Bicycle Mechanics - Alcohol as a chain solvent.

I want to soak my chain in solvent. I already have isopropal alcohol. Will this work? Is there something better?

Well there is some really nasty stuff that will clean your chain really well, but it's quite carcinogenic if you're exposed to it on a regular basis!

As far as reasonable solvents go, mineral spirits or kerosene would probably be better than alcohol. Maybe some chemistry experts can chime in here.

Well there is some really nasty stuff that will clean your chain really well, but it's quite carcinogenic if you're exposed to it on a regular basis!

Now what would that be, hydrazine?

EDIT: that was intended as a joke. Hydrazine will etch silicon, and your skin, too. It's also extremely carcinogenic AND hallucinogenic. You'll be high and and good to die before you know it. To top it all off, it's extremely explosive.

But I'm sure a hydrazine solution would clean that chain in no time.

Mineral spirits. Evaporates quickly and its low odor too. Lp

Methyl Ethyl Ketone (MEK) is my favorite. Available in paint stores.

Methyl Ethyl Ketone (MEK) is my favorite. Available in paint stores.

Yeah, MEK is strong stuff. Used to use it on weapons systems.

Here's the material safety data sheet on MEK (http://www.jtbaker.com/msds/englishhtml/M4628.htm).

Yeah, MEK is strong stuff. Used to use it on weapons systems.

Here's the danger sheet on MEK (http://www.jtbaker.com/msds/englishhtml/M4628.htm).
The "danger sheet" (aka MSDS) for MEK is really pretty benign. Other than high flamability it's toxicity profile isn't too bad.

Just for kicks look up the MSDS for gasoline. If you saw it without being familiar with the stuff, you wouldn't let anybody near it under any circumstances. And, yet, we use it on a daily basis and have huge quantities stored in unsecured locations in nearly every neighborhood and dispensed by completely untrained personel.

I believe isopronal would work fine. Dissovles oils and waxes. Washes out with water, especially rinsing the cleaned chain with hot water.

I noticed some isopronal in the dollar stores have a concentration of is 50% and some 70%. I would go with the higher concentration.

Let us know how it works out.

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ

I noticed some isopronal in the dollar stores have a concentration of is 50% and some 70%. I would go with the higher concentration.

Let us know how it works out.

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ
Regular drug stores, Wal-Mart, etc. also carry a 90% IPA solution. Go with it.

I don't think petroleum based oils are soluable in alcohol. If put a drop of motor oil in methanol it sinks to the bottom. I dont have any isopropyl alcohol to try, and I already drank all the ethyl alcohol in the house.

I don't think petroleum based oils are soluable in alcohol. If put a drop of motor oil in methanol it sinks to the bottom. I dont have any isopropyl alcohol to try, and I already drank all the ethyl alcohol in the house.

Isopropanol dissolves most lipids. Try it. It is different in that sense from ethanol or methanol.

Also: methanol is toxic. Methanol fumes are toxic. I hope you have none in your house! I have no idea how you experimented with it, but caution is advised.

Mineral spirits works well.....

I like good old Simple Green, seems to work well enough.

Mineral spirits works well.....

+1 or gas

Berryman B-12 carburetor parts cleaner. Smells evil, and works like nothing else. Will also strip paint off of deraillers with painted accents, lol.,,,,BD

I guess I don't understand the reasoning for using such harsh solvents for cleaning your chains. Most water based degreasers work just as well.

It's my reasoning, no one needs to understand it but me. Water based is water based. What do you have to get it off the chain with, water? Most water based degreasers are thick and syrupy in my experience, and need to be rinsed off somehow. The stuff I use evaporates quickly, and ends with the chain dry and ready to re-lube.,,,,BD

I guess I don't understand the reasoning for using such harsh solvents for cleaning your chains. Most water based degreasers work just as well.
How about rust?

How about rust?

Never let my chain get super rusty. But I went on a muddy MTB ride a week and a half ago. Immediately thereafter I hosed down the drivetrain with just water. It's been sitting in my apartment since and surface rust developed all over the chain, but once I lubed it with Tri-Flow, it all went away.

I guess I don't understand the reasoning for using such harsh solvents for cleaning your chains. Most water based degreasers work just as well.

-1

Water-based degreasing is sub-par. I can think of no advantage to mineral spirit (yes, it's my degreaser of choice, too, joining the choir) whatsoever eccept price - maybe. But the truth is, detergent-based degreasers won't be able to remove old grease and dirt from the most intimate parts of the chain, try as you may.

I was in a friend's apartment - had been through some snow, ice, and salt on my bike. Wanted to clean the gunk off the chain. All I had with me was my wax based lube - no solvents around to use for cleaning the chain.

So, I took some "full strength" dish washing detergent and a sponge (both of which I used prior to the chain cleaning to clean the rest of the bike), "lubed" the chain with the soap, folded the sponge over the chain while I rotated the pedals for a few minutes, used my water bottle to squirt a water rinse onto the chain, re lubed, chain is clean as a whistle.

I did this using my friend's apartment bathtub.

Waterbased solvents won't hurt your chain, and rust can't develop unless you allow water drops to stand on the chain surface long enough for oxidation to occur.

Caruso

I was in a friend's apartment - had been through some snow, ice, and salt on my bike. Wanted to clean the gunk off the chain. All I had with me was my wax based lube - no solvents around to use for cleaning the chain.

So, I took some "full strength" dish washing detergent and a sponge (both of which I used prior to the chain cleaning to clean the rest of the bike), "lubed" the chain with the soap, folded the sponge over the chain while I rotated the pedals for a few minutes, used my water bottle to squirt a water rinse onto the chain, re lubed, chain is clean as a whistle.

I did this using my friend's apartment bathtub.

Waterbased solvents won't hurt your chain, and rust can't develop unless you allow water drops to stand on the chain surface long enough for oxidation to occur.

Caruso


I agree wholeheartedly, I wasn't arguing that at all. I just say that as a degreaser solvent and cleaner, it's nowhere as efficient as any of the organic solvents.

Rust, after using a water base degreaser? Nope I re lube my chain after cleaning which I'm sure most people do. I live in the Northwest so my chain is wet most of the time while riding and I have never had a problem with rust on the chain. My perfered way of cleaning is putting Simple Green in a 2ltr bottle putting the chain in and shaking. It comes out very clean this way I don't have to worry about disposing of the solvents mentioned.

The solvents are not the problem, but the microscopic metallic shawings in them, and you have them whether you used detergent based or organic solvents. That thin metallic dust contains mostly iron, but also, sadly, chromium and other alloying metals.

That, and the dissolved lubricants - some of them can be somewhat noxious.

BUT not MY chain lubricant - I use a biodegradable chain lube!

I believe isopronal would work fine. Dissovles oils and waxes. Washes out with water, especially rinsing the cleaned chain with hot water.

I noticed some isopronal in the dollar stores have a concentration of is 50% and some 70%. I would go with the higher concentration.

Let us know how it works out.

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ

Any short chain alcohol from 2-butanol to methanol is too polar to do a good job of dissolving long chain aliphatic hydrocarbons. If it will dissolve in water, it won't do a good job on oil. Acetone, MEK, MiPK (methyl isopropyl ketone) are also too polar to do a good job.

Mineral spirits (both kinds), naphtha, kerosene and diesel oil all do a good job because they have the same polarity as the oil. The key is if it won't dissolve in water..."like dissolves like"..., it will probably dissolve oil. Even vegetable oil would probably work but removing it would be more difficult then removing the oil and wax of the chain lube. I suggest mineral spirits because it evaporates more quickly than the other solvents.

Simple green and, to a lesser extent, dish soap work by playing a little chemical trick on the oil. Detergents have a part of the molecule that likes water and a part that doesn't. Put them in water and the water hating part turns around like musk ox protecting their calves and puts the part that likes water looking out. Along comes a little oil molecule seeking shelter from that nasty water and it goes right into middle of the detergent bubble...called a micelle. It's happy now and will go anywhere the micelle goes, i.e. down the drain. It works but there is only so much oil the micelles can dissolve...much, much less than a true solvent will handle.

Waterbased solvents won't hurt your chain, and rust can't develop unless you allow water drops to stand on the chain surface long enough for oxidation to occur.

Caruso

Not against you personally, but the water based solvent thing in general. They all leave a soapy residue unless rinsed off, at least every one I've ever used. And for some reason I don't know why, simple green
reacts badly with my mucous membranes. Just the smell of it makes me feel like I have a cough coming on. Must be the perfume in it. If it had no smell or a low smell, I would probably use it.,,,,BD

Not against you personally, but the water based solvent thing in general. They all leave a soapy residue unless rinsed off, at least every one I've ever used. And for some reason I don't know why, simple green
reacts badly with my mucous membranes. Just the smell of it makes me feel like I have a cough coming on. Must be the perfume in it. If it had no smell or a low smell, I would probably use it.,,,,BD

Some toxics-conscious people are claiming that the ethylene glycol butyl ether (EGBE) in Simple Green is hazardous. Others who make their living through the manufacture or sale of Simple Green, EGBE or chemicals in general claim that the concentration is low enough to be safe. I'd say the precautionary principle should prevail in this case, especially since there are many alternatives. Let the yaysayers pay for more studies to buttress their case.

Also, there is anecdotal evidence out there that soaking chains in Simple Green will damage them. Just take that bottle to your next hazardous waste dropoff day.

As for rubbing alcohol and chains, running the chain through a rag dampened with isopropyl should do a nice job keeping the exterior free of dust-attracting excess lube.

I have used Castrol Superclean (also the knock offs like Purple Power) with excellent results. I used a 2 liter with about 200 ml of Superclean, shake vigorously, drain the liquid into a 2nd botle for reuse, add 200 ml of hot water into bottle with chain, shake vigorously, dispose down drain. Repeat 2 more times. Remove chain, rinse with small stream of hot water working each link under the hot water stream. You can feel the link comoing clean as you work each link. Allow chain to dry overnite. Allow the used solvent to settle out, decant and dispose of the gunk at bottom. Reuse the solvent again.

John Hawrylak
Woodstown NJ

Not against you personally, but the water based solvent thing in general. They all leave a soapy residue unless rinsed off, at least every one I've ever used. And for some reason I don't know why, simple green
reacts badly with my mucous membranes. Just the smell of it makes me feel like I have a cough coming on. Must be the perfume in it. If it had no smell or a low smell, I would probably use it.,,,,BD

The other issue to consider with water based degreasers and rinsing them off is that water has a high surface tension. On the outside of the chain, the water will come off readily but inside the rollers and in between the plates, the water is going to be more tenacious. That's where the real damage can be done in terms of rust forming anyway. Rust the outside all you want but rust the inside and you're asking for trouble...and a lot of squeakiness;)

Simple green and, to a lesser extent, dish soap work by playing a little chemical trick on the oil. Detergents have a part of the molecule that likes water and a part that doesn't. Put them in water and the water hating part turns around like musk ox protecting their calves and puts the part that likes water looking out. Along comes a little oil molecule seeking shelter from that nasty water and it goes right into middle of the detergent bubble...called a micelle. It's happy now and will go anywhere the micelle goes, i.e. down the drain. It works but there is only so much oil the micelles can dissolve...much, much less than a true solvent will handle.

This is interesting. I also have breathing problems around Simple Green; it makes me cough like crazy when only a small amount is sprayed in my vicinity.

Cyccommute, you've now convinced me. Per your post about rust in the chain, I will just point out to those who use water that one of the best ways to avoid having water residue on anything is to make it very hot and therefore quick to evaporate. I find it incredibly frustrating to watch people wash dishes with running cold water when all they need to do is put on some gloves and turn up the hot, it's so wasteful and not as effective.

Oh, and if you're using Simple Green, while the solvent and water are 'bio-friendly' or whatever, they're still slinking down your drain with all that oil sludge and metals, which isn't even great for your plumbing pipes, let alone the sewage and water endpoints.

Oh, and if you're using Simple Green, while the solvent and water are 'bio-friendly' or whatever, they're still slinking down your drain with all that oil sludge and metals, which isn't even great for your plumbing pipes, let alone the sewage and water endpoints.

WIN!!!

Isopropanol dissolves most lipids. Try it. It is different in that sense from ethanol or methanol.

Also: methanol is toxic. Methanol fumes are toxic. I hope you have none in your house! I have no idea how you experimented with it, but caution is advised.
Isopropanol will work better than methanol or ethanol, but it's still crappy compared to something with long hydrophobic chains like kerosene. The gunk you're most likely trying to clean off is dirt and grit stuck in the lubrication you're using on your chain, which is (usually) oil-based. So best bet is something designed to solublize oils. Paint thinner should work very well, too.

How do the citrus based degreasers stack up against the hydrocarbon solvents? Or are they the water-based solvents that have been mentioned so far? Pardon me if I am confused. It's been a long time since HS chemistry class!

How do the citrus based degreasers stack up against the hydrocarbon solvents? Or are they the water-based solvents that have been mentioned so far?

Good question, actually. I never used citrus degreasers, but looking around the 'net, it seems that it's a chemical called d-Limonene and that
a. can be used on its own to dissolve grease and oils, in addition to adhesives of various kind and
b. can be diluted in water, in which case it works as a detergent.

These two facts put together fly in the face of cyccommute was saying - he stated that anything that dissolves in water will not work as a good solvent for lubes (I have a different personal experience, but will keep it for myself for now).

Isopropanol dissolves most lipids. Try it. It is different in that sense from ethanol or methanol.

Also: methanol is toxic. Methanol fumes are toxic. I hope you have none in your house! I have no idea how you experimented with it, but caution is advised.


Thanks wroomwroomoops. Good information. That is helpful. I use methanol as fuel for small engines and years ago I looked for an alternative lubricant to the usual castor oil. That is how I learned that motor oil would not dissolve. I am aware it is toxic.

What about ethanol, like Everclear?

What about ethanol, like Everclear?
there are better uses for it.

I guess I don't understand the reasoning for using such harsh solvents for cleaning your chains. Most water based degreasers work just as well.

FWIW, the guys at KMC say the quickest way to kill a chain is to soak in solvents.

You are far better off cleaning it with a light lube than immersing it in solvents.

FWIW, the guys at KMC say the quickest way to kill a chain is to soak in solvents.

You are far better off cleaning it with a light lube than immersing it in solvents.

I've stopped deep cleaning chains; I wipe them down regularly with clean rags, then with ProGold ProLink-saturated rags.

Good question, actually. I never used citrus degreasers, but looking around the 'net, it seems that it's a chemical called d-Limonene and that
a. can be used on its own to dissolve grease and oils, in addition to adhesives of various kind and
b. can be diluted in water, in which case it works as a detergent.

These two facts put together fly in the face of cyccommute was saying - he stated that anything that dissolves in water will not work as a good solvent for lubes (I have a different personal experience, but will keep it for myself for now).

Actually thats not quite what he said. Yes, like dissolves like but some substances like detergents are organic compounds that are amphipathic, meaning they contain both hydrophobic groups (their "tails") and hydrophilic groups (their "heads"). Therefore, they are soluble in both organic solvents and water!

Its like they are part fat part water and therefore will dissolve in either oil or water;)

Another vote for Purple Power and it's caustic kin. You do need to wear rubber gloves with this stuff- it will eat the oil out of your skin and turn it to soap!

I submerge the chain in an old Tupperware container full of PP, and snap the lid on. I leave it for a couple days, though a much shorter time would be fine. Once the PP has worked it's way into the goop, a quick brushing will loosen all the external crud. I then rinse the chain in water and put it back in the container with PP for a good shake. Another water rinse and it seems like new. I use compressed air to dry the chain, but a quick bake in a toaster oven at 200 deprees or so would also suffice.

My chains cleaned in this manner seem very clean inside when flexed. No gritty noises or feel.

If there's substantial rust on the chain, a bath in my electrolytic rust removal tank will leave it rust free.

Darron

I'm just going to replace my chain next time it gets diry.

I like good old Simple Green, seems to work well enough.

Use the old SG all the time...it's cheap, effective, and won't ruin the water table. Not sure what everyone is doing with their MEK or gasoline when they're done cleaning that chain....

Use the old SG all the time...it's cheap, effective, and won't ruin the water table. Not sure what everyone is doing with their MEK or gasoline when they're done cleaning that chain.... Hopefully not smoking.

Actually thats not quite what he said. Yes, like dissolves like but some substances like detergents are organic compounds that are amphipathic, meaning they contain both hydrophobic groups (their "tails") and hydrophilic groups (their "heads"). Therefore, they are soluble in both organic solvents and water!

Its like they are part fat part water and therefore will dissolve in either oil or water;)

Actually, I can read (unbelievable perhaps, but true), and what you are now talking about was his explanation of how detergents work:


Simple green and, to a lesser extent, dish soap work by playing a little chemical trick on the oil. Detergents have a part of the molecule that likes water and a part that doesn't. Put them in water and the water hating part turns around like musk ox protecting their calves and puts the part that likes water looking out. Along comes a little oil molecule seeking shelter from that nasty water and it goes right into middle of the detergent bubble...called a micelle. It's happy now and will go anywhere the micelle goes, i.e. down the drain. It works but there is only so much oil the micelles can dissolve...much, much less than a true solvent will handle.

I was NOT alluding to this explanation, with which I agree and still remember it from high school chemistry (but much more foggishly than cycc). I was alluding to this:

Any short chain alcohol from 2-butanol to methanol is too polar to do a good job of dissolving long chain aliphatic hydrocarbons. If it will dissolve in water, it won't do a good job on oil.

Use the old SG all the time...it's cheap, effective, and won't ruin the water table. Not sure what everyone is doing with their MEK or gasoline when they're done cleaning that chain....


Amazingly enough, the solvent I use stays in a sealed container, is never poured out, and the worst harm it could do is from evaporation, which happens over time, and I refill the same container. I have never poured it out on the driveway, or anywhere else for that matter. I imagine that's even a little better than simple green and oil mixture making it's way to the nearest river?;),,,,BD

I think what we need to do is have everyone send their chain to an independent lab to find out whose chain is the cleanest. The winner gets to make the last post on this thread.

alcohol is much better for drinking i would have thought lol just use kerosene much easier and does better job,i dont find alchol good for removing any grease actually its better suited for paints etc

I was just looking for a better solvent than these "fuels" and I found this thread. I was just about to go buy a liter a diesel, but now I am looking at "citrus solvents". I have been reading wikipedia articles on solvents, and have not found any info on citrus solvents.

My main problem is that if I have a little bath going on, cleaning my parts, I have no way of disposing the solvent. I have to haul it to this special place where they take care of it.

Is there a solvent that is safe to drain down the sink?

I have tried laundry detergent, while it cleans everything really well, it doesn't really clean out the grime and gunk.

Fuels are to power vehicles? Buy some carb part cleaner like Chemtool from an auto parts store. It comes in a can with a basket, lasts for months and months. A year or more even when used a few times a week.
They key point is to keep the solvent in a sealed container, and it can be used multiple times. There's really no need to dispose of it immediately unless you just want to. If you use the stuff that infrequently, just take your bikes in and let a shop do it.:D,,,,BD


Solvent down the sink is a horrible idea, unless you don't mind drinking it later.;)