"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - Who is Ready for the Future of Shifting?

Actually; I am not sure it is the future of shifting
But I am sure that right at 14 months from now you will be able to buy production
Dura Ace equipped bikes with Electronic shifters, frt der, and rear der
And there will be 3 optional shifters to mount top flat of hbar, on drop near brake lever, or barend

So who is in early ?

brings up all kinds of questions:
where will you carry your spare batteries?
how long till bluetooth with voice activation?
how soon is this the standard down to Sora?
Does it maker you want to buy a new bike or collect old ones?

{PS - normal DA stays in line**

just something fun to think about
mike

i'll leave the real world R&D to the techno-geeks.

Not me. As much as I like the techno stuff, I do not want the e-shift for whatever reason.

I'll be keeping that sh!te as far away from my bicycle as possible.

No thanks. I like standard transmissons in our cars. Why would I favor automatic shifting for my bikes.

No thanks. I like standard transmissons in our cars. Why would I favor automatic shifting for my bikes.

Where did you get the idea that Electric DA has automatic shifting?

Where did you get the idea that Electric DA has automatic shifting?

Hell if they are going to make it automatic as well they may as well make it talk too.:D

http://www.nostalgiacentral.com/images_tv/nightrider_02.JPG

New?

Zap.

A buddy of mine loved his. Then he had a battery die while doing a TT. He said life sucked that day.

I am sure I will want electronic shifting......just not yet. After it has been out for a few seasons and has been through a few generations then I will give it a real look.

Yeah, give it a few iterations, and I'm sure it will work really well. Just interested in seeing how Campy responds as I know they have a prototype as well. My concern would be in the size and position of the battery.

Didn't some pros try them out this year at the Tour? I seem to recall ...

I just bought a new 9-spd D/A brifter. I am not an early adopter. I'll try electronic shifting on my new Aerogel frame in 2020.

Nothing strikes me as being quite as pointless as introducing electronics to bicycle shifting.

We'll see.

If I'm in the market for a new group when it comes out, I'd buy it if the price falls in line with the weight and cool factor.

Is BD going to carry them?

Nothing strikes me as being quite as pointless as introducing electronics to bicycle shifting.


I take it back. The Mets signing Arod would be more pointless than that. Not much however.

Will this be wired or wireless?

if wireless how soon will we see a handheld device that auto shifts everybody around to their 53-12 while were going up a hill. Trust me it wont take long.

Wired.

I'll keep an open mind about it, but to be honest, unless it is substantially better (lighter or more reliable) I can't see switching.

sounds like the answer to a question no body asked.

sounds like the answer to a question no body asked.

Say what?

So who is in early ?

Not me, unless it's on a TT bike (with buttons on both positions).

Shimano should work on something that matters, like cable positioning.

Nothing strikes me as being quite as pointless as introducing electronics to bicycle shifting.

We'll see.
because i'm not as old as you and still have some of my memory intact:p i remember the same arguments for index shifting and sti levers. it may suck now but after it's been an the market for a year or two we'll wonder how we lived without it

Will this be wired or wireless?

if wireless how soon will we see a handheld device that auto shifts everybody around to their 53-12 while were going up a hill. Trust me it wont take long.
That might cause more chaos than the sprint finishes in the TdF (which are cleverly designed to get as many racers as possible to fall off thier bikes).

because i'm not as old as you and still have some of my memory intact:p i remember the same arguments for index shifting and sti levers. it may suck now but after it's been an the market for a year or two we'll wonder how we lived without it
Well, I'm with Pcad on this one. I've seen the stuff written about them on cyclingnews.com; but (and this is a serious question) what is the advantage? Having ridden both down tube (before and after indexed shifting) and brifter equipped bikes, I know that brifters have advantages. What are they for electronic shifting?

Well, I'm with Pcad on this one. I've seen the stuff written about them on cyclingnews.com; but (and this is a serious question) what is the advantage? Having ridden both down tube (before and after indexed shifting) and brifter equipped bikes, I know that brifters have advantages. What are they for electronic shifting?

If they do it right, it could be a LOT lighter.

I can't wait. I burn up so many calories just pedaling. Can't afford to waste 'em on shifting.

I just can't see the reduced brifter weight and cables not being made up in battery and mechanism. I'd imagine these are shifted with a servo motor.

because i'm not as old as you and still have some of my memory intact:p i remember the same arguments for index shifting and sti levers. it may suck now but after it's been an the market for a year or two we'll wonder how we lived without it

Index shifting has obvious benefits. I don't see any benefits to electronic shifting, or am I missing something ?

Is it:

Lighter ?
Less expensive ?
More reliable ?
Easier to use ?

I would need at least 1 "YES" to bother looking. Throw in the dead battery risk, and it seems a hard sell to me.

Index shifting has obvious benefits. I don't see any benefits to electronic shifting, or am I missing something ?

Is it:

Lighter ?
Less expensive ?
More reliable ?
Easier to use ?

I would need at least 1 "YES" to bother looking. Throw in the dead battery risk, and it seems a hard sell to me.

I think it could be lighter. It 'could' be easier to set up for perfect shifting.

I think there are options for good features like automatic trim of the FD when shifting the RD, and shifting from various positions on the handlebars. In theory it could take the thought out of when to shift the FD, but that might cause more problems than it fixes. Wireless would have to be in the near future too, and that would really clean up a bike.

You also won't be as limited on the brake hood shape, so more ergonomic options could be made.

But who knows, they might eff it up and it'll be overpriced, heavy and not actually work...

Next up, electric disc brakes on road bikes :)

If they do it right, it could be a LOT lighter.
Can't seem to find anything on weight. Wonder how long the battery would last riding in cold weather?

Can't seem to find anything on weight. Wonder how long the battery would last riding in cold weather?

i'm curios if they've done something like the mechtronic system, where the battery was charged by a kind of dynamo.

Wonder how long the battery would last riding in cold weather?

In January here in the Hudson Valley: 30 mins.

I just can't see the reduced brifter weight and cables not being made up in battery and mechanism. I'd imagine these are shifted with a servo motor.

Well, an R600 brake lever alone is 115g, where a brifter (D/A) is 210g. So, that's 190g right there. A shift button will weigh like 2g.

One AA battery weighs 23g (Googled, not weighed ;)). There's some wiggle room in there. The ders will gain servos, but they can lose their substantial return springs. If they keep the batteries close to the ders, we can use really thin wire, just for a digital signal to shift, rather than carrying enough current to perform the shift. This would also mean smaller batteries could be used.

Cable housings with ferrules and cables are also much heavier than, say, lamp wire. Frames can also lose their cable stops and the BB cable guides.

Well, an R600 brake lever alone is 115g, where a brifter (D/A) is 210g. So, that's 190g right there. A shift button will weigh like 2g.

One AA battery weighs 23g (Googled, not weighed ;)). There's some wiggle room in there. The ders will gain servos, but they can lose their substantial return springs. If they keep the batteries close to the ders, we can use really thin wire, just for a digital signal to shift, rather than carrying enough current to perform the shift. This would also mean smaller batteries could be used.

Cable housings with ferrules and cables are also much heavier than, say, lamp wire. Frames can also lose their cable stops and the BB cable guides.

this doesnt make any sense. are you saying a AA battery has enough voltage to perform a shift, or are you saying the AA battery is merely used to trigger the shift and then it somehow shifts on its own?

as i see it, eletronic shifting will inherently never be able to be as light as a manual shifter. you lose the weight of a shift lever for a button, and then you make it all back and more with a battery. force to shift has to come somewhere in this system. right now that force comes from our hands, and of course our hands will always be there whether we use them to shift or not. with electric shifters, now the battery does this job. the cables and housing will also all still be there unless you get fancy and go wireless. wireless however seems a pretty poor choice in my book for something as important as shifting.

If I'm in the market for a new group when it comes out, I'd buy it if the price falls in line with the weight and cool factor.

Is BD going to carry them?


YES
limited numbers to start
for those that want the newest stuff

I'm really surprised Shimano is not obsoleting their conventional cable shifters - the only way these e-shifters are going to take over the market is if they won't support the current stuff... and that would be a typical Shimano maneuver.

this doesnt make any sense. are you saying a AA battery has enough voltage to perform a shift, or are you saying the AA battery is merely used to trigger the shift and then it somehow shifts on its own?

as i see it, eletronic shifting will inherently never be able to be as light as a manual shifter. you lose the weight of a shift lever for a button, and then you make it all back and more with a battery. force to shift has to come somewhere in this system. right now that force comes from our hands, and of course our hands will always be there whether we use them to shift or not. with electric shifters, now the battery does this job. the cables and housing will also all still be there unless you get fancy and go wireless. wireless however seems a pretty poor choice in my book for something as important as shifting.

No, I'm sure it will take several batteries. My point was that when you lose the shift mechanism, you get 190g to play with, which will cover eight AA batteries.

Don't take this as a vote in favor of electronic shifting. I think e-shifting will add about as much value as paired-spoke lacing. I do think that e-shifting could save some weight though.

I'm really surprised Shimano is not obsoleting their conventional cable shifters - the only way these e-shifters are going to take over the market is if they won't support the current stuff... and that would be a typical Shimano maneuver.

- darn! now i have to [pardon] shift to Campy!

No, I'm sure it will take several batteries. My point was that when you lose the shift mechanism, you get 190g to play with, which will cover eight AA batteries.

Don't take this as a vote in favor of electronic shifting. I think e-shifting will add about as much value as paired-spoke lacing. I do think that e-shifting could save some weight though.

oh ok. im a bit skeptical it could reduce weight, but then again im no expert in batteries.

YES
limited numbers to start
for those that want the newest stuff

But you don't want to carry powertaps?

Solenoid.

They really only make sense for UCI riders on light frames that have to make up the weight limit difference with something. Electronic system will not be lighter but when your rig has to weigh fifteen pounds so what?

And people wonder why fixed gears keep getting more popular.....

Lets see...

If shimano forgets to make these rebuildable, then life would totally suck...

No way, no one has tried it, no one knows anything about it, no way would I ever want that on my bike or even try it, don't even look at it, I don't know, I don't want to know, you can't handle the truth.
As we all know, electronics are getting bigger, heavier and more expensive with time.
I'll wait for the iShift. My laptops are still running on whale oil, and that's good enough for me.

- darn! now i have to [pardon] shift to Campy!

Campy Electronicco is out in 09.

But whatever, neither of these companies knows anything about shifting. pfft.

Oh cool -- found evidence that the front derailleur uses a sensor to detect chain rub. That idea occurred to me a while ago (the last time I posted in an electronic shifting thread.. lol).

After all the electronic stuff I've got on my bike -- computer, lights -- I don't think that I want to add shifting. I'm happy to have indexing, but the hand-actuated mechanical drivetrain is the last thing that, to me, makes a bike into a go-anywhere-at-any-time machine.

For racing? Sure, why not. For a "daily driver"... nah, I don't want to bother.

Campy Electronicco is out in 09.

But whatever, neither of these companies knows anything about shifting. pfft.

If it is out in 2009 I will realistically take a look in 2011 assuming I haven't gone under a bus by then.

the beauty of the bike is the renewable energy source.

unless these are hub powered, its just needless technology, like walmart mountain bikes with more suspension than the grave digger.

what are the advantages of this? just push button control?

I'll hold off until I can say "We need more power Mr. Scott" and the bike just delivers.

I think it would be very cool if they put anti-lock breaks on a bike.

because i'm not as old as you and still have some of my memory intact:p i remember the same arguments for index shifting and sti levers. it may suck now but after it's been an the market for a year or two we'll wonder how we lived without it

Why do you hate older people in Ohio?