Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - Will my brooks saddle make me sterile?

....Because it sure feels like it.

I've been putting the proofide on it, (quit a bit) and riding it but it still feels stiff as hell and isn't giving *that* much.. what is the end product supposed to feel like? a hard seat catered to your butt so it doesnt hurt? or will the leather eventually soften up and create a pillowy layer on top of the hardness that it is now?

And at what point should i quit putting this proofide on? it's been about 3 or 4 healthy coats, drying and polishing.

Thanks

http://sheldonbrown.com/leather.html

don't think "pillow", think "hammock."

There are people -- me, for instance -- who never find comfort with the Brooks. The idea is that over time the saddle will conform to your individual butt. It does not ever get soft, it just gets dimpled and ribbed and whatever else to fit your shape. Proofide -- or any other treatment -- does not, by itself, make this happen. Time on the saddle makes this happen. And the fun part is that you don't know if it's going to happen at all, for you. Depending upon the model it will take anywhere from 500 to several thousand miles before you know whether you've been torturing yourself for any good reason.

Have fun!

BTW, there are at least two schools of thought re. Proofide and other treatments. The first holds that nothing but Proofide should ever touch the saddle, and then only rarely, like twice a year at most. These folks claim that anything else will ruin the saddle.

The other holds that the above will result in your nads falling off before your saddle breaks in, and that you should soak the saddle in neat's foot oil or something similar to hasten break-in.

I've done it both ways. Neither ruined any saddles, but neither resulted in a comfortable, broken-in saddle either. *shrug*

I had the same problem as you with the Brooks. The area near the tip of the saddle stayed rock hard the whole time, and over 3 months, the rest of the saddle softened a little but not to complete comfort. If I did it again, I'd buy the pre-aged saddles. But my biggest problem was I had the B-17 and it was a little too wide for the saddle-to-bar drop that I like to ride around with.

The story goes two ways... Either you will complain for a year and, during this time, become seriously concerned with your groin until one day when, miraculously, you will realize you have never been so comfortable. At this point you will be telling everybody that it was the best/worst year of your life but it was all worth it.

The other way you'll complain for most of the year and then buy a different saddle... never to experience the true pleasure of your[U] leather saddle.

i've noticed some break in, i guess im just going to pile on the proof, and hope it breaks in quick. I'm not willing to tough 1000 miles of ball bust for an eventually soft saddle.

You're probably already sterile from years of television and microwave dinners!

I had the same problem as you with the Brooks. The area near the tip of the saddle stayed rock hard the whole time, and over 3 months, the rest of the saddle softened a little but not to complete comfort. If I did it again, I'd buy the pre-aged saddles. But my biggest problem was I had the B-17 and it was a little too wide for the saddle-to-bar drop that I like to ride around with.

I've tried the B-17, the Pro, and the pre-softened Pro. The B-17 was too wide. The Pro was too hard and didn't break in even with 2000 miles and a several hour soak in Neat's foot. And the pre-aged was gorgeous, but otherwise identical.

I love the way Brooks looks, and I love the history and heritage. I really wanted them to work for me. They don't. Oh well.

Man, mine was comfortable on the first ride, and has been ever since (B17 Special). Too bad.

Man, mine was comfortable on the first ride, and has been ever since (B17 Special). Too bad.

yeah mine too. only thing with mine is that it started cracking a it cause i didnt treat it with anything. my bussy passed me some mink oil crap and i wiped it on a few times. been shiny ever since. my fat ass loves teh saddle

yeah it will

thats why they are so expensive

cheaper than the ol snip snip though

Never had a problem with my b17 from out of the box. My Pro broke in after 500 kms or so but was good for 100 km rides out of the box---i know this because the first thing i did with it was go for a 100 km ride. Asses are individuals I suppose.

I got the b 17 narrow. I've ridden it a couple times since then it's gotten better since the original post. So far the, buttocks region has adapted but the pubic bone region is killing me. im hoping it breaks in soon or im going to have to wear maxi pads.

I can't decide if this post make me want a brooks more, or less. I'm getting one in the moring, though. Question now is black or honey? I think honey.

Helloamerican, you should start experimenting with saddle tilt. The saddle should not interfere with your pubic bone. It might be either tilted too far down, causing you to slide down; or too far up.

Helloamerican, you should start experimenting with saddle tilt. The saddle should not interfere with your pubic bone. It might be either tilted too far down, causing you to slide down; or too far up.

indeed. it should be relatively comfortable at first, and slowly become more and more. egans story about having to endure a year of suffering before entering the broken-in saddle nirvana is b.s. or just the testimony of someone with a poorly positioned saddle.

maybe they make them so hard and rugged that eventually, if you ride enough, your ass will conform to it

the saddle position is very important. my B17 which i switch between 3 different bikes can be absolutely aweful if its not just right. But when its right, there is nothing better, thats why I switch it between all my bikes.

They key trouble, for me, is that there is no perfect angle. If the tail of the seat is flat/level enough for comfort the nose is angled upward into my nads. And when I start lowering the nose, the rear portion angles up to the point that it's sliding me forward onto my nads anyway. The "hammock" deal just doesn't work for me, and I very much wish that Brooks would make a model that is flat, like the Ideale.

The b17 is pretty flat---you might have success with the narrow model. Also, I flattened my Pro by lacing it.

I consider the B-17 to be pretty "hammocked". It's less so than the Pro, but still not nearly enough for me. The pictures I've seen of the Swallow make it look like it might be what I want, but the price is too high for me to take the gamble. I'm using the Selle An-Atomica now, which is overpriced and stupid looking, but pretty comfortable.

some people get all worked up about this, but i found out the easiest way to break in a brooks is ride it uncovered in the rain once or twice. i did this on accident once, then let it dry out. next time i got on the bike it had the shape of my ass.

honestly, it works.

Helloamerican, you should start experimenting with saddle tilt. The saddle should not interfere with your pubic bone. It might be either tilted too far down, causing you to slide down; or too far up.

yeah ill try tilting it down a notch or so, right now its almost perfect level.. but then again im on the tall end for my bike and the seat is up a good amount higher than the bars. i just thank to god im not riding drops on this or i definitely would have nothing left.

If you don't like it, you could try one of these:

http://handsonseats.com/images/Hand%20seat%20web%20picture.jpg

LMFAO! I need to get one of those to go with my bondage swing. :lol:

I've been working on getting comfy on my new B-17 special. It really helped to tilt it back a little so I could just rest on it without sliding forward. That seemed to be where the real danger of become sterile was. I hope to level it off a bit as it breaks in. I can't deny that everyday I consider whether I should just take the WTB Laser with ti rails off my MTB.

some people get all worked up about this, but i found out the easiest way to break in a brooks is ride it uncovered in the rain once or twice. i did this on accident once, then let it dry out. next time i got on the bike it had the shape of my ass.

honestly, it works.

apparently im going to try this method, considering i just turned around and its poring outside, all over mr brooks. the bikes inside now but its not gonna dry out before i need to ride again.

My Brooks upped my libido within a day of use.

I was riding my first road bike back when all bikes came with a leather saddle like the Brooks. People forget that even some of today's famous Italian makes like Selle San Marco made them. There's a reason these saddles fell out of favour and eventually only Brooks hung on (by a thread too). They were never that comfortable in the first place, and as better saddle technology evolved, the leather saddle faded from use. Better technology came in the form of plastic shells that gave a certain amount, shapes, covers, etc. It's not like everything was bliss for butts when there were only leather saddles. The newer saddles had the advantage that they didn't lose their shape, for one thing, as well as being significantly lighter.

I love the look of the B17 and Pro saddles, especially the ones with the larger rivets, but I've never been able to get comfortable on one. For one thing, for lighter riders like me (60-65 kg or so), they remain hard as a rock virtually forever, unless you let them get wet, and then if you do, they deform so much that they become useless. For a road bike in a classic, not necessarily extreme road riding position, you get a good distribution of weight on the bike between saddle and bars This is why in the long run, the classic road bike position is best on a relatively narrow saddle that doesn't chafe as you pedal, and one that has a compliant shell but not too much padding. But it may not feel good right away. Also, you do have to tinker with position and angle until it's just right (and you're not sliding forward on it -- your sit bones have to sit on it just right).

All bets are off when you ride more upright. For that, you have all of your weight on your butt, and you are moving more towards sitting on the saddle rather than straddling it. Problems are compounded by the fact that if you follow the current fashion and formulas, your saddle is quite high compared to where it would have been in the heyday of the leather saddle.

^^^ Agreed 100 percent.

wow this is by far the most reasonable brooks thread I have every seen in ss/fg.

Get a Fizik Arione.

But, seriously, who wants babies anyway?

So it's been a day or so since i road it in the rain. Seems like i lucked out, i'm a light rider too, 135-140lbs, so it wasnt breaking in quickly, after the rain though it hink the saddle has hit a good shape. i road it home and have let it dry since then, once it's gotten drier i've put proofide on it and it seems to be fine now, im going to ride it again tomorrow to see how it's sitting but from first check of it i think i lucked out with the rain, it's got its shape still and my 'sit bones' have difinitive smoothed out indentations in the seat.

One thing to consider it seems with theese seats is that if you're uncomfortable on them first couple days as you find adjustments you may want to be careful quickly switching everything around. As i've been breaking mine in and being sore from it i think i may have skipped over my ideal setting several times because nothing felt right due to my ass being sore period.

son, you need to harden the **** up.

;)

The largest number of discomfort and break-in complaints (mostly using a B-17 standard) that I've heard have been with lighter riders using a very forward position on the bike. The break-in time will be longer, even with Proofide or Neatsfoot oil, simply because you're putting less weight on your seat. The majourity of riders who seem to get the most comfort from Brooks saddles are usually the touring crowd. I suspect the more upright position helps with the break-in time.
My B-17 felt great after about 100 miles, but I'm a really big guy and it's on my commuter MTB so I'm riding pretty upright. When I first got it, I slathered the entire saddle, top and bottom, with Proofide. I let everything soak in, buffed the topside, and put another coat on the bottom before I even put it on my bike. I put a light coat on the top each night for the next 3 days.
It wasn't the most comfortable seat I'd ever perched on the first time I rode it, mostly because the position was off. Putting it dead-level was no good because I kept sliding forward on it. I had to fiddle around with adjusting it before I found the sweet spot, where I wasn't sliding forward, but the nose wasn't too high up and putting pressure on my bits. I've got about 400 miles on it now, and can't imagine going back to a padded full shell saddle; but everybody's got their own definition of comfort, and saddles are a very individualized thing. Hopefully it works out for you.

The largest number of discomfort and break-in complaints (mostly using a B-17 standard) that I've heard have been with lighter riders using a very forward position on the bike. The break-in time will be longer, even with Proofide or Neatsfoot oil, simply because you're putting less weight on your seat. The majourity of riders who seem to get the most comfort from Brooks saddles are usually the touring crowd. I suspect the more upright position helps with the break-in time.


I think it also has to do with the fact that those in a more forward riding position are spending more time on the nose of the saddle. A position that AFAICT a brooks will never break in for.

Get a Fizik Arione.



That's the most awful uncomfortable POS saddle ever....... For ME anyway

The only way to know which one works is by trying them out. I have a Brooks Swallow on my fixed gear and it was comfy from day one, whether or not it would work for anyone else I can't say but Brooks and Ideale saddles have always been good for me

On my road bike I have a cheapo Velo copy of an SLR saddle (for weight and cost purposes ;) )and it's 1000 times more comfy than the Fizik

PS
The rain thing works on Brooks but be careful to let it dry out and then oil the crap out of it afterwards

Took my geared bike out for a spin today for the first time in months... MAN that b17 is nice! not to mention being able to spin up hills and draft faster traffic :) I really recommend lacing to anyone who is having hammocking issues. As you tighten the lacing you can watch the saddle's profile go from swaybacked to flat. Anyhow don't give up on that thing OP, lots of people love it for a reason.

not sure if anyone else has brought this up (didn't read 2 pages), but you may want to notice that old school bike mechanics/racers that have been racing on selle italias for decades are the same guys that have 4-10 "oops" kids.

not sterile........ just impotent!

some people get all worked up about this, but i found out the easiest way to break in a brooks is ride it uncovered in the rain once or twice. i did this on accident once, then let it dry out. next time i got on the bike it had the shape of my ass.

honestly, it works.

damn right! that's how we used to break in ice hockey skates. wet them and go for a skate. the wet leather forms around you and you never have a problem afterwards.

My seats basically perfect now. The rain was what did it. Although theres a little bit of fitting to be done on the hammock part it's basically fitted to me.

Firm Believer in the "rain to comfort theory".


What is lacing though? and how do you do it, can someone throw a picture up?

My seats basically perfect now. The rain was what did it. Although theres a little bit of fitting to be done on the hammock part it's basically fitted to me.

Firm Believer in the "rain to comfort theory".


What is lacing though? and how do you do it, can someone throw a picture up?

http://www.wallbike.com/content/JPG/swiftbutchered.jpg
http://www.wallbike.com/content/butchering.html

My seats basically perfect now. The rain was what did it. Although theres a little bit of fitting to be done on the hammock part it's basically fitted to me.

Firm Believer in the "rain to comfort theory".


What is lacing though? and how do you do it, can someone throw a picture up?

All you need is a leather punch to make the holes. I got my punch at a flea market for a dollar; at my LCS (local craft store) theyre $15 new. You can make holes with a drill as well but a punch is really much better. Drilled holes in leather are sort of mangled, and a punch makes super clean ones. If you mark the holes yourself and take your saddle to a shoe store they can do it in a minute. Just four holes is good. I started from the lowest point of the b17's skirt and moved back towards the rear, spacing the holes 10-11mm or so from each other (c2c) and 12mm from the hole centre to the edge of the leather. If you have vernier calipers they make marking really easy, just use them to gently scratch the surface of the leather.

apparently im going to try this method, considering i just turned around and its poring outside, all over mr brooks. the bikes inside now but its not gonna dry out before i need to ride again.

this is a really bad idea. the part people keep ignoring is the potential lifespan of a good brooks saddle. my boss at the shop has been riding his for over 40 years. it had been ridden by his father before that even.

however, if you ride it in the rain what you're doing is accelerating it's break in by decades at a time. what will happen if you continue to do this is that the leather will sag, forcing you to tighten the front bolt in order to keep your balls from bouncing off the seat rails. eventually you'll get to a point where you've got no more travel left in the bolt and the only thing preventing you from getting a butt full of carbon fiber is a sloppy leather condom.

if the seat is adjust correctly (height and rail position) then the seat will fit just fine. you should be able to take the bike to your local bike shop, put it on a trainer and get help properly adjusting the seat. once done, you will have an incredibly comfortable saddle right out of the box. it'll only get better from there.

however, if you ride it in the rain what you're doing is accelerating it's break in by decades at a time. what will happen if you continue to do this is that the leather will sag, forcing you to tighten the front bolt in order to keep your balls from bouncing off the seat rails. eventually you'll get to a point where you've got no more travel left in the bolt and the only thing preventing you from getting a butt full of carbon fiber is a sloppy leather condom.
How do you know this to be true?

How do you know this to be true?

I'd link you to a couple threads at Chifg.com but you probably can't read it. Besides my boss telling me so, I've googled out the following links for your reading pleasure.

http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/index.php/t-157638.html
http://www.rivbike.com/webalog/saddles_accessories/11014.html
http://yarchive.net/bike/leather_saddles.html*

*best of the group.

I bet if you did a similar search in the touring or roadie forums they'd sink your thread for thinking rain was a suitable way to break in a Brooks.

This is not "my" thread and I do not claim to have any particular knowledge on breaking in saddles.

At any rate, you answered my question: you don't really know, and are just repeating things you've heard. This is a fine and valid thing to do, but those of us who are searching for the truth always appreciate it if folks let us know if they are passing on first, second, ??? hand information.

FWIW, if you search in depth you will find a lot of folks saying that they personally have gotten their saddles wet and then discovered that this enhanced break-in. You will also find a number of folks who have heard that this will damage the saddle, but relatively few who will tell you that they did it themselves AND it damaged the saddle. This is not the last word, but it does tend to lead us in a certain direction.

I myself have not done it and am therefore a poor source of information on the matter one way or another.