Touring - Back From First Tour (Ca-Az-Ca), gear, thoughts.

Well I'm back from my first tour which took me ten days and around 800 miles round trip. I left San Diego just before a very big storm and God provided some kicking tailwinds for the first few days. This helped tremendously as I did no official "training" before hand. The original plan was the Grand Canyon and back in around 20 days, but once to the foothills before Prescott, it was clear that it was going to be far too cold, so I headed back (nighttime lows for the Grand Canyon were -6 that week). I was two days away before I headed home, so my tour was cut short by about 5 days in total. All in all it went great, here are some observations:

*I was under the impression that there would be areas with virtually nothing but empty road. I was wrong; if you're going there, chances are other people are too (at least in the Southwest US it seems). There was never any need to carry much extra food or water unless you were going to cook/take a sponge bath at night.

*There are some areas of the desert that are so quiet at night that you wonder if the world has frozen. No crickets, no airplanes, no wind, just nothingness. It was wonderful.

*People are generally friendly, curious, and all-around nice.

*Despite the weight penalty, a kickstand would have made life much, much easier at times.

*Even when riding slowly, the long hours on a bike still create the need to eat A LOT! My food budget was double to almost triple what I had estimated before I left. I had to eat untold amounts of nutrition bars and sports drinks to keep from bonking. I don't see how anyone could get by making 60-70 mile days on less than $15 per day for food at the minimum. I think I still lost around 8lbs over the 10 days.

*If you're going through Arizona, be prepared to climb over barbed wire to camp at night. The state has apparently fenced off all the state/public lands from the highways, so while camping there is legal, it is difficult. I unloaded the bike, then lifted the panniers and bike over seperately, then climbed or crawled under the wire. It wasn't a bad or a good thing (since it likely kept everyone else away) but just something to be aware of.

*It is very hard to really get that "far away" while on a touring bike, unless it's a mountain bike with big tires. I had originally wanted to get far enough away from everything when camping at night that even if a car passed on the highway/road, I wouldn't hear it. After a day it became clear that the bike with fairly skinney tires weighing about 70lbs total, and more with a bunch of extra water, was a difficult to manage beast when walking it over sandy or loose ground. I've got a big build, and it still took all my strength to get it up and down some parts of the trails without making much headway.

*If you're like me and have a tendancy to push it a bit, set a absolute time that you will stop cycling and find a camp-site asap. Several times I got stuck riding at night in places because my mind said "well, I'm this far, there's still a lot of daylight, and my body feels good- let's keep going," then by nightfall I was in the middle of a city with nowhere safe to camp. A detailed knowledge of where you're going would aleviate this, but then again that takes away from the adventure. Drrrr.

Gear grades:

Surly LHT, stock build:A.
Did everything well and then some. After going through a mini-sandstorm in Glamis, CA, the drivetrain had some issues, but I suppose that's par for the course. Under a very heavy load (three full bottles of water, extra food, and about and extra gallon of water) the stock wheels felt a bit rubbery. If I was going to be off road I would probably go with something with more spokes. It was stable going down windy roads at est. 40mph underload, and comfortable all day long.

Big Agnes Seedhouse SL1: C-
Even going through some of the driest places on earth, this tent somehow managed to build up incredible amounts of condesation, both on the fly and inside the mesh. My sleeping bag was very wet every morning except two, forcing me to dry it out in the sun for an hour or two before heading on. Many mornings the moisture actually was dripping onto my head. This is all with a very taught pitch, and all guy lines/stakes done up as well. I will be returning this to REI. The only reason it doesn't get an F is because it was very stealth (great camouflage color and it has a small footprint). Edit* I changed the grade of the tent to reflect the outstanding customer service that Big Agnes has provided. A lot of people love the tent, and that's what prompted me to buy it, but it seems for the conditions I'm in, there may be such a thing as too much ventilation.

Western Mountaneering Alpinlite 20deg: A
Despite being wet continually and being down, this still kept me warm, even on a morning that left my other stuff covered in ice. It's also light, roomy, packed small, and dried quickly.

Persons saddle: D
My LBS never got the B17 I ordered through them, so they gave me this saddle instead. Leather with copper rails, it seemed nice, so I said OK since I needed a saddle. I should have gone with a Brooks. The Persons broke in very quickly, but it also broke just as quickly. Whatever kept the nose of the saddle level and even broke after about 50 miles, and consequently the whole saddle was mis-aligned/out of whack for the rest of the tour. I didn't think it was a big deal, because I didn't notice that the whole saddle was tilted. I noticed after a very sore knee/ankle combo appeared from compensating for it, and was stuck for the rest of the tour. Again, just go with a Brooks.

Surly "Nice racks": B+
They're heavy for sure, but I never though twice about putting a very heavy load on them.

Primus Optima stove: B+
Heavy duty, lit easily even on freezing mornings at around 3,000 feet, used up a suprisingly little amount of fuel, and boiled water/cooked food quickly. Cons are its weight and loudness.


Arkel T28s and GT45s: A-
Their heavy duty and well deseigned pockets were great. The attachment system was very solid once on the bike, and my only real complaint was that the rear panniers took some fenagling to attach at times because the hinges/latches wouldn't open all the way. There was plenty of room for everything in them.

Beans and Lentils: F
I tried to make it work by soaking them for a day before cooking, but it was no use. They were heavy to carry around, required a lot of water, and never cooked much at all.

Black Diamond Gizmo Headlamp: D-
Worked only sporadically.

ShowersPass Century Jacket: A
Kept me dry and well vented in the little rain I encountered, and kept me warm as a wind layer on very cold mornings. In a heavy rain the hood probably would be nice, so I may buy one later.

Velour gloves: B
I would give these an A, but a seam ripped and this was the first trip I used them. They did keep my hands nice and warm, while still providing the ability to feel. Still probably not a cold weather glove though, they're better suited for wind blocking.

EggBeater Candy C Pedals: A
Functioned well, and had no problems engaging or disengaging including after walking in mud. Also never gave me one hint of foot problems (though that may be just as due to the Shimano shoes) They don't have the same reassuring "click" that my Time ATAC pedals have (on my mtn bike), but on the road it's not a big deal.

Plain Bread: A+
Good in the morning, good at night, good with PBJ, good with cheese, light, easy to digest, easy to eat on the bike and just a great food for the road.

Thermarest Z-lite sleeping pad: C
It did pad the ground, and made a nice stool for sitting cross-legged when folded up, but provided very little insulation, and the foam broke down very quickly. In the future I may cut it in half for use as a sitting pad, and get an inflatable pad.

Sorry to hear that you didn't get to the canyon, it's always a treat. Probably would be extra nice (less smog, people) in the winter, too. I've had similar issues w/ both the beans and the z-lite. And too bad you got snookered about the saddle. Maybe you can take it back and at least get credit towards a brooks?

Nonetheless, it sounds like you had fun and got away from the world for a bit, which is the whole point.

There was never any need to carry much extra food or water unless you were going to cook/take a sponge bath at night.

*Even when riding slowly, the long hours on a bike still create the need to eat A LOT! My food budget was double to almost triple what I had estimated before I left. I had to eat untold amounts of nutrition bars and sports drinks to keep from bonking. I don't see how anyone could get by making 60-70 mile days on less than $15 per day for food at the minimum. I think I still lost around 8lbs over the 10 days.

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Sounds to me like you were dehydrated to lose that much weight in such a short period of time. Were you consuming about 750 ml of water (or sports drink) every hour or so that you were cycling? And then about that before and after your rides?

Also, I discovered the same thing about needing to eat a lot when I'm on tour. In the future, ditch the nutrition bars and sports drinks. Go with cookies and fruit juice. They're less expensive and more easily acquired. You can buy a whole bag of chocolate chip cookies for $2.50 and they'll do you for a few days. Eat massive amounts of pasta for supper (it's cheap), and try to get some meat every day ... even if it's a $0.99 hamburger at a local McDs.

On my sections through AZ I found no need to cross the barbed wire. Not sure what roads you took, but I imagine they were interstates.

One night I got to an overpass and camped behind it. I was still within 50 feet of the roadway, but at least I wasn't visible and protected from any traffic. That was one of my favorite nights on the tour too. I-10 is a busy road connecting Los Angeles to Phoenix. I imagined it would still be busy at night, but it's not. Sure there is traffic, but much less than during the day. I would wake up every hour or so to a large big rig passing by. I thought that was pretty cool, but that's just me.

Really the best thing about desert nights and mornings are the sunsets and sunrises. They're spectacular.

BTW, food was my largest expense on the tour. I spent over $2k in 2 months time.

Condensation is a problem on cold nights. But we tend to zip up the tent into a sealed cocoon, and this is the mistake. You need to let the moist air from your lungs out, and you need to create a draft through the tent preferably from a low vent hole (meshed, of course) and out through the top (many tents have a vent at the top).

I think also that after a long day in the saddle, we tend to keep a high rate of breathing with additional moist air being transpired, and condensation might be more of an issue for cyclists than other tent users.

A sponge or chamois is useful next morning for wiping down the fly in particular if there has been a dew and to help dry off the inside from transpired moisture.

Condensation is a problem on cold nights. But we tend to zip up the tent into a sealed cocoon, and this is the mistake. You need to let the moist air from your lungs out, and you need to create a draft through the tent preferably from a low vent hole (meshed, of course) and out through the top (many tents have a vent at the top).

Rowan put it very well. Crack the zipper a bit at the top of the vestibule. There's nothing wrong with the tent.

Sounds like a fun tour. Are you planning on a full journal? Are there pictures?

It was great fun, and some pain too :)

My route was the 78 to 10 to 60 to 71 to 89.

The weight that I lost wasn't water weight, I just have one of those metabolisms that if I'm doing a lot of aerobic excercise, my body trims up quickly, then maintains a pretty constant body fat regardless of what I eat.

As for the tent, I tried all of that, and nothing worked. Some nights even the sidewalls of the floor of the tent had moisture on them. I guess the problem is especially bad in places with large temperature change between day and night like the desert, but still it was far too much of a problem.

As someone who has done a lot (years) of camping in Arizona, I agree that condensation buildup should not have been a problem for you. It was never a problem in my sierra designs light year cd tent- even with the single rooftop vent fully sealed up. As for as the idea that tent condensation is a problem specific to (or made worse by) cycling, this makes little sense to me- I agree with the OP that it has more to do with the tent design.

Thanks for your writeup and gear review!

As someone who has done a lot (years) of camping in Arizona, I agree that condensation buildup should not have been a problem for you. It was never a problem in my sierra designs light year cd tent- even with the single rooftop vent fully sealed up. As for as the idea that tent condensation is a problem specific to (or made worse by) cycling, this makes little sense to me- I agree with the OP that it has more to do with the tent design.

Thanks for your writeup and gear review!

I have a BA Seedhouse SL-2 and have only had a condensation problem the one time I didn't stake out the tent fly and let it sit against the body of the tent. Condensation can and does happen in any tent depending on the air temp, humidity, ventilation and how much moisture your putting out. I've slept in the desert without a fly and had a wet exterior on my sleeping bag because the air was cold enough to make any moisture coming out of my bag condense on the surface - that wasn't the tent's fault.

I've tried a lot of light weight tents and really like the Seedhouse SL-2. It is very light, strong and roomy enough for two tall adults to sleep in comfortably.

Humid air has a stronger tendency to rise than most people tend to think. If you can create good air flow, to allow the moisture-laden air to escape at a good rate -- something like a chimney effect -- it can help a lot.

Stephenson Warmlite tents are single wall. If you go to their website, there are some good explanations of how to make them work (with minimal condensation). The guy who designed them used to be an engineer with Hughes, and he has some well-considered designs.

Just found the site: http://www.warmlite.com/tents_In.htm

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Thanks for sharing all these experiences and observations.

One of the best ways of saving money on food (as well as making it easier to prepare) is to learn more about utilizing oats. I almost posted some of this on the legume thread; but since it seemed to be focusing on legumes, I left it out.

Oats are almost as high in protein as most beans, and they are a lot easier to prepare and digest.

You can make great breads on tour without baking. Just use rolled oats [you can use quick oats, but the standard rolled oats don't take that much longer to cook (maybe five minutes on the stove and five or ten to finish in some kind of insulation), and the texture is preferred by many people]. If you use less water than usual (less than half as much as usual -- about a cup or so of water, or even less (for 'drier' bread) per cup of oats), the final texture is very different from the usual oatmeal.

If you then let it cool after cooking, it congeals to form a bread.

If you get it right, it can have a very bread-like texture. There are air pockets between the oat flakes. Instead of achieving the air pocket/ bread effects with yeast (and their CO2 bubbles) or baking soda or powder (and their bubbles), it is achieved automatically by the oat flakes' somewhat randomized positionings, and the spaces between them. It can turn out *very* well. The main trick is getting the amount of water right. And also using some good seasonings or spices. A little experimentation gets you there pretty quickly.

If you add something like blueberries and sweetener(s), it is great. Other dried fruits are good too. And pecans.

Nutmeg, mace, cloves and cinnamon can be good spices to use with it. (You can just go with your own favorite additions).

There are some very good ideas you can glean from looking at the (flavored) Quaker Oats section of supermarkets -- some good variations and possibilities.


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There are many other options also, including savory ones. You can add Italian herbs, dried tomatoes, olives and dry cheeses, and drizzle some flavored olive oil over it.

Or you can add an Asian spice mix, or any number of others.

The pot they are cooked in makes for a good storage place (if you cook up some extra, or prepare a batch before going to sleep, or before breaking camp), and it's easy to eat later with a spoon, like spoon bread.

You get a lot of nutrition for your money with oats, and they are easy to prepare. You can even eat them 'raw' (they've already been cooked) -- they can be good that way with nuts and dried fruits, and there are many other ways of using them as well.

You can even make a good, flavorful, nutritious, very digestible 'oat milk' with them.

For solutions to moisture condensation inside sleeping bags, see Stephenson's sleeping bag sections.

It's not so much breath as 'insensible perspiration' from the body. There is much more moisture lost through the skin at night than most people realize.

There are solutions -- Jack Stephenson discusses them.

I've found that wider tires often help greatly in sand and loose dirt. They are also much more stable in many types of gravel, and allow for safer and faster riding in a variety of non-paved conditions.

If they can handle higher pressures and have a smooth center section, they can be excellent on pavement as well.

I've tried a lot of light weight tents and really like the Seedhouse SL-2. It is very light, strong and roomy enough for two tall adults to sleep in comfortably.

Tall adults? I'm 6'4" and I had ruled out the Seedhouse because it seemed just a little too short. I have a Clip Flashlight now, and it's a bit too short. Isn't the Seedhouse about the same or an inch or two shorter? I need to replace the Clip Flashlight because it leaked around my feet, so I'm interested in info on tents.

Thanks!

Thanks for all the suggestions. Those Warmlite tents look nice, but $500 is a lot for a tent.

Niles I'll have to try out the oat stuff, that sounds delicious even at home.

It was great fun, and some pain too :)

My route was the 78 to 10 to 60 to 71 to 89.

The weight that I lost wasn't water weight, I just have one of those metabolisms that if I'm doing a lot of aerobic excercise, my body trims up quickly, then maintains a pretty constant body fat regardless of what I eat.

As for the tent, I tried all of that, and nothing worked. Some nights even the sidewalls of the floor of the tent had moisture on them. I guess the problem is especially bad in places with large temperature change between day and night like the desert, but still it was far too much of a problem.


Was Kathy around at Kathy's Kitchen on 60?

Were the fighter jets flying around you on 60?

Did you stop at the first gas station once you completed the climb out of Congress? Was the blonde haired guy and the midget working? Real nice guys that are used to the cyclists coming in.

Was Wilhoit just a ghost town when you went through?

I didn't stop into Kathy's Kitchen, but it was still there (at least if it's the one I'm thinking of) and had a few signs outside saying "Bikers welcome!"

Fighter jets were one thing I saw a lot of. On the 60 there were plenty of F18s training, and one night and day they were doing chaff/missile avoidance excercises. It was cool to watch at night. On the 78 I saw the Blue Angels training. Along the same stretch of the 78 there was a T38 doing some low passes at pretty high speed. It was nice having the military guys doing excercises, so that the airspace was closed off. That way once then were done it was dead silence.

The blond haired guy and midget are two people I never saw, and Wilhoit must have been, because I don't have the faintest recolection of it haha :)

I didn't stop into Kathy's Kitchen, but it was still there (at least if it's the one I'm thinking of) and had a few signs outside saying "Bikers welcome!"

Fighter jets were one thing I saw a lot of. On the 60 there were plenty of F18s training, and one night and day they were doing chaff/missile avoidance excercises. It was cool to watch at night. On the 78 I saw the Blue Angels training. Along the same stretch of the 78 there was a T38 doing some low passes at pretty high speed. It was nice having the military guys doing excercises, so that the airspace was closed off. That way once then were done it was dead silence.

The blond haired guy and midget are two people I never saw, and Wilhoit must have been, because I don't have the faintest recolection of it haha :)

Ha. You missed quite the experience if Kathy wasn't there. I never figured out if she meant she was closing up for good or just the season when I went through early May 07'.

Yea the fighter jets are cool. Sounds like you got a special treat. That was a cool memory from my tour was being way out on 60 and seeing these guys slipping through the air silently at 500+ mph.

Wilhoit is the last town right before you climb 89 into Prescott. You climb out of Congress, peak and have a nice downhill for several miles, then climb into Wilhoit, and then the real climb into Prescott. Wilhoit was one of the most eerie places to ride through. It was about 4-5 pm when I got there, and not even a dog could be heard. It was a real ghost town.

Did you go into Prescott then or where did you stop on 89? Get to Jerome?