Now For the Bottecchia CF Frame 'group buy'

[briscoelab]

Is the fork all Carbon, or does it have an alloy steerer as mentioned earlier. (Not that it really matters for $50)

[Meek]

Is there a rider weight limit for this frame as I am getting larger at the moment and will probably be around 230 soon?

[cranky old road]

Is the fork all Carbon, or does it have an alloy steerer as mentioned earlier. (Not that it really matters for $50)

The fork is $70 with an aluminum steerer, is it not?

If I get a frame, and I think I will, I'll make a headbadge and downtube decals that say GENERIC. Probably in white, possibly red. I already have a font and headbadge design in mind.:D

[Gibbygoo]

Is there a rider weight limit for this frame as I am getting larger at the moment and will probably be around 230 soon?
I'm riding the crap out of my RS (same frame?) at 240. You'll be fine.

[Meek]

I'm riding the crap out of my RS (same frame?) at 240. You'll be fine.

How's bottom bracket stiffness?

[Indolent58]

I'm riding the crap out of my RS (same frame?) at 240. You'll be fine.

I don't think it's ever been established that the Bottecchia frame is the same as the RS.

[Indolent58]

You still don't list the head tube length. Will you have that info before the frames arrive?

MY WEB GUY JUST ADDED MORE DETAILED LINKS FOR PURCHASING
ONE FOR FRAME ONLY - ONE FOR FRAME W/ FORK

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/forum_frame.htm


http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/forum_framefork.htm


Bottecchia and Motobecane frame are both excellent
Motobecane costs us 20% more as it is one of the most expensive CF frames made in Asia

This bikeforums private link and sales opportunity on the Bottecchia CF frame will end once they arrive and start to ship -- Sometime between Sept 15th and Oct 1st {i can not know for sure when they will land]

thanks

mike

[cranky old road]

About these dimensions... are the top tube and "size" (seat tube length c-c?) real or virtual lengths. Thanks.

[bikesdirect_com]

You still don't list the head tube length. Will you have that info before the frames arrive?

It appears the headtube sizes are

125mm; 145mm; 160mm; 180mm; & 200mm

on the 5 frame sizes in order

these frames are selling very well
thanks

mike

[rruff]

I don't think it's ever been established that the Bottecchia frame is the same as the RS.

No... but the description, photo, weight, and dimensions appear to be identical.

[Indolent58]

No... but the description, photo, weight, and dimensions appear to be identical.

The specs for the Bottechia call for a 31.8mm FD clamp. The RS is speced at 34.9mm. Other dimensions appear to be the same.

Unless one of the FD clamp specs is incorrect it would seem that the frames are very similar but not quite identical.

[russian]

I would like to buy a Motobecane Fantom Cross CycloCross Bike from BD. The first of all I'm not sure that it's secure to buy from this site, as it looks like their sale and support email doesn't match domain name and it looks very suspecious. Instead of being sale@bikesdirect.com they provide aol addresses like bd4salesteam@aol.com for example. It doesn't make any sense for me, why they want to separate email addresses from the domain name? Then during my credit card processing the browser generates an error which I belive is inacceptable for an ecommers site. In addition the credit cards images they posted on the payment form are clickable, but do not refresh a form, many links are broken. When I tried to communicate by email, they say ok, just send a fax with your credit card info to Joe to Florida, but the company is located in Texas. Who is Joe and what his doing there, I have no clue. Anybody could advice?

[kk4df]

What type of headset does this frame take? Integrated, internal, or conventional headset?

[rruff]

The specs for the Bottechia call for a 31.8mm FD clamp. The RS is speced at 34.9mm. Other dimensions appear to be the same.

My guess is that one of those is wrong. It's a moncoque frame so it doesn't make sense to have one thing like that different. The dimensions and look of the frame are identical.

[bikesdirect_com]

I would like to buy a Motobecane Fantom Cross CycloCross Bike from BD. The first of all I'm not sure that it's secure to buy from this site, as it looks like their sale and support email doesn't match domain name and it looks very suspecious. Instead of being sale@bikesdirect.com they provide aol addresses like bd4salesteam@aol.com for example. It doesn't make any sense for me, why they want to separate email addresses from the domain name? Then during my credit card processing the browser generates an error which I belive is inacceptable for an ecommers site. In addition the credit cards images they posted on the payment form are clickable, but do not refresh a form, many links are broken. When I tried to communicate by email, they say ok, just send a fax with your credit card info to Joe to Florida, but the company is located in Texas. Who is Joe and what his doing there, I have no clue. Anybody could advice?

Sure
I can explain that

we had email problems for years thru our server; vario, who is one of the top ones
we got e-mails; but some of our return emails would not deliver [mainly to comcast and earthlink customers]
this made some people think we were not answering
now we use aol and yahoo addresses on email
and our email gets delivered almost 100% of the time

credit card processing is another issue; some of the customers who use our CC processor get rejected when they have a good card -- most of those email us; we send them a phone number and they call in their order to a processor {lindsay in the office does 5 or 10 of these a day]

we are working on installing a second CC processor so that customers are nore likely to get their order thru without calling us; that may take a bit of time

as for being worried; I think even bike shops that hate us admit we take orders and ship what we advertise. I havbe been doing this for 30 years; noone has ever thought we took peoples money without delivery of item. Plus we take returns; so no risk deal.

mike

[bikesdirect_com]

What type of headset does this frame take? Integrated, internal, or conventional headset?

intergrated

[bpohl]

Do you have any approximate time frame for how long this will be going on? It may be another month before I have the disposable cash.

[89quattro]

Just wondering if anyone has placed an order and received their frameset?

I placed order and received e-mail with tracking number 2 days ago, but it's showing as not received by UPS.

[Ostuni]

Just wondering if anyone has placed an order and received their frameset?

I placed order and received e-mail with tracking number 2 days ago, but it's showing as not received by UPS.
am not expecting it to ship until mid-september or early october which i think is indicated in the first post or thereabouts?

the email we got from ups probably is just an automatic notification that goes out when the shipment is ordered, and i think we'll get another notice when it is actually picked up and en route...

[bikesdirect_com]

Just wondering if anyone has placed an order and received their frameset?

I placed order and received e-mail with tracking number 2 days ago, but it's showing as not received by UPS.

When consumers preorder
the office prints label and bemails tracking

Then as soon as the item lands
we ship the item

these frames are no in yet
but are on the way

mike

[89quattro]

When consumers preorder
the office prints label and bemails tracking

Then as soon as the item lands
we ship the item

these frames are no in yet
but are on the way

mike

Mike - thanks for the clarification. I was thinking we got lucky, and delivery on your side was sooner than expected.

[jciv03]

Mike,

Can you confirm the front derailer clamp size? 31.8?

Also, what is the FD clamp size of the Motobecane Le Champion SL? (if I were to transfer it over)

[bikesdirect_com]

Mike,

Can you confirm the front derailer clamp size? 31.8?

Also, what is the FD clamp size of the Motobecane Le Champion SL? (if I were to transfer it over)

Sorry
I check and web guy put up wrong frt der spec
it is 34.9mm

I think you will find that is the same as pedal force says on the RS frame

mike

[rruff]

I think you will find that is the same as pedal force says on the RS frame


Looks like it *is* the PF RS then... and we have plenty of info on that one. Thanks for doing this deal, Mike... looking forward to getting the frame.

[Ostuni]

Looks like it *is* the PF RS then... and we have plenty of info on that one.....
and the pf price for same frame = $700 (plus ship)?

wow.

[curveship]

Looks like it *is* the PF RS then... and we have plenty of info on that one. Thanks for doing this deal, Mike... looking forward to getting the frame.

It's still a maybe. ADK, the maker of the RS frame, makes (at least) two frames out of the same mold. The RS is the top line (AKFM03SL) which has 3k (finer) weave, no painted joints and uses a higher modulus structural CF. The lower model (AKFM03) has painted joints, 12k weave and a lower modulus CF, making it about 200 grams heavier and not as stiff. Based on the painted joints in the Bottechia picture Mike posted, it looks like it's the lower model.

EDIT: I've had a lot of people interested in my RS frame, and I'll definitely be sending some customers BD's way ... if I can just get confirmation that it *is* an equivalent frame. It seems like Mike's been asked this question several times now without answering. The silence is steering me away :(.

[RoadToad]

subscribing!

[Indolent58]

It's still a maybe. ADK, the maker of the RS frame, makes (at least) two frames out of the same mold. The RS is the top line (AKFM03SL) which has 3k (finer) weave, no painted joints and uses a higher modulus structural CF. The lower model (AKFM03) has painted joints, 12k weave and a lower modulus CF, making it about 200 grams heavier and not as stiff. Based on the painted joints in the Bottechia picture Mike posted, it looks like it's the lower model.

EDIT: I've had a lot of people interested in my RS frame, and I'll definitely be sending some customers BD's way ... if I can just get confirmation that it *is* an equivalent frame. It seems like Mike's been asked this question several times now without answering. The silence is steering me away :(.


Mike said in an earlier post in this thread that he thought the sample he had was 12K, and the pictures clearly show painted joints. One might reasonably conclude that it's the lower spec model. BTW, how do you know that it's less stiff?

[Ostuni]

...The lower model (AKFM03) has painted joints, 12k weave and a lower modulus CF, making it about 200 grams heavier and not as stiff. Based on the painted joints in the Bottechia picture Mike posted, it looks like it's the lower model....
the RF is 1.05 kg (53cm) according to pf..

when the 'bottechia' gets here (i ordered the 53) i'll weigh and report just for fun...

[cranky old road]

Any idea what brands use the AKFM03?
Just curious, cause I'm sure I'll enjoy the frame I ordered once I transfer the Record components from my other "Bottecchia." If I don't, I'll sell it and buy a steel frame like God intended us to ride... or keep the Record on the Zonal "Bottecchia" which is actually a fine ride instead of putting the compact Xenon gruppo I bought from PBK on it... or transfer the Record to my Bianchi CD'I ... or bend the stays out on my Ron Cooper and put the Nuovo Record stuff in storage... What the hell's the matter with me anyway?:rolleyes:

[curveship]

BTW, how do you know that it's less stiff?

It's from my memory of the earlier groupbuy megathread. Before it was decided to go with PF, some people were researching buying straight from ADK. IIRC, it was ADK that supplied the weight figures and stiffness claim.

Ostuni: thanks, I look forward to hearing what yours weighs.

[rruff]

It's still a maybe. ADK, the maker of the RS frame, makes (at least) two frames out of the same mold. The RS is the top line (AKFM03SL) which has 3k (finer) weave, no painted joints and uses a higher modulus structural CF. The lower model (AKFM03) has painted joints, 12k weave and a lower modulus CF, making it about 200 grams heavier and not as stiff. Based on the painted joints in the Bottechia picture Mike posted, it looks like it's the lower model.

Just curious... where do you find this information?

[rruff]

Just searched through the threads to find out about the different frames, and saw the reference to the QS2's 12K weave indictating the less stiff frame that weighs ~.45 lb more. If that is true then it's no good for me. But then Mike said the frame should weigh 2.5 lb, be at least as good as the Pedal Force frame, and be made of high-modulus carbon... so who knows.

[curveship]

Just curious... where do you find this information?

A bunch came from others who corresponded directly with ADK. Also some from biketaiwan.com and bicyclesb2b.com. This frame is also sold by element6bikes.com, and the owner of that was pretty free with information. Pedalforce was pretty quiet, wouldn't even confirm that the frame was from ADK.

[Ostuni]

... and saw the reference to the QS2's 12K weave indictating the less stiff frame that weighs ~.45 lb more. If that is true then it's no good for me....
i have a qs2 - a most awesome frame imho...

[rruff]

i have a qs2 - a most awesome frame imho...

The Pedal Force frames are 3k external weave and are the higher quality frames that weigh ~.45lbs less. The Bottecchias are the cheaper ones... or so it seems.

[steelblue]

Mike,

What is the warranty on the frame? I couldn't find any info on it.

Thanks,
Gary

[Demit]

I have an elementsix frame and will soon have one of these. Once I get this one, I'll subject them to any test you guys want me to do to see if theres any difference.

[rruff]

Weighing it would be a good start...

[roy harley]

A bunch came from others who corresponded directly with ADK. Also some from biketaiwan.com and bicyclesb2b.com. This frame is also sold by element6bikes.com, and the owner of that was pretty free with information. Pedalforce was pretty quiet, wouldn't even confirm that the frame was from ADK.

It seems like the Pedal Force frame deals are a once a year thing, do you have any other sources for these kind of frame sales? I would like to get something like the RS frame and it sounds like this deal from BD is the lower grade version (Bottecchia) of the RS. thanks for the info!

[Demit]

interesting, bikesdirect.com says the frame weights 2.8lbs

http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/motobecane/centuryelite_08_carbon.htm

[bikesdirect_com]

Hi

I received a PM asking for an update

frames shipped august 30th
and should unload real soon
maybe this week
maybe early next
we will ship out the pre sold ones that day
and then kill the 'pre sale' links
the remainding frames will be sold on bikeisland

on weight
I got a sample of the frame and it weighed 2.4 lbs on our scale [which is a very good scale]
my assumption is 2.5 or 2.6 in closer to correct across the board
but on the Motobecane that uses it the web guy listed 2.8 to be safe
truth is -- CF production frame weights can vary a lot more % vise than metal -- means you can see a given frame weigh up or down by even 200 grams in same size

I will be very interested to see how these frames sell in the general market
our other frames sell very well; but not as quick as bikes

mike

[curveship]

but on the Motobecane that uses it the web guy listed 2.8 to be safe


Your "web guy" is responsible for the published specs of your products? :eek: Wow.

I've been close to buying a bike from you in the past and have recommended you to others, but this is leaving a bad taste in my mouth. So you first start talking about this frame buy in the closing weeks of a competitor's group buy, with the possible intent to kill it. Then you put up a picture of a frame that looks like one of theirs ... and you're quick to answer any question that makes the two look identical (like the seatpost clamp size) but when it comes to one that makes them look different, you delay and hem and haw ("maybe 2.4 lbs maybe 2.8 ... carbon weights vary [not that much!] ... and that crazy web guy!").

I think you're intentionally promoting the misconception that you're selling the pedalforce frame for less money. No thanks. No sale.

[bikesdirect_com]

Your "web guy" is responsible for the published specs of your products? :eek: Wow.

I think you're intentionally promoting the misconception that you're selling the pedalforce frame for less money. .


My 'web guy' has several years experience in bike shops and many years of bicycle racing under his belt - he just happens to also do my web work

I am selling this frame to see the reaction up & down of CF frames sold at close to cost
and therefore I have not gone out of my way to 'push' the frame
it should speak for itself

Then after the BF members who have ordered it get them; they can comment on how they feel the value is. AND I HOPE THEY EACH COMMENT ON HOW IT COMPARES TO ANY OTHER CF FRAME THEY HAVE SEEN. I think that is a good way to handle it.

Those that are leery of super low pricing should not order this frame and should go for something where they have more confidence.

It takes a long time to break down barriers; such as the HighPrice equals HighQuality assumption, But I have time and it's fun all the way

Mike

[dtrain]

Your "web guy" is responsible for the published specs of your products? :eek: Wow.

I've been close to buying a bike from you in the past and have recommended you to others, but this is leaving a bad taste in my mouth. So you first start talking about this frame buy in the closing weeks of a competitor's group buy, with the possible intent to kill it. Then you put up a picture of a frame that looks like one of theirs ... and you're quick to answer any question that makes the two look identical (like the seatpost clamp size) but when it comes to one that makes them look different, you delay and hem and haw ("maybe 2.4 lbs maybe 2.8 ... carbon weights vary [not that much!] ... and that crazy web guy!").

I think you're intentionally promoting the misconception that you're selling the pedalforce frame for less money. No thanks. No sale.


+1.

[kk4df]

Then after the BF members who have ordered it get them; they can comment on how they feel the value is. AND I HOPE THEY EACH COMMENT ON HOW IT COMPARES TO ANY OTHER CF FRAME THEY HAVE SEEN. I think that is a good way to handle it.

Those that are leery of super low pricing should not order this frame and should go for something where they have more confidence.

It takes a long time to break down barriers; such as the HighPrice equals HighQuality assumption, But I have time and it's fun all the way

Mike


Thanks. I can hardly wait to get mine and give you some feedback.

[cranky old road]

I'm looking forward to mine, too. I hope I bought the right size. I hit the 3000 mile mark today on my Bottecchia with Record components and Zonal frame, with no complaints (although I threw away the saddle and the bearings on the rear wheel could have a little less friction. I'm not complaining at $1500). BTW, when did Mike claim that the frame was made by ADK, that it was the same as the PF group buy frame or that anyone who is uncomfortable with the deal should buy one? 'Mike don't say nothin' he just keeps rubbin his knees...'

[cranky old road]

Anyone know what size seatpost clamp this puppy is going to take? Also where do I get downtube barrel adjusters, or do they come with the frame?

[bikesdirect_com]

Hi

The Carbon Fiber Bottecchia frames ship today
And since they are now in stock - the sale is over

My warehouse guy said on his scale that
50c was 2.45 lbs
53c was 2.6 lbs
55cm was 2.7 lbs
58c was 2.75 lbs

seems about right to me
within the range ADK quotes

to those that ordered
thanks for playing

please feel free to post your thoughts after you get your frame

mike

[vic32amg]

so can I still buy the frame just not at the sale price? what is the new price? and can you post pics of it?