Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) - Make the Diabetes Thread a Stickie? Vote.....

Air, maybe we should make a new thread with a new poll? I know I haven't been following this thread because I don't have diabetes, so didn't have an opinion. Perhaps there are others that would be interested now since we're talking about a whole new idea.

Right -that's what I imagined. Not nutrition but weight loss and 'health' which could include Diabetes, blood pressure, arthritis, or whatever ails thee.

I think it would be great to have a weight loss and health related sub forum. It would certainly fit the need that seem to be there. It is true that weight (not weight loss) and being a clyde are very closely tied together, but that is more in the weight related issues as they pertain to bikes.

My vote is for a sub forum.

Ask and you shall receive...new poll and thread here (http://bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=338988)

I've been on the sidelines for a bit, but I'll chime in. I definitely have some very (sometimes heated) opinons about the methods of weight loss that exist today. I have been in some very very heated debates about them with numerous people. In fact, I've lost friendships (albeit briefly) due to those heated debates. Have they gotten me anywhere?

Nope.

The only thing that happened was that the opposition to my lifestyle change quieted quickly, and the ones I opposed either failed, put more on, or in one case proved me wrong. I'd say the overall score was definitely negative, as there were ruffled feathers all around. Some very close relationships were damaged almost irrevocably for reasons that now seem not even worth it. There are still hurt feelings on all ends, something I wish would go away.

In fact, right now I'm facing a similar situation. A group of friends want to do something "for me" that I'm not at all interested in doing. I must be vague, but it would basically taint what I'm working so hard on right now, and it would definitely derail the "intense" month of health and weight loss I'm trying to have before my upcoming wedding. They are well meaning, great people, but I'm no longer interested in what they want to do. And trying to get that across without hurt feelings is seemingly impossible.

Simply put, unless someone is in our shoes, they don't understand why a friday night of cycling sounds more appealing than drinking half the beer in the city. They don't understand how good a healthy dinner can be when compared to a fat-laden grease fest. And you can obviously see the counterpoint, I no longer understand the appeal of those activities.

As such, there are weight loss methods I vehemently disagree with to the point where I constantly have to resist "weighing" in (no pun intended, of course). There are ones I greatly agree with. But over time I've seen people fail miserably at the methods I push. I've seen people excel at the methods I find downright ridiculous. And I've seen everything in between. So at this point, if someone wants to try to lose weight, I say go for it. If I don't agree with the method, I'll try to support the intent. The same goes with opposition, I'll sit quietly on the sidelines, as vehement opposition seems only to fuel the fires.

That's my opinon, at least. And I think with any forum full of larger people exercising, weight loss discussion is inevitable, but in my opinion should not outweigh the cycling discussion.

I've been on the sidelines for a bit, but I'll chime in. I definitely have some very (sometimes heated) opinons about the methods of weight loss that exist today. I have been in some very very heated debates about them with numerous people. In fact, I've lost friendships (albeit briefly) due to those heated debates. Have they gotten me anywhere?

Nope.

The only thing that happened was that the opposition to my lifestyle change quieted quickly, and the ones I opposed either failed, put more on, or in one case proved me wrong. I'd say the overall score was definitely negative, as there were ruffled feathers all around. Some very close relationships were damaged almost irrevocably for reasons that now seem not even worth it. There are still hurt feelings on all ends, something I wish would go away.

In fact, right now I'm facing a similar situation. A group of friends want to do something "for me" that I'm not at all interested in doing. I must be vague, but it would basically taint what I'm working so hard on right now, and it would definitely derail the "intense" month of health and weight loss I'm trying to have before my upcoming wedding. They are well meaning, great people, but I'm no longer interested in what they want to do. And trying to get that across without hurt feelings is seemingly impossible.

Simply put, unless someone is in our shoes, they don't understand why a friday night of cycling sounds more appealing than drinking half the beer in the city. They don't understand how good a healthy dinner can be when compared to a fat-laden grease fest. And you can obviously see the counterpoint, I no longer understand the appeal of those activities.

As such, there are weight loss methods I vehemently disagree with to the point where I constantly have to resist "weighing" in (no pun intended, of course). There are ones I greatly agree with. But over time I've seen people fail miserably at the methods I push. I've seen people excel at the methods I find downright ridiculous. And I've seen everything in between. So at this point, if someone wants to try to lose weight, I say go for it. If I don't agree with the method, I'll try to support the intent. The same goes with opposition, I'll sit quietly on the sidelines, as vehement opposition seems only to fuel the fires.

That's my opinon, at least. And I think with any forum full of larger people exercising, weight loss discussion is inevitable, but in my opinion should not outweigh the cycling discussion.


Excellent post.

Simply put, unless someone is in our shoes, they don't understand why a friday night of cycling sounds more appealing than drinking half the beer in the city. They don't understand how good a healthy dinner can be when compared to a fat-laden grease fest. And you can obviously see the counterpoint, I no longer understand the appeal of those activities.


you know that really rings true, and it sometimes has nothing to do with weight loss, but more with what I really enjoy. I love to get up early on a saturday and do a 3 to 4 hour ride (by early I mean 6:00 to 7:00, to my teenage kids early on saturday is 1:00 or 2:00 in the afternoon :), but that's a whole other discussion ) the feeling of getting out and on my bike is something that only another biker will understand and that is why I ride, I think it was said early that weight loss and health are by products of cycling, I really cycle because I love it.

I know I don't post here much, but I do have an opinion. I think there should be a diabetes sticky of some sort - but in Training & Nutrition. There are some really important issues to consider with both types of diabetes and cycling, and people would benefit from hearing from experienced diabetic cyclists. I could even imagine getting a couple of our BF members who are physicians and/or nurses to scan it occasionally to make sure we're not putting something outlandish out there. We could also have a disclaimer at the beginning of the thread.

I dunno. I think there is a presumption in this forum that everybody's in it for the weight loss, and I think that not only dominates the threads (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, they'll be driven by the interest of the people here), but colors people's responses to questions on everything from training methods to nutrition while riding to equipment choice. I would like to see this be a bicycling forum. A thread on the ever-recurring subject of "I'm really overweight and I want to bike to get healthy, help me!" isn't off topic, but honestly, I don't think that a thread about a weight loss method really belongs here. It's about biking, not pills from GNC or the latest "research" results as reported in the popular media.

Also...to the point that some have made about this being a warm and wonderful and for-everything and for-everyone community...god, I always feel like I'm kicking a puppy when I say this, but I find that online "communities" that focus on warm-and-fuzzy inclusiveness usually end up being really messed up, for a couple of reasons. First, the quest for warm-and-fuzzy inclusiveness promotes an "anything goes as long as it's sugar-coated" standard, and the forum gets clogged with a horrible mess of irrelevant fluff drenched in sugar syrup, with post after post filled with nothing much but "lol" followed by every smiley-flavored emoticon in the toolkit (and hey, people, emoticons are like the clutch on your car: just because it's there doesn't mean you have to lean on it every minute of every day). Second, warm-and-fuzzy communities can become pretty damn nasty when it comes to lowering the boom on anyone who dissents from the warm-and-fuzzy party line. Okay, standing back now to hear all about how I kicked somebody's puppy...

I'm just not seeing us as "warm and fuzzy", unless compared to a really tough forum. We tend to be supportive of each other, but I think if someone said they hadn't been able to bike because there was too much on TV, we'd have something to say.

But really if you read the description of the board on the front page, weight loss is one of the reasons the forum is here. We talk about equipment a lot...not much to be warm and fuzzy about there. We talk a lot about achievements and trips, which one would expect nice responses to on any forum.

What I don't want to see are people not feeling free to post here and join the community because they may be coming from a different starting point than others, or have a different philosophy. I think this forum can be very* helpful to people with Clyde status, and I think it's important it's there for people. If we were as tough as the fixie forum, I think we might not be serving our purpose here. But then again, I'm only one opinion. The majority will set the tone in the end.

And "differing philosphy" doesn't really have to do with weight loss... I'm sure there are several things we all feel passionately different about. But in the end, we all like bikes! (no smiley here, because lbb is right about those things, and I'm a main offender!)

Edit: Also, I think it's important to remember that people have differing tolerances for conflict. Some like debates to be direct and animated, others like them quieter and more carefully phrased. I think every forum finds the place where most of the users are at, and that's why each forum is so different.

You.......puppy kicker you ;) (KIDDING! :eek:)

There'll always be some of that because people are looking for ways to achieve their goals. I'm pretty sure you've noticed though that the focus is always back to using the bikes and other physical activities, and some of us may look at alternative methods as a risk assessment. I dunno. I think there is a presumption in this forum that everybody's in it for the weight loss, and I think that not only dominates the threads (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, they'll be driven by the interest of the people here), but colors people's responses to questions on everything from training methods to nutrition while riding to equipment choice. I would like to see this be a bicycling forum. A thread on the ever-recurring subject of "I'm really overweight and I want to bike to get healthy, help me!" isn't off topic, but honestly, I don't think that a thread about a weight loss method really belongs here. It's about biking, not pills from GNC or the latest "research" results as reported in the popular media.

Also...to the point that some have made about this being a warm and wonderful and for-everything and for-everyone community...god, I always feel like I'm kicking a puppy when I say this, but I find that online "communities" that focus on warm-and-fuzzy inclusiveness usually end up being really messed up, for a couple of reasons. First, the quest for warm-and-fuzzy inclusiveness promotes an "anything goes as long as it's sugar-coated" standard, and the forum gets clogged with a horrible mess of irrelevant fluff drenched in sugar syrup, with post after post filled with nothing much but "lol" followed by every smiley-flavored emoticon in the toolkit (and hey, people, emoticons are like the clutch on your car: just because it's there doesn't mean you have to lean on it every minute of every day). Second, warm-and-fuzzy communities can become pretty damn nasty when it comes to lowering the boom on anyone who dissents from the warm-and-fuzzy party line. Okay, standing back now to hear all about how I kicked somebody's puppy...

I actually liked what you said about warm-fuzzies, lil brown bat. I know I'd get a good kick in the virtual you-know-what if I posted something about not riding because I "didn't have time," or some such nonsense. That's part of what makes it so great :) I'm really glad things here are generally supportive, but not "sugar-coated."

Nothing against Diabetic riders, and it might prove to be a valuable thread for those with it obviously. But as one of the few males in my family without Diabetes, I would rather not have to filter through stickies. I don't know if diabetes "belongs" in the Clydes forum as my family members with it have been in decent shape their whole lives with type 2 diabetes.

There you go, now I am discussing it.

I was the one who asked whether we should make this a sticky or not. My purpose wasn't to cause an uproar in the clydes forum. I understand this is a CYCLING forum, but I also THOUGHT we were here to support each other whether in cycling or other, after reading some of the posts, I am not so sure. It appears that some are rather passionate about keeping this strictly a cycling forum, however, our weight and riding go hand in hand, as do our health issues. My point is if you are NOT interested in the post DON'T read it, that is what I do.

I was the one who asked whether we should make this a sticky or not. My purpose wasn't to cause an uproar in the clydes forum. I understand this is a CYCLING forum, but I also THOUGHT we were here to support each other whether in cycling or other, after reading some of the posts, I am not so sure. It appears that some are rather passionate about keeping this strictly a cycling forum, however, our weight and riding go hand in hand, as do our health issues. My point is if you are NOT interested in the post DON'T read it, that is what I do.

How do you know if you are interested or not if you don't read it?:D

My point is if you are NOT interested in the post DON'T read it, that is what I do.

Statements like this are often used in defense of an "anything goes" approach to internet forums, and IMO the argument fails every time. Suppose I were to post my thoughts about the rise of militarism in 15th century Japan? Is it legit for me to do so and then command anyone who objects to "DON'T read it"? Any forum that doesn't devolve into crap has some parameters, and this thread has (not unreasonably) moved into the arena of discussing just what those parameters should be for this forum. These are not questions to be afraid of -- let's not start shouting them down, okay?

The statement is not an anything goes as you so describe, my point being is that you can either read the post or not read it. I don't recall "commanding" anyone to read or not read it as you put it. The choice is yours, no one is twisting your arm to read it.

I am sure we all have our opinions of what should and should not be on this forums. I asked Tom if he would put a vote out to see if others are interested in a diabetes sticky, assuming there was a little democracy left. The vote was "no" and I have no problem with that.

What happened? I thought we got rid of most sticky's and now I see 6 up there again.

Had a couple temporarily stuck to hold them til established. Fixed now. ;)

Had a couple temporarily stuck to hold them til established. Fixed now. ;)

OK...I didn't mind if they were just temporarily there....I just thought that maybe the whole idea was forgotten already.

Yes, make it sticky.

Yes, make it sticky.

I think if you look at the poll at the top, the motion was already made, seconded and defeated.

Yep, it was and I guess it's time to close this thread.