Living Car Free - how to discourage car ownership

What got them the title, if you don't want to ***** up the thread you can pm me. I'm curious as the bus and a single train route are the only forms of mass transit for us here in Houston.

-Nate

CATA Press release (http://cata.org/news/APTA_Award.html)on American Public Transit Association award.

This is dead on right. I would personally LOVE to not have a car or have to depend on a car. But I live in Connecticut where it snows and gets freezing cold and there's virtually no public transportation. I HAVE to drive to and from work no matter what the price of gas might be. If the public transportation is there, I'd use it in a minute.

It's great when people dream about how all the rest of us should live. Try looking at the reality of the situation. Amerca isn't Europe. This is a country of sprawled out communities and towns, very little public transportation, much less GOOD public transportation, and a entire society built on the premise of free travel (meaning unhindered travel, meaning you need a car). If some dreamer can show me how to get from Simsbury CT to Bristol CT (22 miles) every day at odd times no matter what the weather, I'll be happy to listen. There's no bus, no car pool, no train, and that leaves my car. If you think I'm trying to commute 44 miles round trip through or after an ice storm (like we had this week) on my bike, you're nuts.

I'm not criticizing you, but I do wonder if you've tried to do anything about the public transit situation in your area. If you're feeling the need, some of your neighbors probably are too. You all might be able to do a few simple things to improve transit in your area. Go to public meetings, talk to your representatives, support candidates who are pro-bus, etc. The more public pressure there is, the more likely that you'll gat a bus in your area.

I'm not criticizing you, but I do wonder if you've tried to do anything about the public transit situation in your area. If you're feeling the need, some of your neighbors probably are too. You all might be able to do a few simple things to improve transit in your area. Go to public meetings, talk to your representatives, support candidates who are pro-bus, etc. The more public pressure there is, the more likely that you'll gat a bus in your area.
Or at least speak up privately when appropriate, for example when your lunch buddies start grumbling about some local transit proposal or project. You don't have to start a debate, just say you might use it. If your support of transit is secret and silent, it doesn't count for a lot.

"If you think I'm trying to commute 44 miles round trip through or after an ice storm (like we had this week) on my bike, you're nuts." -- Friendly Fred

Fred, consider the renowned ArcticBiker. Does ArcticBiker wimp out, exclaiming "Oh, it's just simply too much for me!"??? Of course not!! ArcticBiker is One Cool Dude.

If you must (absolutely must) WIMP OUT, and, as you say, there's no public transportation or carpool available, get yourself a motorcycle. You'll get far greater fuel efficiency, and thereby cause less smog and global warming.

This is dead on right. I would personally LOVE to not have a car or have to depend on a car. But I live in Connecticut where it snows and gets freezing cold and there's virtually no public transportation. I HAVE to drive to and from work no matter what the price of gas might be. If the public transportation is there, I'd use it in a minute.

It's great when people dream about how all the rest of us should live. Try looking at the reality of the situation. Amerca isn't Europe. This is a country of sprawled out communities and towns, very little public transportation, much less GOOD public transportation, and a entire society built on the premise of free travel (meaning unhindered travel, meaning you need a car). If some dreamer can show me how to get from Simsbury CT to Bristol CT (22 miles) every day at odd times no matter what the weather, I'll be happy to listen. There's no bus, no car pool, no train, and that leaves my car. If you think I'm trying to commute 44 miles round trip through or after an ice storm (like we had this week) on my bike, you're nuts.

There's really no need to take a defeatist attitude. The reality of the situation is that the situation has to change. Oil is going to run out. When it does, cars won't be an option for you or virtually anyone else - which will necessitate a change in lifestyle for a lot of people. People will need to live closer to work, for one, especially in areas with inclement weather, or just use transportation that doesn't rely on oil regardless of inconvenience. Keep in mind that humanity somehow managed to live just fine without cars for about 2 million years... it is astonishing that corporations have managed to drill it into people's heads that cars are necessary at all, much less necessary on a regular basis.

Since change is going to happen no matter what, you have 3 options:
1) Change now
2) Change only when absolutely necessary
3) Give up on life

Which do you think will be the most beneficial?

Keep in mind that humanity somehow managed to live just fine without cars for about 2 million years... it is astonishing that corporations have managed to drill it into people's heads that cars are necessary at all, much less necessary on a regular basis.

They're necessary these days because we've designed everything around cars, trucks, trains, ships, and airplanes. Even if we got all the cars off the roads, we'd still have to transport huge amounts of goods everywhere. The corner store isn't going to have enough bread if it has to arrive by donkey.

It's not just Big Corporate's fault. Society, as a whole, got us into this mess.

If some dreamer can show me how to get from Simsbury CT to Bristol CT (22 miles) every day at odd times no matter what the weather, I'll be happy to listen. There's no bus, no car pool, no train, and that leaves my car. If you think I'm trying to commute 44 miles round trip through or after an ice storm (like we had this week) on my bike, you're nuts.

How about a bike? This is bikeforums right? There are people here would ride in all weather, all times of year, every day much farther than that. rive the car if you want, but don't did yourself into thinking it is the only way.

It's great when people dream about how all the rest of us should live. There's no bus, no car pool, no train, and that leaves my car. If you think I'm trying to commute 44 miles round trip through or after an ice storm (like we had this week) on my bike, you're nuts.

Well, your dreaming about how you should live. Work for it.

Roody's got a point. If you are unhappy, you have to express this by action. Get involved with your local bicycle advocacy group (http://www.wecyclect.org/) or even the Central Connecticut Regional Planning Agency (http://ccrpa.org/). They are working on an alternative transportation plan (http://ccrpa.org/baep/CCPATHdraftplan.pdf).

Joe Voter won't get out of his/her car till there are alternative facilities in place. He/she needs to be led.

So get involved. It will take a long while, so expect to make some old friends while you work. I'm involved in the Bicycle Advocacy of Central Arkansas. Because of BACA, I've met judges, mayors and even Mike Huckabee.

We've helped get bike racks on the buses and get bicycles defined as a transportation vehicle and not just a recreational vehicle. The latter is important because it opens up funding for bike paths and bike lanes and forces the state to accept bicycles as a real mode of transportation.

They're necessary these days because we've designed everything around cars, trucks, trains, ships, and airplanes. Even if we got all the cars off the roads, we'd still have to transport huge amounts of goods everywhere. The corner store isn't going to have enough bread if it has to arrive by donkey.

It's not just Big Corporate's fault. Society, as a whole, got us into this mess.

That's why it's important to think in terms of local solutions. Local farmers markets, having you own vegetable garden and baking your own bread are really good places to start with knocking dependance on long distance foodstuffs. I have a policy of not buying any imported food, produce & etc and I deal with an old fashioned local butcher shop when I buy meat.

I usually lurk the car-free forum but don't usually post because I am only car 'light' not free. However, I feel compelled to address the items in this original post.


I think it is very implausible that any one address/family combination requires more than one automobile. In every case that I know of, certainly the chief breadwinner can get to work by bus/train. And, at least some other car trips are wasteful impulses that are really unnecessary, and which could, easily enough, be accomplished by public transport (which, the more it is used, the more it becomes available). There are cases where a family needs a car, for example, to help deal with an elderly relative's doctor visits.
There are two assumptions being made with these statements:
1) Public transit is accessible
2) Only the elderly are mobility impaired, and therefore must travel assisted by someone.

When the effective range of your mobility is under 200 yds before needing a break, even when walker assited, public transit is no longer an option. There isn't a bus terminal within 50 yards of everyplace one needs to go, especially if multiple locations are required to complete all your errands.
The assumption that mobility impaired individuals need assistance to venture from the home is incorrect and, to be honest, a bit rude. Many people with mobility impairments choose a limited walking capacity (cane, crutches or walker) over a faster or more distance-ready form of transit (wheelchair or power-scooter) because of societal perception. People (in general) address someone differently if they're in a wheelchair versus walking with a cane, especially if the impaired person is relatively young.



I might discourage second- and third-car ownership in these ways.
First, big luxury tax. At any family/address combination, there must be a record of the principal automobile. It must be the least expensive one. All other automobiles there are luxuries in fact.
My fiancee and I each own a car. Mine is the lesser expensive one, but it is also used the least (under 2000 miles/year.) If her vehicle is more fuel efficient and used as daily transport so she can get to work, while mine is a 4wd utility vehicle used only once or twice a week, which one is the luxury? Since I have a job related travel necessity one day a week making it highly impractical to ride my bike that day, and the use of her vehicle is tied up with her work duties, is ownership of either vehicle truly luxurious?


Second, a very big consequence for cases where it is discovered that a family/address combination has failed to honestly record an automobile. For example, if an unregistered or a misrecorded second or third automobile is in an accident, the victim could receive treble damages. If such a car is otherwise discovered, it could be assessed back-taxes with interest.
Reasonable sounding, but see my response above regarding appropriate registration of 'primary' vs. 'luxury' vehicles.


Third, our gasoline could be taxed at rates similar to what Europe has done. Five- and six-dollar per gallon gas would help people see sense.
I'm fine with this idea, but consider the overall ramifications of such a tax. Are you prepared to see public transit costs double or triple based on the surge in fuel prices? For those of us that live in areas where locally grown produce is a seasonal luxury, how will the cost of produce be affected? I'm willing to bet most people aren't prepared to pay the increases.

That's why it's important to think in terms of local solutions. Local farmers markets, having you own vegetable garden and baking your own bread are really good places to start with knocking dependance on long distance foodstuffs. I have a policy of not buying any imported food, produce & etc and I deal with an old fashioned local butcher shop when I buy meat.

Right, yet there are still places with huge populations that a farmer's market (as an example) just wouldn't have the capacity to serve everyone. Baking my own bread would still require me to get the materials to make it, and I can't plant enough grain crops on my 45-unit building's rooftop or on its 250-sq-ft "lawn" ;) to make enough bread for myself, let alone everyone else who lives under the same roof. Your butcher shop doesn't have its livestock grazing out back, either; it had to be transported to the shop.

I'm all about supporting my local businesses -- if I'm not already on a first-name basis with them, they at least recognize me when I come in. I don't drive unless I can't find something nearby, either. But I physically can't make stuff for myself even if I wanted to.

Humanity's been around for 2 million years, but prior to the 20th century, it's never had the capacity to coagulate into centers of such high population density and still be able to feed itself. Motorized transport changed everything.

Maybe telecommuting will be the real answer...

Well, your dreaming about how you should live. Work for it.

Roody's got a point. If you are unhappy, you have to express this by action. Get involved with your local bicycle advocacy group (http://www.wecyclect.org/) or even the Central Connecticut Regional Planning Agency (http://ccrpa.org/). They are working on an alternative transportation plan (http://ccrpa.org/baep/CCPATHdraftplan.pdf).

Joe Voter won't get out of his/her car till there are alternative facilities in place. He/she needs to be led.

So get involved. It will take a long while, so expect to make some old friends while you work. I'm involved in the Bicycle Advocacy of Central Arkansas. Because of BACA, I've met judges, mayors and even Mike Huckabee.

We've helped get bike racks on the buses and get bicycles defined as a transportation vehicle and not just a recreational vehicle. The latter is important because it opens up funding for bike paths and bike lanes and forces the state to accept bicycles as a real mode of transportation.


Thank you for your work, even though it doesn't directly benefit me...it is an example that can be used by many others with their local political battles to increase bicycle awareness and support.

-Nate

Right, yet there are still places with huge populations that a farmer's market (as an example) just wouldn't have the capacity to serve everyone. Baking my own bread would still require me to get the materials to make it, and I can't plant enough grain crops on my 45-unit building's rooftop or on its 250-sq-ft "lawn" ;) to make enough bread for myself, let alone everyone else who lives under the same roof. Your butcher shop doesn't have its livestock grazing out back, either; it had to be transported to the shop.



Sorry, I should've said I live in a rural community with mainly dairy farms all around the town for miles. Meat comes from a small local area slaughterhouse. The Hauraki Plains area is crossed with navigable rivers and until just after WW2 an awful lot of freight was carried by coastal shipping. We used to have a good rail link too until a shortsighted Tory government closed down our branch line and lifted the tracks.

The coastal vessel 'Tuhoe' that used to carry freight to the town where I live (Paeroa). The 'Tuhoe' survives in the hands of a preservation society.
http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/4676/cargoshipstuhoelate60snv7.jpg

Personal motorised transport of the kind that our society now depends on is unsustainable. There are plenty of other transport solutions besides owning a humugous great steel car or SUV. When my kiddies were small I was also living in a rural area and I used a sidecar outfit to get myself and my family around. The 'tractor' bike for my outfit was only a 350cc twin and despite the 'interesting' quality of the roads my outfit managed to take us anywhere we wanted to go and in all weathers too. These days I use either a bicycle or my electric tricycle for transport, if I need to go further afield I take the bus. Most times it's possible to get what I need locally so I don't need to drive a great lump of metal with wheels on about the place. Local solutions are global solutions, - it's simply a case of refusing to take part in all the insanity.

Sorry, I should've said I live in a rural community with mainly dairy farms all around the town for miles. Meat comes from a small local area slaughterhouse. The Hauraki Plains area is crossed with navigable rivers and until just after WW2 an awful lot of freight was carried by coastal shipping. We used to have a good rail link too until a shortsighted Tory government closed down our branch line and lifted the tracks.

Right, I know what you mean -- I can imagine a lot of places getting along just fine.


Personal motorised transport of the kind that our society now depends on is unsustainable.

No argument from me there.

I'm not saying that such a future is impossible or that society won't evolve to handle it; I'm just clarifying "why it is how it is" (to make a catchphrase out of it ;) ). I've got family in Germany who have gotten along well without a car for almost two years now (although we're going to be renting a van for a trip that just wouldn't work by rail). The public transportation system there is so much more thorough than even here in DC, it's not even funny.