Yesterday i was having a conversation with someone who had just moved to town and was considering his transit options (does not own a car). When i mentioned a bicycle he told me he doesn't want to become one of those "bicycle people". When i asked what he meant by that he told me that he did not want to become one of those people whose life revolves around the bike, can only talk about bikes, only hang out with bikers, etc.

My response was that when you choose to ride a bike and not have a car it becomes a lifestyle simply because of the culture in this country. If this country was not so car oriented then maybe choosing the bicycle would be such a lifestyle choice, it would just simply be a way to get to where you are going. I love bikes and i love to talk about bike (that's why we are here right?), so maybe i am one of those "bicycle people" who can only speak and think about bikes! :eek:

Another thread raised a good question:

Does your attitude towards transport affect your attitudes towards other things in life?
Does it affect your choice of friends or people you hang out with?

I am a bike person... and a car person.......LOL

If this country was not so car oriented then maybe choosing the bicycle would be such a lifestyle choice, it would just simply be a way to get to where you are going.

+1

People make WAY to big a deal about being car free. Not just people who are not car free but even some on this forum make it out to be a much bigger deal than it really is. Quite simply it's just my method of transportation, nothing more nothing less.

When i asked what he meant by that he told me that he did not want to become one of those people whose life revolves around the bike, can only talk about bikes, only hang out with bikers, etc.

I was at a Chamber of Commerce mixer last night, representing the Bicycle Advocacy of Central Arkansas. I had a chance to talk with a little old lady who had just moved from Denmark a few days before. She was very pro-bicycle and talked about Copenhagen and it's bicycle facilities. She hoped that bicycling could become more popular in Little Rock, i.e. to become a normal method of transportation.

The company she was with had just expanded to the U.S. to make windmill blades. Sounds cool to me.

I think one of the "problems" if you will, is that the bicycle in the US has been looked upon as a toy or a piece of sports equipment for so long that when it is approached as a transportation alternative/lifestyle it has a tendency to become the center piece of the lives of those involved. I think also many people use bicycles not only as a form of transportation but also as a hobby. I know that is my case. I have been involved with some form of cycling for over 40 years. Whether cruising the neighborhood, racing, wrenching, or touring the across the USA. I also accumulate bicycles and enjoy riding them for the pure enjoyment of self powered transportation. I have a friends scattered around the world. Some enjoy their bikes as much as I do, for others it is just another form of transportation that makes more sense than car in their situation.

Aaron:)

+1

People make WAY to big a deal about being car free. Not just people who are not car free but even some on this forum make it out to be a much bigger deal than it really is. Quite simply it's just my method of transportation, nothing more nothing less.

I agree as well. Sure, there are some challenges to living car-free, but there are also many hassles to owning a car. Actually, in my case at least, being car-free seems easier than owing a car.

Originally Posted by DavidLee View Post
+1

People make WAY to big a deal about being car free. Not just people who are not car free but even some on this forum make it out to be a much bigger deal than it really is. Quite simply it's just my method of transportation, nothing more nothing less.


+ 1 !!!!!

Only one thing worse than becoming one of those bicycle people. That's becoming one of those bikeforums people.

Erm... I mean...

+1

People make WAY to big a deal about being car free. Not just people who are not car free but even some on this forum make it out to be a much bigger deal than it really is. Quite simply it's just my method of transportation, nothing more nothing less.

Beautifully put. I've often said that the people who call themselves cycling "advocates" frequently do more harm than good to their cause by trying to politicise the simple act of riding a bike.

Does your attitude towards transport affect your attitudes towards other things in life?
Does it affect your choice of friends or people you hang out with?
Respectively - yes and sometimes.

Does your attitude towards transport affect your attitudes towards other things in life?
Yeah. I like getting myself there quickly, so I don't like it when I see lots of new housing developments go up. More houses mean more people, which means more traffic that I have to deal with.
Does it affect your choice of friends or people you hang out with?
I don't choose friends based on how they choose to get around. I'd honestly be surprised if someone decided not to hang out with me because of my transportation choices. I'd hope that being a decent person would matter more than my wheels.

This can be paralleled to talking about civil rights, female equality, etc.. As a white guy, I don't find myself needing to talk about this stuff (though I do!) because realistically I'm in the majority and these issues don't effect me as much as the people without their rights. Riding my bike in lieu of driving only becomes a "bike thing" because it isn't driving not because it is biking.

If you do something against the grain, per se, it becomes a thing. Nature of the beast I suppose.

My lifestyle choice does not affect my friends. If it did I would have few since biking is an Alien Concept where I live. I don't make a big deal of it in the office but everyone else does, the fact that I live car free os the converstiaon starter of choice when people talk to me.

My lifestyle choice does not affect my friends. If it did I would have few since biking is an Alien Concept where I live. I don't make a big deal of it in the office but everyone else does, the fact that I live car free os the converstiaon starter of choice when people talk to me.
We haven't done a good job of explaining our motivations in terms that Joe & Sally Sixpack can relate to.

There's something about being carfree that intrigues most people. It often expresses itself as humor or disdain, but underneath all that there is a fascination of some kind.

+1

People make WAY to big a deal about being car free. Not just people who are not car free but even some on this forum make it out to be a much bigger deal than it really is. Quite simply it's just my method of transportation, nothing more nothing less.
That was certainly true of me until I got married, and I never thought about it in terms like car-free. Now that I have 8- and 10- year old kids, I could be car-free, but it be challenging and would involve compromises. I have no problem with compromises; but these would not be compromises I make on my own behalf; they'd be compromises I'd make on behalf of my whole family. And that's where the "bicycle people" thing comes into play. Kids seem to want to grow up in a 'normal' family with a 'normal' lifestyle... taking them car-free would involve what I consider compromises, and what society as a whole would regard as unnecessary hardships. It becomes very difficult to say "I don't care what people say" when kids are involved. The bottom line is, I'm not car-free, and I have so far been quite unsuccessful in becoming car-lite, and until my kids are off to college, I can't imagine how I could ever be car-free.

That was certainly true of me until I got married, and I never thought about it in terms like car-free. Now that I have 8- and 10- year old kids, I could be car-free, but it be challenging and would involve compromises. I have no problem with compromises; but these would not be compromises I make on my own behalf; they'd be compromises I'd make on behalf of my whole family. And that's where the "bicycle people" thing comes into play. Kids seem to want to grow up in a 'normal' family with a 'normal' lifestyle... taking them car-free would involve what I consider compromises, and what society as a whole would regard as unnecessary hardships. It becomes very difficult to say "I don't care what people say" when kids are involved. The bottom line is, I'm not car-free, and I have so far been quite unsuccessful in becoming car-lite, and until my kids are off to college, I can't imagine how I could ever be car-free.

Owning motor vehicles for what ever purpose is perfectly fine with me. You need one to properly take care of your family, nothing wrong with that at all. Even if you decided to have a car just for the sake of having one that's all good as well. Each individual or family has their own set of needs & goals. Owning an automobile to meet those needs & goals shouldn't make anyone feel "guilty". I'm more in favor of "car-lite" rather than "car-free". Use a bike/walk when you can if you want, otherwise use your car & enjoy your family & life. :)

As for me I've been car-free since March '06 but will buy a car this November & still be car-lite as much as possible. Not for some esoteric reasons or needs but simply because I enjoy the hell out of cycling. I learned the hard way last Winter that being car-free with Maryland's unpredictable Winter weather is not safe for me or motorist for that matter. Having a 2 ton snow plow coming at you with nowhere to go but grab your bike & run off the road isn't a pleasant feeling. :p There are other reasons, yes reasons I once again need a vehicle but as stated I will remain as car-lite as I can be.

...do more harm than good to their cause by trying to politicise the simple act of riding a bike.

I wholeheartedly agree. I was on my commute home one evening, when a dude pulled up next to me and started chatting about all the evils of cars and global warming, etc. Now, I agreed with every word he was saying; but I realized that riding my bike is not a statement I'm trying to make. It's just me trying to "be the change I want to see in the world." I realized it because I was out there enjoying my ride and I didn't want to talk to him about all of that stuff. I just wanted to delight in the nice, warm day and enjoy the fact that I was on mile 38 of my 1.6-mile route home. :D Yes, it's political for me, too. But, if you ask me why I ride my bike to work and other places (I'm car-lite, not free), I'm not going to get into politics with you about it. I just enjoy it.

Upon reading the title of this thread, I was immediately compelled to go watch Monkey Dust's "The Cyclists (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAOHhV1EFe4)" video.

I'm a bike person, a car person, a motorcycle person, a train person, and/or an airplane person depending on what I happen to be doing at the time! :lol:

Personally, I'm an animal person. What does that have to do with anything?

When i mentioned a bicycle he told me he doesn't want to become one of those "bicycle people". When i asked what he meant by that he told me that he did not want to become one of those people whose life revolves around the bike, can only talk about bikes, only hang out with bikers, etc.

lots of people own cars without getting 20" spinners and a chrome tip for their exhaust pipe. your pal can certainly ride a bike without hooking up with black label. right?

disclaimer: i don't really know what '20" spinners' means... but i hear people say it a lot. forgive me if i sound like a jackass.

disclaimer: i don't really know what '20" spinners' means... but i hear people say it a lot. forgive me if i sound like a jackass.
It means 20" wheels (which are big for your average car) that have a "spinner" which continues to spin when the car is stopped. These wheels have very low profile tires so the chrome wheel fills as much of the wheel well as possible. These are often items seen on cars owned by gangster wannabe types.

At the company I just left, the owners son got a company truck... BIG 4x4 dodge with 20" wheels. (No spinners, though...)

The overall effect is to make it look like a life-size HotWheels truck. Dorky as all hell.

[QUOTE=zoltani;5264570]Yesterday i was having a conversation with someone who had just moved to town and was considering his transit options (does not own a car). When i mentioned a bicycle he told me he doesn't want to become one of those "bicycle people". When i asked what he meant by that he told me that he did not want to become one of those people whose life revolves around the bike, can only talk about bikes, only hang out with bikers, etc.

QUOTE]

It's up to him how "into" biking he wants to get. No one should be forcing any topic of conversation on the guy, nor is anyone likely to.
A bike is a highly visible interest. The great thing is that any person can get as into it as they want, or not. It's a very customizable thing. I think it's perfectly natural to gravitate towards other people who share a common interest, whatever that may be. I also like to ride in the rain, so take my opinion for what it's worth. :D

I find myself constantly talking about bike stuff. I'm the only one I know that's major mode of transport is a bike. I eat a huge dinner and they'll be like "You eat this week?" and I'll say "I had a big breakfast and a medium pizza for lunch." and they just laugh and remind me to use the cute hand signals and little blinkie.

Yesterday i was having a conversation with someone who had just moved to town and was considering his transit options (does not own a car). When i mentioned a bicycle he told me he doesn't want to become one of those "bicycle people". When i asked what he meant by that he told me that he did not want to become one of those people whose life revolves around the bike, can only talk about bikes, only hang out with bikers, etc.

My response was that when you choose to ride a bike and not have a car it becomes a lifestyle simply because of the culture in this country. If this country was not so car oriented then maybe choosing the bicycle would be such a lifestyle choice, it would just simply be a way to get to where you are going. I love bikes and i love to talk about bike (that's why we are here right?), so maybe i am one of those "bicycle people" who can only speak and think about bikes! :eek:

Another thread raised a good question:

Does your attitude towards transport affect your attitudes towards other things in life?
Does it affect your choice of friends or people you hang out with?

Some folks always assume the worst of people who devote time, energy, and money to a specialization. Notice all the nasty names for doctors, lawyers, writers, teachers, computer programmers, etc. And the same style of disparagement applies to hobbies and lifestyles. Back when I played chess competitively (as an amateur) I once had a non-chessplayer tell me to my face that I "must hate all people who don't play chess." The 'bicycle person' comments strike me as a different song but the same note.

Yesterday i was having a conversation with someone who had just moved to town and was considering his transit options (does not own a car). When i mentioned a bicycle he told me he doesn't want to become one of those "bicycle people". When i asked what he meant by that he told me that he did not want to become one of those people whose life revolves around the bike, can only talk about bikes, only hang out with bikers, etc.


What she really said was, I don't want to look poor which is why I'm taking the bus. I suspect 90-95% of transportation cyclists are riding department store bikes and can't afford public transportation. That's really the bottom line. The "bicycle people" was talking about are poor Mexicans and homeless men.

What she really said was, I don't want to look poor which is why I'm taking the bus. I suspect 90-95% of transportation cyclists are riding department store bikes and can't afford public transportation. That's really the bottom line. The "bicycle people" was talking about are poor Mexicans and homeless men.

I took a Street Skills for Cyclists class in which the instructor called such "bicycle people" as you describe "utility cyclists." In retrospect that hardly seems a good description.

What she really said was, I don't want to look poor which is why I'm taking the bus. I suspect 90-95% of transportation cyclists are riding department store bikes and can't afford public transportation. That's really the bottom line. The "bicycle people" was talking about are poor Mexicans and homeless men.

(mstrpete scratches his head at this idea) Riding the bus to avoid looking poor? Not in this town. It's actually interesting how that statement does not reflect the reality of this area. Here(Olympia, WA.) it's everybody from doctors and accountants to college students and middle-class families riding to the neighborhood school. I wish I had a picture of all the bikes that were ridden to our neighborhood potluck the other day. Treks, Electras, you name it...and our neighborhood family doctor on his recumbent, doctor bag on the rear rack! The poor folks are stuck on the bus :D

Upon reading the title of this thread, I was immediately compelled to go watch Monkey Dust's "The Cyclists (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAOHhV1EFe4)" video.

That show was the best. It's too bad it finished. I haven't seen anything like it. I especially liked the Paedofinder General.

There are people who just ride bikes, bike people and bike nazis.

I'm a bike person. I bike 100 - 200 miles per week in warm weather, less in winter, but pretty much all year. I've been doing this since the mid 80s. I do my own maintenance and upgrades. I like to read about bikes and interact with other bikers and join forums like this one.

The bike nazis are the ones non bikers are usually referring to when they express disdain for bikers. The bike nazis I know berate other bikers for infractions of everything from dress code to road manners to bike set up. They aggressively 'defend' their vision of bikers' rights vs cars by actively provoking beefs with drivers and then relishing the fight that follows.

The funny part is, all of "those bike people" I've ever met, I met at a ride they had driven to! Carbon derailleur arms and custom length titanium cranks and lightweight rim tape and on and on and on.

Almost as bad as "those car people", the way they can corner you and talk you into the ground with suspension geometry and titanium exhaust pipe. Or "those food people" going on for three hours about preparing last night's meal. Drivers have their gearheads, eaters have their gourmands, and cyclists have roadies.

I think the last 2 posts pretty much sum it up, I think someone should start a poll
are you
1: a bike rider
2: a bike person
3: a BIKE NAZI!!!

I'm definitely a bike people. I think about bikes a lot, and no matter what I'm doing I usually wish I were doing it on a bike. I have to be careful when I'm counselling clients, because my first thought when anybody mentions a problem, no matter what the problem is, is "Get a bike."

I do most of my bike talking here on Bikeforums. That way I get tit out of my system and I don't bore the poor non-bike-people as much.

"Get a bike" ain't such a bad prescription for the blues.

Does your attitude towards transport affect your attitudes towards other things in life?
Does it affect your choice of friends or people you hang out with?

It definitely affects me a little bit. Not on my high horse, but might sound like it, but I think that riding a bicycle to work, school, groceries, etc. shows a bit of respect for the environment that we live in. If I see someone driving a Humvee or something ridiculous, I tend to develop a feeling that that person and myself don't share the same values. So to answer the question, yes it would affect my decision making process of who I am friends with. If Humvee guy/gal and me were to meet, he would start at a deficit in my respect for him/her as it pertains to issues that I care about.

Regarding the first question, although I ride a bike for fun, I also choose to ride as much as is possible because I have made a decision to try and live my beliefs (someone else said that earlier, although much better than I). Along with biking for environmental reasons, other things are influenced by the same line of thinking, for example: water usage and simplicity of living, etc.....but what is cool is when you find something that you can be good to the environment with, while having fun.....like bicycling....
Scott

Unless you're a grease-monkey gearhead, or a homie in search of the phat whip, what the hell is exciting about passively being transported by car?

Of course folks that cycle for their primary form of transportation become "bicycle people".
It's a drug.

Does your attitude towards transport affect your attitudes towards other things in life?
Does it affect your choice of friends or people you hang out with?

I notice more things when I'm on a bicycle or walking. I'm able to hear the birds in summer or the coyotes in the hills on a winter evening. I can notice the smells of sage, juniper and fruit trees. I can see some of the more suble things around me. And I can feel the heat, cold, wind or rain because I'm not shielded from the elements. When I notice the world around me, I feel much more connected to it.

As to the second question, most of my friends are not avid cyclists, but that doesn't seem to matter. The people I consider my friends will respect me for who I am, including my choice of transportation. And I in turn will respect them for who they are.

Unless you're a grease-monkey gearhead, or a homie in search of the phat whip, what the hell is exciting about passively being transported by car?

Just try driving down Highway 74 into Palm Springs. That should answer your question. It's not very passive. Even Lance loves fast cars. :p

Crap I fit into the bicycle category:) Society hands me another label.
The cyclist video is hiliraous, what is this from??

I must say that since most of you contributors live in the USA, the 'lifestyle thing' is much more of an issue, as the culture in the USA is completely and utterly car-centred. I am Dutch, and lived in The Netherlands for 19 years before moving abroad, and the culture there is the opposite; a bike is a bike is a bike-nobody owns carbon fibre racers or top of the range MTBs to ride to work or the like. Any bike will do, as it is simply about the transport. So 99.9% of bikes in The Netherlands are not polished every weekend or cherished like us enthusiasts would. It's a completely different mindset.
I moved to the USA after those 19 years, lived in NYC, moved to Dallas, then San Antonio, then Houston, then to San Francisco. I would not see myself riding a bike as a main means of transport in TX or NY; everything is spread out over great distances and most drivers regard you as poor scum since you are not a driver like them (my experience). There are next to zero bike facilities. So, I drove everywhere.
After having lived in the USA I moved to London in the United Kingdom. I quickly found public transport was utterly useless because of unreliability and the huge amount of time involved in getting from A to B. It is also horrendously expensive. Driving a car is also pointless; when they built most of the roads here many hundreds of years ago, the sheer volume of traffic they see nowadays is something they could never have foreseen. Result-traffic jams nonstop... So, I did the smart thing and started riding my bike. I was one of the very few 13 years ago when I moved here. Now I am one of thousands. The bike is not so much a lifestyle choice for most of these people, but a necessity; it will get you from A to B in less time than buses/metros/trains or cars. It costs nothing. You are free to go where you want, when you want. It's better for your health and the environment. And nobody will bomb you off your bike (after the July 7th bombing of the metro and buses, all bikeshops sold out of bikes the next day, all over London). I can ride the 25k to work in 35 minutes to an hour depending on the bike I use and the time of day. The other day I stayed ahead of a guy in a black Lamborghini for 3/4 of the way; in the end it kinda became a race between us, with him only being able to pull away when we came to the suburbs and honking and waving at me when he screamed off for the performance.
I have only become a bike enthousiast because of upgrading my bikes to make the daily ride faster and more pleasurable and thus becoming more into riding, and now I find myself meeting like-minded people on the road on racers etc, spontaneously forming riding groups and racing one another through the streets. This is something that you would not encounter in The Netherlands because of the cultural differences-bikes are too much the norm there. In London, people are embracing the fact they are a group with different values, and are forming intergroup understandings that are changing the transport culture. In short-great developments!!!
So yes, to wrap up this long post, it does influence the people you befriend and hang out with, in many ways. Over the last two years forn example I have seen my group of friends change attitude as well; in a group of say ten people I would be the only one or one of two that rode my bike everywhere. Now all of my male and female friends have bought bikes and ride them regularly-9 out of 10 use them for their main mode of transport.
I do own a car but only use it late at night when I go party in town (pretty tough picking up a chick at a club with a bicycle parked outside, as well) or when I go out of town.

When i mentioned a bicycle he told me he doesn't want to become one of those "bicycle people". When i asked what he meant by that he told me that he did not want to become one of those people whose life revolves around the bike, can only talk about bikes, only hang out with bikers, etc.


it struck me that you could easily substitute "parents" with "bicycle people" and it totally works...

When i mentioned children he told me he doesn't want to become one of those "parents". When i asked what he meant by that he told me that he did not want to become one of those people whose life revolves around the kids, can only talk about what their kid did today, only hang out with other parents, etc.

Some people are funny about anything that's "unusual." I have been an on again off again vegetarian for over 30 years, and it amuses me how defensive some people get when I mention it. I don't, actually, unless I am at a meal where I politely refuse whatever animal carcass is offered to me. I used to defend myself, but I realized over time that I am just falling in line with whatever stereotype is clouding the mind of the person confronting me. I just smile and say something like "To be honest, I really couldn't care less what you eat so why does it matter to you what I eat?"

Living car free has made my life so much better for so many reasons, but I would rather influence people by example than trying to drum sense into their thick skulls.

I moved to London in the United Kingdom. I quickly found public transport was utterly useless because of unreliability and the huge amount of time involved in getting from A to B. It is also horrendously expensive

I find this hard to believe. I see the schedule and the London Metro runs frequently. You're not going to get subways running every 10 minutes but it's not bad at all. Other than the fact they don't have A/C, it runs about as well as many subways. The bus situation in London may be another story.

I think it looks slow after being a motorist for years. I'm sure if you went back to the Netherlands, it would also seem a slow way of transport.

Some people are funny about anything that's "unusual." I have been an on again off again vegetarian for over 30 years, and it amuses me how defensive some people get when I mention it. I don't, actually, unless I am at a meal where I politely refuse whatever animal carcass is offered to me. I used to defend myself, but I realized over time that I am just falling in line with whatever stereotype is clouding the mind of the person confronting me. I just smile and say something like "To be honest, I really couldn't care less what you eat so why does it matter to you what I eat?"

Living car free has made my life so much better for so many reasons, but I would rather influence people by example than trying to drum sense into their thick skulls.

Do you think, possibly, the defensiveness you see in others springs from your air of assumed superiority to those of us who eat "animal carcasses" or have "thick skulls" because we own an automobile?

Originally Posted by DavidLee View Post
+1

People make WAY to big a deal about being car free. Not just people who are not car free but even some on this forum make it out to be a much bigger deal than it really is. Quite simply it's just my method of transportation, nothing more nothing less.


+ 1 !!!!!

I'd like to think you are right. But, try and Remember that when you run into a car addict who thinks cars equal status and honks, curses at cyclists. Maybe even forces you off the road. Everything is sjubject to the political sphere, when that organized motorists tries to deny you access to bike lanes. Guess, I sort of consider myself one of those bicycle people too. Some of us live and think bicycles much of our conscious hours and think the obsessive car culture has lead to an unhealthy populace. Both mentally and physically . . see below

I find this hard to believe. I see the schedule and the London Metro runs frequently. You're not going to get subways running every 10 minutes but it's not bad at all. Other than the fact they don't have A/C, it runs about as well as many subways. The bus situation in London may be another story.

I think it looks slow after being a motorist for years. I'm sure if you went back to the Netherlands, it would also seem a slow way of transport.

Well, Steve, hard to believe it may be, but it is certainly true; say I decided to take public transport here in London to get from home to work and back. I first have to walk 10minutes to get to the busstop. I then wait up to 10 or 15mins before the bus gets there (timetables yes, but they have to partake in traffic so are bound by how smoothly they an get through) I sit on the bus for 10-15mins if traffic is easy to get to the metro/railwaystation. One set of roadworks pushes the busride into any amount of overtime. I get to the station. I have to wait up to 15 mins for a train, 20mins for a metro in my part of London, provided they run on time. The faster ride to the centre of town on the train takes 25mins. Once there, I have to change to the metro. These are usually like overpacked sardine tins at rush hour, so you may have to let several trains pass before you can even get on. The temperature underground is t-shirt style stuff in mid-winter, and in high summer can easily go up to 40+ degrees C (105+F). The ride then takes another 10 minutes. And I then have to walk from the station to work, so +10mins. Total? Minimum 1.5 hours there, and 1.5 hours back. The metro is also unreliable because of privatised maintenance and the age of the network, so delays are very common. Timeliness figures of trains and the metro are always presented in the most positive light in public of course. In terms of price? A single ride on a bus nowadays costs £2 ($4), and a daily travelcard (letting you use bus/train/metro as much as you wish during the day) costs me £9 ($18) if I need to use it during rush hour...Anyone having to use them will usually curse them. Compare that to a 35-60min ride if I take my bike to do the same route... And yes, the public transport in The Netherlands is cheaper and runs on time more of the time, but there as well, a racing bike will be faster on short (say 20mile) distances. The Netherlands is also the most densely populated country in the world, so the sheer amount of cars on the road makes you want to use an alternative.

Just try driving down Highway 74 into Palm Springs. That should answer your question. It's not very passive. Even Lance loves fast cars. :p


I'll assume that I have to break the law by speeding to make it anything more than being compliantly carted along.

What she really said was, I don't want to look poor which is why I'm taking the bus. I suspect 90-95% of transportation cyclists are riding department store bikes and can't afford public transportation. That's really the bottom line. The "bicycle people" was talking about are poor Mexicans and homeless men.

I ride my bike so i'm 'not' poor. Everyone I know that drives a car everywhere is constantly broke and in debt, that's not my idea of fun.

I can pay my mortgage, i have money in the bank and I have no debt. Yea, i'm poor because I ride a bike 'haa..haa' let them just keep believing that! I'll be just cycling and laughing all the way to the bank!

Cheers!

yeah seems there is something of a bike sub-culture in different places. but it depends.

in davis and tucson...i notice there is a conservative sort of person who rides bikes...just for transport/utility.. then there is this UNDERGROUND sort of scene. these people are like grease-monkeys..cept with bikes. wear used/weird clothing... dress up their bikes... its more about the arts... its kinda cool. not something i really got much into... but have made friends with lots...

so tell your friend he can ride a bike and still be who he personally wants to be...