Last evening my bf and I were out for a road ride. As we were riding through town we had to go over a triple set of railroad tracks, as we were riding over them a huge diesel pickup buzzed us and sped off. Not too far away was a traffic light and a line of cars. The road splits into a straight lane and one right turn lane (the cross street is a one-way, east, right turn only). So we cruised by the line of cars to sit on the right side of the straight lane to go straight when the light is green. Next light is a cross street one-way, west, left turn only. We sat first in line in the straight lane at the red light. The same big pickup pulls up behind us, very close and guns his engine. It looks to me like his wife and young kids are in the truck with him. I kinda ignore him, but keep an eye on him too. My bf gets a bit pissed and yells (over the diesel engine) "what's your problem?" Maybe the JAM yells back, "your my problem."
Light turns green and I go. My bf hesitates, trying to get into his cleats. Pickup guy probably gets more pissed. He pulls forward and bumps my bfs bike. (no damage.) bf finally goes and truck guns it by us, close to the next stop sign. By the time we get to that stop sign, he's gone.
We did get his plate number and when we got home bf calls police to let them know about an aggressive motorist. The cop said they'd give the guy a call. Dunno know if this guy will ever learn, and it may be too late even for his kids. :rolleyes:
Most drivers in this town are fine, but there are a few of these JAMs.
Blue Order
05-26-07, 04:58 PM
Last evening my bf and I were out for a road ride. As we were riding through town we had to go over a triple set of railroad tracks, as we were riding over them a huge diesel pickup buzzed us and sped off. Not too far away was a traffic light and a line of cars. The road splits into a straight lane and one right turn lane (the cross street is a one-way, east, right turn only). So we cruised by the line of cars to sit on the right side of the straight lane to go straight when the light is green. Next light is a cross street one-way, west, left turn only. We sat first in line in the straight lane at the red light. The same big pickup pulls up behind us, very close and guns his engine. It looks to me like his wife and young kids are in the truck with him. I kinda ignore him, but keep an eye on him too. My bf gets a bit pissed and yells (over the diesel engine) "what's your problem?" Maybe the JAM yells back, "your my problem."
Light turns green and I go. My bf hesitates, trying to get into his cleats. Pickup guy probably gets more pissed. He pulls forward and bumps my bfs bike. (no damage.) bf finally goes and truck guns it by us, close to the next stop sign. By the time we get to that stop sign, he's gone.
We did get his plate number and when we got home bf calls police to let them know about an aggressive motorist. The cop said they'd give the guy a call. Dunno know if this guy will ever learn, and it may be too late even for his kids. :rolleyes:
Most drivers in this town are fine, but there are a few of these JAMs.Assault and battery. Teach him a lesson.
tomg
05-26-07, 08:42 PM
file a complaint w/the police. get him on record!
good work!
t
SSP
05-26-07, 08:55 PM
Bump my bike intentionally? That will get you a kicked in door, or a thrown water bottle at the least.
kjmillig
05-26-07, 08:57 PM
I've gone over the bump senario in my mind and hope I can carry out my pre-thought-out plan to instantly make a big scene of falling to the ground screaming in pain, holding my knee, neck, or whatever as I get a plate number.
deputyjones
05-26-07, 10:43 PM
Bump my bike intentionally?
If that happened to me they would definitely look back on that incident as one of the defining moments of their life.
trackhub
05-27-07, 06:19 PM
Nicely handled. Sounds like a member of "Nascar Nation" all the way. Excellent that you got something on file with the local PD. I'd hang on to that plate number. If he was willing to "tap" your BF, then he's definitely one who uses his manly truck as a weapon. (and probably something else, but we won't go there) He needs to be on a watch list. Kind of off-topic: Are there cameras at the intersections where you live?
If it helps, My primary bike is a,, Gunnar Street Dog.
It's too bad that when those situations are encountered, we just can't will their head gaskets to blow, right there.
Tom Stormcrowe
05-28-07, 07:56 AM
If that happened to me they would definitely look back on that incident as one of the defining moments of their life.
Arrest or a beating? Either one would be fine with me.....:p The arrest though would be the correct legal route in any case:D
Zeuser
05-28-07, 08:02 AM
Wait a minute... bumped the bike intentionally? Hold on there.... that's assault! A criminal charge.
Follow-up on the case and find out if the cops are doing anything.
In my area there's a zero-tolerance policy against road ragers. It's likely that such a rager like that would be charged.
bhtooefr
05-28-07, 11:22 AM
It's too bad that when those situations are encountered, we just can't will their head gaskets to blow, right there.
Ah, but you can with a diesel. Modded diesels tend to have aftermarket air filters that make this easier. Carry a can of ether (starting fluid.) Hold it up to the passenger upper grille - as near to the headlight as you can get while still aiming back into the engine compartment. Fire the entire can.
If your aim was good, and the air filter was sufficiently exposed, the engine should rev uncontrollably to the point that it overrevs and is damaged.
The Human Car
05-28-07, 11:53 AM
Most states require that if your vehicle hits a second vehicle you are required to stop and exchange information otherwise it is a hit and run.
Tom Stormcrowe
05-28-07, 11:55 AM
Ah, but you can with a diesel. Modded diesels tend to have aftermarket air filters that make this easier. Carry a can of ether (starting fluid.) Hold it up to the passenger upper grille - as near to the headlight as you can get while still aiming back into the engine compartment. Fire the entire can.
If your aim was good, and the air filter was sufficiently exposed, the engine should rev uncontrollably to the point that it overrevs and is damaged.
WD40 will do the same thing...the propellant is propane. I've used it to cold start diesels:p
bhtooefr
05-28-07, 12:58 PM
WD40 isn't nearly as bad for a diesel, though. ;)
Ether is some nasty stuff, and has no business ANYWHERE near a diesel engine. It's an easy way to break a piston ring. And, it's way too easy to get a diesel to runaway on it. Oh, and did I mention... ether lights off so easily, it can explode on the glow plugs, causing major damage, if you use it for the advertised function (as a starting fluid)?
(I've used WD40 myself to start a diesel, FWIW.)
trackhub
05-29-07, 04:47 PM
eofelis, I'd be interested in any further news or follow-up information you'd be willing to share on this.
DoYlE_RiD3r
05-29-07, 07:18 PM
I would have probably did something to his car ... something like, I don't know, kick the mirror (don'T know the name, I don'T a very big vocabulary in English). Touk my allen keys and make a nice "F*ck You" on his hood :p... I think you understand the kind of things
tehdely
05-29-07, 07:44 PM
I keep refreshing this thread wanting to see if you heard back from the cops. Any news?
ChipSeal
05-30-07, 02:27 AM
Do you realize how fragile the front grill on most vehicles is? (And how expensive they are?)
fuerein
05-30-07, 06:25 AM
Do you realize how fragile the front grill on most vehicles is? (And how expensive they are?)
Reminds me a story from when my dad had a motorcycle (okay not a bicycle but still good story). He was stopped at a red light and this guy in a pickup didn't see him or the red until too late. The guy hit my father's motorcycle and pushed him into the intersection. Well when all was said and done my father had minor damage to the rear fender on the motorcycle and to the handlebar cause by my father having to lay the motorcycle on its side after the accident. Well the police arrived and wanted both vehicles moved out of the intersection, my father picked the motorcycle off the ground, started it up, and drove off to the nearest parking lot. He then walked back and helped the other guy push the truck out of the intersection because the rear fender had completely ruined the front grill and radiator on the truck causing well over $500 of damage. Primarily minor body damage to the motorcycle but major mechanical damage to the truck. Great times!
gosmsgo
05-30-07, 08:33 AM
If I were the driver that would made me fairly mad too.
He passes you so then you pass him on the right at the stop light making him pass you a second time.
Sounds like fun.
Blue Jays
05-30-07, 09:04 AM
I would wait at the accident site for a police officer to arrive to write the report. Accept nothing less. Leaving and calling from home unfortunately gives the appearance it was extremely minor in nature.
Crazy Cyclist
05-30-07, 09:33 AM
I would wait at the accident site for a police officer to arrive to write the report. Accept nothing less. Leaving and calling from home unfortunately gives the appearance it was extremely minor in nature.
Do you think the jerkoff in the pickup truck is going to wait around for the cops to show up? Not likely. He would have taken off long before that.
Blue Jays
05-30-07, 09:40 AM
/\/\ Who cares what the pickup driver does! The fact a cyclist wishes to speak with an officer onsite, have accident-scene photographs taken, and willing to accept inconvenience to the cyclists' schedules shows that the rider is not just "blowing smoke" to the police. It bolsters credibility and illustrates the cyclist means business. Ask for the officer's businesscard and when you should telephone him/her for follow-up on the hit & run report.
sgtsmile
05-30-07, 11:14 AM
/\/\ Who cares what the pickup driver does! The fact a cyclist wishes to speak with an officer onsite, have accident-scene photographs taken, and willing to accept inconvenience to the cyclists' schedules shows that the rider is not just "blowing smoke" to the police. It bolsters credibility and illustrates the cyclist means business. Ask for the officer's businesscard and when you should telephone him/her for follow-up on the hit & run report.
Well said.
zeytoun
05-30-07, 11:19 AM
He did pass you without incident the first time, didn't he?
No. Read the OP again. The truck buzzed him crossing the railroad tracks.
1ply
05-30-07, 01:49 PM
I agree. It really irritates me, as a driver or cyclist, when a cyclist goes to the front of a line of other vehicles and then sits there, waiting for the light or cutting in line in front of whomever should be next at the stop sign. If you're going to run the light because it is safer for you in that situation, then I won't judge you, but asking motorists to pass you twice is giving the jerks among them all the justification they need to harass you. (It is also giving the bigger jerks among them all the justification they need to harass me, which is why you irritate me.) That doesn't make hit and run right, and you should pursue that as far as possible with the police, but I hope you can understand why the fool might have been upset with you. He did pass you without incident the first time, didn't he?
Rajit
SO if you were a cyclist you would stop at the back of the line at a red light to wait your turn right?
SUUUUUURE. The beauty of a bicycle is that it can and usually does go right to the front of the line - every time :) It is the drivers job to 'pass when safe to do so'.
The road lanes are about 10 feet wide - your bike can take the first 3-4 including handlebars, leaving the remaining 6-7 for the cars. This means that they don't have to (and usually don't) have to make a complete lane change to pass you.
jakub.ner
05-30-07, 02:05 PM
SO if you were a cyclist you would stop at the back of the line at a red light to wait your turn right?
SUUUUUURE. ...
In fact, yes, that is what I do.
I originally replied to this thread stating the obvious problem with the cyclist's behaviour: but removed the post. I thought I am misunderstanding the OP. Otherwise someone would have already said: "why are you passing on the right in light traffic in the first place?". Apparently I did not misunderstand, the OP called the cops on a guy who seems irritated by poor cycling and the cyclist breaking the law.
Now I understand every location is different. Probably in New York traffic you can weave in and out--illegal or not--and not irritate traffic (any more then it already is) since they will not catch up with you. But if the road is wide and open, why are you constantly impeding them? They took you over fair and square now wait your turn.
You can't complain about being buzzed when you pull this kind of stuff.
Please just "Share the Road" ;). Yes it applies to cyclists too.
cooker
05-30-07, 02:35 PM
The road splits into a straight lane and one right turn lane (the cross street is a one-way, east, right turn only). So we cruised by the line of cars to sit on the right side of the straight lane to go straight when the light is green. Next light is a cross street one-way, west, left turn only. We sat first in line in the straight lane at the red light.
So this is the part that is sketchy, At the first intersection you filtered to the front and waited in the right side of the lane, but in the second intersection you took the whole lane? If so, why?
Not excusing the motorist, but when I see a bear I don't bait it.
eofelis
05-30-07, 03:21 PM
So this is the part that is sketchy, At the first intersection you filtered to the front and waited in the right side of the lane, but in the second intersection you took the whole lane? If so, why?
Not excusing the motorist, but when I see a bear I don't bait it.
It is a very strange set of intersections, and the road we were on takes one directly to a MUP/bike path that leads to a bridge that is the only easy/safe way to get a bike across the river in that part of town. Major road construction in other parts of downtown make this road the the most convienient right now. It's also my bf's commute route, he works near there.
First intersection has two lanes: left one is go-straight, right one is right turn. No left turn allowed.
Also at the first intersection, we have tried to keep to the right side of the go-straight lane to get over to the right side of the road through the intersection, since a few weeks ago we had two cars pass us on the right, going straight, in the intersection when we were taking off from the middle of the go-straight lane. It's a wide intersection, it crosses 3 travel lanes. At the time we were trying to get over to the right side of the road. Dangerous situation.
Second intersection has two lanes: left one is left turn, right one is go-straight. No right turn allowed. This intersection is safer to sit in the middle of the go-straight lane. There is no bike lane and the narrow to non-existant shoulder here is full of gravel and junk.
There may be plenty of things to criticize about our actions, but it's not always easy to know what is the right thing to do and sometimes you have to make snap decisions and be on the defensive.
jakub.ner
05-30-07, 04:30 PM
... There may be plenty of things to criticize about our actions, but it's not always easy to know what is the right thing to do and sometimes you have to make snap decisions and be on the defensive.
Awww, agreed. I really didn't mean to be pedantic (in my post above): I hate that. With your latest post it seems like you went through these choices before and are choosing the safest alternative. Seems to me like you know where these "why did you pass on the right" criticisms come from.
Happy (and safe) riding.
KeatonR
05-30-07, 09:45 PM
Definitely follow up with the cops. Press charges.
cooker
05-31-07, 08:46 AM
Second intersection has two lanes: left one is left turn, right one is go-straight. No right turn allowed. This intersection is safer to sit in the middle of the go-straight lane.
Apparently not.
Stacey
05-31-07, 08:59 AM
WTF is a JAM? :o
K4LK
05-31-07, 12:40 PM
WTF is a JAM? :o
Jack Ass Motorist
(a driver that does something really dumb to prove to himself that he and his cage are superior while possibly endangering your safety).
littlewaywelt
05-31-07, 12:42 PM
He bumped the bike? That's assault or hit and run. The guy needs more than a call by the police and the cop should know it.
savage24
05-31-07, 08:34 PM
He bumped the bike? That's assault or hit and run. The guy needs more than a call by the police and the cop should know it.
Have you ever been to court and seen lawyers do their thing?
Please explain how this would be prosecuted.:rolleyes:
Stacey
06-01-07, 03:05 AM
Assault is the threat of injury, battery the act thereof. Simple to prosecute.
littlewaywelt
06-01-07, 06:56 AM
Have you ever been to court and seen lawyers do their thing?
Please explain how this would be prosecuted.:rolleyes:
I'm the only non-attorney in my entire family, crim, biz, corp, etc., :D I've been to court more times than a lot of attys.
It's really quite simple. It's not up to the PO's discretion here to only "talk" to the guy. It's the PO's responsibility to cite the incident and hand it over the sa's/da's office for their discretion. Will they prosecute it...not very likely without a witness, but they could. Plenty of he said he said cases go to court. If the guy bumped the cyclist and left the scene it's hit and run and the cop should know that. Additionally, the cop should know that anyone that bumps a cyclist is a problem driver/aggressive driver.
savage24
06-01-07, 07:09 AM
Light turns green and I go. My bf hesitates, trying to get into his cleats. Pickup guy probably gets more pissed. He pulls forward and bumps my bfs bike. (no damage.) bf finally goes and truck guns it by us, close to the next stop sign. By the time we get to that stop sign, he's gone.
I doubt you could find an officer that would issue a citation in this situation. If the officer was present and witnessed the incident, then maybe. They generally don't like to write tickets that won't hold up in court.
No injuries + no damage = no conviction. The bicyclists back each others stories, the passengers in the truck back the drivers story, and the case is dismissed due to lack of evidence.
It becomes a case of your word against theirs were the guy in the truck denies the road rage, claims the bump was unintentional - "I was passing my son his happy meal and my foot must have come off the brake pedal enough for the truck to ease forward...", or how about this one: "I was watching that girl in them tight little black shorts in front of me; when the light turned green, she took off and I started to go before I realized the guy wasn't moving yet. Hey, I'm a guy - I got distracted." (You might get an inattentive driving conviction from that testimony.)
littlewaywelt
06-01-07, 07:15 AM
Niether assualt nor hit & run require injury or damage.
Again, it's not up to the po. It was an infraction plain and simple. It's the po's job to cite it and the asa/ada's to excericise the discretion in it's prosectution.
I agree it wouldn't get prosecuted, but it would be worth dragging this guy into court for it. Might make him think twice about such reckless behavior.
savage24
06-01-07, 08:12 AM
I agree it wouldn't get prosecuted, but it would be worth dragging this guy into court for it. Might make him think twice about such reckless behavior.
Several years ago a car went past my house one evening at a VERY high rate of speed (at least 60 - 70 MPH). This got my attention since I live on a quiet residential street with a 25 MPH limit. I immediately turned the scanner on. I also heard squaling tires at the end of my street where it meets the busy four lane road thru town (skid marks were later measured at over 90 feet long). A guy at the end of the street had called the police and I heard the dispatcher relay the information to the officer. At this point I called dispatch and reported what I had seen, since I am 1 1/2 blocks from the first caller. The officer responded that she had seen the car sliding sideways into the parking lot of the convenience store and was responding to the store. After a few minutes the officer advised dispatch that she was unable to establish who had been operating the vehicle (she was too far away when the occupants got out of the car and went into the store) and had given the three occupants a "stern verbal warning". Apparently the initial caller had a scanner also, because shortly after this the dispatcher advised the officer that the caller would like to speak with her. I'm pissed. "Stern verbal warning"? WTF?!! I get in my car, go the the convenience store, pull up behind the offenders car, hit my high beams, turn on the dome light and make it very obvious to the three knuckleheads in the store that I am writing down the license number. I then go to the initial callers house where he is giving the cop an ass chewing like I have never seen (I thought he was going to jail for sure). She got him somewhat calmed down and explained that all three occupants of the car refused to say who was driving. I asked why she did not issue a ticket to the owner of the car - at least he would have to go to court and maybe hire a lawyer. She said that she WILL NOT issue a ticket that won't hold up in court. Apparently, at least where I live, it is up to the officers discretion; they will not issue a ticket just 'cause you tell them to.:D I told her that I had the license number and in a few days I would have the guys name & address - if there were any more problems I would take care of it myself. I imagine the police watched for this car for awhile and really wanted to nail them if they could catch them breaking the law, but the fact is the three knucklheads drove off into the night laughing about how they 'beat the rap'. I followed up, got the information from my source, went to the address and saw the car in the driveway but there were no further problems. I think the guy was smart enough to stay out of the village were I live after that.
That's the real world folks, if you don't have good solid evidence, nuthin's gonna happen to 'em.
littlewaywelt
06-01-07, 08:39 AM
She could have definitely cited the owner and it very well could have held up. No points might have assigned but a fine could have been levied against the car owner whether he was driving or not. Same deal as photo radar. 70 mph in an urban setting w/ two witnesses? PO should have issued a citation and let the atty sort it out. No question about it. Poor exercise of PO's discretion, imo.
savage24
06-01-07, 09:22 AM
I grew up in a small town and if I had pulled that stunt as a teenager, I would have received a ticket, and no lawyer in town would have gotten me out of it. I know - my license was suspended twice before I was 18. I now understand that the lawyers would not help me because they might have to face my family or a victims family when I did not learn my lesson and killed myself or someone else.
Here in the 'big city' everybody is just trying to make a buck, including traffic lawyers and DA's.
I think the original poster did good by getting the tag number and reporting the incident to the police, hopefully the police did give the guy a call. I get tired of all the inflammatory posts in A&S regarding assualt, battery, hit & run, attempted vehicular manslaughter, etc. when someone posts about being bumped or buzzed by a JAM. I'm not saying that the incident is not serious, just that some folks here need to get a little tighter grip on the reality of what goes on in the courts these days.
littlewaywelt
06-01-07, 09:52 AM
I think the original poster did good by getting the tag number and reporting the incident to the police, hopefully the police did give the guy a call. I get tired of all the inflammatory posts in A&S regarding assualt, battery, hit & run, attempted vehicular manslaughter, etc. when someone posts about being bumped or buzzed by a JAM. I'm not saying that the incident is not serious, just that some folks here need to get a little tighter grip on the reality of what goes on in the courts these days.
That's all well and good and I agree, but folks don't have a sense of how many "smaller" things go through the courts. The volume blows away serious stuff. It would not be uncommon for someone to be charged for a situation like this and find himself in court. Situations like that are far more common than say someone beating the living pulp out of someone. I saw it on a regular basis. If someone acted like this with a 10 year old kid, everyone would be up in arms. It's completely identical if a motorist does it to an adult. Assault is not always about someone with a black eye or a domestic abuser with a bat or cigarette.
Mr. Underbridge
06-01-07, 11:41 AM
/\/\ Who cares what the pickup driver does! The fact a cyclist wishes to speak with an officer onsite, have accident-scene photographs taken, and willing to accept inconvenience to the cyclists' schedules shows that the rider is not just "blowing smoke" to the police. It bolsters credibility and illustrates the cyclist means business. Ask for the officer's businesscard and when you should telephone him/her for follow-up on the hit & run report.
In most jurisdictions I've lived in, the cops will not obey that request. I was in a minor fender scrape (too minor for any actual bending), and the other party insisted on calling the cops. Cops told them to file a report if they want. In a lot of places, if there are no injuries and both vehicles are mobile, they're not coming.
And no, demanding police presence for a guy tapping your tire does not bolster credibility, I would think the contrary. Something about 'crying wolf'.
Blue Jays
06-01-07, 12:36 PM
/\/\ Requesting law enforcement intervention because a motorist strikes a bicyclist (or a pedestrian) is hardly "crying wolf" in terms of what police handle on a day-to-day basis. You do understand we're not talking about two cars hitting each other in this narrative, right?
littlewaywelt
06-01-07, 01:10 PM
and let's not leave out one other important factor here. intent. an accident is an accident. getting "bumped" by a car while standing over a bike is beyond aggressive and ppl like this need to enter the system before they cause real harm.
Blue Jays
06-01-07, 01:55 PM
I've seen several posts by Mr. Underbridge recently and he seems to be taking somewhat of an intensive anti-cycling viewpoint in the forums. If a cyclist is behaving badly or illegally, I'll call 'em like I see 'em. At the same time, there is nothing a cyclist could be doing that would warrant a motorist striking them with a vehicle. It is certainly possible that Mr. Underbridge has an agenda unknown to us.
bac
06-01-07, 02:24 PM
Nicely handled.
Agreed. In nearly all of these situation, the best call is to just ride away. Getting bumbed from behind though is kind of scary. The beauty is that guys like this usually get themselves in the end. They really don't need much help from us. :D
... Brad
bhtooefr
06-01-07, 02:55 PM
Mr. Underbridge? Even the USERNAME reeks "troll." :D
DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS. ;)
Zeuser
06-01-07, 03:31 PM
Have you ever been to court and seen lawyers do their thing?
Please explain how this would be prosecuted.:rolleyes:
I have! Sent a guy to jail for 4 days for minor assault.
Bah... 4 days you say. Ah yes... but now he has a criminal record!
PS: One of my friends got denied a very good job because he had a criminal record. He got charged after a brawl in a club when he was 20. After losing the job, he had to ask for a pardon to get rid of it.