"The 33"-Road Bike Racing - Would you lie about your placing in a bike race? (a little long)

Did a RR Sunday in absolute brutal conditions - wind, rain, fog, etc. There were lots of DNS and DNF. I came in 20th with a time of 2:15:57. A certain individual, who I won't outright name but works as the sales manager at the lbs hosting the race, got dropped less than 5 miles into the race. I know this because I was riding next to him at the back of the pack from the start, listening to him huff and puff. As soon as the pack got warmed up and picked up the pace he was shelled off the back. I wouldn't have noticed this except the day before I was in his bike shop buying gloves and talking to him about the course. I felt bad for him as we left him in the distance because he seemed like a nice guy. I was even tempted to put my hand on his back to help him along a little but I didn't want to get penalized or offend the guy because I was helping him.

Anyway, to make this short, he got credited with a time of 2:04:15 and coming in 10th, which is absolutely impossible considering when and how he was dropped. I emailed the head judge and she even called him at his bike shop and asked him if he finished the whole course. He said he did and since they had no officials spotting him turning around early they can't do anything. Well it was pouring rain, windy, and foggy - I could have stripped off all my clothes and rode half the course naked and the officials wouldn't have noticed.

I realize this isn't a big deal but it really irks me that a fellow cyclist, someone who I respected the day before, would outright lie about something like this. It also drops me down a spot in the GC, 21st instead of 20th.

I'm tempted to call this guy at his bike shop and ask him what gives but I'm sure he'd just deny it and it wouldn't solve anything.

His loss.

Did 20th pay? cause if not, quit yer *****in

Why would anyone do that? That's idiotic.

I would never do it but it amazes at the people out there that have no problem doing it. I figure if they can live with it so can I. Only reason I would be upset would be if it would knock me out of upgrade points, which it doesn't do in this case.

In a race this past year, I made a new friend during the neutral roll-out. In the final sprint, I saw him go past me -- he had a very distinctive frame. When they posted results and handed out medals, they had me placed ahead of him. We spoke to the Race Director, who didn't want to be bothered. Since there were no points nor money at stake, my friend and I simply swapped medals and had a little chuckle over all of it. I didn't want the better medal, since I had not earned it.

His loss.

Did 20th pay? cause if not, quit yer *****in

No, it didn't pay but it's taking upgrade points away from the guy who actually finished 10th in the RR.

Scoring is so screwy at some races. The pack I was in got lapped by about 5 guys in a crit I did. After the finish I look at the results and I saw that I was like 20th, but was ahead of some of the guys that had lapped us. I told the official, about it, and pointed out everybody in our group that I could remember. For some reason, they slid everybody I named down, except me, so I moved into like 12th place, when I should have been like 30th.

People cheat on their taxes, at cards, on exams, spouses and yes, even at bike racing.

Does it make it okay? No. Unavoidable? Yes.

Yeah, can't really blame the officials for not seeing anything. The first 2/3 of that race were a giant ****storm.

In a race last year, I was dropped along with a group of ten or so. I finished ahead of the others; however, in the final results, I was behind the other ten riders. Does it matter? Not really. If you lose out on upgrade points then I can see why it would be worth making a complaint.

I once rode a points race on the track, I think I was 2nd and 3rd in the first 2, then 1st the 2nd last sprint, then kept going and almost lapped the field. I know that I finished in the first 4 places a few times.

I ended up in about 9th place as I don't think any of my points were given to me. Some guys spoke up and they then worked out I was in 4th or so. The guy who claimed 3rd was 1 lap down I think. We had a good laugh about it in the car park later on.

Which number was he, and what was he wearing? I watcheda lot of people slowly climb away from me as a I was nursing my flat, and pass by as I was stopped at the top, I could probably say whether or not he passed by me...

Once the protest period is over, results are official. So regardless, it's all over but the shouting.

Lots of times, I dont even check my results if I know I'm not in the $$, or did leadout duty, or whatever. I'm sure that I've been mis-placed lots in those circumstances, maybe same for your bikeshop buddy.

Are you certain he was dropped? There have been times in races where I've been surprised to see someone that I was sure got shelled or quit after a couple of hrs. racing, in good weather conditions, let alone poor ones like you describe.

Just pointing out some realities of racing that result in people being placed erroneously.

Storytime:

2 years ago a buddy and I did what is called the DC Velo 7 am group ride in Wash DC. It was same day as a road race in Charlottesville, VA about 3+-ish hrs. away. Both buddy and myself were registered for the race, but decided we didnt feel like taking the drive. When the results were posted, my buddy somehow managed to finish 13th, even though he was 3+hrs. away from the race.

Results errors, they happen, that's racin'.

Why would anyone do that? That's idiotic.

So is cheating at golf. People do it daily. That's why I won't play in non-flighted handicap events. Every time, in the past, some guy with a 15 handicap "shoots the round of his life" and gets a 75, 60 handicap. Once, when mine was 7 I figured I'd have to have shot 65 straight up before strokes to get into the hunt. I told the guy, "If I could shoot an f'n 65 I wouldn't be playing here. I'd be on the gd PGA Tour."

People steal stuff from the office...

The morale standards are not what they used to be.

If it was me, I'd call him on it. I've seen it done at my golf club. Really nice to get caught cheating...hard to get a game after that.

Frankly, I've never seen a cheater at a bike race...but the races I was in were heavily officiated and controlled.

Send him a picture of Rosie Ruiz. (http://www.museumofhoaxes.com/day/04_20_2001.html)

So now you know about this guy's integrity. Consider a lesson learned and re-consider any business you plan to do with him. You could also have a polite and discreet chat with him using open ended, non accusatory questions. The last part is more about your character, however.

Oh yeah, something like that happened at Everest Challenge. There was a guy that finished a little behind me on the first day, but he was struggling to keep my wheel and he just fell apart on the last mile. On the second day I dropped him easily on the first climb, but somehow ended up passing him again later in the day (I hadn't stopped). He didn't speak much English, but I asked if he did the whole thing and he said he did. There is no way he could have gotten back ahead of me!

umd, sounds like a episode of the Twilight Zone!

It looks like he finished DFL in both the crit and TT too. His time in the crit (30:02) is over 5 minutes minutes off the next place above him (24:45), and 6 minutes from the finish (24:02), so I assume he got pulled and received a calculated time. His time in the TT was 34:36, over 3 minutes back from the next slowest, 34:36.

Compare and contrast to the 11th place man in the RR, who got 11th in the TT with a time of 26:52, and 3rd in the crit.

Found a pic of him from the crit. From the timestamps on the pics, it looks like he got dropped on the fourth lap.
http://www.photoscene.com/kimandsteve/images/1728.jpg

One of you too (before the race):
http://www.photoscene.com/kimandsteve/images/1729.jpg

I will go out on a limb and say that it is not possible that he placed 10th in the RR, and I certainly didn't see him pass me when I was stopped. I doubt that he was complicit in the mistiming though, he probably dropped out and left and never even saw the results (the took several hours to be posted)

We have the same frame (yellow TCR)! Are those the Michelin Pro2 tires?

he knows what his time is

LOL at posting his pic

also I like that unattached kit

LOL at posting his pic

a bridge too far, if you ask me.


also I like that unattached kit

-1

just sayin'

Here's the best cheating bike racer story of my career:

We're in the 35+ vets race in Prospect Park, Brooklyn, NY. This guy Earl (don't know his last name) is off the front alone by several hundred meters. The Cat 1/2/3 race is catching us so the officials bark at us to pull over and our race is neutralized while the other peloton passes. Everybody relaxes, and then, in front of like 100 witnesses, Earl jumps on the back of the passing 1/2/3 field. He drafts them a couple of laps to the end, backs off and "solo's" in. Of course he gets DQ'd, there were like 100 witnesses to this blatant cheat. Yet to this day he denies he did anything wrong. At the time he must have been 48 years old, now he's over 60, so I don't think he races anymore, but every now and then we see him on the Nyack Ride.

Earl's a nice, guy, he's a pisser, but he's a cheater too. Oh well.

Found a pic of him from the crit. From the timestamps on the pics, it looks like he got dropped on the fourth lap.
http://www.photoscene.com/kimandsteve/images/1728.jpg


Are you sure that isn't some recreational rider that snuck onto the course?

a bridge too far, if you ask me.

My point was that I don't think he was cheating. I doubt that he went to themand said hey pssst, makeme 10th. They probably either put the wrong number down (there was one rider listed as DNF that had finished and protested), or he didn't finish the course, turned around and came back after others had finished, and crossed the finish line unintentionally.

My point was that I don't think he was cheating. I doubt that he went to themand said hey pssst, makeme 10th. They probably either put the wrong number down (there was one rider listed as DNF that had finished and protested), or he didn't finish the course, turned around and came back after others had finished, and crossed the finish line unintentionally.

don't take it personally. if i really felt strongly about it, i would have replied directly to your post.

The morale standards are not what they used to be.


When were morals better? I can't think of a time or place anywhere in the history of the world where human nature was anymore elevated than any other time.

guy on yellow bike with unattached jersey, what model is that sexy helmet?? does it only look that good because of the camera angle.. wtf
rather than being angry at him, you should pity him... it's sad... by doing nothing, you prove you're that much better than him... however, talk endless **** about him with your friends, lol.

PCad reminded me of a RR last summer:

Pack of the 1/2's goes buy yelling guff at the four of us (5's). Then the official's car goes by. I notice a fifth fellow who was drafting us for a a few hundred yards swings out behind the officials car and starts drafting trying like hell to bridge back to the 1-2 group. Chubby fellow was chugging like mad and had to be told TWICE to knock it off. Never decided if it was funny or sad.



Here's the best cheating bike racer story of my career:

We're in the 35+ vets race in Prospect Park, Brooklyn, NY. This guy Earl (don't know his last name) is off the front alone by several hundred meters. The Cat 1/2/3 race is catching us so the officials bark at us to pull over and our race is neutralized while the other peloton passes. Everybody relaxes, and then, in front of like 100 witnesses, Earl jumps on the back of the passing 1/2/3 field. He drafts them a couple of laps to the end, backs off and "solo's" in. Of course he gets DQ'd, there were like 100 witnesses to this blatant cheat. Yet to this day he denies he did anything wrong. At the time he must have been 48 years old, now he's over 60, so I don't think he races anymore, but every now and then we see him on the Nyack Ride.

Earl's a nice, guy, he's a pisser, but he's a cheater too. Oh well.

http://www.photoscene.com/kimandsteve/images/1729.jpg



Is that what you call 'absolute brutal conditions'? In Oregon we call that a sunny day.

We have the same frame (yellow TCR)! Are those the Michelin Pro2 tires?

Yep, Michelin Pro2 Race. :)

Is that what you call 'absolute brutal conditions'? In Oregon we call that a sunny day.

That was the crit on Saturday. We had clear skies that morning, cold temps but clear skies. The brutal conditions were during the RR on Sunday.

My point was that I don't think he was cheating. I doubt that he went to themand said hey pssst, makeme 10th. They probably either put the wrong number down (there was one rider listed as DNF that had finished and protested), or he didn't finish the course, turned around and came back after others had finished, and crossed the finish line unintentionally.

Well, I'd say maybe but I emailed the head official and she emailed me back stating she contacted Rodney at the bike shop and he said he finished the RR course. The official said since no official witnessed him turning around early and the 15 time limit had obviously passed there was nothing she could do.

also I like that unattached kit

You probably sport one of these.
http://www.8ball.co.uk/productimages/18228-1.jpg
http://www.sptimesphotos.com/blogs/80s/uploaded_images/whamart-788412.jpg

guy on yellow bike with unattached jersey, what model is that sexy helmet?? does it only look that good because of the camera angle..

No, it only looks that good because it's on my head. :D It's a Giro Atmos, '07 I guess.

Is that what you call 'absolute brutal conditions'? In Oregon we call that a sunny day.


Saturday...
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x220/esammuli/SNSR/IMG_1195.jpg

Sunday...
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x220/esammuli/SNSR/RRrain.jpg

Some of them are wearing knee warmers! The horror!!

PS: and black lenses in fog - really smart.

Sad that guy turning around early and still scoring. In the old USCF days I was an official at a 2 day junior stage race in Steamboat Springs, CO. In the time trail (being the noob official) I was out at the 5 mile turn-around taking numbers. No one cheated there. At one crit one guy who had been near the front suddenly was about fifth from last. When, as we saw it, the leaders caught him we tried to pull him from the race. What a fight. It turned out he had jumped some 30 positions in one lap and was actually the leader. At least we could award him one of the preems.

The offender in the story is officially a ******bague. End of story.

I'm gonna call BS on posting the guy's pic unless you believe he was actually in on the scoring screwup. This stuff probably happens in most every race; only this time somebody noticed.

Are you sure that isn't some recreational rider that snuck onto the course?
As funny a comment as that is, I might spend part of my season giving lead-outs to a guy who really needs two of me to get a decent draft!

End of story

You got that right.

You shouda yelled at him!

Found a pic of him from the crit. From the timestamps on the pics, it looks like he got dropped on the fourth lap.
http://www.photoscene.com/kimandsteve/images/1728.jpg

This person works in a bike shop? Too bad he can't get a bike that fits.

It's one thing to be "misplaced". Another to boast or say it was for real or share the placing as if it were legit.

I was placed 6th one year at a local RR Jiminy Peak. Tough course for me, I've never made it one lap with the field. That year was no different, I got shelled on the first lap, got in my car, drove home. Got a check and a mug in the mail for 6th place. Laughed, wrote a thank you note, sent the mug, check, note back to the promoter.

But I never, ever told anyone seriously that I got 6th. For a month or two people would come up to me at races "Man you must have had an awesome day at Jiminy Peak". I'd laugh and say, no, they just screwed up the numbers. Never took credit for getting 6th in the race, ever. Since whoever got 6th didn't protest (or maybe the results were mistyped when sent to USCF), it was past the protest period and nothing could be changed.

If I did I'd be a total effing loser.

cdr

Oh yeah, something like that happened at Everest Challenge. There was a guy that finished a little behind me on the first day, but he was struggling to keep my wheel and he just fell apart on the last mile. On the second day I dropped him easily on the first climb, but somehow ended up passing him again later in the day (I hadn't stopped). He didn't speak much English, but I asked if he did the whole thing and he said he did. There is no way he could have gotten back ahead of me!


Times and placings were pretty f'd up at EC this year. Hard to ***** at volunteers though.

Anybody who's raced even a few times probably has a story about screwed up placings. (e.g. I did a race a couple of years ago where I placed 11th AND 18th, in the SAME race).

Transponders are supposed to be the cure, but at least in my neck of the woods we're having way too many "technical" glitches with them.

Anyway, there's still the standard protest mechanism if it's important enough to you.

Bob

You probably sport one of these.
http://www.8ball.co.uk/productimages/18228-1.jpg
http://www.sptimesphotos.com/blogs/80s/uploaded_images/whamart-788412.jpg

Or this shirt:

Sunday...
http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x220/esammuli/SNSR/RRrain.jpg

OK, that looks pretty lousy.