Electric Bikes - Ewheelie Video to the rain forest

A wheelie poping day riding up 2000 feet in elevation to the rainforest in 20 minutes on 4 amp hours of battery power.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5496865780878321081

nice run i was wondering that other video 0 to 20mph is that yours and if so do you have a picture of the
gear setup on your ebike? it shifts fast. i like the setup :)


cheers

nice run i was wondering that other video 0 to 20mph is that yours and if so do you have a picture of the
gear setup on your ebike? it shifts fast. i like the setup :)


cheersThanks.

hmm kinda looks like a 3 speed hub. what brand is it?

ahh found it i was right its a 3 speed hub with 5 speed cluster nice

sram

http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=10688&category=2713

this i would like to try:)

thanks

ahh found it i was right its a 3 speed hub with 5 speed cluster nice

sram

http://www.universalcycles.com/shopping/product_details.php?id=10688&category=2713

this i would like to try:)

thanks Not exactly... Replace the cassette cluster and derailer with...Two side by side BMX freewheels are machined to slide onto the FREEHUB.One goes to the pedals and the other has a 92 tooth gocart sprocket attached to it for two independent drives utilizing the 3 speed hub in common with either drives coasting or powering BOTH with the motor or pedals shifting both drive ratios at the same time.
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=ecyclemaui

0 to 24 mph.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=54683645398356399

0 to 24 mph.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=54683645398356399

I've watched that film and I can't really see how the motor is connected. The film showing the 0 - 20 miles an hour burst sounds like the motor is running through the three speed gear hub, so I'm assuming you have it chain driven, rather than being a hub motor. I suppose you have a few development bikes set up differently.

Do you maybe have site where you've shown how to do this, or perhaps it is a commercial venture and you intend to sell the products. I think I heard you say something like that to the vendor on one of the films.

If it is public domain I'd like to know how you've done it all. I'd like to try myself. If it's a commerical undertaking - then very good luck to you.

You seem able to run power levels that are not allowed here unless the bike is licensed, insured, has a number plate and is treated like a moped.

I've watched that film and I can't really see how the motor is connected. The film showing the 0 - 20 miles an hour burst sounds like the motor is running through the three speed gear hub, so I'm assuming you have it chain driven, rather than being a hub motor. I suppose you have a few development bikes set up differently.

Do you maybe have site where you've shown how to do this, or perhaps it is a commercial venture and you intend to sell the products. I think I heard you say something like that to the vendor on one of the films.

If it is public domain I'd like to know how you've done it all. I'd like to try myself. If it's a commerical undertaking - then very good luck to you.

You seem able to run power levels that are not allowed here unless the bike is licensed, insured, has a number plate and is treated like a moped.After I proved A VIABLE way for ebikes to travel the islands the governor made all ebikes illegal.The law that was in existance allowed 1500 watts and NO speed limit.Our new mayor will work with me to get the ebikes laws back on track.On the volcano climb I only used less than 750 watts at any time.

That's a strange way for the governor to go on given the focus of attention in reducing reliance on petro energy...

Ok. I suppose you don't give away your secrets then since you didn't address that. Of course there's no reason why you should do.

I'm surprised that the SRAM hub can handle that much power, but clearly it does. The little planetary gears are so small, you'd imagine they wouldn't do so well with high torques like your motor must develop.

Anyway Randy - well done on your developments. These are the best looking prospects I've seen yet in ebikes - though I'm certainly a neophyte in this area. Good job there.

Smooth shifting and a sedate riding style will be very easy on the those tiny gears. Also not full throttling where the tire could break loose and then grab. That's a great way to break any overstressed transmission. Being skinny would help too :)

http://www.lightfootcycles.com/customoptions.htm

"This system is complicated, with several external small bits and fragile pieces."

"NOTE: For warranty reasons, SRAM restricts the size of the low gear that can be used to drive the Dual-Drive hub; our trikes have so much compound gearing that they easily exceed the torque restrictions of the Dual-Drive hub."

Thanks - very interesting material. Well worth reading.

Hello Randy

I wasn't pleased that they booted you off Endless Sphere a while back, I am glad you have resurfaced here.

As you may be aware I am looking at doing a conversion like yours, a few questions for you, have you found the hub gear to be reliable? its a lot of torque to put through the pawls of the gears, have you had any failures? also do the BMX freewheels last very long? as again they are having to put through 100nm or so?

I see you machined the BMX freewheels so they slide on to the Freehub, what type of BMX freewheels did you use? did you just adapt a basic screw on one and then couple that to the kart sprocket?

I can get the Sram 3 speed hub so that's no problem and I can machine the BMX freewheels to fit as well, I am going to run one of my motors through a planetary gearbox so I can keep the rear sprocket size down and try and keep the noise down some, less efficient than going direct as you have done but it should still work.

On your system do you back off the throttle when changing gear up and down? and are the BMX freewheels the original ones that have 20,000 miles?

Cheers

Knoxie

Hello Randy

I wasn't pleased that they booted you off Endless Sphere a while back, I am glad you have resurfaced here.

As you may be aware I am looking at doing a conversion like yours, a few questions for you, have you found the hub gear to be reliable? its a lot of torque to put through the pawls of the gears, have you had any failures? also do the BMX freewheels last very long? as again they are having to put through 100nm or so?

I see you machined the BMX freewheels so they slide on to the Freehub, what type of BMX freewheels did you use? did you just adapt a basic screw on one and then couple that to the kart sprocket?

I can get the Sram 3 speed hub so that's no problem and I can machine the BMX freewheels to fit as well, I am going to run one of my motors through a planetary gearbox so I can keep the rear sprocket size down and try and keep the noise down some, less efficient than going direct as you have done but it should still work.

On your system do you back off the throttle when changing gear up and down? and are the BMX freewheels the original ones that have 20,000 miles?

Cheers

KnoxieIt was LOWell who booted me from the last forum and our new friend ROBBie got me kicked of the last, with his lies.Welcome to jelous AZZES. LOL. You can use Dicta freewheels but I use a custom freewheel for the motor drive.The slow moving hub gears or the 3 speed hub have not given me any problems in over 23000 miles of hard 1600 watt speedshifts.NO FAILURES! on the whole ebike except for a blow out at 40 mph and a failed lipo pack after 8 months of abuse.

Smooth shifting and a sedate riding style will be very easy on the those tiny gears. Also not full throttling where the tire could break loose and then grab. That's a great way to break any overstressed transmission. Being skinny would help too :)

http://www.lightfootcycles.com/customoptions.htm

"This system is complicated, with several external small bits and fragile pieces."

"NOTE: For warranty reasons, SRAM restricts the size of the low gear that can be used to drive the Dual-Drive hub; our trikes have so much compound gearing that they easily exceed the torque restrictions of the Dual-Drive hub."The Sram hub you posted is NOT a Dual Drive hub. it was the Sram Spectro 3X7 that was redesigned three times to come up whit the Sram DD hub that is the latest version.I tested them all before any were even available to the public.Who needs a warranty if it tested out to be bulit proof carrying a 100 pound load of batteries up a 10000 ft volcano on a ebike weighing 300 lbs includung the rider that has over 22000 miles logged on the hub?
Lets see a 45 mph ebike (or ANY ebike) with a hub motor drive 7 miles each way and still do this feat in the middle of the ride on a 72 volt 12 amp hour battery of any kind.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1501457501981349249&q=ecyclemaui&total=6&start=0&num=10&so
=0&type=search&plindex=2


Note No derailer and 3 speeds for pedals or motor or BOTH in common with invidual freewheeling.

That's a strange way for the governor to go on given the focus of attention in reducing reliance on petro energy...

Ok. I suppose you don't give away your secrets then since you didn't address that. Of course there's no reason why you should do.

I'm surprised that the SRAM hub can handle that much power, but clearly it does. The little planetary gears are so small, you'd imagine they wouldn't do so well with high torques like your motor must develop.

Anyway Randy - well done on your developments. These are the best looking prospects I've seen yet in ebikes - though I'm certainly a neophyte in this area. Good job there. Thanks!
You certainly seem to look at all things you see here as pretty objective in which you should ! glad to see that my sense has reached someone else.
I just put together my Razor 650 I got today. It looks FUNNNNNNNN!
I plan to fallow the Segway TOURS here in Lahaina LOL and see what happens!

Thanks for the clarification on the Sram Dual Drive. So that's the bullet proof one to get for ebike use?

My favorite Segway videos:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=IVuhPwy4f1w
http://youtube.com/watch?v=R_h98YLiRX0

There is some interesting technology being discussed here and a lot of expertise on all sides. I'm not so sure about some of the interpersonal disputes, but them aside, I've learned quite a lot here in a couple of hours of browsing.

I really like the advantages of a geared motor, but hub types would seem simple to install and convenient. I have a few bikes, but my main ride for commuting is a small Brompton clone folder. There's a guy who uses a small hub motor with a freewheel called the 'Nano'. It fits with UK power regulations which are VERY low - all of Europe's are in fact. He has a neat arrangement carrying the batteries in the detachable front luggage.

http://www.nano-motor.co.uk/brompton/


Thanks.

A geared hub motor would be ideal for a folder:
http://www.teamhybrid.co.uk/pages/crystalyte/evtech/pumahubmotor.htm

The Brompton probably isn't going to work with any kind of add on chain drive motors and still be able to fold up properly.

A geared hub motor would be ideal for a folder:
http://www.teamhybrid.co.uk/pages/crystalyte/evtech/pumahubmotor.htm

The Brompton probably isn't going to work with any kind of add on chain drive motors and still be able to fold up properly. Hub motors do have a use.

Hello Randy

Thanks for the input, I think I will get the dual drive on order then, I want to try a system like yours as I think it is a great idea and always have done, I also like hubs and other kits however for overall efficiency and durability and reliability you are right, again I know we sometimes dont see eye to eye but I have always been on your side as far as your system goes.

I think its going to be a lot of fun setting a system up and trying it out and making up some videos and testing out the efficiency and trying to improve it, I like the idea of using less power to climb hills and the like and having tried the 45mph and mega power I actually prefer slower speeds with more efficiency and higher reliability, I dont think I will need more than 1500 watts at any point in order to do what I want.

Cheers

Knoxie

Hello Randy

Thanks for the input, I think I will get the dual drive on order then, I want to try a system like yours as I think it is a great idea and always have done, I also like hubs and other kits however for overall efficiency and durability and reliability you are right, again I know we sometimes dont see eye to eye but I have always been on your side as far as your system goes.

I think its going to be a lot of fun setting a system up and trying it out and making up some videos and testing out the efficiency and trying to improve it, I like the idea of using less power to climb hills and the like and having tried the 45mph and mega power I actually prefer slower speeds with more efficiency and higher reliability, I dont think I will need more than 1500 watts at any point in order to do what I want.

Cheers

Knoxie Actualy this MX 650 motor may do well using this dicta freewheel that is on my Razor. Combined with the Sram DD hub and used at 48 volts may be a kick.All of our roads on Maui have been closed or too crowded to travel Due to a rather large forest fire so I will be testing my new toy in town today.Yes its illegal but its the only mode of decent transportation today.

http://www.razor-help.com/mx650-dirt-rocket-parts.html

Hello Randy

Thanks for the input, I think I will get the dual drive on order then, I want to try a system like yours as I think it is a great idea and always have done, I also like hubs and other kits however for overall efficiency and durability and reliability you are right, again I know we sometimes dont see eye to eye but I have always been on your side as far as your system goes.

I think its going to be a lot of fun setting a system up and trying it out and making up some videos and testing out the efficiency and trying to improve it, I like the idea of using less power to climb hills and the like and having tried the 45mph and mega power I actually prefer slower speeds with more efficiency and higher reliability, I dont think I will need more than 1500 watts at any point in order to do what I want.

Cheers

Knoxie
Are you that guy in Banbury that made those hurtling ebike videos riding on pavements? If so, you'll get unlicenced ebikes banned in Britain ya knacker! If I'm talking to the right guy - you know what our nanny state politicians are like. Ken Livingstone wants ordinary cyclists to carry number plates, road tax, driving licence and insurannce because of nutters riding through red lights. What they'd make of people driving electric bikes at speed through parks, along canal tow paths and on pavements - and at speed, I'll leave you to think about.

In a highly regulated society like ours, the freedom to ride electric assist bicycles without the interference of motor vehicle laws is a loophole just waiting to be filled when a few people behave irresponsibly.

If I'm talking to the wrong person here - please accept my profound apologies for the mistake.

Hi Randy

Yes would like to see some video of the bike as well, those little pocket bikes look like a load of fun.

Cheers

Knoxie

Are you that guy in Banbury that made those hurtling ebike videos riding on pavements? If so, you'll get unlicenced ebikes banned in Britain ya knacker! If I'm talking to the right guy - you know what our nanny state politicians are like. Ken Livingstone wants ordinary cyclists to carry number plates, road tax, driving licence and insurannce because of nutters riding through red lights. What they'd make of people driving electric bikes at speed through parks, along canal tow paths and on pavements - and at speed, I'll leave you to think about.

In a highly regulated society like ours, the freedom to ride electric assist bicycles without the interference of motor vehicle laws is a loophole just waiting to be filled when a few people behave irresponsibly.

If I'm talking to the wrong person here - please accept my profound apologies for the mistake.


Hello

Well its nice to meet you as well, yes I made a few videos and a lot of people watch them and you are the only person I have ever heard complain to me about them, I get a lot of e-mails from people who have been inspired by them to make their own bikes and buy kits and stay out of their cars.

I dont ride my e-bikes like that every day, the idea of that video was to show how quickly you can cut through the town, you can legally ride on the towpaths and through that park and in our bus lanes? Sure I could make a 5 min video of me riding at 15mph who would watch that?

Anyway as for banning or making my bike illegal? well any bike that develops over 250W is illegal anyway? with Britains determination to be a leader in affecting climate change I can hardly see them banning e-bikes or making cyclists have insurance and number plates, somehow I dont think it likely, it is more likely that they up the power limit to something useful to encourage people to commute on them.

Red Ken hates cyclists coz he cant tax them and the traffic across London is so slow that cyclists whether electric or not can get across the city faster. Also it is a fact and was highlighted recently that cyclists that jump red lights are actually safer than ones that wait in traffic as more cyclists are killed whilst sitting waiting at lights and being side swiped by lorries and cars. I always go across to the side of traffic lights, even with power assist drivers still cut you up, its dangerous.

Anyway this is Randys thread not mine, back to the subject in hand.

Knoxie

Hi Randy

Yes would like to see some video of the bike as well, those little pocket bikes look like a load of fun.

Cheers

Knoxie The MX has about the same power as the larger Bionic hub motor.It wont take the hills aroung here.The first test is climbing my street block.It wont make it half way with a running start.My ebike does it at 24 mph with 1/2 the watt hours.The MX tops out at 17 mph on the flats..Its great the way it is for kids.I was going to mount my motor on it but deciced to stick with full size great handeling MTBs.I may try a 18" rear wheel to limit the top speed to 30 mph in 3 rd gear. Only 2 nd gear would need to be used going to 24 mph max ANYWHERE and 1 st gear would only be used for a granny for 30% grades "WALLS" for 10 mph max at 4000 motor rpm.I tend like to go slower myself but LOVE TORQUE! 2nd gear the gearbox is locked out for 100% hub efficiency.

Hello

Well its nice to meet you as well, yes I made a few videos and a lot of people watch them and you are the only person I have ever heard complain to me about them, I get a lot of e-mails from people who have been inspired by them to make their own bikes and buy kits and stay out of their cars.

I dont ride my e-bikes like that every day, the idea of that video was to show how quickly you can cut through the town, you can legally ride on the towpaths and through that park and in our bus lanes? Sure I could make a 5 min video of me riding at 15mph who would watch that?

Anyway as for banning or making my bike illegal? well any bike that develops over 250W is illegal anyway? with Britains determination to be a leader in affecting climate change I can hardly see them banning e-bikes or making cyclists have insurance and number plates, somehow I dont think it likely, it is more likely that they up the power limit to something useful to encourage people to commute on them.

Red Ken hates cyclists coz he cant tax them and the traffic across London is so slow that cyclists whether electric or not can get across the city faster. Also it is a fact and was highlighted recently that cyclists that jump red lights are actually safer than ones that wait in traffic as more cyclists are killed whilst sitting waiting at lights and being side swiped by lorries and cars. I always go across to the side of traffic lights, even with power assist drivers still cut you up, its dangerous.

Anyway this is Randys thread not mine, back to the subject in hand.

Knoxie
Oh I watched them and enjoyed them too. My point is that if ebike riding doesn't stay below the radar of the Colonel Blimps in government, and if a few 'Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells' letters arrive on the desk of the Transport Secretary pointing out that these 'anarchistic types' are disobeying he law and frightening dogs in the park, it is curtains for ebikes here. And don't dismiss the threat that Tw*ts like Livingspoon pose to our freedom as cyclists in general. They have enormous support from the fuming idiots in cars who see my Lycra clad arse shooting down the side of their lane and want to kill me, or at least to stop me from doing it.

No offence by the way, but just look at the threads about Maui's ban on ebikes. How did they get noticed? Someone made it obvious they were breaking the rules or getting around a loophole where there weren't rules. Politicians are almost universally useless c**s who want to be seen 'doing something about' people who get up the nose of old ladies and retired army officers. Once you know that, you know what to avoid to stop them getting on your back. Your video on the BMX for example while fun, breaks just about every road traffic law there is, except drunk in charge (I assume).

Oh I watched them and enjoyed them too. My point is that if ebike riding doesn't stay below the radar of the Colonel Blimps in government, and if a few 'Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells' letters arrive on the desk of the Transport Secretary pointing out that these 'anarchistic types' are disobeying he law and frightening dogs in the park, it is curtains for ebikes here. And don't dismiss the threat that Tw*ts like Livingspoon pose to our freedom as cyclists in general. They have enormous support from the fuming idiots in cars who see my Lycra clad arse shooting down the side of their lane and want to kill me, or at least to stop me from doing it.

No offence by the way, but just look at the threads about Maui's ban on ebikes. How did they get noticed? Someone made it obvious they were breaking the rules or getting around a loophole where there weren't rules. Politicians are almost universally useless c**s who want to be seen 'doing something about' people who get up the nose of old ladies and retired army officers. Once you know that, you know what to avoid to stop them getting on your back. Your video on the BMX for example while fun, breaks just about every road traffic law there is, except drunk in charge (I assume). I will explain why ebiking is iilegal in Hawaii:
1 I had the governor in court and won court cases against her as well as getting whole hotel sites for parks when she was was our mayor and she knew me since she was a Maui Concail person while I was working with the county on the community plan zoning process.for west maui.in 93'.
2 Her Cutter Ford Dealership family has the State and county vehicle contracts and probably car rental agreements here too.
3 The Haleakala Down Hill Tour bike companies make millions per year.The state makes $ off permits and taxes. Electric ebkie rentals may dip into a few areas?
4 Segway lobbied and since there was no one selling or using electric bikes in Hawaii it would be smart to eliminate any competion in the bud before ebikes broke loose.The Mayors Lycra buddies also wanted to have the bikeways exclusive for them selves.. LOL
Iam in the process working with our new mayor That Ive known a long time along with two State legislatures from Maui to change the motorized bicycle back to deleted 1500 watts at the posted speed limit law.. We all may have a meeting about this soon. Or Ill just write more letters in our news paper at election time.. LMAO

Hello Randy

Yes I could never understand why in such a beautiful place they would make such a ******** step it flies against all that makes sense, your videos prove how effective an e-bike powered machine can be, I also remember that you power your bikes off sun and solar power? it doesn't get much better than that.

Evilv, I understand your stance on the legal side of things believe me I do and infact some of my movies never got posted for those reasons, you will however notice from some of my videos that car drivers can be irresponsible, in the last 5 mins of my film a car driver passes me and another car on a blind bend up a hill.

The BMX video was done to highlight the power of the motor, I would have stayed on the track for the most part but it was spinning too much and again the BMX is never used on the road, it was just done for the movie, again the idea being to make e-biking look like fun, shopping bikes and the usual lead sled bikes just dont sell e-biking to anyone other than old people, Both me and Steve (Dirt Monkey) wanted to change that and Randys bike is the leader in efficiency and reliability for sure, this is why I want to try his setup, if we didnt have a restriction on speed as well as power Randys system could make for a powerful assist even at the legal 250W limit.

I hope the videos that I have made do more good than harm and it seems from the response that I get it is making people buy bikes and improve their rigs, the last motor I sold was to a 67 year old fella in Yorkshire!

Like Randy I would still ride my e-bike even if they were illegal totally, my bikes (all of them) are road legal now, I have electronic limiters on them and I still peddle a lot as I like the fitness and health benefits that I get from e-cycling.

I hope that Randy can get the situation redressed in Hawai, I believe he still rides on his bike anyway and I dont blame him.

Cheers

Knoxie (The Outlaw!) :-)

Thank you both for your explanations.

Knoxie - don't get me started on the car driver thing. I ride twenty miles a day minimum nowadays (I'm semi - retired) on my Brompton clone bicycle. I see much courtesy from most drivers, but some utter twa%s too - often in great big 4x4 trucks, often though just idiots with no respect and no consideration. Yesterday I was riding down a winding 12 foot wide woodland road in the rain at 15 mph and some **** tried to overtake me on a bend with no visibility. Of course he met another car coming the other way and both of them ended up slewed around in the road! I had to stop toute suite and ended up mounting a kerb to stop from running into this mess myself. Harsh words were exchanged. I ride on pavements when the road is dangerous as long as there are no pedestrians. If there are, I slow right down to 4 mph max as I pass them. I think that is minimal courtesy required. I see Randy does that too in his park videos. Good for him.

On the technology side, I am fascinated by it. I have two good barely used mountain bikes that could be testbeds. I'm no engineer, though a competent cycle and car mechanic - but truly amateur.

I think that ebiking has a bright future as long as we don't get it stopped. The UK legal limit is truly pathetic. I can ride my Brompton clone (a Merc) at an average of 13 mph for twenty miles and I'm 56 years old. If they set the limit at max twenty mph and maybe 600 watts, things would be better. The more people that take to two wheels in Britain, the better everything will be. We also need protected cycle ways like in Holland.

Battery life is a problem really as well as cost. If you pay £300 for a pwer pack, you'd want it to past a long time, but they don't seem to last that long. I'd want a thousand cycles out of it, but I'm a tight arse.

:)

There are some good, safe lipo packs around and if they constantly give a full 9 ah out of a 12 ah rated pack for 300 cycles for a 48 volt pack= 27 mile range at 20 mph with no pedaling. At about $600. a pack (Retail price) would be $2. per 27 mile trip for your battery cost plus about 50 cents a charge.Or if your home is solar or wind powered the charging cost may be free after you paid off the pannels ect.
Now if you made 1000 packs and had a market for them the Retail price would be more like $300. a pack and a great 3 speed 1000 watt ebike with a small 5 lb motor could sell for about $600 without batteries.Only if 1000 were produced and sold right away to waiting buyers.This type of mounting will work on most bicycles.Its simular to the Currie USPD kit but the motor mount plate is just welded to the bicycles seat stay and dropout.The pedal freewheel on the outside of the hub connects by chain to the chainring as usual.All motor drive sprockets,chain and freewheel weighs less than two pounds.

Do you have anymore recent photos? I think I saw these for the first time about 4 years ago?

Thanks!

Robbie

Do you have anymore recent photos? I think I saw these for the first time about 4 years ago?

Thanks!

Robbie This is the drive system I use on all my new vehicles and ebikes.A 3 speed hub,a lightweight 1600 watt motor with a wide range of speeds with better than 90% efficiency in all ranges, eliminating all derailer patrs, just make your self a mental picture of any bike you like for the rest of the picture..

This is the drive system I use on all my new vehicles and ebikes.A 3 speed hub,a lightweight 1600 watt motor with a wide range of speeds with better than 90% efficiency in all ranges, eliminating all derailer patrs, just make your self a mental picture of any bike you like for the rest of the picture..

Why on earth would you continue to build a personal fleet of ebikes in a state where your own personal activities made them illegal to ride on the roads? This would be like continuing to build guns when bullets could no longer be had.

Robbie

Why on earth would you continue to build a personal fleet of ebikes in a state where your own personal activities made them illegal to ride on the roads? This would be like continuing to build guns when bullets could no longer be had.

Robbie

My sentiments exactly, keep it going robbie!

Why on earth would you continue to build a personal fleet of ebikes in a state where your own personal activities made them illegal to ride on the roads? This would be like continuing to build guns when bullets could no longer be had.

Robbie Dirt bikes are not street legal but people do buy and ride them.My friend here is talking at Honolua Bay.Just up the hill there are 100s of miles of dirtbike trails ..People that live in the hills would much rather have ebikes there than gas motocross bikes.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6625545906690359655&q=maui+mountain+biking&total=22&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=2
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=maui+mountain+biking
Weather or not I had anything to do with making ebikes ilegal in Hawaii is questionable but I am in the process of reinstating the old 1500 watt ebike laws.I just contacted the mayors office who I met with two weeks ago (I have known her for 20 years) Her new assistant who I spoke with today was my roommate and a county lifeguard that moved up the ladder.Two of the State legislatures from Maui are also long friends who are going to help as well.In the mean time I have County permission to ride on the streets with my ebikes that were registered in 2002. 6 ebikes total.

Results Randy. We're all waiting for results. Do let us know when you win.

Robbie

Dirt bikes are not street legal but people do buy and ride them.My friend here is talking at Honolua Bay.Just up the hill there are 100s of miles of dirtbike trails ..People that live in the hills would much rather have ebikes there than gas motocross bikes.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6625545906690359655&q=maui+mountain+biking&total=22&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=2
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=maui+mountain+biking
Weather or not I had anything to do with making ebikes ilegal in Hawaii is questionable but I am in the process of reinstating the old 1500 watt ebike laws.I just contacted the mayors office who I met with two weeks ago (I have known her for 20 years) Her new assistant who I spoke with today was my roommate and a county lifeguard that moved up the ladder.Two of the State legislatures from Maui are also long friends who are going to help as well.In the mean time I have County permission to ride on the streets with my ebikes that were registered in 2002. 6 ebikes total.Do let me know when there is a serious ebike challange to climb to 10,005 feet in elevation again.