Electric Bikes - Help, Don't Know Where To Begin

Hi everyone. I have a Trek 7100 Hybrid Bike. I would like to convert this bike to a ebike. I just don't know where to begin. I know nothing about ebike kits. I will tell you about the bike and maybe someone can point me in the right direction to converting to an ebike.

* My Trek 7100 hybrid has 700x35c specialized armadillo tires

* Frame size is 15 inches, the smallest frame trek makes

* The bike has a front shock absorber

Here's my goal for the bike. Speed is not that important. I would be satisfied with 10-20 mph max.
All riding will be on flat ground. Theirs no hills in my area. I would like to get a minimum of 20 miles before the battery needs recharged. I live in a small town and the bike would be used mostly for running errands. I'm retired, so their is no commuting to work.

I should also mention that I'm not mechanically inclined at all. Whichever kit I buy. I would have to have the local bike shop install it.

I've thought about purchasing a good used "Kawasaki Ninja 250" Motorcycle for about $1500 off ebay. However, I think the motorcycle would be overkill for what I want it to do. The ebike really excites me. No gas, licencing, or insurance cost.

I really like my 7100, I know I would like it even more with a electric motor. LOL. I also have a roadbike. I want to leave the roadbike like it is. I want to convert the 7100.

What are my options? Is it possible to convert the 7100 to an ebike? If so which batteries, and electric motor companies would you suggest? Or would it be better to just buy a ebike already produced? How reliable are these electric motors? Do they break down often? Do they come with a warranty? Thanks in advance for replying.

I don't know if this is important, but I still plan on pedaling the bike about half the time or more. In other words, the electric motor won't be doing all the work.

Hi Groundhawg! I'll try to give you some advice:

Pre-built bikes are as a general rule, not of good quality. There are a lot of junk models out there, and unlike the kits/motors, there isn't a lot of user capability to repair them should something go wrong. Kits are tried and tested, many of them are proven reliable.

That said, the Giant line of electric bicycles has been successful, the Lite being their pinnacle. I'm not sure what the new models have to offer, but the Giant Lite was definetly a good pre-built, so its an example that not all of them are bad. Still, unfortunately as a general rule, they are.

There are some questions i'd like to pose about what you want to do with your bike:

Is weight an issue? What are your hopes on how much it will weigh, finished?
Is price an issue? I notice that you're willing to put upwards of $1500 on a motorbike, does the same apply here? A kit can be completed for as little as approximately $400, but thats the lowest end of reliable. You can find some *exceedingly* snazzy and well performing kits, but the pricetag can go pretty close to that $1500 range.

Reading that you're interested in low maintenance and high reliability, my suggestion would be to go with a direct drive brushless hub motor. These are heavier than some other options, starting at 7.5lbs and moving up into the 16lb weight range, but they're quiet, simple, reliable and pretty much 100% maintenance free. With the front fork of your bicycle being suspension, the best choice would be rear wheel drive.

There are some other choices that I wouldn't discount yet, such as frame mounted motors, but i'll let someone else tell you about those if it comes up. These tend to require more attention and maintenance than a hub motor though, which is the reason for that suggestion.

As for converting your bicycle in this case, these hubs will fit almost any bicycle, but you will need to check your dropout width, and you'll likely need a new front shifter that will handle a freewheel (EDIT: I just went and looked at the specs on this bike, if you're using an un-modified 2007 model, it only comes with 21 speeds so your front shifter may work anyways! that would be good news. I still suggest consulting your LBS)

If you're not up on bike terms or don't know how to check these things out, don't worry :) your local bike store can help you out for sure.

So, I think your bike will work out fine personally, just get the dropouts checked to make sure your hub motor will fit in there (that is, if you decide to go with a hub motor)

My two personal picks:
(and yes, honestly biased, but thats only because i've had good experiences with them):

On the lower cost side, Crystalyte is a good reliable product, priced very well and is very non-proprietary, so you'll always be able to find parts should there be a problem. You can use these motors in a huge variety of different voltages, pick the battery you want, the throttle you want, mount the batteries anywhere you want = very customizable. You can pick up a motor, controller, and throttle for $350-400, then pick whatever battery you like!

It is however, heavy, the biggest drawback. Crystalyte's motors are some of the heavier ones on the market, a standard motor from them weighs in around 16lbs. I personally don't find it unmanageable, but your mileage may vary.

BionX is a Canadian made motor, much lighter than the Crystalyte. These clock in between 7.5-9lbs, they're quality: good looking, great performing. This system is pretty complete, it comes as one unit and has a speedometer/control unit which sits on your handlebar and gives you lots of information, also allows you to change various settings. The whole system is exceptionally light, includes regenerative braking (which is a great feature), and features pedal assist, where the BionX motor will help you out as you pedal, along with some models also featuring a traditional throttle. This kit keeps your bike quite like a bike, just one that helps you along!

Negatives for this one include a high price tag (1100-1500 I think, but that does include the cost of the battery), non-customizable, and proprietary. If something goes wrong and you need a new part, or your battery wears out, BionX is the only source.

As for warranties, I know that BionX has a 2 year warranty on everything but the battery, which is one year. Crystalyte usually just comes with whatever your dealer offers, mine came with one year. The thing about the Crystalyte is, unless you've done something extraordinary to brutalize the motor, the parts are very simple and can be replaced/repaired easily.

I know this is a long read, hope you're not asleep yet. Will end it with batteries:

If you pick a kit that lets you choose your own battery, here are some tips:

Sealed Lead Acid batteries (SLA):
+inexpensive first choice, their big cause for being so popular. These are *cheap* compared to some of the other choices.
-heaviest choice
-Performance decreases over time
-poor charge characteristics. If you want to keep the lifespan on these batteries decent they MUST be charged soon after use, if not immediately.
-leaving these in the cold/letting them chill will cause them to perform very poorly until heated again
-average working life of 200 cycles, making their value not look so great when you realize you need maybe 2 packs of SLA to 1 pack of lithium, and 3 packs of SLA to 1 pack of NiMH as time goes on and your batteries wear out!

Nickel Metal Hydride (NiMH):
+Excellent lifespan. These will last a very long time in the long run
+Do not mind not being charged right away, in fact they do well if you run them flat
+Lighter than SLA but cheaper than Lithium
-More expensive than SLA

Lithium:
+Super light compared to the others. Can weigh as little as 4lbs! Even the biggest ones are usually under 9lbs. This is a big reason for people to pick Lithium, when you can save lots of weight.
+Good charge characteristics. They don't like being abused, but they're more forgiving than SLA.
+Run well under wide weather conditions and temperatures
+Longer lifespan than SLA, by about 2x
+Peformance is consistent all the way to the end
-High price! Lithium batteries are just about the most expensive pick of the bunch.

there is alot out there good and bad,ask yourself how fast i need to go,how far i need to go,yep thats also good advice dont buy a cheapy allready built,thats what i did,i ended up with a heavy lead battery and a slow bike,i eneded up with a good bike though but now i am chasing up another kit,from what i have learnt so far its better to have a good look about and be prepared to spend a bit for a decent kit and battery,but that still works out cheaper than rego and petrol.also you need to ask do i want a hub setup or currie type.i have found there are advantages and disadvantages to every setup,no one size fits all.

Hi Groundhawg! I'll try to give you some advice:

Pre-built bikes are as a general rule, not of good quality. There are a lot of junk models out there, and unlike the kits/motors, there isn't a lot of user capability to repair them should something go wrong. Kits are tried and tested, many of them are proven reliable.

That said, the Giant line of electric bicycles has been successful, the Lite being their pinnacle. I'm not sure what the new models have to offer, but the Giant Lite was definetly a good pre-built, so its an example that not all of them are bad. Still, unfortunately as a general rule, they are.

There are some questions i'd like to pose about what you want to do with your bike:

Is weight an issue? What are your hopes on how much it will weigh, finished?
Is price an issue? I notice that you're willing to put upwards of $1500 on a motorbike, does the same apply here? A kit can be completed for as little as approximately $400, but thats the lowest end of reliable. You can find some *exceedingly* snazzy and well performing kits, but the pricetag can go pretty close to that $1500 range.

Reading that you're interested in low maintenance and high reliability, my suggestion would be to go with a direct drive brushless hub motor. These are heavier than some other options, starting at 7.5lbs and moving up into the 16lb weight range, but they're quiet, simple, reliable and pretty much 100% maintenance free. With the front fork of your bicycle being suspension, the best choice would be rear wheel drive.

There are some other choices that I wouldn't discount yet, such as frame mounted motors, but i'll let someone else tell you about those if it comes up. These tend to require more attention and maintenance than a hub motor though, which is the reason for that suggestion.

As for converting your bicycle in this case, these hubs will fit almost any bicycle, but you will need to check your dropout width, and you'll likely need a new front shifter that will handle a freewheel (EDIT: I just went and looked at the specs on this bike, if you're using an un-modified 2007 model, it only comes with 21 speeds so your front shifter may work anyways! that would be good news. I still suggest consulting your LBS)

If you're not up on bike terms or don't know how to check these things out, don't worry :) your local bike store can help you out for sure.

So, I think your bike will work out fine personally, just get the dropouts checked to make sure your hub motor will fit in there (that is, if you decide to go with a hub motor)

My two personal picks:
(and yes, honestly biased, but thats only because i've had good experiences with them):

On the lower cost side, Crystalyte is a good reliable product, priced very well and is very non-proprietary, so you'll always be able to find parts should there be a problem. You can use these motors in a huge variety of different voltages, pick the battery you want, the throttle you want, mount the batteries anywhere you want = very customizable. You can pick up a motor, controller, and throttle for $350-400, then pick whatever battery you like!

It is however, heavy, the biggest drawback. Crystalyte's motors are some of the heavier ones on the market, a standard motor from them weighs in around 16lbs. I personally don't find it unmanageable, but your mileage may vary.

BionX is a Canadian made motor, much lighter than the Crystalyte. These clock in between 7.5-9lbs, they're quality: good looking, great performing. This system is pretty complete, it comes as one unit and has a speedometer/control unit which sits on your handlebar and gives you lots of information, also allows you to change various settings. The whole system is exceptionally light, includes regenerative braking (which is a great feature), and features pedal assist, where the BionX motor will help you out as you pedal, along with some models also featuring a traditional throttle. This kit keeps your bike quite like a bike, just one that helps you along!

Negatives for this one include a high price tag (1100-1500 I think, but that does include the cost of the battery), non-customizable, and proprietary. If something goes wrong and you need a new part, or your battery wears out, BionX is the only source.

As for warranties, I know that BionX has a 2 year warranty on everything but the battery, which is one year. Crystalyte usually just comes with whatever your dealer offers, mine came with one year. The thing about the Crystalyte is, unless you've done something extraordinary to brutalize the motor, the parts are very simple and can be replaced/repaired easily.

I know this is a long read, hope you're not asleep yet. Will end it with batteries:

If you pick a kit that lets you choose your own battery, here are some tips:

Sealed Lead Acid batteries (SLA):
+inexpensive first choice, their big cause for being so popular. These are *cheap* compared to some of the other choices.
-heaviest choice
-Performance decreases over time
-poor charge characteristics. If you want to keep the lifespan on these batteries decent they MUST be charged soon after use, if not immediately.
-leaving these in the cold/letting them chill will cause them to perform very poorly until heated again
-average working life of 200 cycles, making their value not look so great when you realize you need maybe 2 packs of SLA to 1 pack of lithium, and 3 packs of SLA to 1 pack of NiMH as time goes on and your batteries wear out!

Nickel Metal Hydride (NiMH):
+Excellent lifespan. These will last a very long time in the long run
+Do not mind not being charged right away, in fact they do well if you run them flat
+Lighter than SLA but cheaper than Lithium
-More expensive than SLA

Lithium:
+Super light compared to the others. Can weigh as little as 4lbs! Even the biggest ones are usually under 9lbs. This is a big reason for people to pick Lithium, when you can save lots of weight.
+Good charge characteristics. They don't like being abused, but they're more forgiving than SLA.
+Run well under wide weather conditions and temperatures
+Longer lifespan than SLA, by about 2x
+Peformance is consistent all the way to the end
-High price! Lithium batteries are just about the most expensive pick of the bunch.

Thanks for replying Abneycat. There's a lot of valuable info in your post. After reading your post, I started doing a lot of research online. I've come down to 2 options. The first is I really like the Bionx kit. That's probably what I'm going to purchase. If I choose this route. I will have to install the Bionx kit myself. I called my local bike shop today and they told me they had never installed one of these kits, and have never converted a bike to a ebike. They said they wouldn't do it. This bike shop only handles Trek and Specialized bikes.



I call a second bike shop in a large city that is near me. I figure that they would install the kit for me , because they are a Giant bike distributor, and Giant makes an ebike. So I give this bike shop a call and here is what the guy told me. He said they have never installed any kits on a bike either. However, he said they could do it at a price of $60.00 an hour !! He then said that it could take as much as 8 hrs, because since no mechanic of his had ever installed a kit before. They would have to be sure that their were no bugs in it.

To make a long story short. If I purchase the "Bionix" I will have to install it. Giant does make a ebike called the "suede e" for $1070. Here's a link to it. Giant Suede E (http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-US/bikes/lifestyle/1272/29755/) I asked the guy if they have any in stock. He tells me they don't stock the bike. If I wanted one, they would have to special order it. This Giant bike only comes in medium and large sizes. I think the medium will be to big for me. It's 18 inch frame. My trek is a 15 inch frame and fits good.

This Giant dealer is located about 75 miles away. He told me to come down and sit on one of their other Suede bikes to be sure it isn't to big. He said if They order the ebike for me. I would have to purchase it because they don't stock them. That's one option. I do like the Giant bike and it's good to know that if anything goes wrong with it. That they can fix it.

Now for my other option. Putting the BionX kit on my Trek 7100. I'm a small guy only 5'6 inches tall. As I stated in my previous post. I have the 15 inch frame in the 7100. To give you an idea how small this frame is. It only has room for one water bottle. All other sizes on the 7100 have 2 water bottle brackets below the top tube. I got the size of the battery off BionX website, and it looks as if it's an inch to big to fit in that space. I could buy a rear rack and put it on their. Or it may possibly fit under the top tube. It's going to really be close.

I have saw some pics on the net that have the "BionX" mounted on a rear rack for this purpose. I want the BionX" kit on one hand. However, I figure that giant would be good also. And they would fix the bike if anything went wrong. I just haven't made my mind up yet. The giant bike would serve my purposes. I only want a ebike to do quick errands, and would probably ride it 10 miles or less.

I also have a roadbike. The roadie is the one I really like to ride for exercise. I have a lot of thinking to do. I am determined to either convert the 7100 or buy a new Giant suede e. Or if I get to frustrated, I will just go and buy a good used Kawasaki ninja 250. No, I'm not going to give up that easy. LOL. I'm determined to have a ebike. What's your thoughts on the Giant Suede E ? I could have the whole bike with the motor and battery already installed for about the same price as the BionX kit.

If the bike wasn't a name brand like Giant. I wouldn't give it a second thought. I would buy the "Bionx kit" However, I know that Giant makes excellenet bikes. I just don't know about their ebike. I do realize that the giant won't go as far or as fast as the 7100 with the "Bionix kit on it. However, speed isn't really important to me, and as previously stated most of my rides will be 10 miles or less. The Giant has a top speed of 17 mph if I remember correctly. And a distance of 20 or 30 miles between charges.

Again, thanks for responding. You've helped me out a lot already.

there is alot out there good and bad,ask yourself how fast i need to go,how far i need to go,yep thats also good advice dont buy a cheapy allready built,thats what i did,i ended up with a heavy lead battery and a slow bike,i eneded up with a good bike though but now i am chasing up another kit,from what i have learnt so far its better to have a good look about and be prepared to spend a bit for a decent kit and battery,but that still works out cheaper than rego and petrol.also you need to ask do i want a hub setup or currie type.i have found there are advantages and disadvantages to every setup,no one size fits all.

Thanks for the info Mike. Which ebike did you buy that was giving you trouble? Was it the $300 bike from walmart? The reason I ask is because I think I saw where you posted in another post somewhere that it was the walmart bike. I could be wrong though. I did read a post on one of the internet forums that a guy had purchased this bike. He said he was dissappointed in it. It would only go about 13 miles and would have to be charged back up again. He also said the bike was very heavy? I can't remember right now.

yep i have a similar bike the currie ezip,not a bad setup or bike,the bike is well built but motor and battery aint crash hot for serious riding (slow and heavy)still it does the odd trip to the shop to get the milk,i am looking at getting a faster currie motor and a lithium battery to fix him up and that is going to cost me a penny or two.we have kmart stores over here in sydney but i hear walmart is comming down under soon.

Thanks for replying Abneycat. There's a lot of valuable info in your post. After reading your post, I started doing a lot of research online. I've come down to 2 options. The first is I really like the Bionx kit. That's probably what I'm going to purchase. If I choose this route. I will have to install the Bionx kit myself. I called my local bike shop today and they told me they had never installed one of these kits, and have never converted a bike to a ebike. They said they wouldn't do it. This bike shop only handles Trek and Specialized bikes.



I call a second bike shop in a large city that is near me. I figure that they would install the kit for me , because they are a Giant bike distributor, and Giant makes an ebike. So I give this bike shop a call and here is what the guy told me. He said they have never installed any kits on a bike either. However, he said they could do it at a price of $60.00 an hour !! He then said that it could take as much as 8 hrs, because since no mechanic of his had ever installed a kit before. They would have to be sure that their were no bugs in it.

To make a long story short. If I purchase the "Bionix" I will have to install it. Giant does make a ebike called the "suede e" for $1070. Here's a link to it. Giant Suede E (http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-US/bikes/lifestyle/1272/29755/) I asked the guy if they have any in stock. He tells me they don't stock the bike. If I wanted one, they would have to special order it. This Giant bike only comes in medium and large sizes. I think the medium will be to big for me. It's 18 inch frame. My trek is a 15 inch frame and fits good.

This Giant dealer is located about 75 miles away. He told me to come down and sit on one of their other Suede bikes to be sure it isn't to big. He said if They order the ebike for me. I would have to purchase it because they don't stock them. That's one option. I do like the Giant bike and it's good to know that if anything goes wrong with it. That they can fix it.

Now for my other option. Putting the BionX kit on my Trek 7100. I'm a small guy only 5'6 inches tall. As I stated in my previous post. I have the 15 inch frame in the 7100. To give you an idea how small this frame is. It only has room for one water bottle. All other sizes on the 7100 have 2 water bottle brackets below the top tube. I got the size of the battery off BionX website, and it looks as if it's an inch to big to fit in that space. I could buy a rear rack and put it on their. Or it may possibly fit under the top tube. It's going to really be close.

I have saw some pics on the net that have the "BionX" mounted on a rear rack for this purpose. I want the BionX" kit on one hand. However, I figure that giant would be good also. And they would fix the bike if anything went wrong. I just haven't made my mind up yet. The giant bike would serve my purposes. I only want a ebike to do quick errands, and would probably ride it 10 miles or less.

I also have a roadbike. The roadie is the one I really like to ride for exercise. I have a lot of thinking to do. I am determined to either convert the 7100 or buy a new Giant suede e. Or if I get to frustrated, I will just go and buy a good used Kawasaki ninja 250. No, I'm not going to give up that easy. LOL. I'm determined to have a ebike. What's your thoughts on the Giant Suede E ? I could have the whole bike with the motor and battery already installed for about the same price as the BionX kit.

If the bike wasn't a name brand like Giant. I wouldn't give it a second thought. I would buy the "Bionx kit" However, I know that Giant makes excellenet bikes. I just don't know about their ebike. I do realize that the giant won't go as far or as fast as the 7100 with the "Bionix kit on it. However, speed isn't really important to me, and as previously stated most of my rides will be 10 miles or less. The Giant has a top speed of 17 mph if I remember correctly. And a distance of 20 or 30 miles between charges.

Again, thanks for responding. You've helped me out a lot already.

Groundhawg, i'm not personally sure about the Suede, just because its a different design from the Lite (which is the one that people rave about). But, it looks like a decent package, one of the best points is that you have the option to go and try it out, which is a nice thing to be able to do.

As for the BionX: this installation guide pretty much covers the whole process:

http://www.bionx.nl/BionX%20installation%20guide.pdf

I think that bike store may be unsure of whats required, because that list of tasks isn't all that extensive, some bike shops can put these together in about an hour.

Groundhawg, i'm not personally sure about the Suede, just because its a different design from the Lite (which is the one that people rave about). But, it looks like a decent package, one of the best points is that you have the option to go and try it out, which is a nice thing to be able to do.

As for the BionX: this installation guide pretty much covers the whole process:

http://www.bionx.nl/BionX%20installation%20guide.pdf

I think that bike store may be unsure of whats required, because that list of tasks isn't all that extensive, some bike shops can put these together in about an hour.

Thanks for responding Abneycat. It looks like the Lite bike is no longer produced. The "Suede E" is my only option with Giant. That's the only ebike I could find on their website. Thanks for the link to the installation guide. I'm going to go and sit on one of the suede models to see if it will fit me. That could be a few weeks though.

I'll let everyone know which route I choose. Whether it be the giant Suede E. Or a kit like "Bonix". Thanks again.