Classic & Vintage - Questions about what I think I have learned from BF....

I have been looking/learning from BF and have a few questions about what I may have learned........btw I am using this knowledge to buy and restore (learning how to) bikes as a hobby (change of lifestyle). I don't want to waste my time on junk........

1. Peugeot; good quality older French bike; people gripe about the BB threads.... We have metric and standard; I must be missing the point somewhere.....?
2. Lugged frames are a general sign of a "better bike".....?
3. You can't hardly go wrong with most Schwinns.......?
4. You can use any "quality" grease with success (allowing for differing climates)......:rolleyes:......
4a. You can "brew" your own satisfactory chain lube..............
5. WD-40 is a solvent, not a lube...??
6. Loose ball bearings are better than caged........??
7. Sheldon Brown is God.............
8. It is very difficult to get bike decals unless you are a frame painter or have a note from God (Sheldon Brown).

Thanks for your insights and responses.......

1) Some Peugeots are good others are not quite as good (U08), threading (metric/french vs English) varies
depending on age of bike.
2) Some boom era lugged bikes were junk.
3) no argument here.
4) we discussed grease ?
4a) Olive oil for italian bike? just go buy some at LBS
5) correct
6) either works for me
7) one of many in the vintage bike world
8) wrong, contact JRestore or Greg Softley.

and I should add
9) Dutch bikes just might be the most bang for the buck in vintage bikes.

marty

Dutch brands???? When was the boom era???

Bike Boom was in the early to mid 70's
see this thread:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=374751
Dutch bikes: Batavus, Gazelle, Concorde (actually italian built), Koga Miyata (japanese built dutch
design).
then there are the oddball marques, de Reus, Remy, RIH, Zieleman, Jabo, Joco, Locomotief.

Marty

I have been looking/learning from BF and have a few questions about what I may have learned........btw I am using this knowledge to buy and restore (learning how to) bikes as a hobby (change of lifestyle). I don't want to waste my time on junk........

1. Peugeot; good quality older French bike; people gripe about the BB threads.... We have metric and standard; I must be missing the point somewhere.....?

The worst Peugeot (UO-8,) is a big step above 90% of what Schwinn ever made, Schwinn made bikes that would last forever, but I can't get past the weight, a road bike should not be 40+ lbs...


2. Lugged frames are a general sign of a "better bike".....?

True, but there are allways exceptions, in the 80's a lot of decent french bikes were internally lugged. Also, the fillet-brazed Schwinns are supposed to be pretty good.


3. You can't hardly go wrong with most Schwinns.......?

Depends on what you want, would I go back to my EF Schwinn Continential as an everyday ride?? Not a chance..


4. You can use any "quality" grease with success (allowing for differing climates)......:rolleyes:......
4a. You can "brew" your own satisfactory chain lube..............
5. WD-40 is a solvent, not a lube...??
6. Loose ball bearings are better than caged........??


7. Sheldon Brown is God.............
not even going to touch that one. lol


8. It is very difficult to get bike decals unless you are a frame painter or have a note from God (Sheldon Brown).

E-bay is your friend, decals are out there.


Thanks for your insights and responses.......

You forgot two important notes:

1. East Hill always requests pictures.

2. Mr. Brown has search agents enabled, and tends to pop into threads when his name is mentioned. :)

Hope you're being made welcome and plan to stick around. There's always more to learn - and that applies to all of us.

The worst Peugeot (UO-8,) is a big step above 90% of what Schwinn ever made, Schwinn made bikes that would last forever, but I can't get past the weight, a road bike should not be 40+ lbs...
I'm aways surprised when statements like this are made. It's as though all Schwinn ever built was forty pound electro-forged Varsities and Continentals, and the Paramounts, Pelotons, Circuits, Voyageurs, Volares, etc., never existed. :rolleyes:

2. Well, I think most people in this forum would agree (and especially as a general rule of applicability to mass produced bikes), but keep in mind you are posting in C&V where most people are biased toward the classic lugged steel frames. Lug-less fillet brazed frames and welded frames can be of equal quality, but there's just something about the beautiful, classic aesthetics of a lugged frame.

I bet there's even some poor, deluded souls over in the roadies forums that would tell you that their plastic bikes are good quality.

4. True, subject to servicing and repacking bearings at regular intervals. But in a world where "Phil Wood's Waterproof Grease" exists, why would you gamble on anything else?

4a. True, but why? There are good quality chain lubes available for reasonable prices. These guys that concoct their own to save one-half cent per application are getting a bit carried away with themselves, IMO.

5. True.

6. Generally true, but a small and probably overstated point. The retaining rings space the balls out, while using loose balls allows you to put in a couple more balls in place of the spaces (you still need to leave some space to avoid binding, generally equal to the space that one ball would occupy). More balls should translate into slightly better load distribution. But if you inspect, repack, and replace bearings at regular intervals, the difference is nominal.

7. Our god is a generous god.

I'm aways surprised when statements like this are made. It's as though all Schwinn ever built was forty pound electro-forged Varsities and Continentals, and the Paramounts, Pelotons, Circuits, Voyageurs, Volares, etc., never existed. :rolleyes:


Sadly, in the wild, in the hinterlands.... You won't see many Paramounts and Pelotons popping up.

For every Paramount you will find a couple of thousand Varsitys, Contis and Worlds....

Well, listen closer...

1. Peugeot; good quality older French bike; people gripe about the BB threads.... We have metric and standard; I must be missing the point somewhere.....?
French threads in general hard to find these days, but no real problem if you have the parts you need. But I typically avoid French bikes!

2. Lugged frames are a general sign of a "better bike".....?
Just one thing to look for. Chrome and Campagnolo dropouts are other good signs...

3. You can't hardly go wrong with most Schwinns.......?
Umm, unless its a Paramount, I'm not interested...

4. You can use any "quality" grease with success (allowing for differing climates)............
White grease from the auto parts store is just fine.

4a. You can "brew" your own satisfactory chain lube..............
I used to use motor oil, now TriFlow.

5. WD-40 is a solvent, not a lube...??
BS. Spray some in a container and see what's left in a few days when the propellent evaporates: oil.

6. Loose ball bearings are better than caged........??
I don't really think so, either seem to work just fine...

7. Sheldon Brown is God.............
He sure knows a lot!

8. It is very difficult to get bike decals unless you are a frame painter or have a note from God (Sheldon Brown). Its getting much better.

a frame question I forgot to ask...........does a frame with the dérailleur hanger as an integral part of the frame indicate a better frame???

and thanks for the input!!!!!!!!!!!

2. Mr. Brown has search agents enabled, and tends to pop into threads when his name is mentioned. :)



I should do that! That would help my eternal search for those threads which lack the requisite photos.

Taking a page from the master's book:

East "Photos?" Hill

a frame question I forgot to ask...........does a frame with the dérailleur hanger as an integral part of the frame indicate a better frame???

and thanks for the input!!!!!!!!!!!

It is an indicator, but like just about every other rule about bicycles, there are exceptions.

1. I avoid the french at almost all costs. For my normal flippers many times parts need to be replaced. I have a ton of parts to use, but zero are french. The few french bikes I have had (couple lower end 80's Pugs and a couple of Motos) have been a pain to work on. It is just not the BB threading, the stem diameter is different, rear freewheel threading can be, and so can pedal threading be different. If I found a PX-10 or an other upper end French bike I will buy it in a heartbeat, but the lower end ones I usually pass on.
2. NO!!! Back in the day that was the way bikes were made even down to bottom of the barrel gas pipe bike booms bikes. Down tube shifters, integral derailleur hanger, tubing decal, and forged dropouts are better signs of quality than just being lugged.
3. I will always pass up every Varsities and Contis even if they are free. Schwinn did make a lot of nice bikes, but a lot of lower end junk IMHO. But, a 70'/80's lugged Schwinn road bike at a resonable price I will buy in a heartbeat.
4., 4a, 5, and 6 sure
7. YES, when it comes to bikes he is. All Hail Sheldon!!
8. like mentioned above EBay

Sadly, in the wild, in the hinterlands.... You won't see many Paramounts and Pelotons popping up.

For every Paramount you will find a couple of thousand Varsitys, Contis and Worlds....

I do. I own three Paramounts and a Peloton and none of them were that expensive. I have also had a lot of their "midrange" bikes come through my shop including tons of LeTours, Passage, Prelude, Voyageurs, as well as others. I wouldn't trade any of them for a U08 Pug.

I do. I own three Paramounts and a Peloton and none of them were that expensive. I have also had a lot of their "midrange" bikes come through my shop including tons of LeTours, Passage, Prelude, Voyageurs, as well as others. I wouldn't trade any of them for a U08 Pug.
Same here. The heaviest Schwinn I ever owned was a '72 fillet brazed chrome-moly Super Sport that weighed 32 pounds (Ashtabula one-piece crank) and was indestructable.

To each his own. I guess it's a good thing we don't all want the same things (UO-8s). :D

Same here. The heaviest Schwinn I ever owned was a '72 fillet brazed chrome-moly Super Sport that weighed 32 pounds (Ashtabula one-piece crank) and was indestructable.

To each his own. I guess it's a good thing we don't all want the same things (UO-8s). :D

It probably depends on your proximity to a large city, redxj is not all that far from Detroit. I'm deep in Ohio farm country.

I have two UO-8's but only one is staying, I don't flip bikes, so the french stuff is not really a problem. If you compare vintage french lightweights to some of my other hobbies, like early 20th century wood and metal working machinery, french parts are easy as heck to find. Try finding a lower wheel for a 1928 Crescent 20" bandsaw...:D or the Zamak cast F-N-R gearbox to a '34 Atlas 9" lathe. French Bikes are easy :D

It probably depends on your proximity to a large city, redxj is not all that far from Detroit. I'm deep in Ohio farm country.

I have two UO-8's but only one is staying, I don't flip bikes, so the french stuff is not really a problem. If you compare vintage french lightweights to some of my other hobbies, like early 20th century wood and metal working machinery, french parts are easy as heck to find. Try finding a lower wheel for a 1928 Crescent 20" bandsaw...:D or the Zamak cast F-N-R gearbox to a '34 Atlas 9" lathe. French Bikes are easy :D

You tell 'em Aaron!

I notice some folks are very practicle when choosing a vintage bike. That would not include me. It's purely emmotional. If you grew up lusting after a UO-8 or a Schwinn Varsity or rode a Continental in college and would like to relive your youth then get one. That's what it's all about to me.

You tell 'em Aaron!

I notice some folks are very practicle when choosing a vintage bike. That would not include me. It's purely emmotional. If you grew up lusting after a UO-8 or a Schwinn Varsity or rode a Continental in college and would like to relive your youth then get one. That's what it's all about to me.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not anti-Schwinn, I'd take a Paramount if one crossed my path cheap. I have a '75 LeTour downstairs that might even live again. And I really like the 80's Mississippi Schwinns.

I just rail against the attitude that everything Schwinn is good, outside this community, in the general populace there are a whole lot of people (who probably don't ride) Who still think everything Schwinn is gold plated.

Don't let the avatar fool you, most of my favorite stuff is English.

I'm aways surprised when statements like this are made. It's as though all Schwinn ever built was forty pound electro-forged Varsities and Continentals, and the Paramounts, Pelotons, Circuits, Voyageurs, Volares, etc., never existed. :rolleyes:


+1. Tempos and Preludes aren't bad either. Very nice lug work and Columbus Tenax tubing. Even the midrange models were pretty decent by the mid eighties.,,,,BD

3. I will always pass up every Varsities and Contis even if they are free.Let "Sierra" and I know if you stumble across any free '60 - '66 Varsities or Continentals in nice shape. (Same goes for Sierras, Super Continentals, Superiors and Super Sports ... I call "dibs" on any violet Super Sports -- free or otherwise). :D

Bob

+1. Tempos and Preludes aren't bad either. Very nice lug work and Columbus Tenax tubing. Even the midrange models were pretty decent by the mid eighties.,,,,BD

I had a Tempo, years ago. I bought it new in the mid-eighties. It might have been the nicest (new) bike I ever owned. Shimano 105 components, with indexed downtube shifters and Biopace chainrings. I rode the hell out of it, lent it to my brother for a year for him to use while he worked as a New York City bike messenger (and it took the beating that entails very well), took it back, rode it some more, and finally it was stolen in 2000, if I remember right. I miss that bike.

I had a Tempo, years ago. I bought it new in the mid-eighties. It might have been the nicest (new) bike I ever owned. Shimano 105 components, with indexed downtube shifters and Biopace chainrings. I rode the hell out of it, lent it to my brother for a year for him to use while he worked as a New York City bike messenger (and it took the beating that entails very well), took it back, rode it some more, and finally it was stolen in 2000, if I remember right. I miss that bike.


Want another one? The frame on mine is too small, and it's stripped down (bare frame with HS and BB) at the moment. What size frame do you ride?,,,,BD

Turquoise and white. Here it is in it's last incarnation. It was about the time I realized it was too small.:(


http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n267/Kustombyker/TurqTempo.jpg

Still have the fork?
Looks too big for me, anyway.
Top

Here's something I've learned over the years, but not here:

Always use Never Seize on your freewheel and pedal threads, and grease the stem and seatpost where it goes into the frame. Someone 20-30 years from now will love you for it!

Well, listen closer...

5. WD-40 is a solvent, not a lube...??
BS. Spray some in a container and see what's left in a few days when the propellent evaporates: oil.
It's refreshing to see some disagreement with what seems to have become orthodoxy in the bike world. According to the MSDS for WD-40 (which you can find here (http://www.wd40.com/Brands/msds_usa.html)), the "aerosol" version is 15 to 25% petroleum based oil, and the "bulk" (which comes in small squeeze-spray bottles) is 30-35%. When people say it's "not a lubricant," I guess they're making a judgment that its not viscous enough for their purposes. But, if you've ever stepped on the puddle of it that was oversprayed on your linoleum a week ago, you have little doubt that it's a lubricant.

The Schwinn thing...
For a fun project, there is a lot in favor of one of the electro forged Schwinns:
1) Parts availability. Yes there are some peculiarly sized parts (stems), but in a pinch, most of these are available - I think Wald even makes a stem that fits.
2) Durable. There aren't any known parts on a Schwinn - even a Japanese or Taiwanese Schwinn - that are likely to fail.
3) maintainable. The only special tools you'll need to disembowel say a 3 speed Traveler down to the frame are a hammer, a block of wood, a large adjustable wrench, a punch and a flat bladed screwdriver. Convert that to a Varsinental and add in a freewheel remover and a vise. (vice ? :) ) For a Raleigh or Peugeot you're looking at cottered cranks and some bottom bracket tools. Not that tools are a bad thing, but to test the waters, so to speak, the Schwinns are less demanding on the budget.
4) they may ride differently than we expect a road bike to ride, but is that so wrong? It's just different.
5) after about '74, the Letours, Voyageurs, and Travelers are really pretty decent bikes, some in plain steel, some chromo. The 74 Traveler frame I have still uses a funky stem, but later versions became more and more standard. I think they're largely underrated bikes. After 83, darned near everything was chromoly, meaning a mid 80's World Sport (I think) is a real bargain. Replace some of the components and it's a sleeper, IMO.

This is not to discredit Peugeots, Raleighs, or anything else, only to point out that an electro-forged Schwinn is a very low risk first project. Even if you ball it up, it's probably savable.

Want another one? The frame on mine is too small, and it's stripped down (bare frame with HS and BB) at the moment. What size frame do you ride?,,,,BD

Turquoise and white. Here it is in it's last incarnation. It was about the time I realized it was too small.:(


That's the same color scheme I had. Unfortunately, that's too small for me. I might well buy one just like it, but if I remember right, the one I had (which fit me perfectly) was the biggest frame they made.