Electronics, Lighting, & Gadgets - 50 bucks for battery + charger?

i am going to get a dinotte 200L in a month or so and i don't want to use the 200mh batteries it comes with....i want to get 8 2500mh batteries for the slightly longer run time...anyway, i want to spend about 50 dollars to get 8 batteries and a charger...what do you recommend..links to the exact page would be awesome :p

or......

should i just go ahead and order the 200L with the battery and charger it comes with and just buy 4 2500mh batteries....i want to have 8 batteries so i can carry the extra 4 while i ride incase of the first 4 running out...so maybe i could just buy the 200mh and use those as the first set and take along the 2000mh as my back up batteries...

which method would you guys recommend?

I would recommend the La Crosse Technology BC-900 AlphaPower Battery Charger (http://www.amazon.com/Crosse-Technology-BC-900-AlphaPower-Battery/dp/B00077AA5Q/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1200710982&sr=8-1)from amazon.com It's just $39.99 with Free Super Saver Shipping, and even comes with batteries. It will charge four batteries at a time.

^^^

I'd pay a little more and get the Maha C9000. It can charge batteries up to 4000mAh while the LaCross can only charge up to 3000mAh. Currently the highest rated batteries are 2900mAh, so it's not out of the question to have batteries higher than 3000mAh in the near future.

This combo offers a top of the line charger and very high quality batteries for a great price. Cheap shipping too. http://thomasdistributing.com/shop/-maha-mhc9000-battery-charger-combo-kitbrdiscount-shipping-for-limited-timebrincludes-4-maha-aa-2700-batteriesbr1-four-cell-battery-holder-storage-case-p-540.html?SP_id=57&osCsid=euscl924hj42454v5ogepk6hl5

If you are not aware of it, at Radio Shack you can purchase battery cases for $1.89.

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062251&cp=&sr=1&origkw=holder&kw=holder&parentPage=search
Holds 8 - AA's.

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062243&cp=&sr=1&origkw=holder&kw=holder&parentPage=search
4 - D's

If you want to use D's you will have to go with a Maha charger since the LaCrosse only does AAA's and AA's. Something to consider if you have other devices that you could use rechargeable C or D batteries for.

Dinotte may still have some D battery case holders that they use to offer. It will not hurt to ask them. They will probably throw them into the deal to get rid of them.

The Lacrosse is a much simpler setup. If you're anal, get the Maha. The LaCrosse "does" charge C- and D-cells. Actually they provide C and D adapters for AA batteries. From what I understand, there is no difference between these and the "real" C- and D-cell NiMH batteries out there.

I also recommend the Sanyo Eneloops. Only 2000mAh as of this moment, but nice to know that they hold a charge much longer than regular NiMHs.

Ziemas, how do you know that the LaCrosse charges only up to 3000mAh?

Ziemas, how do you know that the LaCrosse charges only up to 3000mAh?

I just got mine a couple days ago, and in the instruction manual it states that the max charging capacity is 3000mAh.

Lacrosse with included batteries plus and 8-pack of Sanyo eneloops here. Been using for over a month and am very satisfied so far. Very impressed by the longevity of eneloops once they've been charged.

One of reviews on amazon has a nice, very detailed comparison test between La Crosse and Maha units.

The Lacrosse is a much simpler setup. If you're anal, get the Maha. The LaCrosse "does" charge C- and D-cells. Actually they provide C and D adapters for AA batteries. From what I understand, there is no difference between these and the "real" C- and D-cell NiMH batteries out there.

I also recommend the Sanyo Eneloops. Only 2000mAh as of this moment, but nice to know that they hold a charge much longer than regular NiMHs.

Ziemas, how do you know that the LaCrosse charges only up to 3000mAh?

I didn't buy the Maha becase I'm anal (I'm far from it), I bought it because it's a great charger that won't be obsolete in the near future and has a three year guarantee.

I visited the Dinotte site. They say that the batteries they sell are specifically designed to work with their systems and using the wrong batteries can cause problems. Might void their warranty. Use a volt-ammeter on your lights while they are running and get batteries that can provide that precise voltage and current.

I visited the Dinotte site. They say that the batteries they sell are specifically designed to work with their systems and using the wrong batteries can cause problems. Might void their warranty. Use a volt-ammeter on your lights while they are running and get batteries that can provide that precise voltage and current.

They were most likely referring to the Li-ion battery packs which they also sell and not AA rechargeables.

sanyo eneloop blister pack at costco...
everything, 25 bucks I think

oh yeah...

finally...this thread got me to order a MAHA charger. I am sick of the cheap
energizer chargers you can buy everywhere that are only timers.

yes they charge batteries but they cook them and do not trickle charge

got a MAHA 8-bay smart charger on the way now....finally.

Energizer chargers are timers? I thought they were smart chargers. Are you sure about that? Which energizer chargers are you talking about? IIRC they have a bunch of different models.

www.dealextreme.com for cheap battery cases. Free S/H. Only catch is slow shipping (~7-10days) or ~14days is what most people report. For the price of the items I can take the wait time. You can however speed up your shipment if you pay the extra S/H.

While you're there check out some of the pocket lights as your backup light. :) BTW I have no affiliation to this site other then just ordered 2x Cree Q5's and 3 x SSC P4 U-bin LED's for my naughty DIY system. :)

2900 batteries? That's news to me. I thought 2700mAh batteries are the highest capacity out right now. Maha's brand which is 'Powerex' has 2700mAh batteries and all reports from testers report ~2710-2745mAh ABOVE SPEC. What that means in simple terms is you're getting what you paid for. I'm skeptical of those 2900mAh batteries if they are out there. I'm pretty sure they're just 2700mAh batteries with inflated claims. The Maha C-9000 or the Lacrosse BC-900 can tell you how close to spec on those cells you bought to know if you got your monies worth.

I would say get 2 x 4pack Maha Powerex 2700mAh and 1 pack of Sanyo Eneloop or 1 pack of Ideions (spelling) from Maha which are 2100mAh low-self-discharge (LSD) and keep that package of LSD cells in your bag/pocket/bike as your 'oh crap all cells are dead and I forgot to recharge everything' backup. The LSD cells all come pre-charged. They work in any charger even the Dinotte chargers. As long as the charger suppports NIMH they will work. However a good charger will prevent overheating/cooking the cells. IMHO your money should go towards a decent charger. If the charger is not cooking/killing the cells then you are already saving money in the long run then always buying more cells later when the cheap charger cuts the life of the cells in half in less then a year.

Energizer chargers are timers? I thought they were smart chargers. Are you sure about that? Which energizer chargers are you talking about? IIRC they have a bunch of different models.


almost all the energizer chargers you can buy at malwart, target...etc, are just timers.
and you need a pair of batteries, can't do singles.


unless it specifically says 'trickle charge' or 'smart' on the package, it isn't,
not energizer. so, they will eventually leave you with dead nimh long before
a smart charger would. they cannot condition the batteries either

they are not smart. they will cook a half-dead nimh as much as a flat one. and when
done they sit on the charger and loose charge.


I talking about the 4 bay, slide-out versions. which are common. I looked at the others
at target and malwart and they are not the slide out versions, but they still aren't
smart. at best they can detect voltage initially and decide if a battery needs
just a 1/2 charge, or the full charge. but nothing smarter than that.



http://worldcadaccess.typepad.com/s1is/2004/08/beware_of_energ.html

http://www.amazon.com/Energizer-Charger-Rechargeable-Batteries-Adapter/dp/B0000DC4EO
http://www.amazon.com/Energizer-15-Minute-Battery-Charger/dp/B0000DIIAS
http://www.nextag.com/energizer-battery-charger/search-html

all the above are not smart. you have to dig around for an energizer smart charger.
I said screw it.

anyone want 2 energizer chargers ? I am throwing mine out

They were most likely referring to the Li-ion battery packs which they also sell and not AA rechargeables.

Yep. They've even sold the AA lights without batteries. Any rechargeable AA will work, though some last longer than others.

I've never been picky about what charger to use for AA batteries. I typically just go with the least expensive.

almost all the energizer chargers you can buy at malwart, target...etc, are just timers.
and you need a pair of batteries, can't do singles.


unless it specifically says 'trickle charge' or 'smart' on the package, it isn't,
not energizer. so, they will eventually leave you with dead nimh long before
a smart charger would. they cannot condition the batteries either

they are not smart. they will cook a half-dead nimh as much as a flat one. and when
done they sit on the charger and loose charge.


I talking about the 4 bay, slide-out versions. which are common. I looked at the others
at target and malwart and they are not the slide out versions, but they still aren't
smart. at best they can detect voltage initially and decide if a battery needs
just a 1/2 charge, or the full charge. but nothing smarter than that.



http://worldcadaccess.typepad.com/s1is/2004/08/beware_of_energ.html

http://www.amazon.com/Energizer-Charger-Rechargeable-Batteries-Adapter/dp/B0000DC4EO
http://www.amazon.com/Energizer-15-Minute-Battery-Charger/dp/B0000DIIAS
http://www.nextag.com/energizer-battery-charger/search-html

all the above are not smart. you have to dig around for an energizer smart charger.
I said screw it.

anyone want 2 energizer chargers ? I am throwing mine out

Hmmm. On the energizer product page they are claiming that the chargers know enough to not overcharge. Also, how would a timer-based charger know when a battery is HALF full? The nominal voltage from 50% full is essentially the same as that of say 80% full, or 20% full. I did the math on the super-rapid 15 min charger, and concluded that assuming what they claim is true, then it does not actually fill the batteries to 100% (7.5 A * 15 min = 1875 mAh) (7.5 A * 20 min = 2500 mAh) BUT the fact that the NiMH charge efficiency is only 66% or so is not taken into account (or does uber-rapid charging increase this number?) Anyhow, I don't have an energizer charger so I can't say anything from personal experience. I do have a very old Rayovac "smart" charger that really does detect battery fullness, presumably from the voltage depression. The charger also charges the hard-to-find anymore rechargeable alkalines that Rayovac once made. It easily takes 12+ hours to charge batteries up though.

oh yeah...

finally...this thread got me to order a MAHA charger. I am sick of the cheap
energizer chargers you can buy everywhere that are only timers.

yes they charge batteries but they cook them and do not trickle charge

got a MAHA 8-bay smart charger on the way now....finally.

I went with the LaCrosse from Thomas distributing for the same reason, and like the 200 mA charging rate. I've used a similar smart charger for my motorcycle battery for years, and it's extended the life on those. I'm hoping for the same effect with the AA's I used for the bicycle. It may be a while until I get to use them outside, the streets are still covered with snow and salt, and I don't need the headlight when I'm on the trainer.

I did the math on the super-rapid 15 min charger, and concluded that assuming what they claim is true, then it does not actually fill the batteries to 100% (7.5 A * 15 min = 1875 mAh) (7.5 A * 20 min = 2500 mAh) BUT the fact that the NiMH charge efficiency is only 66% or so is not taken into account (or does uber-rapid charging increase this number?)

It can take hours to read it all, but a close reading of all the pages at BatteryUniversity.com (http://www.batteryuniversity.com/) can answer some of these questions. Specific to your question, yes, charging a NiMH battery from 0% to 75% can be done extremely rapidly with very low heat and resistance buildup. I have no first-hand experience with 15-minute chargers, but it should be possible to do this super-fast charge to slam the first 75%, then drop back to a far lower rate, like 1A or 0.8A for the last bit. I still wouldn't suggest doing it on a standard NiMH though. Maybe an extremely low resistance battery like the Eneloops, but even then, I personally would rather just plan ahead enough to use a regular 1-hour charger.

I went with the LaCrosse from Thomas distributing for the same reason, and like the 200 mA charging rate. I've used a similar smart charger for my motorcycle battery for years, and it's extended the life on those. I'm hoping for the same effect with the AA's I used for the bicycle. It may be a while until I get to use them outside, the streets are still covered with snow and salt, and I don't need the headlight when I'm on the trainer.

I too purchased my charger from Thomas Distributing, although I got the Powerex MH-C9000. As for charging rates, I've read from multiple sources including this page on BatteryUniversity.com (http://www.batteryuniversity.com/partone-11.htm) that you should not rely on tricke charging NiMH batteries as your primary method of charging. I've always read that 0.5 - 1.0C charge rates should be used. For those unfamiliar, "C" is the rate to fully charge or deplete a battery in 1 hour. So for an 800mAh AAA battery, a 1C rate is 800mA and 0.5C would be 400mA. To charge my 2700's at 0.5C would mean 1350mA, although my charger only goes in 100mAh increments. What I like about the MH-C9000 is you can charge at any rate in 100mA increments from 200 to 2000. As such, the maximum charge rate on a 2700 is actually only 0.74C with my charger.

I recently purchased some more 2700's as well as a whole slew of Eneloops, which are supposed to have far lower impedance, and thus permit much greater C rates both on the charge and discharge without building up heat. Since I do all my discharge tests at rates that are comparable to the devices I use them in, that means 100mA for my AAA's and 200mAh for my AA's to simulate the load they're under in my real electronics. Since I still have to complete the initial discharge tests for all my new batteries, followed by the break-in, or formative charge for them all it's going to be a while before I'm done with even the initial analysis. Then of course there's the fact that it can take 5 to 10 cycles of a NiMH to achieve its full rate. It might be a while before I have any lab-grade data, but in the mean time I am tracking everything in an Excel spreadsheet to see what kind of data I get. At the very least, what I am sure of is that even with all that I've spent so far, I should be at break-even versus buying Alkalines within 12-15 months.

I have $10.00/4 Duracell 2650s. I'm using the overnight Energizer $11.00 charger with them. When they were new, I tested them after a few uses in the 200L and got 3 hours 8 minutes to the low power blink warning. I've probably charged them 20 times since then, and the last test was 2 hours 50 minutes.

So they don't do quite as much runtime now, but I only use them once or twice a week. I'll see how they perform the rest of the year, then decide if an expensive charger makes sense for me. I was expecting to replace the AA set occasionally, that's one of their advantages.