So, after 7 years of collecting cobwebs in basement, I dusted of my wife's old Kona (not sure of model, but probably ~ 17 years old now). Simply put air in the tires (and they held!), a little in the forks, rode it up to the local bike shop and picked up a set of wire collapsable pannier's, and I've got the Grocery Getter.
Obviously, I'm new at this. I haven't owned or ridden a bike since I was doing endo's on my Diamond Back BMX back in the mid '80s.
So, after a couple rides over the past week I'd like to make a couple changes but need a little guidance:
1. Planning on replacing the existing tires (knobbys) with some smooth road tires.
2. Would like to 'up' the gears. This bike seems to be geard low (set up for climbing / trails) and I'm planning to use it on shorter, flatter road missions (I don't call it the grocery getter for nothin'). No real road trips just errands around town.
Here are my questions (with the spirit of keeping costs to a minimum in mind):
1. If I decide to change rims on this mountain bike, what do I need to know? I'd go for a narrow rim. Will road bike rims fit my mountain bike (I'm guessing not)? Are there narrow MB rims with an appropriately sized hub for my frame / forks? Or am I best off to just get smooth rubber for the existing rims (likely what will happen due to costs).
2. What's the easiest way to change the gear ratio? New front sprockets? I think my big one is a 42 tooth. Can I put a road sprocket on it? If so, would I (or can I, or must I) change the entire crankset? Will a road crankset fit in my mountain bike frame? How much practical difference is there between a 42 and a 44 or 46 tooth sprocket? Should I be focussing on the rear sprockets?
Sorry for all the questions, I'm just starting to realize how little I know!:eek:
joejack951
07-28-07, 11:29 AM
So, after 7 years of collecting cobwebs in basement, I dusted of my wife's old Kona (not sure of model, but probably ~ 17 years old now). Simply put air in the tires (and they held!), a little in the forks, rode it up to the local bike shop and picked up a set of wire collapsable pannier's, and I've got the Grocery Getter.
Obviously, I'm new at this. I haven't owned or ridden a bike since I was doing endo's on my Diamond Back BMX back in the mid '80s.
So, after a couple rides over the past week I'd like to make a couple changes but need a little guidance:
1. Planning on replacing the existing tires (knobbys) with some smooth road tires.
2. Would like to 'up' the gears. This bike seems to be geard low (set up for climbing / trails) and I'm planning to use it on shorter, flatter road missions (I don't call it the grocery getter for nothin'). No real road trips just errands around town.
Here are my questions (with the spirit of keeping costs to a minimum in mind):
1. If I decide to change rims on this mountain bike, what do I need to know? I'd go for a narrow rim. Will road bike rims fit my mountain bike (I'm guessing not)? Are there narrow MB rims with an appropriately sized hub for my frame / forks? Or am I best off to just get smooth rubber for the existing rims (likely what will happen due to costs).
2. What's the easiest way to change the gear ratio? New front sprockets? I think my big one is a 42 tooth. Can I put a road sprocket on it? If so, would I (or can I, or must I) change the entire crankset? Will a road crankset fit in my mountain bike frame? How much practical difference is there between a 42 and a 44 or 46 tooth sprocket? Should I be focussing on the rear sprockets?
Sorry for all the questions, I'm just starting to realize how little I know!:eek:
1. There's no reason to get new rims just to fit more narrow tires on your MTB. You can most likely run 1.25" tires without any problems, and maybe even 1". A lot of commuters tend to run something a little fatter for dealing with crappy roads (not sure what yours are like). 1.5" seems to be the popular size and is what I use on my MTB turned commuter.
2. Unless you are only looking for a little boost in gearing, changing the rear cassette won't make much of a difference. Most MTb's come with at least a 12 tooth cog in the rear cassette so the only change you could possibly make there would be to get a cassette with an 11 tooth cog. With that said, I use a wide road cassette (11-28) on my commuter to get closer gear spacing than a standard MTB cassette (mine came with an 11-32).
Changing the crankset to a hybrid/trekking crankset is probably your best choice unless you really like to mash gears, in which case a road crankset might suit you better. I use a hybrid cranket on my commuter (48/38/28) that I picked up for $25 on Ebay. I had to get a new chain to deal with a larger big/big combo (too short a chain will damage your rear derailler) but I got my original front derailler to work fine. A road crankset would probably require a new front derailler due to the large chain rings.
With that said, unless you are riding at 25mph on the flats, you shouldn't be running out of gearing on a standard MTB setup. You might want to try pedalling a little faster (using a higher cadence) which will save you some energy and might keep you from having to change anything on the bike. It takes some getting used to but it will benefit your riding in the end.
oilfreeandhappy
07-28-07, 01:22 PM
Here's my grocery getter:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/204/523826657_f56c934523.jpg
Tires are the simplest choice. Your weight and road conditions will dictate what you want. I weigh 250, so I use a 26x1.5" on my non suspension bike. You probably don't want to go below 1.25" on std. MB rims. Look at this chart for an idea.- Look near the bottom of the page.
Keep in mind, going to a smaller dia. tire on the rear also gears you down even further. The difference in a 26x2" vs a 26x1.5" is 4%. One tooth difference on a 12T cog is 8.3%, so the smaller tire is like adding a 1/2 tooth gearwise.
http://sheldonbrown.com/tire-sizing.html
You should determine if you have a Free WHEEL or a Free HUB. Gearing options are somewhat different between the 2. See-
http://sheldonbrown.com/free-k7.html
If your current rear cogset has an 11 tooth as the smallest, you can't gear it up any higher. 12 or more, you probably can, although going to an 11 MAY incur additional expense.
Get back with the details of your "sprockets".
What are the tooth counts on your biggest ring and largest & smallest cogs?
Going to a "bigger" ring means you have to have enough clearance so it doesn't rub the chain stay. Some bikes don't have it.
Jay.Money
07-28-07, 04:23 PM
Thanks for the fantastic info!
So it looks like I have a free hub. I haven't had anything apart yet, but there is the tell tale bulge at the right side of the hub.
I think I count 12 teeth on the smallest rear cog. I don't think I'm going to go down to an 11. Gonna try the smaller, smoother rubber first and see how it feels.
What's the simplest approach to change my gearing. My guess is add a larger front ring to the existing crankset. Am I over simplifying (I do tend to do that)?
JoeJack: Good suggestion on the pedal faster. The reason I was looking in to higher gears was that I usually found myself pedalling comfortably in the top 3 or 4 gears most of the time. When end up heading downhill (even slight grades), above about 30 or 35 KM/h I find it tough to keep up with the bike. Coasting ain't the worst way to travel:D, but I thought if I could expand my range of drive gears, I would.
Jay.Money
07-28-07, 04:24 PM
Jim: Nice trailor. You've definitely got greater capacity than me!
Bill Kapaun
07-29-07, 01:58 AM
"What's the simplest approach to change my gearing. My guess is add a larger front ring to the existing crankset. Am I over simplifying (I do tend to do that)?"
As I mentioned, you have to see if you have the clearance. If the largest ring is just barely clearing the chain stay, a larger ring is going to hit it. You need a couple MM to allow for frame/ring flex.
Going to an 11T cogset will most likely mean you have to also get a "Compact" Free Hub body. Page down under the 10 speed cassettes at this link and read the part about 11T.
http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/k7.html#10
Another option on tires is to go small on the front, but stay large (and smooth) on the back to maintain gearing. You do keep the weight penalty however for the rear.
One recommendation I make about street tires for someone that isn't sure about them is to try ONE on the front.
As far as "spinning out" is concerned- If your feet aren't coming off the pedals, you're OK. Just because it spins easy doesn't mean you are slow! I recently discovered that with the purchase of a cheap speedometer. I now spin easy, maintain the same speed and can last a LOT longer. All from down shifting ONE gear!
raster
07-29-07, 07:19 AM
...going to an 11 MAY incur additional expense.
But these amps go to 11...
mirage1
07-29-07, 01:29 PM
As far as "spinning out" is concerned- If your feet aren't coming off the pedals, you're OK. Just because it spins easy doesn't mean you are slow! I recently discovered that with the purchase of a cheap speedometer. I now spin easy, maintain the same speed and can last a LOT longer. All from down shifting ONE gear!This is a good point...I was really surprised to realize after a few weeks that the 85 - 95 rpm that had felt so odd at first was actually comfortable...with platform pedals, even.
Jay.Money
07-29-07, 01:38 PM
Just realized, if I go down to 1.5" tires, I suppose I'll also have to change my tubes, huh?
BAH
07-30-07, 11:08 AM
dont forget to convert it to an xtracycle for the ultimate grocery getter..... :D
Just realized, if I go down to 1.5" tires, I suppose I'll also have to change my tubes, huh?
Depends what's in there, should say on the tube. Go down to MEC (King/Peter) and get yourself a $5 membership and some tubes (around $2 each) - this isn't a showstopper.
I can't remember my MTB gearing, but I have a Canadian Tire cheapo MTB, and though I've spun out (with platforms) at around 60km/h it's perfectly adequate for all city riding I've done, and I used this bike exclusively (including winter) until early May when I got a road bike. I have a 15T on as my smallest RD cog, so you should be OK IMO.
Just checked my notes and my big ring is 48 or 50 (I obviously didn't count it very carefully), and with a 28-15 cassette on the back (28/29/30 for the first top RD cog I didn't get that accurately either). Judging at my triple numbers (38/28 for the middle/granny ring) it's probably a 48/38/28.
Conversely, my roadie is 52/42 with a 26-13 7 speed cassette.
Oh yeah, as for grocery runs - I use a trailer, too - I got a little tikes thing (cozy cruiser?) from Toys R Us that I've used to transport all kinds of junk in, as well as groceries and hauling my darling daughter around. The MTB is my 'rig' bike, so it does all the workhorse stuff like that, though I have ran the trailer behind the roadie once, it's not something I want to do often.
Got the new tires today. Huge difference. Tioga City Slickers. Cheap (good). Much less resistance. 26 x 1.5 (on numerous recommendations). Thanks Folks.
Bill Kapaun
07-31-07, 12:47 PM
I was going to get the Tioga, but the store only had them in 1.95", so I went with the Serfas Drifter in 1.5".
When i got the second tire, they had the 1.5" Tioga's, but I decided I'd rather have the tires match.
How do they look? I know at the store, they looked real "V" shaped, but have no idea what they look like when mounted. Are they still kind of V'd or just a nice even radius? Curious minds.....Pic's???
Jay.Money
08-01-07, 07:41 AM
Not very V shaped. I'll try get some pics up tonight....
jyossarian
08-01-07, 08:29 AM
Just get some 1.25" - 1.5" slicks and forget about changing the gearing for now. You'll wanna keep those low gears for when you have to ride BACK from the grocery store loaded down with 50 lbs of groceries. For more speed, put on toeclips/straps.
With that setup, I'd be feeding the pigeons and squirrels, all the way home. :eek:
Raiyn
08-01-07, 12:12 PM
Here's my grocery getter:
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/204/523826657_f56c934523.jpg
And here's mine.
http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x74/RaiynStorm/IMG_0010.jpg
Rehabbed a Kiddie Trailer (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=311932)
oilfreeandhappy
08-03-07, 09:43 PM
And here's mine.
http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x74/RaiynStorm/IMG_0010.jpg
Rehabbed a Kiddie Trailer (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=311932)
Raiyn,
Nice rehab job on the trailer. I may eventually have to do something similar. The canvas fabric on ours has some wear and tear.
Raiyn
08-07-07, 04:21 PM
Raiyn,
Nice rehab job on the trailer. I may eventually have to do something similar. The canvas fabric on ours has some wear and tear.
Thanks, when we got ours the canvas was 14 different kinds of nasty, having been left outside for the last couple of years. The conversion was always on the table so the fact that the fabric sucked had no bearing or complicating factors for us.
whatsmyname
08-07-07, 04:29 PM
Jay Money: imvho, do what you've already done, and don't worry about the gearing. if you use the bike for long enough that you're really frustrated by the gearing, then you'd probably want to change bikes to something else completely. stick with the kona and see what happens.
btw, a kona from that long ago is a thing of beauty for many Kona-spotters (inc me). Take good care of it!
zippered
08-07-07, 05:03 PM
if you're already talking about taking things apart and putting them back together i think you might have the "bug" like all of us. :D if it's your wife's bike, she might like it fixed up and you might like the excuse to get something for yourself...
Jay.Money
08-08-07, 08:10 AM
Jay Money: imvho, do what you've already done, and don't worry about the gearing. if you use the bike for long enough that you're really frustrated by the gearing, then you'd probably want to change bikes to something else completely. stick with the kona and see what happens.
btw, a kona from that long ago is a thing of beauty for many Kona-spotters (inc me). Take good care of it!
I did come to that realization. I've been doing well with the gearing as is since I started this post. That said, I'm almost always on the largest crankset ring....
This Kona hasn't kept any of it's original markings (but don't worry, I'll take good care of it - it rides quiet and smooth). I tried to post a pic for Bill Kapaun last night but was having trouble...
if you're already talking about taking things apart and putting them back together i think you might have the "bug" like all of us. :D if it's your wife's bike, she might like it fixed up and you might like the excuse to get something for yourself...
Yeah, I tried that... it seems that she's done with cycling. Seems I do have the bug. I find myself checking out almost every bike I come across, spending my lunch breaks at local bike shops, dreaming about fenders, etc.
Raiyn
08-08-07, 01:59 PM
Yeah, I tried that... it seems that she's done with cycling. Seems I do have the bug. I find myself checking out almost every bike I come across, spending my lunch breaks at local bike shops, dreaming about fenders, etc.
It's not so much a "bug" as an addiction. Probably one of the healthiest ones to have.
I've been using the manual quote tags within the reply to thread. Let's see if it looks better this time.
Jay.Money
08-08-07, 02:05 PM
It's not so much a "bug" as an addiction. Probably one of the healthiest ones to have.
Interesting, this is manually copying and inserting quote tags. The post before this was using the 'reply with quote' button.
Raiyn
08-08-07, 04:20 PM
Interesting, this is manually copying and inserting quote tags. The post before this was using the 'reply with quote' button.
If you type and then do the close [/qu*te] (edited to defeat) or even added the = username inside the first manually quick reply produced [quote] brackets it will get allow you to attribute the quote, but you won't have the link back to the actual quote in the tread.
example:
[quote=Tarzan]Me Tarzan, you smell FUNKY
Jay.Money
08-08-07, 09:51 PM
If you type [quote=username] and then do the close [/qu*te] (edited to defeat) or even added the = username inside the first manually quick reply produced [quote] brackets it will get allow you to attribute the quote, but you won't have the link back to the actual quote in the tread.
example:
Dude...
whatsmyname
08-09-07, 09:45 AM
Let's not get too concerned with different ways of formatting quotes! :)
San Rensho
08-09-07, 09:55 AM
My grocery getter is a shoulder bag. But I only shop for me and the grocery store is less than a mile away, so I just go to the store everyday for what I need, sometimes twice a day.
Every once in a while I get lazy and go in the car to buy the big bag o' dog food and paper products for a month.
Raiyn
08-09-07, 01:57 PM
Let's not get too concerned with different ways of formatting quotes! :)
It's always good to know who (and sometimes where) the quote came from. The one thing I don't like about the new software tweak is that in no longer gives you the quote bubble when you use the quote function in Quick Reply. It just looks like a slightly formatted copy / paste defeating the purpose of having the tag.
UmneyDurak
08-09-07, 02:16 PM
Interesting
UmneyDurak
08-09-07, 02:28 PM
It's always good to know who (and sometimes where) the quote came from. The one thing I don't like about the new software tweak is that in no longer gives you the quote bubble when you use the quote function in Quick Reply. It just looks like a slightly formatted copy / paste defeating the purpose of having the tag.
yeah bubble rocked.
zippered
08-09-07, 03:00 PM
It's not so much a "bug" as an addiction. Probably one of the healthiest ones to have.
ironic you should say that because i'm currently working at an addiction service, and i've managed to get a couple coworkers commuting by bike already.
oh, and i have 4 bikes... so far :D
Raiyn
08-09-07, 03:41 PM
yeah bubble rocked.
All your base are belong to Quote Bubble!
Not too shabby at all, I'd lose the plastic pedals though (that's what they look like) and swap in a set of BMX style flats at first.
http://www.pricepoint.com/images/styleImages/Z_240%20WELLA5.jpg (http://www.pricepoint.com/detail/14780-240_WELLA5-3-Parts-65-Pedals/Mountain/Wellgo-LU-A52-Flat-Pedals.htm)
But that's just me.
Jay.Money
08-14-07, 06:44 PM
Not too shabby at all, I'd lose the plastic pedals though (that's what they look like) and swap in a set of BMX style flats at first.
But that's just me.
Haha, that's funny, I want to do that but bought those plastic $10 pedals to get it on the road... It had clipless on it.
Anyone wanna trade some Shimano clipless for a pair of decent BMX pedals?
Raiyn
08-15-07, 01:14 PM
Haha, that's funny, I want to do that but bought those plastic $10 pedals to get it on the road... It had clipless on it.
Anyone wanna trade some Shimano clipless for a pair of decent BMX pedals?
Good luck with that one, but then again I've never cared for Shimano's SPD's. I'm a Time man myself