"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - Power Tap SL

I made the plunge and bought a used PT SL off ebay, it is to arrive today. All the BF victories last year by those training with power convinced me of the benefit. Should be interesting as I've predominantly trained with perceived exertion in the past and recorded HR as a biproduct of effort. Last season family and work developments really limited my training time, and this hasnt changed, so I'm hoping the power thingy will help me and my coach really get rid of the junk, optimize my training, and direct me to race to my strengths. :)

Now, fellow BF members please be prepared for a thousand ?s on how to install, set up, record, turn on and off, and use this device ... and the charts, I'm going to need to learn how to post the charts!

Congrats! I've been training without even a recorded HR, and I'll be building my PT SL tomorrow night. Big changes ahead :D

I'll piggy back on your questions...

Welcome to the dark side.

ahahaha i cant wait til you post a graph!

Yeah it may get rid of the junk, but you'll offset that time analyzing every single number. :D

Muahh bwa ha ha. (Evil Laugh).

Graphs for all threads, I say.

im not sure how i feel about the possiblity of being out on a ride with you and not hearing a snarky comment about power numbers.

im not sure how i feel about the possiblity of being out on a ride with you and not hearing a snarky comment about power numbers.

snarky commentary will now have a self depricating tone

... and the charts, I'm going to need to learn how to post the charts!

Do you use excel? Perhaps at work?

If you don't, I suggest changing careers to a job that has you using excel 40 hours per week. You'll get pretty good at the charts.

Now, fellow BF members please be prepared for a thousand ?s on how to install, set up, record, turn on and off, and use this device ... and the charts, I'm going to need to learn how to post the charts!

And prepare for the winning race reports!

Congrats on your new toy.

And prepare for the winning race reports!



maybe i should ask for my money back. i didnt get any of those with my purchase. :p

Now, fellow BF members please be prepared for a thousand ?s on how to install, set up, record, turn on and off, and use this device ... and the charts, I'm going to need to learn how to post the charts!

Mine just came in yesterday as well, also off ebay. I'll be joining you when it comes to the barrage of posts. Installation was super easy and I was finding out how wussy I am right away.

ahahaha i cant wait til you post a graph!


This graph clearly shows that global warming is in direct relation to the decline of pirates in the world.

http://www.venganza.org/piratesarecool4.gif




Heres a pie chart showing more data


http://craphound.com/images/pacmancharthumor.jpg

Graphs?
Show your age, how many understand any of this?: :D

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/cslone/graphzz8.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/cslone/graph2he5.jpg

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/cslone/image129.png

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/cslone/image038.gif

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/cslone/image214.jpg

^yikes. not the direction I saw this thread going when I started it. Although the Pac man chart I do understand, but it looks like it is representative of the amount of pie I've eaten/day over the past week.

Hey, you wanted graphs!

Mmmm.


I like graphs.

See, nobody cares WHAT the graphs are, just that they are here. :D

Hey, what's the program most everyone uses for uploading and using the data from the PowerTap? Is there a comparable (or better) program for Macs?

Cycling Peaks if you can find a program to make it run on your Mac.

That's right. I couldn't remember it's name. Most new Macs can run Windows programs. Unfortunately #1, I own an older Mac. Unfortunately #2, the software I use for analyzing Garmin data is better on the Mac (Ascent--don't mind plugging it here as it is awesome) vs. any PC offerings.

Are there any command-line/one-click programs out there that will just download off the PT and save it directly to a file?

I'd prefer to use my own spreadsheet/logging (etc.) and was wondering if there was any quicker way to get raw data other than opening some program, importing it, naming it, exporting it, and then finding the file.

I searched around and found mention of a ptapdl.exe but I haven't been able to locate anything like it.

CSLONE:

yah, i'm very familiar with your graphs... very funny, thanks.

nice to find another cyclist who enjoys the rapping music... wow those are some really idiotic songs.
why do we listen to them again??



(I'm hot cuz I hijack threadzzz!)

How about this snarky comment: A power meter without Cycling Peaks Software is pointless.

--Steve

Are there any command-line/one-click programs out there that will just download off the PT and save it directly to a file?

I'd prefer to use my own spreadsheet/logging (etc.) and was wondering if there was any quicker way to get raw data other than opening some program, importing it, naming it, exporting it, and then finding the file.

I searched around and found mention of a ptapdl.exe but I haven't been able to locate anything like it.

You could just dload it with poweragent (native PT software) and export the CSV. I use the CSV for a certain type of file analysis. But honestly, for overall power meter usage, you'll spend a lot of time/effort doing for yourself what the Cyclingpeaks folks have already done.

How about this snarky comment: A power meter without Cycling Peaks Software is pointless.

--Steve

I can do more in Excel than Cycling Peaks can.

You could just dload it with poweragent (native PT software) and export the CSV. I use the CSV for a certain type of file analysis. But honestly, for overall power meter usage, you'll spend a lot of time/effort doing for yourself what the Cyclingpeaks folks have already done.

Yeah I know. That's what I am currently doing but I was hoping there was some solution out there that would allow me to just click one icon as opposed to going through the steps in poweragent.

I can do more in Excel than Cycling Peaks can.

It's not so much CAN as NEED. But... this coming from someone who doesn't use the PMC in Cyclingpeaks. I use one in Excel with a lot more adjustability.

Oh yeah, well do you have TSS, IF, TSB, ATL and CTL in one colorful customizable chart?

:D

No. I calculate NP, and obviously could quite easily have TSS if I wanted it. It is a colorful customizable chart. I don't know what IF, TSB, ATL, and CTL are, but if I wanted to, and knew what they were, I could add them.

Intensity Factor
Training Stress Balance-based off ATL/CTL
Acute Training Load
Chronic Training Load

How do you manually calculate NP? If it's not too terrible to explain.

No. I calculate NP, and obviously could quite easily have TSS if I wanted it. It is a colorful customizable chart. I don't know what IF, TSB, ATL, and CTL are, but if I wanted to, and knew what they were, I could add them.

IF, TSB, ATL and CTL are almost all calculated off the information required for TSS or TSS itself. If you can get TSS, you can pretty much do it all. Training with Power and the website has almost all the equations and methods. Pretty interesting to read through.


How do you manually calculate NP? If it's not too terrible to explain.It is a 30 second rolling average of the power data in watts, if I understand correctly.

Info here: http://www.twowheelblogs.com/intensity-factor-and-training-stress-score

How about this snarky comment: A power meter without Cycling Peaks Software is pointless.

--Steve

+100000000000000

Lately, I've decided that I'm not riding with a PM during winter base. Screw it. I'm giving myself a break from the calibration checks and graph analyzing and all the other cruft that comes with measureing power. I re-installed my CatEye double-wireless. That's all the computer I need for now.

Call it nerdy, but you could always install linux and then run Cycle Peaks on that...

Intensity Factor
Training Stress Balance-based off ATL/CTL
Acute Training Load
Chronic Training Load

How do you manually calculate NP? If it's not too terrible to explain.

Column A: Power
Column B: Power^4
Top Row of Column B: (Average Column B)^.25

I'd post the file, but I zipped it, and it was still 1.1 MB.

ok, now find your peak 30 second power..

Column A: Power
Column B: Power^4
Top Row of Column B: (Average Column B)^.25

I'd post the file, but I zipped it, and it was still 1.1 MB.

Where's the 30 second rolling average?

Cool EJ.

Unfortunately I am a geek for numbers but not a geek with numbers. It's quicker for CP to figure that stuff out for me. Plus again, I like the pretty colors.

I can do more in Excel than Cycling Peaks can.

Yeah, and I can calculate the square root of a number without using a calculator and can start a fire using only flint-and-steel.

--Steve

Where's the 30 second rolling average?

Column R.

Watts is actually in D, and NP is in column P. I was using A, B, etc as examples.

Yeah, and I can calculate the square root of a number without using a calculator and can start a fire using only flint-and-steel.

--Steve

Better to light a flamethrower than curse the darkness.

CP is the darkness, I say. Excel is the flamethrower.

Cool EJ.

Unfortunately I am a geek for numbers but not a geek with numbers. It's quicker for CP to figure that stuff out for me. Plus again, I like the pretty colors.

BUT I HAVE COLORS! LOOK AT THE COLORS!

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w309/eljamoquio/excel-1.jpg

Column R.

Watts is actually in D, and NP is in column P. I was using A, B, etc as examples.

I still don't see the 30 second rolling average in your example. It looks like you take raw power, raise it to the 4th power, average, and take the 4th root.

BUT I HAVE COLORS! LOOK AT THE COLORS!

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w309/eljamoquio/excel-1.jpg

I keep hitting the "start" button on your graph but nothing's happening. And I can't get the browser to work either. What am I doing wrong?

Oh yeah, well do you have TSS, IF, TSB, ATL and CTL in one colorful customizable chart?

:D

Do you have a rolling 7 day average TSS? (not weighted, ala ATL)
Rolling 28 day TSS?
CTL Ramp rate?
Does Cyclingpeaks allow a scale for your weight that doesn't start at 0? (like I ever plan to weigh less than 160?)
Calorie intake?
Perceived Exertion to TSB comparison?
How about an entry for PE at all?

Cyclingpeaks is way inferior in graphing capability to anything Excel can put up against it. I use cyclingpeaks to examine actual power files, comparing sections based on both average and normalized power. I use it to do all the power file math for me (to get Normalized Power/IF/TSS). I use it to examine and compare heart rate/power output information when I feel like it - but almost exclusively for single rides at a time. For the PMC and long term training stress (as well as diet management in my case), I've found Excel to be a far superior tool - especially when it comes to planning workouts based on desired TSS.

For the PMC and long term training stress (as well as diet management in my case), I've found Excel to be a far superior tool - especially when it comes to planning workouts based on desired TSS.

Which is why you should offer up your spreadsheet so we can eyeball it :)

Seriously, I find gaps in CP's abilities. I used to write the odd Excel program but have gotten lazy. Love to see what you've come up with.

http://www.cycleiwakuni.com/download.php?file=Tsb-planner-07.xls

This is last year's. I've made modifications to it based on the Excel 2007 functionalities for my 2008. It's hefty @ 5 mb.

I still don't see the 30 second rolling average in your example. It looks like you take raw power, raise it to the 4th power, average, and take the 4th root.

Rolling 30 second average is just that, in column R. Average(D... : D...).

I keep hitting the "start" button on your graph but nothing's happening. And I can't get the browser to work either. What am I doing wrong?

You're not using Excel. Excel should be used for everything.

You can do a lot in Excel if you are mathematically inclined and decent with computers. Should you program training software yourself instead of buying CP? Probably not.

Personally I enjoy playing around with my data in Excel. Different strokes for different folks.

I am willing to wager my excel sheet is one of the most complicated on the board and can do stuff that CP can't. It's only 6,295KB.