Classic & Vintage - Is this a Schwinn Twinn?

I'm looking at this bike which is on Craigs List and won't be able to see it until after July 16. Bob Hufford and Stan Cooper believe it is a Schwinn Twinn from about '80-'81. What are your thoughts? Has anyone had any experience with these models, and do you believe, if it is in fair and working condition (as claimed by the seller), worth $75? Thanks for any help and guidance. (Sorry about the picture quality. They were taken by the seller.) Here's a a link to Tom Findley's catalogue page. Pictures below.
http://www.trfindley.com/flschwinn_1980_1990/1980_42.JPG

I'm looking at this bike which is on Craigs List and won't be able to see it until after July 16. Bob Hufford and Stan Cooper believe it is a Schwinn Twinn from about '80-'81. What are your thoughts? Has anyone had any experience with these models, and do you believe, if it is in fair and working condition (as claimed by the seller), worth $75? Thanks for any help and guidance. (Sorry about the picture quality. They were taken by the seller.) Here's a copy of Tom Findley's catalogue page. Pictures below.


Schwinn Twinn Sport it is. Where's the rear brake?

Twinns in stock configuration usually range anywhere from $75-100 for reasonable examples to easily over $200 for nice ones and beauties.

I'd say you can't go too wrong on this deal, although I wouldn't put too much emphasis on speed with this machine - they're nothing but stretched Schwinn Suburbans when it comes to ride and weight. Nevertheless, put a nice RD on it, some barcons, and you're good to go.

Take care,

-Kurt

Kurt,

Thanks for the advice. If the Catalogue page is correct it had a rear hub expander brake. Speed is not a concern, but I imagine this baby could fly down a steep NH hillside!

That same-side drive is cool, and it avoids the more common crossover drive's problem of needing a right-threaded left crank arm and two left-threaded right crank arms.

That same-side drive is cool, and it avoids the more common crossover drive's problem of needing a right-threaded left crank arm and two left-threaded right crank arms.

Either that or a lot of Loctite ;)

-Kurt

".....Where's the rear brake?"
My first thought until I saw the brake rod.

Those handlebars must be REALLY heavy!

".....Where's the rear brake?"
My first thought until I saw the brake rod.
I believe the "rod" you see is actually the kickstand. As best I can tell, but have no pictures to confirm this, a brake cable runs to the rear hub brake (which is more of a drag brake or down hill speed modulator, than a real stopper). I found these pictures from an old ebay listing showing a '71 version of the rear hub I suspect is on this bike.

Those handlebars must be REALLY heavy!

I'm not sure about the handlebars but the listed weight on the bike is 50+ pounds. :rolleyes: It must be Scwhinn EF steel, although BobHufford wondered if they are fillet brazed .

It will need to go on a diet. I imagine it has steel rims and bars. Hard to tell about the seatposts. If they are those skinny Schwinn ones, not much can be done.

the listed weight on the bike is 50+ pounds. It must be Scwhinn EF steel, although BobHufford wondered if they are fillet brazed .The listed weight on the fillet-brazed Sports Tourer single was 31 pounds so 50 doesn't seem unreasonable for a tandem (the Paramounts came in at 43 pounds) and this photo from a recently complete eBay auction for a Twinn Sport looks like fillet joinery and not EF.

Bob

"I believe the "rod" you see is actually the kickstand."

I was beginng to wonder too when I went back and looked at the picture.
It sounded good at the time:)

Well, I've decided to buy this old tandem. The daughter and wife said go for it. The seller was enthusiastic to sell it to someone who liked older Schwinns. She was also willing to wait until I could travel over to the NH-ME seacoast region to pick it up about July 18. I'm not far from NH-VT line in the mountains, and as they say in these parts, "Ya can't git thar from har!". Plus I leave in a few hours to go to northern NM for a class during the next week.

Can't beat the $75 price. When I have it I'll post the before pictures. Clean it up, take care of the handlebar issue, grease, tires, cables, etc., ride it for the remainder of the summer, than decide how to improve it over the winter. If I'm going to keep the wife and daughter happy, I'll need lower gearing for hill climbing and it will have to stop adequately. My wife asked yesterday, "Is there a place for me to rest my feet while you still pedal?"

Thanks for everyone's thoughts and help!

I returned from my trip to NM last Sunday and was able to travel over to Maine to look at the Twinn Sport and I decided for $75 I couldn't go wrong. The pictures the seller had provided were a bit out of focus. So here are some shots I took today, pretty much as I brought it home except the front tire wouldn't hold air so I threw on a spare wheel. I also have losely attached a center pull brake to the rear bridge but it has no blocks nor is it cabled.
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/P1010008.jpg
Over all it looks nice. I'll do a quick cleaning and lube to make it road worthy for the remainder of the summer and then plan to do a major overhaul during the winter. To begin with I'll put on new saddles, tape the front bars, add rear upright bars (for the daughter and wife), and remove the toe clips. The front caliper is bent so I'll use another center pull there. I also plan to attach a ratchet type adjuster for the rear drum brake to use as a drag brake on the decents.
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/P1010017.jpg
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/P1010018.jpg
I still wonder about the joints. Some look fillet brazed, others look welded, and a few look Electro Forged.
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/P1010012.jpg
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/P1010010.jpg
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/P1010020.jpg
Overall it shifts very nice but braking is terrible. One other problem is that the Captain's chainring is a 40 tooth (110 BCD) and the Stocker's chainring is a 36 (maybe 118 BCD), so the pedals are out of sync. I think I have the needed rings to solve this challenge, but I might be begging from my buddies here at BF-C&V. :) BTW, it was built January 29, 1979.

Nice bike for a nice price. The drag brake sounds like a good idea, I should consider this for my twinn, except I would need to be creative hanging a rear caliper on mine.

I wouldn't stick with the drop bars on the front, I'd opt for uprights.

Make sure the rear uprights are wide before the rise, I'm not passing judgement on you, but speaking from experience.

Nice bike for a nice price. The drag brake sounds like a good idea, I should consider this for my twinn, except I would need to be creative hanging a rear caliper on mine.

I wouldn't stick with the drop bars on the front, I'd opt for uprights.

Make sure the rear uprights are wide before the rise, I'm not passing judgement on you, but speaking from experience.
When I picked the bike up the first thing I looked for was a brake bridge over the rear wheel. I was glad when I found one.:)

I don't mind the drop bars since I ride on the hoods most of the time. I do plan to replace the levers which will loose the the safety extentions.

I've already mounted the new Captain's saddle and the Stoker's upright bars. Despite my wide bottom, :rolleyes: the new combination works!

I recommend a quick release for the stokers saddle.

Oh, and changing the rear tire, something that wasn't obvious to me at first was that I didn't have to remove the brake cable, but rather remove the locknut and slip the backing plate w/brake shoes off of the hub.

If you read the article on Sheldon Brown's site about the Electroforge process, it explains why all the joints on a frame cannot be electroforged. Since the framemembers are acting as the welding rods, if they are already connected, you cannot draw an arc. Also since the process consumes part of the tube material, the center tube must be welded in last.

I recommend a quick release for the stokers saddle.

Oh, and changing the rear tire, something that wasn't obvious to me at first was that I didn't have to remove the brake cable, but rather remove the locknut and slip the backing plate w/brake shoes off of the hub.

Great idea. I have one which might work. If I have a chance I'll try to see if it will do the job.

Thanks for the tip on the rear wheel. I had wondered how that might work.


If you read the article on Sheldon Brown's site about the Electroforge process, it explains why all the joints on a frame cannot be electroforged. Since the framemembers are acting as the welding rods, if they are already connected, you cannot draw an arc. Also since the process consumes part of the tube material, the center tube must be welded in last.

Thanks, it has been a while since I read that article. Sometimes EF joints are so perfectly smooth, they are difficult to distiguish from a fillet brazed. This has such a mix, including what look like TIG welded joints. I suppose it was just practical to utilize all three processes.

Nice!

I'd love to play around with a tandem, but haven't yet found one that is "our" size. I am 6' 1" and Mrs. K is 5' 3". I can't ride a small and she can't go too large!

Nice!

I'd love to play around with a tandem, but haven't yet found one that is "our" size. I am 6' 1" and Mrs. K is 5' 3". I can't ride a small and she can't go too large!

If your ever in the SF Bay Area, I have a nice Univega tandem that might do the trick. I'm 5'11, and used it with my (then) 10 year old daughter on lots of metric centuries.

Please get those crank arms in sync! Its driving me nuts! LOL! ;) Nice bike!

Nice!

I'd love to play around with a tandem, but haven't yet found one that is "our" size. I am 6' 1" and Mrs. K is 5' 3". I can't ride a small and she can't go too large!

I'm 6' 1" while Ms. PB is 5' 4" and my daughter is 5' 5." I sould know by the end of the week how it fits them. I'll let you know how they fit.


Please get those crank arms in sync! Its driving me nuts! LOL! Nice bike!

I know, I know! As I mentioned earlier, the Captain's chainring and the Stocker's chainring are two different sizes and two different BCDs. :eek: A 40 and a 36 tooth, respectively! I need to check all my spares to see if I can come up with matching tooth counts.

pastorbob,
FWIW, I just went and checked my Sport Twinn Tandem, and the 36 tooth is the one you want to keep. I'm 5'10 and my wife is 5'3", we can ride it just fine and the seats aren't down all the way. It is great fun, but takes some getting used to, especially the starting/stopping part. It doesn't quite turn as quickly as my De Rosa, either;)

Enjoy the ride, it is an exercise in cooperation. I figure if a husband/wife can enjoy riding a tandem together, the marriage will last forever!

If your ever in the SF Bay Area, I have a nice Univega tandem that might do the trick. I'm 5'11, and used it with my (then) 10 year old daughter on lots of metric centuries.

We are actually overdue for a trip up there. My wife has relatives in Danville. One of these days...one of these days....!

We are actually overdue for a trip up there. My wife has relatives in Danville. One of these days...one of these days....!

Danville? I'm the next town south - San Ramon, maybe 5 miles, if that. If you ever get up here, gimme a shout. We can go for a ride and have lunch at Norm's. Norm's is in DT Danville, and has some pretty good chow....... :)

pastorbob,
FWIW, I just went and checked my Sport Twinn Tandem, and the 36 tooth is the one you want to keep. I'm 5'10 and my wife is 5'3", we can ride it just fine and the seats aren't down all the way. It is great fun, but takes some getting used to, especially the starting/stopping part. It doesn't quite turn as quickly as my De Rosa, either;)

Enjoy the ride, it is an exercise in cooperation. I figure if a husband/wife can enjoy riding a tandem together, the marriage will last forever!

We have 27+ years and counting. We're starting to look out 15 or so years towards retirement, making certain our ducks are in a row and quacking soundly! I've interested my wife in more biking. Had her out for a 28 miler on a rails to trail path today. She did great!

Thanks for checking on the tooth count! I just checked all my spare chainrings and I can't make a match, either 36-36 or 40-40. I have yet to determine the exact BCD of the primary chainrings (the ones under the Stoker). They are tough to measure while attached.

Does any one have a 36 tooth 110 BCD chainring to swap for either a 38 or 42 tooth 110 BCD (both new)? Or I have several used Campy 144 BCDs and even a big 55 tooth 151 BCD. Let me hear from all you chainring collectors!

Bob, I think I have a 110bcd 40t or 38t. PM me.

-Kurt

Danville? I'm the next town south - San Ramon, maybe 5 miles, if that. If you ever get up here, gimme a shout. We can go for a ride and have lunch at Norm's. Norm's is in DT Danville, and has some pretty good chow.......

I am familiar with it. Driven that way many a time!

If I go I will be sure to let you know. :D

Here are a few update photos of the Twinn Sport. I've made some changes. Added leather saddles, upright stoker bars, different pedals, changed the front caliper to a centerpull, added a centerpull rear, converted the drum to a drag brake, and the biggest change, a triple crankset. Everything is not quite yet up to snuff, drive wise, but I'm working on it.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/FullView2Sep3.jpg

It cleaned up very nicely despite all the chips in the paint

Looking very nice there, Rev. It's still a bit of a beast though, isn't it? Mine hangs on the ceiling of the garage, and requires a bit of effort to take down/put up, and may go up for sale before too long. The Mrs has taken quite a liking to the new/old Merckx.

Bob, it looks terrific! You did a great job cleaning it up.

I drove down to the Performance store today to pick up a trainer and a couple of tools, and passed a seventies Paramount tandem with a young couple on it in the bike lane on Market St. I gave them a "thumbs up" and they were grinning ear-to-ear.

Any day on a Paramount is a thumbs up grinning from ear to ear day!

This Twinn is a beast, but something fun to tinker with. I've modified the stoker crankset to add the triple. It was an idea I pulled from another website that I'll post the link to later. I'm not convinced it will work. The crank arm hits the chain as it comes around. I might have to go to a more conventional tandem crankset.
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/DriveSideCranksSep3.jpg
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/BackofCranksSep3.jpg

John Allen deserves the credit for how to build this crankset. I found it on his website.
http://www.bikexprt.com/bicycle/tancrank.htm

I'm resurrecting my old thread on my '79 Schwinn Twinn Sport (say that 10 times fast) instead of starting a new one.

Last year I did nothing with this bike. It hung in the basement gathering dust. Over the winter I decided to re-visit the lack of success I had trying to make it more suitable for the mountains.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/Twinn%20Re-Build%202009/TSFullTimingChainView.jpg

This time around I had several goals:

1) Convert it from a double to a triple, which meant moving the timing chain from the right to the left.

2) Improve the braking by having "Quad Brakes" operated from two levers.

3) Make it into an upright position bike with fenders which Mrs. PB will enjoy for trips to town, picnic, MUPS, etc.

Last night I took it for a solo test spin and I'm very pleased! :D

Here are a few of the specs:

Drivetrain: Huret Eco Duopar RD and Duopar FD, Suntour barend ratcheting shifters, Suntour Perfect ultra spaced 6 speed freewheel (14-32), Sugino crankset 48-40-30. The rims are Alex 27" ones from Nashbar and the tires are Panaracers 1 & ¼" with kevlar. I'll probably use SPD pedals in the front and platforms in the back.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/Twinn%20Re-Build%202009/TSFDRDSugionocrankset.jpg

Timing Cranks: Moved to the left side from the right. Added the single speed pulley for tension. I wanted to add an eccentric BB but my shell was not large enough. Eventually I made the right hand captain's crank arm out of a crankset I pulled off a junked Peugeot.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/Twinn%20Re-Build%202009/TSTimingChainTensioner.jpg

Brakes: Originally it had a front sidepull caliper and the rear drum. Now it has rim DiaComp centerpulls, as well as front and rear drum brakes in the hubs. The levers are dual pull MTB syle. The right lever pulls the centerpulls and the left the drum brakes.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/Twinn%20Re-Build%202009/TSBrakeLeverGripandShifter.jpg

Frame & Accessories: I added the chrome fenders, rear rack, front bar bag, Brooks B-72 saddles, and Northroad captain & upright stoker bars. The grips are leather ones from Nashbar.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/Twinn%20Re-Build%202009/TSRearView.jpg

Now that's a work of art, Bob - especially the dual-cable MTB levers.

Curiously, how is that singlespeed jockey wheel kept under tension? I can't seem to see any spring device on it. Looks sharp nevertheless.

-Kurt

Looks great Pastor. The Brake levers look trick. The setup sounds interesting too. It reminds me off the linked brakes that I had on an old Moto Guzzi.

Does the lever offer more cable pull in the lower housing?

You have done a lot of nice work. Is the rear crankset a tandem set up or did you modify a single crankset? If it is modified, how did you add the left side timing ring?

Neato brake setup! Is that ss pulley sprung?? On our tandem we had an RD setup to tension the sync chain at one point but now its back to rigid. I'm wanting to put a sprung tensioner back on as they do a much better job imo...

Now that's a work of art, Bob - especially the dual-cable MTB levers.

Curiously, how is that singlespeed jockey wheel kept under tension? I can't seem to see any spring device on it. Looks sharp nevertheless.

-Kurt
There is no spring. Originally there was a jockey like wheel which slid up and down in the bracket you see this attached to. The bracket is well positioned for a right side timing chain. Moving to the left side created the challenge of tensioning the timing chain. This unit works very nice and is simply bolted on. I added the spacers to assist with proper positioning. The red wheel can move left to right on its bearing several mm. The mounting arm is tighten down with that nut and a heavy lock washer. Seems to do the job nicely. I'll see after a 15-30 mile ride.


You have done a lot of nice work. Is the rear crankset a tandem set up or did you modify a single crankset? If it is modified, how did you add the left side timing ring?

If you look at the pictures at the beginning of the thread you can see how the Twinn was set up when I bought it. Both the timing chain and drive chain were on the right side. The rear crank was a triple and the granny gear acted as the timing gear. The captain's crank was a Sugino triple (110 & 74 BCD).

I needed a triple on the rear for my mountain climbs. :rolleyes: First I tried moving the timing chain outboard and you can see pictures of this earlier in this thread. It did not work due to the stoker pedal hitting the timing chain as I cranked.

Then I picked up tandem timing cranks (left side only) as a bargain on ebay. While I found two captains right arms, neither worked because they had different "Q Factors" from the right hand side. Eventually, I cut a swagged on chainring off of a "dump find" crankset and created my own right hand Captain's crank arm. :lol:

Now the other challenge was the BB. The Twinn Sport comes with Astubula style BB shells. Therefore I had to convert these with euro adapters, and then find the correct sized cartridge BBs. The front uses a 115mm Tange, and the rear uses a 118mm Shimano.


Neato brake setup! Is that ss pulley sprung?? On our tandem we had an RD setup to tension the sync chain at one point but now its back to rigid. I'm wanting to put a sprung tensioner back on as they do a much better job imo...

See above reply to Kurt. There is no spring tension and I don't believe any will be needed.


Looks great Pastor. The Brake levers look trick. The setup sounds interesting too. It reminds me off the linked brakes that I had on an old Moto Guzzi.

Does the lever offer more cable pull in the lower housing?

The brakes were an interesting adventure. Originally there was a sidepull caliper on the front original steel rim, and the Atom hub brake in the rear. Stopping was horrible. I swapped the front for a centerpull and added a centerpul on the rear steel original rim. I only had a little improvement. I knew that if I wanted to see improvement I had to swap the rims for aluminum ones. I figured while I was doing this I might as well add a drum to the front, thus the quad brakes. :D

When I first tried them, I had both front brakes hooked to one lever and the same with the rear. Pulling two different types of brakes did not work well and there was a great deal of friction in the line. When I reworked them to have the right lever pull both centerpulls and the the left lever to pull both drums, the friction went away and it was significantly easier to to adjust and sync the two brakes on one lever. I don't believe there is more pull in the lower or upper cable attachment.

Last night on my solo ride I got the bike up to about 20-25 mph and tried an emergency stop. I was very impressed and satisfied.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/Twinn%20Re-Build%202009/TSFrontDrum.jpg

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p71/pastorbobnlnh/Twinn%20Sport/Twinn%20Re-Build%202009/TSRearAtomDrum.jpg

Here's the catalog page for the 1980 Twinns from the Findley collection.
http://www.trfindley.com/flschwinn_1980_1990/1980_42.html