Electric Bikes - Motor choice

I get confused...the more I read the more confused I get. How do you know if motor will be durable? Are hub motors more durable than something that uses a belt/chain drive? Which one is more effecient - assuming that the belt/chain drive is hooked up to a reasonable set of gears.

I want to make an e-bike that using 50% motor assist will take me 100 miles on a single charge...yes, I know, will need some batteries to go with it, but it also means that I will need a motor that will work for 4 hours on a regular basis without melting down. How do I choose?

I have over 10000 km on my 500 watt hub motor and it works great. It is my preferance for appearance and makes no noise. However, some people do prefer mounting their own motors and this setup seems to work very well for them. It may take a bit of customization with adding a mount for the motor. I have not tried the non-hub motor yet so I cannot comment on how well they work. My motor only gets warm on the largest hills. We have a lot of big hills in Vancouver, BC

Thanks! Now...to add one more question..and if you can answer this one correctly I will give you a homemade chocolate cake...the trick is ya have to come to China to get it :) Assume I have two bicycles. Both have 500 watt motors of good quality and both have the same batteries. One has a hub motor, the other has a motor that is attached to the wheel via a belt or chain and has a 5 speed hub gear box. Which setup will give me more range? Which setup will give me more power?

The motor running through a 5-speed hub sshould provide more climbing power (torque) and more range by always operating in it's high effeciency rpms.

Thanks! Now...to add one more question..and if you can answer this one correctly I will give you a homemade chocolate cake...the trick is ya have to come to China to get it :) Assume I have two bicycles. Both have 500 watt motors of good quality and both have the same batteries. One has a hub motor, the other has a motor that is attached to the wheel via a belt or chain and has a 5 speed hub gear box. Which setup will give me more range? Which setup will give me more power? Now that depends on how much power you want, how much range between low and high gear, how many times you need to shift if at all and how efficient the motor and drive train is.You also must know how each geard hub shifts under a certain power load and how long the hub would last under different conditions and loads.Slecting the right motor/controller and drive train parts can keep you busy for many years. LOL but you may learn a lot.

Wow! That is a lot of "knows"! About 50% of my cycling will be in bumper to bumper traffic with a lot of stop and go's...top speed is usually about 15 km per hour, which on a 26" wheel would probably be just into 3rd gear on an average gear spread. The other 50% will be in the outskirts of the city where I can let loose a bit and go 5-10 minutes or more without having to even slow down. One of the attractions for the non hub motor is that comparably rated motors seem to be much less expensive than the hub motors. Has anyone else found this to be true? There are also higher power ratings for the non hub motors.

There are also higher power ratings for the non hub motors.

I got confused in this question. Could you enlightened me?

No problem! I get confused all the time :) I have googled for hub and non hub motors of different power ratings. It seems to be easier to find 500 watt non hub motors (and greater variety) than it is to find 500 watt hub motors. The non hub motors seem to be cheaper than a hub motor of the same wattage.

No problem! I get confused all the time :) I have googled for hub and non hub motors of different power ratings. It seems to be easier to find 500 watt non hub motors (and greater variety) than it is to find 500 watt hub motors. The non hub motors seem to be cheaper than a hub motor of the same wattage. Non hub motors that have a much higher power to weight ratio can be three times more powerful in 1/4 the size as a hub motor and be twice as efficient in a larger RPM range band.The more compact the get the price starts going up a bit but a lot less materials are needed.

Thanks! Now...to add one more question..and if you can answer this one correctly I will give you a homemade chocolate cake...the trick is ya have to come to China to get it :) Assume I have two bicycles. Both have 500 watt motors of good quality and both have the same batteries. One has a hub motor, the other has a motor that is attached to the wheel via a belt or chain and has a 5 speed hub gear box. Which setup will give me more range? Which setup will give me more power?

The one with the gear box will have a better chance of running at the motors optimum speed at a greater variety of road speeds; thus, it should give better speed range and road power.

And I'm already in China.

The one with the gear box will have a better chance of running at the motors optimum speed at a greater variety of road speeds; thus, it should give better speed range and road power.

And I'm already in China.Then you must know that copper,aluminum and iron is a lot cheaper than high strength magnets and a quality freewheel to the point of proffits.other than making a small motor and anything that would matter too much being used with lead batteries.

The one with the gear box will have a better chance of running at the motors optimum speed at a greater variety of road speeds; thus, it should give better speed range and road power.

And I'm already in China.Then you munt know that copper,aluminum and iron is a lot cheaper than high strength magnets to make a stronger motor with a freewheel 1/3 rd the size. Not so important using lead batteries.

Then you must know that copper,aluminum and iron is a lot cheaper than high strength magnets and a quality freewheel to the point of proffits.other than making a small motor and anything that would matter too much being used with lead batteries.

I hate to have to ask this, but can you rephrase this. I do not want to find that I am arguing against you on a point in which we may be in agreement.

I hate to have to ask this, but can you rephrase this. I do not want to find that I am arguing against you on a point in which we may be in agreement. To put it simple the market is not in high quality efficient ebikes at higher powers.Who dicticates the market besides laws? The companies? Us ? I can rephase it many ways. LOL

To put it simple the market is not in high quality efficient ebikes at higher powers.Who dicticates the market besides laws? The companies? Us ? I can rephase it many ways. LOL


Agreed, the first thing that people look at is style, then cost. It always surprises me when I see people purchase almost any piece of equipment or machinery and not ask to see the spec sheet.

Sales people often look irritated with me when I ask to see the manual on prospective purchases, it is just not a common thing to do.

Agreed, the first thing that people look at is style, then cost. . That's why most ebikers are stuck on heavy inefficient hub motors.

"Non hub motors that have a much higher power to weight ratio can be three times more powerful in 1/4 the size as a hub motor and be twice as efficient in a larger RPM range band.The more compact the get the price starts going up a bit but a lot less materials are needed."

Can someone out there point me to a website that sells these kinds of motors? When I start googling I run into all kinds of motors, all of which are too heavy to mount on my poor little bike...or even on a huge bike. Also is a brushed motor better than a brushless for starting up at 0 mph? for higher speeds and efficiency?

"Non hub motors that have a much higher power to weight ratio can be three times more powerful in 1/4 the size as a hub motor and be twice as efficient in a larger RPM range band.The more compact the get the price starts going up a bit but a lot less materials are needed."

Can someone out there point me to a website that sells these kinds of motors? When I start googling I run into all kinds of motors, all of which are too heavy to mount on my poor little bike...or even on a huge bike. Also is a brushed motor better than a brushless for starting up at 0 mph? for higher speeds and efficiency?
Good small motors with enough torque to direct drive a ebike wheel by chain and sprocket WITHOUT a gearbox reduction are hard find.No ebike manufacture has steped up to the plate yet with such motors.They are still in low gear with profit making junk.I had to make my own brushless motors.

Thanks! I am planning on putting a 5 speed hub gear box on the front wheel and also a gear attached to the front wheel itself to get the speed of the motor in the right ballpark. Where can I find a motor for this? Also is brushless really mandatory for this application? How can I make my own motor (or have one made)? How do you know if a motor is durable? Sorry for the stupid questions.

http://tncscooters.com/product.php?sku=106105
About as good as it gets for your aplication

Thanks! I am planning on putting a 5 speed hub gear box on the front wheel and also a gear attached to the front wheel itself to get the speed of the motor in the right ballpark. Where can I find a motor for this? Also is brushless really mandatory for this application? How can I make my own motor (or have one made)? How do you know if a motor is durable? Sorry for the stupid questions.one motor has over 24,000 miles on it inclucing climbing a 10,000 ft volcano several times without ant failures in the motor or controller.Another on a ebike hac about 10,000 miles on it.The 5 lb motors are made from junk yard alternator stators with home made rotors and a quality made Mil Spec controller made in the USA.It's all top secret. LOL

Or you could get high tech axial flux Disc Motor with or without gearboxes that are made by the designer Brigs and Straton E-Tek motor.The small geard motor may go for about $100.They are used in floor scrubers.
http://www.marselectricllc.com/