Using a high torque motor to Chain drive the rear wheel in a single reduction you can use this sprocket/freewheel to addapt a 92 tooth 8mm composite sprocket to. A My 1020 motor shaft will except a 9 tooth 8mm drive sprocket for a 10.2 to 1 reduction to the wheel.FYI there only one slightly better way.The cost of this system including a 48 volt controller and chain costs less than $150. minus a motor mount.Less parts ARE more efficient!
http://tinyurl.com/2zolh4

How big exactly is a 92 tooth chainwheel? The curious should Google Eric Peltzer where details of his experiments with single reduction power transmission are documented. I accept his discoveries that the noise from the chain, issues of chain tension and safety make a double reduction regardless of the complexity a better choice.

H

How big exactly is a 92 tooth chainwheel? The curious should Google Eric Peltzer where details of his experiments with single reduction power transmission are documented. I accept his discoveries that the noise from the chain, issues of chain tension and safety make a double reduction regardless of the complexity a better choice.

H Eric had a hard time excepting my system until It made it up a 10,005 ft volcano in 36 miles, then he wrote this article that went to EV world.
After 6 years of using the most efficient chain,sorockets and motor on a bicycle still no one has used it nor has made a alternator motor for a electric bike that I know of. The 92 tooth sprockets I use are 9" in diameter amd can be slightly heard above 3000 rpm on the motor.Eric has tried to get ahold of one of my motors until he left the forums.Eric also drew up this prototype I described to him in detail over a weeks time with several changes.
There is no use for a power robbing double reduction chain system if your motor provides the efficient tourque needed to do the job without more parts. Eric never delt with quality, efficient 219 timing chain or composite sprockets.

That big sprocket should be about 10" diameter.

That big sprocket should be about 10" diameter. It's smaller than your hub motor and weighs about 22 pounds less at 6 ounces.

I didn't know an ebike could be powered by a single 6 ounce sprocket.

How big exactly is a 92 tooth chainwheel? The curious should Google Eric Peltzer where details of his experiments with single reduction power transmission are documented. I accept his discoveries that the noise from the chain, issues of chain tension and safety make a double reduction regardless of the complexity a better choice.

H With the belt and motor brush noise how could Eric ever hear the chain? With a much QUITER single 219 chain and composite sprockets you can get a 10 to 1 reduction as Eric got only 8 to 1 with a lot more parts , expence,weight and maintenance headaches LOL
Why do you think gocart racers use the racers edge ? = efficiency! The next sprockets will probably be skip tooth composite wheel sprockets to reduce friction even more! some use roller bearing chain too.These composite sprockets cost as little as $8. and last forever.European motorcycle builders, motor sports racers, and nasa all have the same things in common that passes it down to industry what only ulitizes in volume.Ebikes are at the bottom of the technology chain because of the profit made on the somewhat usless production ebikes that are over priced and avalilable today. Find the technology in all the right places that fits your needs and budgit wonders can be done that you can not find in a complete off the shelf product. First of all what is the prefered turn key ebike and how much does it cost ?


http://www.peltzer.net/ebike/

With the belt and motor brush noise how could Eric ever hear the chain? LOL


http://www.peltzer.net/ebike/

Post up a video so people can listen to how loud your chain drive and motor is.

Post up a video so people can listen to how loud your chain drive and motor is. Yes you can barly hear it winding out in a low gear gaing speed to 26 mph after climbing a 30* grade hill. .
I 'm sorry but ebike riding is ilegal now and every other place that I sometimes rode is now considerd tresspassing.Things are changing too fast and one person could not relax if energy was put into changing progress.Time is better spent going foward with the flow.. LOL

How big exactly is a 92 tooth chainwheel? The curious should Google Eric Peltzer where details of his experiments with single reduction power transmission are documented. I accept his discoveries that the noise from the chain, issues of chain tension and safety make a double reduction regardless of the complexity a better choice.

HHere sire you are wrong I rode my bike in it's V1 configuration and it was quiet and efficient, however for my use it didn't make sense because it made pedaling along almost impossible. A single gear reduction of ~10:1 is rather easily accomplished and quiet and efficient.



Post up a video so people can listen to how loud your chain drive and motor is.

I am sorry Lowell; but My friend with a 5303 at 48v that does ~40mph rode my bike and commented on how QUIET my system was, and I am totally taken aback at how loud his hub motor is and how horrible it is to ride off pavement (but that could be attributed to his bike significantly)... Hub motors AREN'T SILENT hell the Izip trailz I rode was quieter than his X5.

BBDrive: That comment was directed at EbikeHawaii. I have no doubt that your 10:1 reduction is pretty quiet.

For some reason the 5304 is much much quieter than the 503. I've never tried a 5303, but the 5304 is amazingly silent.

Using a high torque motor to Chain drive the rear wheel in a single reduction...

My average speed was 12.2 mph, mostly in first gear... (http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?archive=1&storyid=562&first=3636&end=3635)

Is this not a discrepancy? I'd prefer to use the bike's gears in addition to the motor, whether they're internal or drailier. Looks like I'm not alone.

BBDrive: That comment was directed at EbikeHawaii. "I have no doubt that your 10:1 reduction is pretty quiet".

For some reason the 5304 is much much quieter than the 503. I've never tried a 5303, but the 5304 is amazingly silent. Lowell = LOL.


I am sorry Lowell; but My friend with a 5303 at 48v that does ~40mph rode my bike and commented on how QUIET my system was, and I am totally taken aback at how loud his hub motor is and how horrible it is to ride off pavement (but that could be attributed to his bike significantly)... Hub motors AREN'T SILENT hell the Izip trailz I rode was quieter than his X5.

Using a high torque motor to Chain drive the rear wheel in a single reduction...

My average speed was 12.2 mph, mostly in first gear... (http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?archive=1&storyid=562&first=3636&end=3635)

Is this not a discrepancy? I'd prefer to use the bike's gears in addition to the motor, whether they're internal or drailier. Looks like I'm not alone. That looks like my speed going up a 10,005 ft volcano for 36 miles the perk with 2 more additional higher gears was that on the downhill half of the trip speeds of over 45 mph could be had by adding just a couple amps of power to make a round trip of 72 miles in 4 hours = 18 mph AVERAGE speed.This is not including the 20 minutes that I sat down at the creator rim on the way up to the summit 1/8 mile away.This was with 80 lbs of batteries and a heavy bike (for testing the system) using the batteries total capacity of 1584 watt hours. A ebike weighing a total of 1/3 less with lithiums and a lighter bike would need 1/4 less watt hours and the time would be considerably faster.
These are the facts that many now are trying to copy and mix up and are doing a great job of it. LOL = Lowell
Yes Hub / motor / pedal reduction is great! as long as you can go through only 3 gears with the right ratios to shift all together with a CLICK! at any power up to 1600 watts (for durability) power shifting of sitting still and get a smooth engagement with NO twisted bicycle chains or multipul chain or motor/gear reductions or Any derailers. BOTH the Motor and Pedals freewheel INDEPENDENTLY AT THE HUB so the chain is not spinning while coasting and high rpm motor freewheels or motor/gearbox freewheels do not need replacing often.A more direct approach to the best economical technology for a ebike has just been told. I wish someone would prove me wrong. Hell Who will match 5 grand for prize $ Is there not a ebike manufacture willing to step up to the plate ? I didn't think so ... Geezzzz ya all can chip in and pay LOL = Low___ to come to the volcano here to cook pancakes for his girlscout troop.

Admittely I have only been a contributor to this particular sub-forum for a short time but I have been a site member for some time. In any case, Randy, you make it seem as if your volcano run represents the sum total of your experience with e-bike technology. You have rested on your laurels as it were. I don't think that is the case, you seem to have ideas beyond what you actually were able to fabricate but you refuse to return to the drawing board. Time marches on. Anyone can cobble together a Salt Flat Special or HillClimb One Off that performs like the dickens but looks like hell and can only be ridden by its inventor. I for one want anything that I use to commute and/or play on to look nice. My folding bikes stop traffic and my tandems get thumbs ups whenever me and the GF are out on it. I'd like my e-bike to be attractive AND practical. After reading in this forum and looking at some of the links that many of you have posted of either your bikes or other manufacturers I have a very good idea of what I would build if I had the skills/time or what I'd like to see built. I must admit I came to this forum hoping to find out a lot more about the eGo. I think the eGo looks very nice but the fact that it has no pedals is IMO a serious omission, other than that its great. Still the battery placement is hard to argue with a big beef with many systems, particularly kits is the very large, square, battery pack mounted up high hanging from the top tube, just doesn't seem stable. What became of the TidalForce hub mounted battery pack? Was that patented battery placement?

Try this on: Longtail bicycle frame, i.e. one that either has an Xtracycle attachment fitted or is built to accept the Stokemonkey motor system, whether or not it actually is the Stokemonkey. In fact it would be better if it isn't because the Stokemonkey does not have a 'Pedelec' torque sensing controller. My system would/should. Why, because with a torque sensing controller the electric motor would not need a throttle, this makes for a short learning curve and retains a bicycle like characteristic. The DC motor could not only supply a variable amount of assistance to the human operator pedalling but it could also assist a small two or four stroke gas motor (gasp!!). Two throttles are just too much for a busy rider to deal with and the gas motor must have one. When combined, peak power in excess of 2HP could be easily obtained. Purists need not purchase the gas motor option but it would provide unlimited range AND charge the battery pack while using a negligible enough amount of fuel to justify being gasoline fed. With my system the battery pack can be a reasonable size and use SLA batteries as they can be constantly charged so they never have to remain in a discharged situation. SLA aren't really a serious option but they are there if wanted. Notice all motive power sources feed into the crankset. The driving of the hub directly by the e-motor without its access to either a derrailleur system or hub gear is a design flaw IMO. E-motors have great torque characteristics yes, but the wide range of road speeds needed in the real world, not to mention terrain, winds and the relatively small amount of power that can be carried (less than 3HP total) make gears for all the power sources (including the gas motor) adviseable. Discuss. (please).

H

Admittely I have only been a contributor to this particular sub-forum for a short time but I have been a site member for some time. In any case, Randy, you make it seem as if your volcano run represents the sum total of your experience with e-bike technology. You have rested on your laurels as it were. I don't think that is the case, you seem to have ideas beyond what you actually were able to fabricate but you refuse to return to the drawing board. Time marches on. Anyone can cobble together a Salt Flat Special or HillClimb One Off that performs like the dickens but looks like hell and can only be ridden by its inventor. I for one want anything that I use to commute and/or play on to look nice. My folding bikes stop traffic and my tandems get thumbs ups whenever me and the GF are out on it. I'd like my e-bike to be attractive AND practical. After reading in this forum and looking at some of the links that many of you have posted of either your bikes or other manufacturers I have a very good idea of what I would build if I had the skills/time or what I'd like to see built. I must admit I came to this forum hoping to find out a lot more about the eGo. I think the eGo looks very nice but the fact that it has no pedals is IMO a serious omission, other than that its great. Still the battery placement is hard to argue with a big beef with many systems, particularly kits is the very large, square, battery pack mounted up high hanging from the top tube, just doesn't seem stable. What became of the TidalForce hub mounted battery pack? Was that patented battery placement?

Try this on: Longtail bicycle frame, i.e. one that either has an Xtracycle attachment fitted or is built to accept the Stokemonkey motor system, whether or not it actually is the Stokemonkey. In fact it would be better if it isn't because the Stokemonkey does not have a 'Pedelec' torque sensing controller. My system would/should. Why, because with a torque sensing controller the electric motor would not need a throttle, this makes for a short learning curve and retains a bicycle like characteristic. The DC motor could not only supply a variable amount of assistance to the human operator pedalling but it could also assist a small two or four stroke gas motor (gasp!!). Two throttles are just too much for a busy rider to deal with and the gas motor must have one. When combined, peak power in excess of 2HP could be easily obtained. Purists need not purchase the gas motor option but it would provide unlimited range AND charge the battery pack while using a negligible enough amount of fuel to justify being gasoline fed. With my system the battery pack can be a reasonable size and use SLA batteries as they can be constantly charged so they never have to remain in a discharged situation. SLA aren't really a serious option but they are there if wanted. Notice all motive power sources feed into the crankset. The driving of the hub directly by the e-motor without its access to either a derrailleur system or hub gear is a design flaw IMO. E-motors have great torque characteristics yes, but the wide range of road speeds needed in the real world, not to mention terrain, winds and the relatively small amount of power that can be carried (less than 3HP total) make gears for all the power sources (including the gas motor) adviseable. Discuss. (please).

H Using 3 gears in the hub to pedal, motor, or both is all a 750 watt motor needs to run efficiently to 30 mph.You can pick the cadence and speed or amount of power you want to exert eaisly. What do you want to discuss ? derailers would be useless.Ebikes that are designd for off road use at three times most legal ebike power range by use of higher voltage packs would be apealing to any user.Speed and power limiting programable controllers address the legal issues for those requirements..

A gear range of 526% (http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/rohloff.html) in a sturdy, reliable package. Such a kick ass transmission would be the foundation of an "efficient" e-bike. It could be driven by a tiny motor, since the transmission would get so much more work out of it. I've always been a fan of internal gear hubs, and this puppy is the coup de grass! Of course, you could always throw more power at it for a hairy, inefficient ride! (http://www.greenspeed.us/machine-x_zvo-bike.htm)

A gear range of 526% (http://www.sheldonbrown.com/harris/rohloff.html) in a sturdy, reliable package. Such a kick ass transmission would be the foundation of an "efficient" e-bike. It could be driven by a tiny motor, since the transmission would get so much more work out of it. I've always been a fan of internal gear hubs, and this puppy is the coup de grass! Of course, you could always throw more power at it for a hairy, inefficient ride! (http://www.greenspeed.us/machine-x_zvo-bike.htm)You seem to beleave that higher power motors cant operate more efficient than tiny motors.. well they can! and be just as efficient at at more than 5 times the power being many times less in weight.How many times do you want to shift going to 20 mph in less than ten seconds? or 5 seconds ? without pedaling untill you get there ? to the speed you like to pedal at that is if at all.
Getting the most out of a nice 3 speed hub for a nice gear range just for pedaling with a slight motor assist is nice! A motor of 1 hp in a direct rear sprocketto motor drive even if mounted on the left side with a freewheel ,1 speed for the motor works just as well for speeds to 20 mph but then you miss out on the free granny gear needed on above 20* grades and 3 rd gear for faster bike speeds.all the parts are off the shelf except for a modified freewheel broach to fit two freewheel sprockets onto a freehub with 3 gears in common.Simple ! It works ! it's cost effective, light weight, and the most effent use of bicycle parts to power a ebike.
Ditching the derailer ditches weight and chain slop when going over large bumps causing the chain to bounce off or causing misshifts even without the help of motor power added to the factor using 1 hp motor power.Twisted chains do not help. So where are the best 1 hp motors for ebikes? LOL Who has a decent design to protect a motor and batteries ? A little skinwork and this frame could address a few cosmetic styles in protective covering, seat, fender, chain guard,a space frame to have the frame on the outside of the batteries is also just a design that is easy to impliment for a manufacture,

That looks like my speed going up a 10,005 ft volcano for 36 miles the perk with 2 more additional higher gears was that on the downhill half of the trip speeds of over 45 mph could be had by adding just a couple amps of power to make a round trip of 72 miles in 4 hours = 18 mph AVERAGE speed.This is not including the 20 minutes that I sat down at the creator rim on the way up to the summit 1/8 mile away.This was with 80 lbs of batteries and a heavy bike (for testing the system) using the batteries total capacity of 1584 watt hours. A ebike weighing a total of 1/3 less with lithiums and a lighter bike would need 1/4 less watt hours and the time would be considerably faster.
These are the facts that many now are trying to copy and mix up and are doing a great job of it. LOL = Lowell
Yes Hub / motor / pedal reduction is great! as long as you can go through only 3 gears with the right ratios to shift all together with a CLICK! at any power up to 1600 watts (for durability) power shifting of sitting still and get a smooth engagement with NO twisted bicycle chains or multipul chain or motor/gear reductions or Any derailers. BOTH the Motor and Pedals freewheel INDEPENDENTLY AT THE HUB so the chain is not spinning while coasting and high rpm motor freewheels or motor/gearbox freewheels do not need replacing often.A more direct approach to the best economical technology for a ebike has just been told. I wish someone would prove me wrong. Hell Who will match 5 grand for prize $ Is there not a ebike manufacture willing to step up to the plate ? I didn't think so ... Geezzzz ya all can chip in and pay LOL = Low___ to come to the volcano here to cook pancakes for his girlscout troop.


You're in luck Randy. I will be in Hawaii for a wedding on Feb. 4, 2008

Olowalu Plantation House
810 Olowalu Village Road
Lahaina, HI

It's time to put the $_it talking to rest and do a little racing. So tell me Randy, how much are you willing to put up in cash for this race?

You're in luck Randy. I will be in Hawaii for a wedding on Feb. 4, 2008

Olowalu Plantation House
810 Olowalu Village Road
Lahaina, HI

It's time to put the $_it talking to rest and do a little racing. So tell me Randy, how much are you willing to put up in cash for this race? 5 grand if you make it to the top of the 10,005 ft Haleakala Volcano from the beach riding your ebike in less than 3 hours in one charge on one set of batteries as the power sorce using no more than a set of batteries RATED AT 1584 watt hours of battery power plus any pedaling.

How come your article states that you used 1865w for your ride? trying to hobble the opposition?
" The Evercels stayed in the mid 50 volt range until the last 3 miles." and " using 37.3 amp-hours from the batteries "
I did the calc allowing an average voltage of 50v according to you story I should probaly have used a higher average which would make it 2kw used.
Why not make it a 1 on 1 race it would be much more entertaining.

That looks like my speed going up a 10,005 ft volcano for 36 miles the perk with 2 more additional higher gears was that on the downhill half of the trip speeds of over 45 mph could be had by adding just a couple amps of power to make a round trip of 72 miles in 4 hours = 18 mph AVERAGE speed.This is not including the 20 minutes that I sat down at the creator rim on the way up to the summit 1/8 mile away.This was with 80 lbs of batteries and a heavy bike (for testing the system) using the batteries total capacity of 1584 watt hours. A ebike weighing a total of 1/3 less with lithiums and a lighter bike would need 1/4 less watt hours and the time would be considerably faster.
These are the facts that many now are trying to copy and mix up and are doing a great job of it. LOL = Lowell
Yes Hub / motor / pedal reduction is great! as long as you can go through only 3 gears with the right ratios to shift all together with a CLICK! at any power up to 1600 watts (for durability) power shifting of sitting still and get a smooth engagement with NO twisted bicycle chains or multipul chain or motor/gear reductions or Any derailers. BOTH the Motor and Pedals freewheel INDEPENDENTLY AT THE HUB so the chain is not spinning while coasting and high rpm motor freewheels or motor/gearbox freewheels do not need replacing often.A more direct approach to the best economical technology for a ebike has just been told. I wish someone would prove me wrong. Hell Who will match 5 grand for prize $ Is there not a ebike manufacture willing to step up to the plate ? I didn't think so ... Geezzzz ya all can chip in and pay LOL = Low___ to come to the volcano here to cook pancakes for his girlscout troop.


Cocky ******.

5 grand if you make it to the top riding your ebike in less than 3 hours in one charge on one set of batteries as the power sorce using no more than1584 watt hours of battery power plus any pedaling.

Man, you're a little weasel aren't you? What kind of race is that? By your own admission, watt hour numbers can be faked.

How heavy are you? Are we going to ballast our bikes to equalize rider weights??

If you're so sure my bike can't make it to the top, then you have nothing to be afraid of, and it's an easy 5 grand for you. Why the sudden backpedaling with a ridiculous "1584 watt hour" limit?

You seem to beleave that higher power motors cant operate more efficient than tiny motors..

Throw any motor you want at that Rohloff, and it will end up far more efficient than any three speed. That 526% gear range is not a typo. What's the gear range on a sturdy 3 speed hub? LOL

The point is, gearing DOES make a difference. I'm not the one touting, "single reduction" without bothering to mention the use of internal hub gearing in the mix.

Less parts ARE more efficient! Tell that to Rohloff, but hell simple is good, too! (http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=4390197853554430118&hl=en-GB) LOL.

How come your article states that you used 1865w for your ride? trying to hobble the opposition?
" The Evercels stayed in the mid 50 volt range until the last 3 miles." and " using 37.3 amp-hours from the batteries "
I did the calc allowing an average voltage of 50v according to you story I should probaly have used a higher average which would make it 2kw used.
Why not make it a 1 on 1 race it would be much more entertaining. This shows how watt hour meters can be off quite a bit in a long usage.I uses FOUR 12 volt batteries rated at 33ah and tested by the manufactures to put 33 amp hours at a .5c discharge rate to DOD.My average discharge rate was about.3c so I may have squeezed more out of the batteries in ah because I discharge them less they were rated for.I would say the voltage sag averaged the total watthours of the batteries to be 33ah. The rating of a new battery is more accurate than a watt meter in long distances..When the battery only gives you half of its power its OVER! going up any hills.

Man, you're a little weasel aren't you? What kind of race is that? By your own admission, watt hour numbers can be faked.

How heavy are you? Are we going to ballast our bikes to equalize rider weights??

If you're so sure my bike can't make it to the top, then you have nothing to be afraid of, and it's an easy 5 grand for you. Why the sudden backpedaling with a ridiculous "1584 watt hour" limit? Bike Races and ebikes are both ilegal on maui unless you have a specail permit. I have already been timed and documented in such a event.If you wish to do this it is up to you and I will race!
If you are challanging me for ebike performance than a battery pack for both of us to use must be specified.Since I have already been to the top why don't you document how much faster you can do it on any amount of batteries on your own and film it for documentation in realtime? your comming here anyway show some balls. Do all YOU can do your the challenger beat what exists! if you can.. Do Bike racers add balest? why should a ebiker? there is more pedal power from fat riders anyway.... How about a wheelchair race with twin hub motors mounted directly to the tires.....LOL

Bike Races and ebikes are both ilegal on maui unless you have a specail permit. I have already been timed and documented in such a event.If you wish to do this it is up to you and I will race!
If you are challanging me for ebike performance than a battery pack for both of us to use must be specified.Since I have already been to the top why don't you document how much faster you can do it on any amount of batteries on your own and film it for documentation in realtime? your comming here anyway show some balls. Do all YOU can do your the challenger beat what exists! if you can.. Do Bike racers add balest? why should a ebiker? there is more pedal power from fat riders anyway.... How about a wheelchair race with twin hub motors mounted directly to the tires.....LOL

Bike racers don't add 'balest' but then pedal bike racers don't have motors and batteries. So let me get this straight - you expect two riders of different weights to use the same battery pack? I think anyone can see that you're trying to make up rules that favor yourself.

How about you ride your bike, I ride my bike, first one to the top takes the cash.

btw, how is it that anyone heavier than you must be 'fat'?

http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=17002#17002

"Most of you guys are so lost in your heavy Chineese hubmotors that will NEVER make it up such a mountain on its own power before frying.
If you are so sure you can make it up this volcano put $10,000 up and I will be glad to take it. Some one suggested 400 watts to go 12 MPH up this volcano on a 250 lb bike.. That person is totaly off his rocker. A 400 watt motor would burn up carrying a child up a few miles up on a 50 lb bike at 12 mph.
The purpose of entering the cycletothesun race was ONLY to get documented by the race crew. 2 minutes after I started the race I never saw another bike racer until I stopped for 20 minutes 1/8 mile from the summit and 3 Marvac Team racers passed me as I was sitting down overlooking the creator,Then I rode up the rest of the way behind them.
I have dessribed how to build such a record making system for a ebike but you rether be cheerleaders for your girlscout hub cookie team.
It is most of you who ARE THE LOOSERS! http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_lol.gif
See if I waste my time here any more. Hub motors are useless except for fixing.Come up with a equal REAL challange! All the BS I heard here is enough to puke.
Prove YOUR peices of chit.No Balls No Glory and you will be GirlScouts forever!"


Ok Randy, if you're a man of your word, then I'm taking you up on your $10,000 offer. I will use a heavy 'Chineese' hubmotor to power my bike :)

http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=17002#17002

"Most of you guys are so lost in your heavy Chineese hubmotors that will NEVER make it up such a mountain on its own power before frying.
If you are so sure you can make it up this volcano put $10,000 up and I will be glad to take it. Some one suggested 400 watts to go 12 MPH up this volcano on a 250 lb bike.. That person is totaly off his rocker. A 400 watt motor would burn up carrying a child up a few miles up on a 50 lb bike at 12 mph.
The purpose of entering the cycletothesun race was ONLY to get documented by the race crew. 2 minutes after I started the race I never saw another bike racer until I stopped for 20 minutes 1/8 mile from the summit and 3 Marvac Team racers passed me as I was sitting down overlooking the creator,Then I rode up the rest of the way behind them.
I have dessribed how to build such a record making system for a ebike but you rether be cheerleaders for your girlscout hub cookie team.
It is most of you who ARE THE LOOSERS! http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/images/smiles/icon_lol.gif
See if I waste my time here any more. Hub motors are useless except for fixing.Come up with a equal REAL challange! All the BS I heard here is enough to puke.
Prove YOUR peices of chit.No Balls No Glory and you will be GirlScouts forever!"


Ok Randy, if you're a man of your word, then I'm taking you up on your $10,000 offer. I will use a heavy 'Chineese' hubmotor to power my bike :)Do it your self if you want to prove something.You say you can then just DO IT!. I already have and have nothing that I need to prove again.If you say you can make it up you prove that you can on any hub motor ebike.No one else gives a ****..

"I may have squeezed more out of the batteries than they were rated for..."

Of course you did. Just like everything you say about YOUR contraption.

Do it your self if you want to prove something.You say you can then just DO IT!. I already have and have nothing that I need to prove again.If you say you can make it up you prove that you can on any hub motor ebike.No one else gives a ****..


So you're backing out of the public offers you made? That's what I thought.

So you're backing out of the public offers you made? That's what I thought.Set it up to have a LEGAL RACE with offical timming.Your the challanger of a set record. Break it it if YOURSELF if you can before I race you.You don't need me to prove what you can't do.First just make it to the top on your own like I did and document it.You may have a eaiser time making it a few miles up(before the hub motor burns up) if you were not racing anyone and tried to slip under the radar.I am not willing to go to jail for riding a illegal motorized vehicle on the road or in a National park.A illegal public bet that did transpire would not be in the best interest of anyone as well.
There would be no other benifit other than the cash to beat any hub motor bike in performance and efficiency.Any one with knowlege about hub motors vrs a chain drive motor knows what the result would be any way. LOL. IF you need to prove that you can fry pancakes on a hub motor have at it youeself and you can be the fool by yourself at your own expense and illegal ways..

"If you are so sure you can make it up this volcano put $10,000 up and I will be glad to take it."

Randy, please clarify this statement. If you don't want a heads up race, that's your choice.

My interpretation is that you're betting $10,000 that my bike cannot make it to the top. Is that correct?

"If you are so sure you can make it up this volcano put $10,000 up and I will be glad to take it."

Randy, please clarify this statement. If you don't want a heads up race, that's your choice.

My interpretation is that you're betting $10,000 that my bike cannot make it to the top. Is that correct? Put it this way.At any price I would never trust in the way you interpet anything. Do what YOU can do. If you think you can and let's see the video. lol

Put it this way.At any price I would never trust in the way you interpet anything. Do what YOU can do. If you think you can and let's see the video. lol

Make your statement in legal terms. You made the $10,000 offer.

Make your statement in legal terms. You made the $10,000 offer.How legal can a ilegal ebike race bet be on the internet crossing state lines ? LOL

How legal can a ilegal ebike race bet be on the internet crossing state lines ? LOL

Clarify your $10,000 challenge with exact and detailed wording.

Clarify your $10,000 challenge with exact and detailed wording. It would be YOUR challange with the volcano.Been there done that already.Move on.

It would be YOUR challange with the volcano.Been there done that already.Move on.

I called your bluff and you folded. At least you're smart enough not to play a losing hand. I'm done with this topic.

I called your bluff and you folded. At least you're smart enough not to play a losing hand. I'm done with this topic.YOU called your own bluff by not taking on the challange of climbing the volcano YOURSELF and showing everyone what you can not do legaly or otherwise.. LOL Lowells next attempt for a LEGAL volcano climb.... but he forgot the hub motor.
http://tinyurl.com/2abr8o

Randy, your going to need a Lithium battery anyway

Randy, your going to need a Lithium battery anywayI didn't need lithium batteries the first three times up the volcano and will not need lithiums to hold the record untill someone breakes it without lithiums.It will not be broken with any hub motor with or without lithium batteries.That is lowells challange NOT mine.

I didn't need lithium batteries the first three times up the volcano and will not need lithiums to hold the record untill someone breakes it without lithiums.It will not be broken with any hub motor with or without lithium batteries.That is lowells challange NOT mine.

It was YOUR challenge until it became obvious that you would lose you money. You got called on your incessant bragging and instantly bailed.
Grow up.

I didn't need lithium batteries the first three times up the volcano and will not need lithiums to hold the record untill someone breakes it without lithiums.It will not be broken with any hub motor with or without lithium batteries.That is lowells challange NOT mine.

So now you're saying that the record can only be broken if the bike does not use lithium batteries?

Three times up the volcano? Let's see: Once your batteries died before reaching the top, another time you took a wrong turn, what happened the third time?

So now you're saying that the record can only be broken if the bike does not use lithium batteries?

Three times up the volcano? Let's see: Once your batteries died before reaching the top, another time you took a wrong turn, what happened the third time? The non lithium batteries DID make it to the top in 3 hours the first try.The record was set with NON lithium batteries rated at 48 volts, 33 amp hours. If you think YOU can make it on ANY batteries with a X-lite Hub motor have at it... It's all YOU! The second time I made it to the 5500 ft elevation mark at 25 miles in 1 1/2 hours including a ten mile sceanic detour ride back down hill while some of the bike racers caught up.The other times I went up the volcano were just for riding pleasure with lithiums.

So now you're saying that the record can only be broken if the bike does not use lithium batteries? No. YOU said that.

Three times up the volcano? Let's see: Once your batteries died before reaching the top, another time you took a wrong turn, what happened the third time? The non lithium batteries DID make it to the top in 3 hours the first try.The record was set with NON lithium batteries rated at 48 volts, 33 amp hours. If you think YOU can make it on ANY batteries with a X-lite Hub motor have at it... It's all YOU! The second time I made it to the 5500 ft elevation mark at 25 miles in 1 1/2 hours including a ten mile sceanic detour ride back down hill while some of the bike racers caught up.The other times I went up the volcano were just for riding pleasure with lithiums.
What's YOUR next excuse?

Randy, why are you cutting across the road like this? Is it too steep for your bike?

http://img471.imageshack.us/img471/5771/randyimg6067stdin2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

No wonder you don't pedal... how wide are those battery packs??

http://img471.imageshack.us/img471/7223/randyimg6068stdvj2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/616/randyimg6069stdsi7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Regardless how I did it No one else has on a electric vehicle.

Now that's performance!!! LOL...

If you guys are still going to race, just make the bike weights are the same and rider weights are the same. No pedalling. See who gets up the hill faster.