Electronics, Lighting, & Gadgets - i love my garmin, but ...

isn't it time garmin, or any other manufacturer, bring these bike units up to date? i understand the outdoor/fitness market is small in comparison to automotive GPS units. i also understand that there are needs for miniaturization and there is only a very limited amount of battery power available. but still!

here is what i want:

-color display
-modern battery technology
-the GPS should tell me where i am instead of where i was when i arrive at home
-interactivity with other components (like in flightdeck by shimano) optional
-map options via memory card
-more way points
-expandable memory
-better host software (ascent is so much cooler than training center)
-user replaceable battery

please let me know in case i missed a product that is out there already.

j

-user replaceable battery

Thats a good point how does the garmin edge 305 stand up with the battery, should I let it go completely dead before recharging so spot charging doesnt ruin the battery?

isn't it time garmin, or any other manufacturer, bring these bike units up to date? i understand the outdoor/fitness market is small in comparison to automotive GPS units. i also understand that there are needs for miniaturization and there is only a very limited amount of battery power available. but still!

here is what i want:

-color display
-modern battery technology
-the GPS should tell me where i am instead of where i was when i arrive at home
-interactivity with other components (like in flightdeck by shimano) optional
-map options via memory card
-more way points
-expandable memory
-better host software (ascent is so much cooler than training center)
-user replaceable battery

please let me know in case i missed a product that is out there already.

j

Garmin eTrex Legend Cx offers you:

-color display
-the GPS tells you where i are
-map options via memory card
-more way points (plus set your own routes)
-expandable memory
-user replaceable battery

Coupling it with SportTracks (a free software), you also get:
* Complete route information including:
- location (and in the beta sporttracks, google earth satellite images)
- speed info, elevation/gradient, etc
* Ability to couple it with HR info from your HR monitor
* Ability to compare and average all your rides recorded in your eTrex for almost any datapoint you want

It's seriously the most cost effective solution out there right now.

i will check it out. thanks for the pointer. i like to ride long distances and bike maps for our region seem hard to come by. except for NYC itself which has free excellent maps. if your suggestion works i can leave the printouts from google earth at home finally. thanks!

the garmins are nice for a workout log. yes, the batteries seem to have memory and degrade rapidly in my experience. i refuse to think about it. i use the garmin at least 5 times a week and it goes back on a USB cable when i come home and stays there. not the best solution for the battery, but it doesn't get lost when kept on the USB-leash :-).

j

Garmin eTrex Legend Cx offers you:

-color display
-the GPS tells you where i are
-map options via memory card
-more way points (plus set your own routes)
-expandable memory
-user replaceable battery

Coupling it with SportTracks (a free software), you also get:
* Complete route information including:
- location (and in the beta sporttracks, google earth satellite images)
- speed info, elevation/gradient, etc
* Ability to couple it with HR info from your HR monitor
* Ability to compare and average all your rides recorded in your eTrex for almost any datapoint you want

It's seriously the most cost effective solution out there right now.

+1 I just can't believe people would rather ride with the 305 than the Etrex Legend CX. I want a moving map when I ride.

hi gear,
i hear you loud and clearly and i too am ready move up to something with a color map. how are the etrex in terms of water proofing? how does it compare to offerings from other companies like this one:

delorme np 20 (http://www.gpsmaniac.com/gpsmaniac/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=441806)

how do the different map packages compare? is there a software that features bike lanes/routes?

another comparison is size of course. which is the smallest/lightest of these units?

the garmins are not navigation units. they are more log-keepers for your workouts. i go the same way from brooklyn to central park 5 times a week. i will find my way without a map by now. the garmins take excellent track of lap times, miles, calories, and the like. it is a different species of products.

hi gear,
i hear you loud and clearly and i too am ready move up to something with a color map. how are the etrex in terms of water proofing? how does it compare to offerings from other companies like this one:

delorme np 20 (http://www.gpsmaniac.com/gpsmaniac/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=441806)

how do the different map packages compare? is there a software that features bike lanes/routes?

another comparison is size of course. which is the smallest/lightest of these units?

the garmins are not navigation units. they are more log-keepers for your workouts. i go the same way from brooklyn to central park 5 times a week. i will find my way without a map by now. the garmins take excellent track of lap times, miles, calories, and the like. it is a different species of products.

A few things:

1. The eTrex is water proof (at least the eTrex Legend Cx) and I've ridden with it in the rain, no problem
2. The eTrex is a Garmin (just mentioning it since you said "garmins are not navigation units" and the eTrex is definitely a navigational unit)

I've been really happy with the eTrex and the navigation it provides. The only thing I'd change is to turn the volume higher (which apparently you can't do, I'm looking for a hack that would allow it). The alerts to notify you a turn is coming up can sometimes be hard to hear when cars are going by, but the screen also changes to show the turn coming up and it notifes you twice.

Coupled with the free software of SportTracks, it's a fantastic option.

you are totally correct. i refer to my garmin 305 as "the garmin". i am aware that garmin makes full featured navigation devices. my wrong. i'm glad to hear about the reliability of the etrex in the rain.

you say that the etrex talks to you? wow! that is a feature i wasn't even thinking about. i saw this feature used only once. my office in manhattan is over a bar and on the way home i saw a drunk guy using a handheld device telling him how to make it home. it wasn't easy since he was on his knees already and had only 3 points of contact with the ground while holding up the GPS device.

I've used my etrex in a downpour (I wish I didn't have to but thats' biking) so I know it is at least very water resistant. I've used it in combination with Garmin's mapsource maps and maps by Terain Navagator. I like to save tracks of on and off road rides I've made and sometimes reload them to do them again. I've used it in Europe and traveling in N.A. I've used it walking and in my car. I have mounts on all my bikes' handlebars. The best thing to me is to explore places I've never been and use the GPS moving map to get me back to familiar turf after getting real lost. Its' a small unit but I can read the screen (while biking or driving) without my reading glasses.

+1 I just can't believe people would rather ride with the 305 than the Etrex Legend CX. I want a moving map when I ride.

isn't cause of all the nice statistics the 305 can tell the user when riding their bikes? (I only assume since I do not own one).

+1 I just can't believe people would rather ride with the 305 than the Etrex Legend CX. I want a moving map when I ride.

I dont need my garmin for navigating. I'm not lost, i know where im going, and where ive been. What I did buy it for was keeping track of my rides, replacing my cyclo computer and my heartrate monitor, and for training when i'm alone.

Now getting home from a group ride, commute, or training ride I can just plug it in, and my fitness log is updated with all the crap I used to be too lazy to type in :)

Now if they can come out with a combined version, without getting bigger, im all over it.

I use a Garmin GPSMAP 60 for ride info (cyclocomputer functions), map display, and geocaching on the bike. The Garmin bike mount for these units is great, and the GPSMAP 60 goes 20+ hours on a set of batteries. Mine does not have removable map storage, but it does have 24 MB of internal memory for maps. The reason I got the GPSMAP 60 over a Legend is that the GPSMAP 60 is more rugged, has a larger screen, a better antenna, and better battery life. I don't have a color screen, but I really don't understand the need for one. There's definitely a unit out there for everyone's needs.

Ken

you are totally correct. i refer to my garmin 305 as "the garmin". i am aware that garmin makes full featured navigation devices. my wrong. i'm glad to hear about the reliability of the etrex in the rain.

you say that the etrex talks to you? wow! that is a feature i wasn't even thinking about. i saw this feature used only once. my office in manhattan is over a bar and on the way home i saw a drunk guy using a handheld device telling him how to make it home. it wasn't easy since he was on his knees already and had only 3 points of contact with the ground while holding up the GPS device.

Sort of. It doesn't have a voice but alert beeps. It's got diff. beeps to warn you a turn is coming up and then again when it's time to turn and for other things (waypoints, etc). So it lets you know but with sounds, not voice.

I have an eTrex Legend (not Cx so no color) and over the years it has been subjected to serious salt spray while boating to dive sites, submerged during an incident with a canoe, splashed while kayaking and survived a major endo on my MTB. It still gets me to where I'm going just fine.

I never got used to having something as big as a Etrex on the handlebars. I usually just throw it in my pack on "record track" function and DL the data when I get home.

I have a standard little cateye on the bars and only take out the Garmin if I get lost.

A few things:

1. The eTrex is water proof (at least the eTrex Legend Cx) and I've ridden with it in the rain, no problem
2. The eTrex is a Garmin (just mentioning it since you said "garmins are not navigation units" and the eTrex is definitely a navigational unit)

I've been really happy with the eTrex and the navigation it provides. The only thing I'd change is to turn the volume higher (which apparently you can't do, I'm looking for a hack that would allow it). The alerts to notify you a turn is coming up can sometimes be hard to hear when cars are going by, but the screen also changes to show the turn coming up and it notifes you twice.

Coupled with the free software of SportTracks, it's a fantastic option.

While talking with some folks at the local Walmart as they're looking at GPS's they told me that Garmin did not cover repairs for thier Etrex Legend (black & white) or any models if the unit is subjected to salt water. Just a FYI I thought I'd throw out. WhileI'm sure mostof you are all in North America so I don't think salt water is too much of an issue unless you dropped it into a saltwater aquarium.

While talking with some folks at the local Walmart as they're looking at GPS's they told me that Garmin did not cover repairs for thier Etrex Legend (black & white) or any models if the unit is subjected to salt water. Just a FYI I thought I'd throw out. WhileI'm sure mostof you are all in North America so I don't think salt water is too much of an issue unless you dropped it into a saltwater aquarium.

Why were you at a Walmart? You support them?

While I love the Etrex for it's size but from what I've read it's not vibration protected for biking. Something I've read on the board and other forums about the circuit board or some electronics inside the unit coming loose and the unit is FUBAR'ed then.

Also another issue I have with the Etrex is they have /NOT/ gotten the SiRF technology into the units. Sure if you're out in the open then you'll be fine without issues but when you're under cover in the trailpaths and offroad under the trees you lose the signal quite a lot. Anyone that has been there knows what I'm talking about. If you're geocaching as well the signal fades in/out as you're under cover and takes about a minute to a few mins to re-lock on your position. I've had routes where it looked like the Family Circus where Billy is walking around the place with dots and break ups all over the place when I checked my traceroute.

Come on Garmin, it's been like 2yrs I think since SiRF has been out on your CS60 models (if I got the model number right) why can't you put that on your Etrex models? I'm sure the hunters have complained as well as other riders.

Otherwise I love the size and use of the unit.

Why were you at a Walmart? You support them?

I stopped by to check out some stuff while passing by and I find I don't get pressured into buying stuff while there then like other stores just for looking and trying out the products. What are you the spending police? :rolleyes:

A few things:

1. The eTrex is water proof (at least the eTrex Legend Cx) and I've ridden with it in the rain, no problem
2. The eTrex is a Garmin (just mentioning it since you said "garmins are not navigation units" and the eTrex is definitely a navigational unit)

I've been really happy with the eTrex and the navigation it provides. The only thing I'd change is to turn the volume higher (which apparently you can't do, I'm looking for a hack that would allow it). The alerts to notify you a turn is coming up can sometimes be hard to hear when cars are going by, but the screen also changes to show the turn coming up and it notifes you twice.

Coupled with the free software of SportTracks, it's a fantastic option.

I have a 305 just for cadence and HR pretty much, but if I was going to do it again, I would have gotten the eTrex and a cheaper regular HRM/cadence computer. The real shame is that they should just make a bicycle kit for the eTrex instead of having the separate system...

from what I've read it's not vibration protected for biking. Something I've read on the board and other forums about the circuit board or some electronics inside the unit coming loose and the unit is FUBAR'ed then.

My Etrex has been through several crashes - the handlebar mount kept it securely in place on the bike, and, although the bike and everything on it (including me) was subjected to quite a shock in each of these crashes, it continues to work without complaint.

Caruso

xxx

eTrex Legend Users:

I am considering the Garmin 305 versus the eTrex Legend. Can you answer the following for me?

1) Does the eTrex Legend require a subscription to a GPS service, or do you just simply turn on the unit?
2) How big is the unit? Does it fit on a bike handlebar? Are there bike mounting brackets included or available?
3) Is there as way with the eTrex Legend to save past routes? or upload your stats (speed, distance, routes) to another software program?
4) If i have a separate cadence/HRM, is there any reason why I would want the 305 model.

Sorry about all of the questions. I just don't have a lot of experience with either model.

Thanks!

1- Etrex doesn't require any subscriptions. GPS is free.
2- It's about the size of a candybar phone. You can see the specs at Garmin's website
3- etrex and 98% of all gps units can save routes you create via waypoints at minimum. You can upload to the best program available which is free and requires no subscription unlike many web-based solutions. sporttracks from www.zonefivesoftware.com
4- don't know, I use the 305 forerunner not 305 edge

I had an older Garmin GPS V, not the eTrex, but have used it mounted on my bike. It has maps for my local area, and does track my route with speed. For this GPS, I had to use another program to get my data into a compatible file, which I could then import into SportTracks. Once there, I can see the route I took along with speed. I also had a heart rate monitor, but it could not download data to the PC.

I recently bought the Garmin Edge 305. The Edge puts everything all in one small unit: route followed, speed, elevation, cadence, and heart rate. Now it's just really simple to load the data into the PC. I had stopped using the previous GPS simply because it required too much effort after each ride. The Edge downloads the data AND recharges the battery when I plug it in to capture the data.

Of course if I ever bike somewhere that I've never been and think I might get lost, I'll either have a map or the old GPS with me. ;-)

eTrex Legend Users:

I am considering the Garmin 305 versus the eTrex Legend. Can you answer the following for me?

1) Does the eTrex Legend require a subscription to a GPS service, or do you just simply turn on the unit?
2) How big is the unit? Does it fit on a bike handlebar? Are there bike mounting brackets included or available?
3) Is there as way with the eTrex Legend to save past routes? or upload your stats (speed, distance, routes) to another software program?
4) If i have a separate cadence/HRM, is there any reason why I would want the 305 model.

Sorry about all of the questions. I just don't have a lot of experience with either model.

Thanks!

1. Nope, it's like all GPS units, it uses the satellites put up by the gov't (just like the 305)
2,3,4: ALL answered in previous posts in this thread. (Seriously, did you read the thread? You didn't even need to use the search, the answers are all in THIS thread)

I understand that the 305 just tells you where you have been, and not where you are going. However, if you are riding a route that you have been on before, but do not remember all the turns, can you use the route if it is saved in the 305 to repeat the same course? Just curious.

You can follow a course uploaded or saved to the edge. you just follow the line to be on the same course. Unfortunate that It doesn't have a way to take a gpx file and map it to cue sheet instructions. If it had that, I would be happy. I don't need a color screen, that would just drain the battery faster.

How does the Venture Cx reception compare to the 305 under tree cover?

not having tried in real life, i think the sirfstar III chipset should give the edge an edge over the etrex. i'm sure both work reasonably well. i use my sirfstar-based gps on streets through forests in rockland county and in very narrow streets with extremely tall buildings in downtown manhattan without any problem.

article on why sirfstar is a big deal: link (http://gpstracklog.typepad.com/gps_tracklog/2006/03/sirfstariii_why.html)

the difference in mapping software is assumably bigger than performance. The top row is what is available out of the box with the delorme PN-20. The middle row is what you get out of the box with Garmin. The bottom is the Garmin topo that is purchased extra.

view map sample (http://forums.delorme.com/files/pn-20___topo_-_garmin_base_-_garmin___topo_798_263.jpg)

While I love the Etrex for it's size but from what I've read it's not vibration protected for biking.

I've ridden over 10,000 using a Etrex including a trip from SC to TX without these problems. It's been dropped a few times while riding without a lick except for a stratch. Now maybe using them for really hard mountain cycling but be a bit different.
[/quote]



Also another issue I have with the Etrex is they have /NOT/ gotten the SiRF technology into the units.


Cost of the unit was the reason. But they just released the H series for the Etrex series which comes with a super sensative antenna very similar to the SIRF. Geocachers are raving about how good it is on their forums.

http://forums.groundspeak.com



Come on Garmin, it's been like 2yrs I think since SiRF has been out on your CS60 models (if I got the model number right) why can't you put that on your Etrex models? I'm sure the hunters have complained as well as other riders.


Only the X series with the 60 and 76 have the SIRF receivers. The 60 and 60C do not have the SIRF chip. Like I said, the H series has a far more sensative chip. Even the little yellow Etrex is getting this new technology.

http://www.garmin.com/outdoor

Also one more thing to mention to everyone. You'll have to fork out around 100 bucks to get local maps for your area, the basemap of any handheld unit is just that, very basic.

One more follow up. The new H series Etrex has a much, much faster processor. That's important for routing and browsing maps. If you are in the market for an Etrex, make it is an H series one. The others are a few years old.

PS - the B&W Etrex Legend is not getting the H chip. But the B&W yellow is. Go figure.

I've ridden over 10,000 using a Etrex including a trip from SC to TX without these problems. It's been dropped a few times while riding without a lick except for a stratch. Now maybe using them for really hard mountain cycling but be a bit different.

Cost of the unit was the reason. But they just released the H series for the Etrex series which comes with a super sensative antenna very similar to the SIRF. Geocachers are raving about how good it is on their forums.

http://forums.groundspeak.com

Only the X series with the 60 and 76 have the SIRF receivers. The 60 and 60C do not have the SIRF chip. Like I said, the H series has a far more sensative chip. Even the little yellow Etrex is getting this new technology.

http://www.garmin.com/outdoor

Also one more thing to mention to everyone. You'll have to fork out around 100 bucks to get local maps for your area, the basemap of any handheld unit is just that, very basic.

Oh, yeah, you do need to buy maps. If you have a friend with them who's willing to share, Garmin will allow you to use your maps with two units so they'll let you put it on your unit.

Oh, yeah, you do need to buy maps. If you have a friend with them who's willing to share, Garmin will allow you to use your maps with two units so they'll let you put it on your unit.

Or you can buy Garmin's Metro Guide which doesn't restrict the number of units you can put it on and comes with full mapping. It's Garmin City Navigator that comes with the 2 unit restriction.

But..... OFFICIALLY - Metro Guide doesn't auto-route even on units that support auto-route. City Navigator will allow you to auto-route on those units.

But again...... UNOFFICIALLY - you can auto route using Metro Guide using a 3rd party program called img2gps. :D

Or you can buy Garmin's Metro Guide which doesn't restrict the number of units you can put it on and comes with full mapping. It's Garmin City Navigator that comes with the 2 unit restriction.

But..... OFFICIALLY - Metro Guide doesn't auto-route even on units that support auto-route. City Navigator will allow you to auto-route on those units.

But again...... UNOFFICIALLY - you can auto route using Metro Guide using a 3rd party program called img2gps. :D

Cool. yeah, there's always a way around almost every problem.

For GPS mapping when lost (someone said they throw it in their backpack rather than mount it for full time use) would it be better to use the GPS mapping function available on some of the cell phones these days?

For GPS mapping when lost (someone said they throw it in their backpack rather than mount it for full time use) would it be better to use the GPS mapping function available on some of the cell phones these days?

I highly doubt that but who knows. My guess is the cell phone wouldn't work as well and the battery life would be VERY short.

For GPS mapping when lost (someone said they throw it in their backpack rather than mount it for full time use) would it be better to use the GPS mapping function available on some of the cell phones these days?

Nothing I have seen built into a phone so far has thrilled me. Maybe I am out of date on this.

I never got used to having something as big as a Etrex on the handlebars. I usually just throw it in my pack on "record track" function and DL the data when I get home.

I have a standard little cateye on the bars and only take out the Garmin if I get lost.

I have a mount on my stem for the eTrex Cx. It sits sideways on there, but I got accustomed to it.

So, what did you end up doing? Did you get an eTrex?

Did you get an eTrex?

I bought an Etrex Vista HCx and it works well. Mileage matches my odometer.
I ordered a large dia Handlebar mount but haven't recieved it yet.
I did discover the mini SD NA map insert doesn't load on my PC so I'll return it for the DVD (same price) map. The mini is easy as it is plug and play as far as the GPS.
Just a few days ago Garmin came out with a maping version of the 305 but it costs quite a bit more and I like my powertap. I'll use the GPS in my car as well so this works out. I orrdered the car charger and rechargeable batteries too. (whew!)

new garmin units (http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/29/garmin-intros-two-bike-centric-gps-units/)

pretty much what the op wanted

It's not out until December? Who can wait!
OK I see the author used "obsessed".
Judging from this forum, fair to say I'm not alone?

new garmin units (http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/29/garmin-intros-two-bike-centric-gps-units/)

pretty much what the op wanted

Except for the price.:D

Except for the price.:D

Exactly. I can get everything that can do with an eTrex + HRM. My eTrex was under $200 and my HRM was about $50. Total cost (brand new) was about $200 total (with mail-in rebate and $250 without). You're not getting anywhere near that with the new Garmin Edge's. Even if you add in a cyclometer for cadence, you're only looking at an extra $20.

yeh but ....its new and shiny.

Given I already have odometer, cadence functions plus power (powertap) I added the GPS with mapping. The only advantage is Garmin combines all but power measurement in one unit. It is only a matter of time before they add that?