomatter what your talking about...you get what you pay for.
That's the whole crux of my argument. With XTR it's not that much better (in my view) to justify the premium pricing. XT is damn good and is the first to get the best out of what's good about XTR without having to be the test bed.
If I didn't have to pay for my parts I'd use XTR in a heartbeat. I'd be a fool not to, but I don't live in that world. I have to buy my parts, and even thought the money is there I want as much bang for my buck as possible. The added flash of the XTR label just isn't enough for me.
That's the whole crux of my argument. With XTR it's not that much better (in my view) to justify the premium pricing. XT is damn good and is the first to get the best out of what's good about XTR without having to be the test bed.
If I didn't have to pay for my parts I'd use XTR in a heartbeat. I'd be a fool not to, but I don't live in that world. I have to buy my parts, and even thought the money is there I want as much bang for my buck as possible. The added flash of the XTR label just isn't enough for me.
cryptid01
05-17-07, 07:07 PM
The added flash of the XTR label just isn't enough for me.
But Chris King's is.
Curious.
But Chris King's is.
Curious.
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 07:16 PM
That's the whole crux of my argument. With XTR it's not that much better (in my view) to justify the premium pricing. XT is damn good and is the first to get the best out of what's good about XTR without having to be the test bed.
If I didn't have to pay for my parts I'd use XTR in a heartbeat. I'd be a fool not to, but I don't live in that world. I have to buy my parts, and even thought the money is there I want as much bang for my buck as possible. The added flash of the XTR label just isn't enough for me.
I agree...but I'm not going to point at everyone with xtr and xo or a 7 thousand dollar bike and snicker and call them posers either. Some people need that stuff...some people are weight weenies ( no offense people...but you know who you are :p ) and some are just morons... I put BBS rims on my car...they were twice the price of some other rims that would have done the job just fine...but this was MY car and I wanted BBS because it was the best stuff I could afford... I have seen nicer cars with cheaper rims and the thought of the cost of rims or the quality of the car never crossed my mind...just...damn thats a nice car ;)
I am nobody's judge is all I'm saying I guess...everyones got there own reasons for things...I just want to ride.
If I didn't have to pay for my parts I'd use XTR in a heartbeat. I'd be a fool not to, but I don't live in that world. I have to buy my parts, and even thought the money is there I want as much bang for my buck as possible. The added flash of the XTR label just isn't enough for me.
I agree...but I'm not going to point at everyone with xtr and xo or a 7 thousand dollar bike and snicker and call them posers either. Some people need that stuff...some people are weight weenies ( no offense people...but you know who you are :p ) and some are just morons... I put BBS rims on my car...they were twice the price of some other rims that would have done the job just fine...but this was MY car and I wanted BBS because it was the best stuff I could afford... I have seen nicer cars with cheaper rims and the thought of the cost of rims or the quality of the car never crossed my mind...just...damn thats a nice car ;)
I am nobody's judge is all I'm saying I guess...everyones got there own reasons for things...I just want to ride.
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 07:17 PM
But Chris King's is.
Curious.
CANE CREEK dammit!!!! :p
Curious.
CANE CREEK dammit!!!! :p
Raiyn
05-17-07, 07:21 PM
But Chris King's is.
Curious.
What's so hard to figure out about a ten year warranty so good you can turn in your headset because you don't like the COLOR? I don't see XTR with that.
I agree...but I'm not going to point at everyone with xtr and xo or a 7 thousand dollar bike and snicker and call them posers either.
I wait to see them ride first. If they stick to the bunny trail, then hell yeah I'm going to chuckle to myself.
Curious.
What's so hard to figure out about a ten year warranty so good you can turn in your headset because you don't like the COLOR? I don't see XTR with that.
I agree...but I'm not going to point at everyone with xtr and xo or a 7 thousand dollar bike and snicker and call them posers either.
I wait to see them ride first. If they stick to the bunny trail, then hell yeah I'm going to chuckle to myself.
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 07:34 PM
What's so hard to figure out about a ten year warranty so good you can turn in your headset because you don't like the COLOR? I don't see XTR with that.
I wait to see them ride first. If they stick to the bunny trail, then hell yeah I'm going to chuckle to myself.
yeah...me to...lol
I wait to see them ride first. If they stick to the bunny trail, then hell yeah I'm going to chuckle to myself.
yeah...me to...lol
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 07:35 PM
one of my friends just bought a trek top fuel and upgraded everything on it...he only rides pavement lol I bust his hump every day.
Raiyn
05-17-07, 07:37 PM
one of my friends just bought a trek top fuel and upgraded everything on it...he only rides pavement lol I bust his hump every day.
:lol: That's certainly overkill. I presume he's not doing any kind of "urban' riding?
:lol: That's certainly overkill. I presume he's not doing any kind of "urban' riding?
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 07:41 PM
:lol: That's certainly overkill. I presume he's not doing any kind of "urban' riding?
he does nothing thats worthy of a brand new fox fork and a set of xtr cranks lol...he didnt even ride the bike first before he bought all this stuff... Granted its a nice bike and it rides really really smooth on and off road...I did alittle breaking in... but he didnt buy it to ride it where it belongs...he could have bought a huffy :p
he does nothing thats worthy of a brand new fox fork and a set of xtr cranks lol...he didnt even ride the bike first before he bought all this stuff... Granted its a nice bike and it rides really really smooth on and off road...I did alittle breaking in... but he didnt buy it to ride it where it belongs...he could have bought a huffy :p
Raiyn
05-17-07, 07:55 PM
he does nothing thats worthy of a brand new fox fork and a set of xtr cranks lol...he didnt even ride the bike first before he bought all this stuff...Ouch must resist urge to mock
Granted its a nice bike and it rides really really smooth on and off road...It can't help but to.
I did a little breaking in...I'm sure you did :D
but he didn't buy it to ride it where it belongs...he could have bought a huffy :p
I don't know that I would have gone that far.... (a Huffy? <shudder>) He could have gotten himself a nice comfort bike or the Rolling Barca Lounger (http://www.giant-bicycle.com/en-US/bikes/lifestyle/600/28459/)"
http://www.giant-bicycle.com/_upload_us/bikes/models/zooms/2007_spring/Revive-LX-final.jpg
Granted its a nice bike and it rides really really smooth on and off road...It can't help but to.
I did a little breaking in...I'm sure you did :D
but he didn't buy it to ride it where it belongs...he could have bought a huffy :p
I don't know that I would have gone that far.... (a Huffy? <shudder>) He could have gotten himself a nice comfort bike or the Rolling Barca Lounger (http://www.giant-bicycle.com/en-US/bikes/lifestyle/600/28459/)"
http://www.giant-bicycle.com/_upload_us/bikes/models/zooms/2007_spring/Revive-LX-final.jpg
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 08:00 PM
Ouch must resist urge to mock
It can't help but to.
I'm sure you did :D
I don't know that I would have gone that far.... (a Huffy? <shudder>) He could have gotten himself a nice comfort bike or the Rolling Barca Lounger (http://www.giant-bicycle.com/en-US/bikes/lifestyle/600/28459/)"
http://www.giant-bicycle.com/_upload_us/bikes/models/zooms/2007_spring/Revive-LX-final.jpg
:roflmao:
I havent given up on him though... I WILL drag him through the woods and if he doesnt die...I'm sure he will do it again ;)
It can't help but to.
I'm sure you did :D
I don't know that I would have gone that far.... (a Huffy? <shudder>) He could have gotten himself a nice comfort bike or the Rolling Barca Lounger (http://www.giant-bicycle.com/en-US/bikes/lifestyle/600/28459/)"
http://www.giant-bicycle.com/_upload_us/bikes/models/zooms/2007_spring/Revive-LX-final.jpg
:roflmao:
I havent given up on him though... I WILL drag him through the woods and if he doesnt die...I'm sure he will do it again ;)
MattP.
05-17-07, 08:32 PM
XTR doesn't give you a better warranty
New flash genius! It DOES!
New flash genius! It DOES!
Minesbroken
05-17-07, 09:50 PM
evening pete
_beaver_
05-18-07, 02:33 AM
The top pricepoint are typically all weight reductions and no mechanical performance advantage.
Not true.
Not true.
_beaver_
05-18-07, 02:41 AM
one of my friends just bought a trek top fuel and upgraded everything on it...he only rides pavement lol I bust his hump every day.
Does that make him a "poser"?:rolleyes:
Does that make him a "poser"?:rolleyes:
z415
05-18-07, 03:01 AM
It is a matter of preference, as you can see from the little debate. I don't believe either company has any major advantage to the other, at least not enough to consider, so go find bikes with both and find which ones feel/look better to you.
z415
05-18-07, 03:09 AM
Considering the fact that you "mountain bike" in an incredibly undemanding and flat area, it's easy to see that your posts on this matter are great examples of projection (look it up).
It can get more demanding if you go really really fast or if you ride for a really long time non stop
It can get more demanding if you go really really fast or if you ride for a really long time non stop
mtnbiker66
05-18-07, 04:03 AM
one of my friends just bought a trek top fuel and upgraded everything on it...he only rides pavement lol I bust his hump every day.
Why do you care? Why not just ride and let other people ride what they want?
Why do you care? Why not just ride and let other people ride what they want?