Road Cycling - 2 Newbie Q's

OK, I apologize in advance if this is a naive question, but having only ridden mountain bikes in the past, I've decided to take up road cycling mostly as an aerobic training supplement to my running routine.
I'm planning to buy a mid-range bike to begin with.

A couple questions:
1) are the wheels on most good road bikes so delicate that they'll be damaged by city biking (uneven pavement surfaces, road defects like 2+ inch cracks, etc)?

2) I've done quite a bit of reading and researching about manufacturers/components. BikesDirect has remarkably low prices on what appear to be well outfitted mid-range bikes, but their best deals are on (struggling?) brands such as Mercier.
Anyone have any opinions about the DOWNSIDES of a bike like the Mercier Corvus?
I know I won't get any warm welcomes from my LBS if I buy this way, but for under $800 the savings are tempting.

Thanks for any suggestions/input.

Originally posted by amg55
OK, I apologize in advance if this is a naive question, but having only ridden mountain bikes in the past, I've decided to take up road cycling mostly as an aerobic training supplement to my running routine.
I'm planning to buy a mid-range bike to begin with.

A couple questions:
1) are the wheels on most good road bikes so delicate that they'll be damaged by city biking (uneven pavement surfaces, road defects like 2+ inch cracks, etc)?

No, they will withstand quite a bit, assuming they have been properly tensioned. I go off curbs and up slanted curbs, etc., all the time.

Of course, they are not mtn bikes.


2) I've done quite a bit of reading and researching about manufacturers/components. BikesDirect has remarkably low prices on what appear to be well outfitted mid-range bikes, but their best deals are on (struggling?) brands such as Mercier.
Anyone have any opinions about the DOWNSIDES of a bike like the Mercier Corvus?
I know I won't get any warm welcomes from my LBS if I buy this way, but for under $800 the savings are tempting.

Thanks for any suggestions/input.

As everyone on this forum will tell you, the absolutely most important about any road bike is that it fits you well. This is much more technical to get a good road bike fit then it is to get a good mtn bike fit, due to the more laid-out position on a road bike, among other things.

If it does not fit you properly, you have wasted your money.

Things to be considered in the fit are ratio of upper body length to lower body length, type of riding planned (racing, touring, recreation, etc.) saddle height, arm length, and many more issues.

You will have difficulty getting a good fit on an on-line bike. Only a good LBS, or someone who has experienced different bikes who has confidence in what they want.

There are several web sites on getting a good fit.

http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/fitting.htm

www.sheldonbrown.com

Good luck

Thanks for the insights, DnvrFox.
I'm relieved that I won't have to worry about small curbs and road defects.
I've followed the info from wrenchscience.com for fitting measurements.
I've read several comments here about Mercier and bikesdirect.com.
I'm still undecided in that regard.

Answers:

1. Most reasonably well-made wheels are pretty tough and stand up to as much abuse as a MTB wheel. The exception are those cheap low-spoke-count wheels made by Alex and Vuelta that look like cool boutique wheels, but are not. The problem is not so much in the design as in e machine manufacture, and they often ship with improperly tensioned spokes. Any well-built wheel will stand up to almost any road surface.

2. Mercier is just a label, like Motobecane, placed on generic, cheapo, assembly-line bikes made in Taiwan. They're not terrible, but they're nothing special. Both were once highly respected marques that disappeared several years ago, and the trademarks were bought by mass manufacturers. Buy a bike at your LBS. You will be happier.

While I would, of course, reccomend that you get your bike from a local shop, I will say that if you are confident with your ability to get the right size don't worry to much about the brand on the tubes(Most frames are built in just a few frame shops in Taiwan). Look at the components. In the price you are looking at go with Shimano Tiagra, maybe with some 105 mixed in there. At your price point I would stay away from Campy, their high end stuff is great but the less exspensive stuff can be frustrating.
As far as wheels, I hop curbs and ride over gravel all the time with no troubles, but being smooth helps.

Originally posted by peloton
Answers:


2. Mercier is just a label, like Motobecane, placed on generic, cheapo, assembly-line bikes made in Taiwan. They're not terrible, but they're nothing special. Both were once highly respected marques that disappeared several years ago, and the trademarks were bought by mass manufacturers. Buy a bike at your LBS. You will be happier.

I often find negative opinions to more telling than positive ones, so I'm interested in a bit more info if you don't mind, peloton.
This is my situation:
I'm a world class (age group 40-45) runner and am planning to use cycling as a cross training technique. I'm very serious about my running, and I expect I'll end up logging a lot of miles on my new road bike, but at present I have no plans to compete in cycling.
I'm trying to balance quality and cost by factoring in the 'must have' features against the unnecessary luxuries. Nothing is out of my budget range, but I don't want to spend money needlessly for features I'll never use. I want durability, functionality, and dependability above all else.

My knowledge of the 'reputation' or cache quotients of various marques is limited to what I've picked up over the past couple weeks of research. But I am less interested in reputation in and of itself than functionality.
For example, using cars as an analogy, I've owned several Mercedes, BMW's, Audis and some Acuras and Hondas. When it comes to cars I can distinguish between value and hype. (I'll avoid stepping on toes by remaining non-specific).
What I want in a road bike is the equivalent of a Honda to drive to and from work 250 days per year--well built, reliable, durable, good value. For my current purposes an Aston Martin quality bike would be a waste of resources since I'll not likely tap into its full potential.

So what would you recommend as a Honda Accord equivalent?
And just for kicks, how would you compare the Merciers and Motobecanes of the world with car marques?

Thanks for your opinions.

In the $800-$1000 range, I would give a considerable look to Fuji. I have ridden the Fuji Team for a while now and swear by it. The alum frame is more forgiving than most other alum frames. Plus the gruppo is full Ultegra. All other components are Ritchey. It rides like a dream. Weight with pedals is 17.6lbs. I have seen some websites with overstock '02 models still. I picked mine up for $850 plus S/H.

Good Luck!

AMG55 If that is what you want, I would look for an alum. frame with Shimano 105, and set of 32 hole wheels. That will make for a good training bike with very little headaches.
Dave

It appears you got a great deal, ntwiz2.
I can't find the Fuji Team with Ultegra for less than $1200.
Even the auction sites selling them used are more than what you paid.
The Fuji Roubaix with 105's is $850-895.
I'll keep poking around, though.

Merciers and Motobecanes would be like a Kia IMHO, built well enough but not a Honda yet :)
From my experiences I would say spend a little more and buy a Campy equiped bike if you want extra durability and ability to repair rather than replace. Centaur is great, and Chorus and Record are incredible. I'm not knocking Ultegra and Dura Ace, because they are fine too, I just really prefer Campy.
Also, test ride as many bikes as you possibly can, you'll figure out what you like. I was in a similar situation as you a few months ago, except I was just returning to the sport from a few years layoff, and I ended up with a Litespeed Ultimate with full Chorus! My budget kept climbing as I test drove bikes, I realized this was the last bike I'll have to buy for a very long time!
Good luck, and keep us informed on your progress!

Originally posted by amg55

I'm a world class (age group 40-45) runner and am planning to use cycling as a cross training technique. I'm very serious about my running, and I expect I'll end up logging a lot of miles on my new road bike, but at present I have no plans to compete in cycling.


You, even more than most people, absolutely must get a bike that fits you properly. The last thing you want is to hurt your back or blow a knee while doing off-day training, and both things are more likely for an older rider. And the more miles you plan to ride, the more critical this is.

Do not buy a mail-order bike.

Look for a local bike shop that caters to road racers and triathletes. They will use the Fit Kit or some other repeatable method to determine the frame geometry that will work for you, and most will apply the cost to the price of a bike you purchase from them. Establishing a relationship with such a shop will serve you well when it comes to learning about adjustment and maintenance, will be indispensable if you have warranty issues, and can be a good source of contacts.

This shop will help you choose a frame that matches your dimensions and riding needs. It may be a mass-produced bike that just needs a stem swap; it may be a custom frame if your proportions are unusual.

For your purposes, a set of hand-built (by a master wheelbuilder, another good reason to look for a top shop) wheels using mainstream parts -- Open Pro rims, DT spokes, Ultegra hubs, say -- will be inexpensive, strong, and durable. Frame material is a matter of choice, and the way to decide is to ride sample bikes that are close to what you're considering. I'd suggest that Shimano Ultegra or midrange Campagnolo are the "Accord equivalent" -- Dura Ace, and high-end Campagnolo, are the Mercedes/Lexus level parts that offer a kind of refinement that may not be useful on a training bike. But Shimano 105 is the least you should look for.

Fit, fit, and fit. The three most important things about a bike.

RichC

Great info, LSR.
For some reason the car analogy works well for me.
I guess I'll look beyond BikesDirect.com (and their non-existent customer service).

And many thanks for the warning(s) Rich.
As you probably guessed, I'm partly interested in road biking because recurrent running injuries have limited my training capacity at times and I need a good alternative to running.
Your insight is right on.
Getting old is a bear, and the legs have limitations.
I've always enjoyed casual biking though, and I know having a great road bike will fan the flame.
I'm sure your advice (which boils down to 'spend an extra buck now and it'll pay off over the long haul') is spot on as the Brits say.

Thanks to all you guys for your help.
It's much appreciated.

Got to be more careful with the road tires and wheels. That two inch crack and uneven road surfaces you mentioned could be a big problem. I broke a spoke on a railroad track crossing like that, and another club member got front and back pinch flats. I was doing about 23 mph, but he's on our race team, and might have been pushing 30 mph. That was the first damage I've had to my wheels in ten years, so I'm satisfied with them.

Don't forget eBay. I just made a similar mb to rb transition (see my earlier post) and got a pristine condition Trek 2000 (1999 or 2000 year model) for $340 shipped. I also saw several newer bikes aroud $500. It'd at least be worth a look...

When I was looking for my first road bike earlier this year, I test rode the Specialized Sequoia, and really liked it. My LBS was having a sale, and I could have picked it up for $800. For that price, I don't know too many bikes better, although I'm sure there are. I do know that Lemond makes a few good affordable bikes as well. I agree that fit is most important, and as Rev. Chuck mentioned, you should look for Tiagra and some 105 components.

As for hopping curbs, I'm a mountain biker as well, and although there is a big difference in how the bike handles bumps like that, most road wheels will take a little bit of punishment like riding off a curb. If you are concerned about this, though, you could always get some touring or cyclocross wheels, which are designed for a little more abuse.

Originally posted by CarlJStoneham
Don't forget eBay. I just made a similar mb to rb transition (see my earlier post) and got a pristine condition Trek 2000 (1999 or 2000 year model) for $340 shipped. I also saw several newer bikes aroud $500. It'd at least be worth a look...

That's great!! For some reason, however, I just haven't had any luck with e-bay. It seems like bikes are going for almost as much as I could buy them here locally whenever I've tried it.... Guess you just have to be persistent about it.:) I have heard a lot of e-bay success stories, though, so it wouldn't hurt to look into it.

Well, after much research I'm leaning toward the Fuji Roubaix Pro.
Shimano 105's, Ritchey rims/spokes, carbon fork.
I inquired at my LBS as to whether they would bend on price at all since they're asking MSRP and BikesDirect.com has the Roubaix at $895 with no tax and no shipping.
The owner started getting red in the face and was trying to be polite. He simply said 'don't go there'.
I understand the plight of the local shops. But a 45% price differential is pretty hefty, too (online vs. LBS).
I'm not seeing much on e-bay which is going for less than online retail.

LBS's here are starting to push out 2003 leftovers at 20% off. Maybe that would help skinny the price difference.

I have to say, I think the service and advice my LBS gives is invaluable, not just on bikes, but accessories such as lubes, tools, clothing, shoes, etc ... it's worth a lot to me to have an intelligent human to bounce questions off before purchasing.

Originally posted by amg55

I inquired at my LBS as to whether they would bend on price at all since they're asking MSRP and BikesDirect.com has the Roubaix at $895 with no tax and no shipping.
The owner started getting red in the face and was trying to be polite. He simply said 'don't go there'.
I understand the plight of the local shops. But a 45% price

Are you comparing the same model years? The ones on the bikesdirect site are 2002's.

Although you should be seeing reductions on remaining '03's -- it's that time of year.

RichC

Originally posted by DnvrFox

You will have difficulty getting a good fit on an on-line bike. Only a good LBS, or someone who has experienced different bikes who has confidence in what they want.


Really,

So far for me online fit=1 LBS=0

I did the wrenchscience.com thing, and got a general idea, but was still unsure, so I set up a $50 fitting with the local bike store. Turns out I ended up with the new guy and he did the same measurements wrenchscience did, and gave me the same numbers they did. Fortunately he didn't charge me as he was practicing.

perhaps my experience is not indicative, but they use the same tape measures and formulas we do.

peas,

Jester

I'm by no means an expert, jester, but I have been wondering the same thing.
I used the wrenchscience schema and thought it was pretty thorough. I'm wondering what else a typical salesperson would add to the actual fitment process that couldn't be done with simple adjustments after the on-line purchase.

Well, BikesDirect is sold out of Fuji Roubaix, so it's on to plan B.
They recommended a Motobecane Legacy instead for the same price. I already know how Motobecanes are viewed by many of the readers of this forum, so I'm not too keen on that option.

Well I found what I think was a great deal.
Got a 2003 Fuji Roubaix Pro with full 105, Ritchey wheels, etc for $950, and bought from a reputable bike shop rather than online.
I was pleased with that price.

Took it out for an inaugural 20 mile ride today (101 degrees, no less) and returned feeling good about the bike (but MAN is that seat painful...gonna have to swap it out).

Thanks to all who offered advice.
It was really helpful.

Congratulations, amg55! I approve of your choice (for obvious reasons!). May the bike serve you well.

The Fuji saddle, if it's the same gray Fuji saddle they OEM from Velo that came on my '02, is not worth much, although there must be some riders somewhere for whom it's perfect. Saddle-swapping is one of the things you can discuss with your bike shop (along with sizing the stem) as part of the initial deal.

RichC