I have chased a lot of the old posts about powder coating in the SF/Sac area. Places that were quoted as charging $75 are now asking $150. Does anyone have recent knowledge of a place to blast and coat a frame for a reasonable price? I have a diamond frame and a Long wheelbase recumbent frame.

Tom

BR&F in Santa Clara.

Is the $150 price for you bringing in a fully stripped (of parts) frame?

Usually, blasting was included, but one place said they would bead-blast, but no guarantee that It wouldn't go higher if it took longer than "normal".

http://maasbrothersinc.com in livermore is about 150 frame and fork with color and clear coat
I've been trying to find someplace cheaper

I think there may be a place in Santa Rosa.... I'll post the info if I find out

Here's some guys that posted on Craigslist a while back and I kept note of.
I don't know how much they charge though. I don't think powder coats need
clear coating since they're pretty hard as it is.
This may be old info though.

SMAC Powder Coating, 16503693470
Maas Tech Coat, 31010 San Clemente St., Hayward, CA 94544, (510)471-6227
Miller Powder Coating 165 Cascade Ct. Rohnert Park, CA 94928 707-584-9528 Ask for Scott

BlastRadius,

I have learned that some candy and metallic powders are called 'dormant'-they must have a clear coat for them to show the correct colors.

Tom

why on EARTH would you powdercoat a steel bicycle frame (aluminum would be ok?) wouldn't that just DESTROY the "spring like temper" the metal has now?? powdercoating bakes the parts in an oven thats over 450 degrees for several hours, then cools VERY slowly (annealing or softening the metal)

someone with more knowledge on this please tell me if I'm crazy or not for thinking this.

I paint all my bikes with automotive/motorcycle polyurethane paints for this reason.

I have a guy that does powdercoating about a block from me here in santa clara (he'll do bike frames for about $50, if brought in already bead blasted) but I never took him up on it because I'm into older steel frames and I figured it would ruin the tempered steel.

am I trippin'?

I've only ever heard of powdercoating being done on aluminum frames, maybe that's the reason why.

Well, Rekon, thats a real good question.

I assumed that a steel diamond frame could be powder coated because my steel recumbent frame came powder coated from the factory. And while I know they make them ('bents) as light as they can (and still carry a 275 pound load), I don't know if they are using double or triple butted tubing, such as a diamond frame would, that might be adversely affected by heat.

The frame I want to coat is a '94 Diamondback, with lugged, double-butted chromoly tubes and a Tig-welded fork.

Are there any metallurgists (or frame builders) out there who can answer this?

And while I am at it, thanks to all the people who have responded with good info.

Tom

Rekon, thanks for the heads-up on a possible problem.

I posted your question in the frame builder section of Bike Forums, and in the tech section of another forum. The consensus is that it would take a lot more heat than 450 degrees, probably over 1000, to affect the strength of the metal. The baking temp of the powder that will be used is 392 degrees, so I think it will be safe.

Tom

Have you found a suitable powder-coater and how much are they charging?

BlastRadius,

BR&F In Santa Clara has my vote. They charge $75 per bike for blasting, coat and clear coat. They say they have a 2-3 day turnaround. 408-988-7582.

EDIT: Further communication revealed that BR&F does NOT clear coat. I'm using a transparent powder that requires a clear coat, so I'll go with Miller Powder coating in Rohnert Park, or STC in Santa Clara, ($150 per bike).

Tom

Rekon, thanks for the heads-up on a possible problem.

I posted your question in the frame builder section of Bike Forums, and in the tech section of another forum. The consensus is that it would take a lot more heat than 450 degrees, probably over 1000, to affect the strength of the metal. The baking temp of the powder that will be used is 392 degrees, so I think it will be safe.

Tom

thanks for the qualified reply,...BUT,........the way they temper steel to get a spring like effect is: AFTER heating to over 1000 degrees, and then quenching rapidly,...they heat the steel to about 450-500 degrees THEN cool slowly in an oil bath,....I heard (from our shop QA inspector: a machinist with 45 years experience) that repeating this 500 degree heat and cooling would anneal or soften the steel back to it's original non tempered state.

which is why I asked the question,....

and I still don't feel comfortable powdercoating an old steel frame (old dogs, new tricks, yada, yada)

I'll probably chrome plate it then paint just the tubes, and leave the lugs chrome.

thanks for the qualified reply,...BUT,........the way they temper steel to get a spring like effect is: AFTER heating to over 1000 degrees, and then quenching rapidly,...they heat the steel to about 450-500 degrees THEN cool slowly in an oil bath,....I heard (from our shop QA inspector: a machinist with 45 years experience) that repeating this 500 degree heat and cooling would anneal or soften the steel back to it's original non tempered state.

which is why I asked the question,....

and I still don't feel comfortable powdercoating an old steel frame (old dogs, new tricks, yada, yada)

I'll probably chrome plate it then paint just the tubes, and leave the lugs chrome.


Think about how many industrial grade pieces of equipment are powder coated. If it were to affect the strength of that steel, do you think the manufacturer would still allow it?

"This cure process, called crosslinking, requires a certain degree of temperature for a certain length of time in order to reach full cure and establish the full film properties for which the material was designed. Normally the powders cure at 200° C (390° F) in 10 minutes. The curing schedule could vary according to the manufacturer's specifications."

I don't think 10 in minutes in an oven <i>barely</i> hot enough to make cookies, will affect my steel framed bike.

Does anybody know if an alu-bike with carbon seatstays can be powder coated?
Thanks

i got my frame done at maas bros in livermore. they may be a little pricey, but they do a killer job with bike frames. a lot of bike shops get stuff done there too (including montano velo i believe).

powder coating can be hit or miss, so be careful; sometimes you get what you pay for.

Does anybody know if an alu-bike with carbon seatstays can be powder coated?

I think you're out of luck there.
The glue holding the 2 materials together is what hates the baking part of powdercoating.
Some alu/carbon frames can be powdercoated once when new, but that PC was applied & baked before the carbon pieces were added. The carbon pieces are usually clearcoated before final assembly as well.

I'm going to a place at Sears Point/Infineon Raceway tomorrow - Sears Point Powdercoating. He said he's done alot of bikes and have a wide variety of colors including metallics/candy. I'm bringing in my 63 Schwinn Bicycle Built for Two tandem. Was quoted $200 for full blast/strip and two coat metallic/candy paint. Single color is less. There is also a Powdercoater in Fairfield - on Grobic Court - they can't do metallic though - only solid colors. If you want metallic - they charge you for the cost of the powder.

I'm also looking for a good deals around santa clara. Has anyone had experiences with BR&F?

anyone got their frames powder coated yet?

Greetings, and Happy New Year!

I would like to address some of the comments on here with regard to powder coating. A quality powder coating facility is not cheap to run. For instance, our own facility uses only the highest grade media for our blasters, which are all cleaned out twice a week. We do not ever introduce oily or greasy parts into our media. We have 2 refrigerated air dryers, assuring the best possible dry surface to prepare your parts. We pre-bake all parts to eliminate random air pockets or moisture that may still be in the parts. This is all before masking parts that are not to be coated, and coating.

We do not "bead blast"; we use aluminum oxide. Many people use these synonomously. "Beads" are glass beads, that pock the surface of the metal. They do not leave a surface that is very good for adhesion, and many times, you will experience coating failure with glass bead.

Dormant colors require a clear coat. They are called "dormant" because they do not "wake up" until the clear has been applied. It is a really neat process, and I am fascinated with it every time we have a client that orders one of the Dormant color lines!

Candy colors do NOT require a clear coat, as they themselves are a tinted clear. It would be redundant putting a clear over a candy.

You can powder coat steel just fine. If anyone is using an oven and coating parts at 450 for "a few hours" they are not powder coating correctly according to the powder color cure statistics. The longest cure statistic color in our shop is about 40 minutes at 400 degrees. Even in a 2 or 3 stage, your parts are not curing in the oven for a few hours.
Aluminum is fine to powder coat as well. There are many myths on the internet that aluminum will change its physical characteristics after powder coating. Aluminum does not change molecular properties until it reaches 800F. Again, anyone powder coating at this temperature is not doing something correctly.

I used to work in R&D and Product Development at Diamondback Bicycles in Camarillo, CA before I met and married my husband who owns Andrews Powder Coating, Inc. a powder coating shop here in Chatsworth, CA. We have been in business since 1980 and have a very good reputation.

We have a lot of neat questions and answers on our website, I hope that i am not violating anything by coming on here, but I enjoyed this discussion, and hope to hear from you!

Kind regards,

Sandee Andrews
Andrews Powder Coating, Inc.

I can't believe I missed this last posting.
Thanks for the information Sandee.
What is your website so we can take a look at the QA section?

I can't believe I missed this last posting.
Thanks for the information Sandee.
What is your website so we can take a look at the QA section?

+1000!! Thanks for the great info Sandee!!

Someone earlier asked about powdercoating an aluminum bike with carbon seat stays. What is your opinion on this? Is it not possible due to the glue between the carbon and aluminum?

Thanks!

I think this is their site: http://www.powdercoater.com/

Sandee... do you have any associates you'd recommend up here in the San Francisco Bay Area?

The heat will damage the carbon fiber matrix itself. I've seen stuff from carbon bike makers saying that carbon fiber is ok up to about 150 degrees. But 400? No way. I wouldn't even think of it.

Also, make sure that any holes that need to be an exact fit (head tube where integrated BBs fit) or threaded holes are blanked off. Powder coating is difficult to remove. Ask your powder coater how best to blank them off.

We have tried powder coating carbon fiber in the past without success. We coat for a specialty manufacturer called Predator Cycling, and we do a lot of different things with their line. The carbon fiber coated ok with minimal outgassing, but when they went to put the bike together, the carbon was very relaxed due to the heat of the oven and would not work. DRAT!

Sending a bike to So Cal from San Francisco is not a problem at all. We get parts from all over the world. You can see our gallery to see the work we have done. Someone already posted a link to our website. I assumed that was against forum rules, so thank you to one of the regs!

I appreciate the welcome here! Call us anytime if you need anything!

Sandee Andrews
Andrews Powder Coating, Inc.

Great info here.

I'm wondering if anyone has used or heard anything about Crosslink Powder Coating (http://www.crosslink-powder-coating.com/) in Salinas? I am emailing them (and others) for a quote. I'd rather not do shipping or a long drive, and they are about 20 minutes away. On the other hand, experience and quality counts and I would certainly ship if necessary.

.

FWIW, I thought I'd share the cost estimates I received from three powder coaters here in California (central, southern, and northern). I sent the following inquiry to each powder coating company:

I have an aluminum bicycle frame and a chrome-moly steel bicycle fork that I would like to have powder coated. What would be the estimated cost for the media blasting and 1 color? What would the cost be if the color was candy or metallic?


Here are the three estimates I received:

Crosslink Powder Coating, Salinas, CA (http://www.crosslink-powder-coating.com/)
Standard color $175.00 with fork
Candy metallic $250-300 depending on what color


Andrews Powder Coating, Inc., Chatsworth, CA (http://www.powdercoater.com/)
The cost to do the bicycle frame will be $175 and the fork will be $45. If the frame is currently powder coated and chemical stripping is required the additional cost will be $95. We will then do a light media blast top clean the frame and to etch it in advance of the powder coating. If you wish to do a metallic finish the cost is an additional $125 for the base coat, this is our minimum set-up charge. We will do all of the masking that is required and we understand how to do bicycles correctly.


Leons Powder Coating, Oakland, CA (http://www.leonspowdercoating.com/)
$90 for the sandblasting and powder coat, or $60 for just the powder coating.
turn around time is 1 or 2 days


Stan

(cross-posted in the C&V forum)

.

From the C&V forum:

Although the price is appealing, I've heard they don't do very good work. There was a post or two in regards to this not too long ago.

I guess that "You get what you pay for" may apply.;)

Thanks for the heads up Dr. D.

For the benefit of others, here is the relevant thread with pictures :eek:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=374497

.

I have a "dumb" question regarding powdercoating. Why is that necessary for bikes? Why isn't several coats of paint and clearcoat good enough? I mean, if that works for my car...

Can someone educate me on this?

SC,

Powder coating is very durable. When I had mine done, I took in a painted frame and a powder coated one. They did a quick sandblast test on the forks. The paint came off easily; it just made the powder coat mad. They had so much trouble blasting it, they tried using chemical strippers, which they said just polished it. It is very difficult to chip or scratch, as compared to paint.

Tom

SC,

Powder coating is very durable. When I had mine done, I took in a painted frame and a powder coated one. They did a quick sandblast test on the forks. The paint came off easily; it just made the powder coat mad. They had so much trouble blasting it, they tried using chemical strippers, which they said just polished it. It is very difficult to chip or scratch, as compared to paint.

Tom

OK, so it's bulletproof. But, is it necessary for a bike? I would think my car gets much more abuse than my bike ever would. Why don't they powdercoat car bodies?

I'm not trying to be difficult here, just trying to understand ....

[FONT="Century Gothic"][SIZE="3"][COLOR="Purple"]
Also, the German car manufacturers (Porsche, BMW, Volvo, Audi, Mercedes Benz, etc) are putting clear powder coating over their production line cars.


Aiiieeeeee!!!!! Say it ain't so! One of the many wonderful things about German cars is that beautiful two-stage paint job that they usually come with.