Singlespeed & Fixed Gear - Skipping tutorial

So I've been riding fixed for a very short time now, but I'm working on the finer points of trackstanding, ect. One thing that I've found impossible thus far, is skipping, or skiding. I've read the tips, but I really have no conception of what it means to "unweight" the rear wheel.

Any advice would be totally appreciated, in the minute-est detail you can think of.

Any other tips for a noob fixed rider would be cool too. Thanks!

-Steve

(PS I ride a 1983 Eddy Merckx Track bike. I think its pretty sweet! :))

i'm sure others will have better tips, but the most helpful thing someone told me was to hump my stem and pull up with my front foot instead of pushing down with my back. of course, you will need clipless pedals or toe clips to do this. i can now skid anytime i have the desire, which is never. i think its very hard on my bike and components

ballz2stem, and lock the pedals up like you got no choice, just do it

Try it on grass, gravel or wet pavement when you're first getting it figured out.

Skips and skids are done differently.

Skid stopping for beginners: cinch up your toe straps tight, lean forward to the stem, stiffen up your back leg and push down while pulling up with the front leg. In time, you'll develop the muscle and technique and be able to do these sitting down.

Skip stops: get off your bike. Have one foot in front of the other and try to jump 6 inches forward without bending your knees. This is the same motion you use to unweight the rear wheel / "skip" while the pedals are at 3 and 9 o clock. Learn it with both feet forward, than learn it with your feet at different positions than 3 and 9 o clock.

i'm sure others will have better tips, but the most helpful thing someone told me was to hump my stem and pull up with my front foot instead of pushing down with my back. of course, you will need clipless pedals or toe clips to do this. i can now skid anytime i have the desire, which is never. i think its very hard on my bike and components

What is skidding hard on besides the back tire and (maybe) the chain?

What is skidding hard on besides the back tire and (maybe) the chain?

the whole back wheel, not just the tire. puts a lot of stress on the hub and cog.

the whole back wheel, not just the tire. puts a lot of stress on the hub and cog.

Summerslam in 12 hours, 28 minutes.

What is skidding hard on besides the back tire and (maybe) the chain?

also hard on tha straps

Skipping: Do what andre nickatina said. That advice is genius. To finish, once on the bike, try this jump, and then as soon as you've jumped, pull back like crazy with your front foot. You're trying to keep the pedals from turning and thus the wheel from spinning once you land. That friction of the wheel sliding (or spinning backwards if you are strong/have a funny gear) is what slows you down.

Skidding: Seriously, get your nuts on the stem. Skid with the same leg pattern as your trackstand (left foot forward/right foot back, or whatever you do). Just pull back on your front foot and push like hell with your back foot. Once you get the feel of it, unclip your front foot so that you don't use it at all. You don't need it.

Unweighting is literally trying to put as much of your body over the front wheel as possible. You normally sit in the saddle over the back wheel, so putting your nuts on the stem is literally trying to ride like the stem is your saddle. Shift that weight!

also hard on tha straps

depends on technique and brand of straps. you're not going to stretch out some high quality toshi's from skids, let the winter handle that one...

...and for unweighing for a skip, it is really just for a moment--just enough to hop the back wheel. I always think of backwards bunny-hops ;)

for skipping: as soon as my right foot is on the bottom stroke, i kinda hop the back wheel while pushing off my right foot that is at the bottom stroke. in the split second that i hoped it, mere mm of the ground, i pedal backwards, so when the tire hits the ground it would stop my movement forward.

I think of skipping as just... regular skipping. As though you were prancing in a field of flowers. When the pedal is coming up in its rotation, pull up as though you were jumping.

It can't be taught, it can only be felt. wax on, wax off and all that ****. just get away from your damn computer and ride. you can't learn it by reading a bunch of posts, half of which are different, and half of them probably came from people who asked these questions on this forum originally...

sheldon brown has a tutorial (surprised?) when skidding (and he explains it better), if you keep your rear leg stiff, the forward momentum will push you up and help you unweight the rear wheel.

let the pedal near 7oclock lift you! skiP!


seriosuly tho, i was riding with a buddy. took the lead for a bit and at some points i needed to stop quickly so i skipped. he asked "wtf, is that skipping? how do you do that?" i just told him to watch my feet. and i explained that i just left my stroke lift me up as i hopped (thats how it feels to me).a block and a half later he got it.

sheldon brown has a tutorial (surprised?) when skidding (and he explains it better), if you keep your rear leg stiff, the forward momentum will push you up and help you unweight the rear wheel.

Right before you faceplant if you **** it up.

or, if you feel that you're going to eat it, relax that leg and keep pedaling.

personally i'd say learn to skid first, then skipping might make more sense and come easier. at least that's how it worked out for me.
I was able to do some weak little inneffective skids just by pulling up with the front leg while barely getting off the saddle, but trying too hard to pull up on the front foot just led to alot of soreness where my thigh met my groin from all that unnatural pulling.
i only really got to skid for real once i started ( as many have said):
1. putting as much weight as possible onto my bars
2. shifting my body as far forward as possible. i mean thighs against handlebars, genitals on stem far forward.

after that, i just got into leaning farther and farther forward as i became more comfortable and natural/instainctual reactions,combined with actually spinning the pedals backwards in a skid, that i ended up lifting the rear wheel easily and voila, you are skipping, skipping, skipping along!

have fun and remember to stretch!

off the bike do this:
put your feet about where they'd be if on the pedals with the cranks horizontal
now hop forward a few inches using nothing but ankle

now get on the bike, use the same type motion to unweight the rear of the bike, it doesn't have to be very big, its actually a very subtle but sharp and short movement........someone watching might not even see it, its all in the ankle or ankles, you only need to get your weight off the bike for a split second

by getting your weight off the bike and causing the bike to get unweighted too you won't even have to worry about putting all your weight as far forward as possible, the rear will lock up quite easily when it isn't fighting your body weight

this can be done in the saddle and done repeatedly by rocking the cranks doing a whole bunch of little skids, its like pumping the brakes in a car

unweight and pull up with front foot while pushing down with rear, for longer skids depending on bike layout and your strength yes you may have to lean forward quite a bit, but for short skids which slow you down quite quickly you won't have to lean forward at all

and once you get good at it, crank position won't hardly even matter, you will just do it without even thinking about it

I can't skid, skip or hardly trackstand. I'm a failure.

huh. skips were second nature for me but I had to work on skids for bit before I was comforatbel enough to commit (my girlfiend is pissed at me too)

....just led to alot of soreness where my thigh met my groin from all that unnatural pulling.

have fun and remember to stretch!

:eek::eek::eek:

it's all in your legs, feet, and hands. weight transfer will determine how fast you stop and how easy it is to hold the skid.
the skids that people tell you to do with your nuts on the stem are pointless except for show. they don't slow you down much at all.
to actually use a skid to stop to slow you down you need your weight back by your seat and you're gonna have to use lots of leg muscle to stop the wheel.

you want both legs bent a little like an aggressive sporting type stance...
you use your back foot to keep the pedal from rotating forward, push forward on your bars some to help get more power into your back foot and pull up on the strap with your front foot. don't worry about trying to hold this for a long distance. it doesn't matter. just hold it for a second or two and then relax your legs, the pedals will bring your feet around and you can do the same thing in a half pedal rotation with the other foot forward or you can wait a full rotation do it again with the same foot forward. as you get stronger you can hold the skid longer and stop faster. once again, your weight is still mainly on the back wheel. remember to use your hands to push on your bars, it will help. your front and back feet should work together to almost act like you are trying to pedal in reverse.

Can the OP do any of this stuff yet?

probably not :D

Skip stops: get off your bike. Have one foot in front of the other and try to jump 6 inches forward without bending your knees. This is the same motion you use to unweight the rear wheel / "skip" while the pedals are at 3 and 9 o clock. Learn it with both feet forward, than learn it with your feet at different positions than 3 and 9 o clock.

this is ****ing awesome

Jumping rope is a very good calorie burner and is also a fun playground activity. You can have a total body workout without leaving home and without the feeling you are actually exercising. It develops excellent footwork and coordination and also gives a very efficient cardiovascular workout and muscle toning. Before you get in over your head, work on your skills with these tips.

Steps

Solo Jumping
Choose a rope appropriate to your size. With the rope folded in half, it should reach up nearly to your shoulders. It also helps if the rope isn't too light.
Grab the jump rope by its ends, or the handles, one hand for each handle.
Put the jump rope behind your back and let the loop hang behind your feet.
Throw the jump rope over your head and when it meets your feet, jump over it.
Repeat and see how long you can do it without tripping up. As you practice, you will get better at timing. It might help to do a small hop in between jumps, count jumps, or chant a verse. As you learn to move the rope faster, the in-between hop will become unnecessary.


Tricks
Try some tricks. When you get better at jumping rope forwards, try going backwards. Start with the rope in front of your feet and throw it over your head to the back. Jump over it when it reaches your feet again.
Try crossing your arms in front of you and then do some jumps. Also known as the "Criss-Cross" trick. It takes practice with the timing, but you can get to where you alternate between crossed and uncrossed. If you're having a hard time, let someone else show you how to do it.
Attempt the "Side-swing". This is a trick which consists of folding the rope in half, then holding it with one or both hands and swinging it.
Do several tricks together. If you're feeling adventurous, you might like to try making up a routine using one or two tricks.

As a Group
Choose a longer rope. With the turners a comfortable distance apart, it should still go over the head of the jumper easily.
To get started, stand between the turners. Face one of them and place the rope to the right or left of your feet. Have them throw the rope over your head, and jump when it reaches your other side. Get the rhythm of this jumping before moving on.
Try running into the turning rope. It takes some timing, but it can be done. If you would like to try a trick, think of it before you run in.
Tell the turners what you want them to do, so that they will know instead of messing you up. Run into the rope first, and jump for a few turns to get the rhythm, then move on to the trick.
Try running back out of the rope to give somebody else a turn. Take the next step and try double dutch, with two ropes turning in opposite directions!


Tips
Try to keep your eyes on only one thing. This will help you focus more and helps you to keep your balance. You can judge where the rope is without looking directly at it.
Agree on non-verbal signs with the turners. For example, if you want to go faster, then clap your hands twice and to go more slowly, clap once.
Pretend you're jogging in the rope.
Try to jump with an even rhythm, if you need to, listen to some music while jumping.
Get comfortable with the basics before you try some tricks.
Have your rope light-weight and/or adjustable.
Start out with a rope. The better that you become, move onto a speed jump rope, as this weighs more, meaning that it will be less affected by the wind and can go faster than a normal rope.
Take small jumps, it will save your energy and you will be able to jump for longer. Good jump ropers take such small steps that you can't see their feet moving.
Consider going to or starting a Jump-Rope Club! A Jump-Rope Club is for people who meet once or twice a week to jump rope because they enjoy doing it.
Keep your heels off the ground, stay on your toes. Use your ankles as a spring action...this eliminates your feet from smacking the ground hard.


Warnings
A speed rope swung very fast can sting. Start slowly.
You may get tripped by the rope, be sure to jump where the landing is soft enough that you probably won't get hurt.
Choose an open area to jump rope and be aware of who and what is around you to avoid whipping someone.

how does one do a 180 skid. i only turn about 90 degrees, i can't get the full 180

how does one do a 180 skid. i only turn about 90 degrees, i can't get the full 180

try and swing your ass as hard as you can to the right(or left) and keep your weight forward, don't turn the bars very much

ahh wasn't swing my ass. thanks

it's all in your legs, feet, and hands. weight transfer will determine how fast you stop and how easy it is to hold the skid.
the skids that people tell you to do with your nuts on the stem are pointless except for show. they don't slow you down much at all.
to actually use a skid to stop to slow you down you need your weight back by your seat and you're gonna have to use lots of leg muscle to stop the wheel.

you want both legs bent a little like an aggressive sporting type stance...
you use your back foot to keep the pedal from rotating forward, push forward on your bars some to help get more power into your back foot and pull up on the strap with your front foot. don't worry about trying to hold this for a long distance. it doesn't matter. just hold it for a second or two and then relax your legs, the pedals will bring your feet around and you can do the same thing in a half pedal rotation with the other foot forward or you can wait a full rotation do it again with the same foot forward. as you get stronger you can hold the skid longer and stop faster. once again, your weight is still mainly on the back wheel. remember to use your hands to push on your bars, it will help. your front and back feet should work together to almost act like you are trying to pedal in reverse.
i saw this tshirt not sure if this will help but i think it shows what they mean on how to position ur body.
http://www.swobo.com/images/catalog/SWB09049_NVY_Closeup_Detail.jpg

Extreme skipping.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fx7k7gyJuFA&feature=related

I think it's been implied already, but for those new to skid/skip stops - you do NOT need clips/straps/clipless pedals? I'm currently running platforms and I've been able to skid on snow (surprise, surprise) regular asphalt is still really tricky for me - and I'm only running 66GI (my legs are reasonably strong) - it's all in the weight transfer/technique?

No, I'm not riding anywhere crazy with platforms - it's a temp. setup and it frankly half-disgusts/scares the crap outta me.

op-whats your gear ratio? when i first started i couldnt skid for the life of me but when i switched my cog with a couple more teeth it was like night and day.

Before you learn to skid, decide what skid you're learning to do. That's probably where a lot of the confusion comes from....

Skidding without clips:

Since you can only apply downstrokes without clips, you skid by pushing BACK on your back pedal with your back foot. The front foot is just for control. When your strong foot is at the bottom of its pedalstroke, START pushing back and down against it. Pushing won't be nearly enough to stop the wheel, so don't kill yourself. but you should start to bleed torque from your cranks and get ready for...

Locking your leg! When your back pedal STARTS to come up, lean forward and try to lock your leg when the pedal is farthest from the handlebars--in other words, between 4 and 5 o'clock (from the left side.) This way, there should be a straight line from your foot to your pelvis--which should be making contact with your handlebars. In other words your entire leg should be straight. The pedals will throw you forward until this happens. The handlebar is for your leg to brace against. Picture throwing a stick between your handle bar and the back pedal as it comes up. If you use the stick to push back on the pedals, it won't work. But if you jam it against something fixed--the handlebars, then the wheels will lock.

This is pretty useless for actual stopping. This is for drifting around the road like an ass or just coasting while you decide what to do. It's super fun on hills and after riding brakeless with no clips, you caaan use it to stop but you have to bank the bike really hard and basically hockey-stop for it to be useful at all.

CLIPPED-IN SKIDS

Wayyyy harder to do the first time, since you're actually muscling the pedals backwards instead of letting a fixed object--your straight leg--jam them. Since you can use an up AND downstroke with clips, both of your feet will be involved!

It starts kind of like not-clipped in skids. When your strong foot is at the bottom of its downstroke, start pushing back and down, but before it gets as high as you let it when skidding on platforms, lean BACK and pull UP with your front foot as hard as you can. Twisting your hips and turning the bike a bit to the direction of your pulling up foot doesn't just look cool, it will help you break traction easier.

For me, my legs don't lock when I do this kind of skid. I'm ever so slooowly pedalling backwards, because just resisting will make you tired but pedalling backwards is actually an easier motion for your legs. You can only backpedal until about 12 o'clock and 12 o'clock before you don't have the posture to keep the wheel stopped and your wheels will start moving again. I pull up until my knee is bending and then I can't pull up anymore, and then I start pedalling again. Make this motion really slow for long skids and make the revolution fast for quick (actually effective) skids.

Will provide pics of each skid and the posture required for each!

BTW, what's this idea that you need clips to be safe on a fixed-gear bike? Unless your feet fall off on a freewheel, they're not going to slip on a fixed bike. I was reading an old roadie book and Greg Lemond thinks it's really dangerous to get out of the saddle without having clips--what nonsense is this?

^ good advice
it sounds so easy the way you describe it, it is hella hard for me i can only do like small 5cm skids
pics should help a ton

All you really got to do is to put one of your feet across the backtire and apply some force, depending on need. Platforms are best for this kind of braking. Another method might be to put one of your hands along the top of the fronttire. Need gloves for that.

Sorry I didn't keep up with this thread. I now can skid to my little hearts content, and am having fun getting better and better. I definitely agree that skidding is more natural than skipping. Mostly, for me the trick in learning was watching some youtube videos and having a nice large, traffic-less parking lot to practice in. Thanks for all the tips, guys!

-Steve

Look up videos of people skidding on youtube. I think there is/was a video thread floating around on here too. That'll probably make it a little easier to visualize.

Also, try it on wet pavement, or gravel, or a bit of snow. That'll give you the feeling, and once you get used to that it'll be easier to do it on dry pavement.

Edit: Hah, now I feel like a jerk for not reading page 2. Glad you worked it out.

BTW, I'm running 44x15.

Here's a good tutorial on how to skip (http://www.ehow.com/how_2622_skip-rocks.html)

skipping isn't a beginer thing. learn to skid first. skid by pulling up with one foot and pushing equaly as hard with the other to lock the wheel so it is strong enough to break friction with the road, lean forward to take your body weight off the back tire and put it more on the front.

if you still can't get it hose down your driveway and try there but don't die skidding on waters easy to eat **** on.

skidding is not really for stopping, more killing off speed very slowly and for being "fancy."

skpping really slows you own quick. if your bombing a hill, you gotta be able to do it with both feet, very quickly.

is this really what skipping is? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewhWYqqIXb0)

is this really what skipping is? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewhWYqqIXb0)

Uh sort of...

bump

Front brake helps to learn too. Hit brake a bit and lock up legs. Work towards control with rear wheel only.

Seriously, if you can't do a panic stop at speed, run one.