Tandem Cycling - What's your tandem weigh?

Our fairly new Calfee weighed 35.38 lbs (Record 10).

Interesting... which wheels are you running, what are the other components, and what else was attached to the frame when you weighed it? Pumps, disc, computers, seat packs and the like really add up. For example, some pedals will add a couple lbs to a frame vs. something like our Ti Frogs that only weigh 212 grams per pair, or a little under a pound for both sets when installed on the tandem.

Our Calfee has a very small frame but picked up some extra weight by adding an extra 1.5" to the stoker compartment; however, the frame by itself still only tipped the scales at about 9.7 lbs. Regardless, if you'd like to see how our Calfee got to be around 30 lbs, you'll find a spreadsheet about 1/2 way down this page that breaks down every component by weight contribution (most of them were weighed to get actuals vs. catalog) as well as how the costs stack up using MSRP (not the actual prices we paid BTW): http://www.thetandemlink.com/calfee_tandem_build.html

Anyway, at the end of the day the couplers really kill the uber-lightness of a Calfee tandem as the current spec'd aluminum couplers add 3.3 lbs (1,500 grams) to what is only about a 6.5 lb frame without couplers, depending on size. After that it's the nickel & dime grams that really add up.

In fact, one of the easiest places to see just how components influence the weight of a tandems has always been to compare a Co-Motion Speedster with a Co-Motion Supremo, where the only difference in total bike weight comes down to the components since both bikes use the same frame: it's about 4.5 - 5lbs. Most of the weight comes out by switching from a steel to carbon fork (1.8 lbs), followed by the wheels (1lbs), and then it gets down to the nickel and dime stuff which does add up.

Regardless, if you'd like to see how our Calfee got to be around 30 lbs, you'll find a spreadsheet about 1/2 way down this page that breaks down every component by weight contribution (most of them were weighed to get actuals vs. catalog) as well as how the costs stack up using MSRP

No pumps or bags were included. I think a big part of the difference are the disc brakes. I'll weigh the wheels to see the difference. I though they would only add about 2 lbs.

Our fork weighs 666 grams and the pedals 325. That's about a 1 lb difference.

I think a big part of the difference are the disc brakes. Our fork weighs 666 grams and the pedals 325. That's about a 1 lb difference.

If you've got dual discs that will explain a lot of the weight. Whose hubs, how many spokes, which rim and what size tire? Whose cranks are you using? Also, what's your total team weight and did they use a 1.75" top tube or a 2" top tube?

12. Buy a vehicle that allows you to put your tandem inside where it's better protected and more secure. ($10k - $40k)
Our Speedster fits perfectly inside our Subaru Impreza. I was a little surprised at that, but there it is. Cover with a shipping blanket and we can stack soft luggage on top. It was the hit of my 45th HS reunion.

It weighs 36# with pedals and cages. My carbon Trek weighs 18#, so that seems darn good for a long complicated steel contraption. It'll be 100g more than that when I get my new rear rim on. But I can get that 100g back out by going to ultra light tubes. Which I'll do. ;)

I should also report that my stoker lost 3 pounds in the past month. How about that for a salary? I figure motor weight is worth about $1000/lb. Until you have every gram out of the motors, worrying about bike weight seems pretty funny. And you actually get paid to lose motor weight, since fueling costs are less.

Absolutely... I just wanted a minimalist look that doesn't draw the eye away from the frame. The Profile Karbon Lite (19 grams on my postal scale without mounting hardware) was an unexpected find and at least on our first ride with them and using large 25 oz bottles, they actually worked quite well. In fact, Debbie was thrilled with her "cup holder" (yeah, we both laughed at that comment for a while) and found that it was actually much easier to use than the stainless cages we'd been using.

http://www.nashbar.com/nashbar_photos/500/PS-CLK-NCL-ANGLE.jpg

The shape of this cage makes it a lot easier to get a 24 oz bottle into/outof the top bottle holder on the speedster. It's also very stable in terms of holding the bottle (in response to someone elses question)

Our S&S coupled Calfee is 31.2lbs. Like Zona said, " doesn't help much" at our age. What we really notice is the ease of starting on a steep hill compared to our former tandem. I quote a friend of ours, " if it looks good, buy it. Performance enhancement is only an added benefit". However, when I chose the components for it, I worked very hard at shaving the little ounces. Pedals - I started with Crank Brothers 4Ti egg-beater pedals. 167 grams/pair. I didn't like the shoe clips, so I purchased Speedplay x1 ti pedals. Knocked off an ounce. I just installed a Hope disk brake rotor. The "cool" factor is high, and it is lighter than the stock 203mm Avid disc rotor by .85 oz.

I Visited Calfee yesterday to verify some details on the new bike. Frame weight for custom (54/54) standard length boom tube, captains top tube a couple cm longer than standard, with aluminum couplers was around 10.75. I am not paying a lot of attention to weight for the build. If I have a choice between components of equal safety and performance, then I choose the lighter if price is not prohibitive. I should have a finished weight in a couple of weeks.

TG when you did the bike weigh in at the tandem rally did you ask people what their bike weighed before you put it on the scale? If so any typical result?

TG when you did the bike weigh in at the tandem rally did you ask people what their bike weighed before you put it on the scale? If so any typical result?

Eveyone was initially under estimating the weight but, then again, this was way back in the late 90's when a "light" tandem was anything under 38 lbs and 40lbs was the norm.

The original plan was to make it a guessing game and not reveal the results until later. However, given how far off the mark the first guesses were and becausae there was a pretty good crowd there we opted to provide the feedback instantaneously. As you'd expect, the guesses got progressively better as folks began to see what other tandems were actually weighing vs. what most folks though they'd weigh.

Just so no one has to go surfing, here's a link to a posting that had a summary of the weights plus some other comparson weights of more contemporary models:
http://www.bikeforums.net/showpost.php?p=936287&postcount=1

TG I looked at your listing, interesting stuff. I think I will be be happy if the new bike is under 35lbs, thrilled if it is under 32.5lbs, nervous if it is under 31lbs and shopping if it is over 35lbs.

If you've got dual discs that will explain a lot of the weight. Whose hubs, how many spokes, which rim and what size tire? Whose cranks are you using? Also, what's your total team weight and did they use a 1.75" top tube or a 2" top tube?

The Calfee frame size is similar to a M/S with a longer and shorter stoker compartment. The top tube measures 1.9".

Total wheel weight with cassette, skewers, tires, tubes, and tape is 3730 grams. These are 40 spoke, White Industry hubs, Velocity Deep V Rims.

Avid BB7 calipers are 463 grams. So, by my calculations the disc brakes add (including beefier fork) 2.1 lbs to the bike. Add a half pound more for the heavier pedals and the bikes are about a little over two pounds different.

The top tube measures 1.9".

That sounds like the standard diameter, i.e., it's probably smaller than your down and boom tube.

Total wheel weight with cassette, skewers, tires, tubes, and tape is 3730 grams. These are 40 spoke, White Industry hubs, Velocity Deep V Rims.

Let me guess... You're running 700 x 28c Gatorskins?

If I do the math correctly to account for the front disc rotor (178 grams), front disc hub (+83 grams), and 4 extra spokes (+25 grams front & +25 grams rear) the difference between your wheels and my wheels (White Industry / Deep-V with rear disc mounted @ 3,310 grams total) is about 134 grams, or the difference between the weight of my 700x23c Vredestein's @ 253 grams/ea and a set of 700x28c Conti Gatorskins @ 320 grams/ea.

Therefore, you've got an extra 1lb of wheel weight + another 480 grams for the extra caliper and heavier fork + another 220 grams for the pedals and I'd guess the rest of the weight difference is probably in the bottom brackets, but that's just a guess.

The more time you spend looking at how the individual component weights compare and stack up the more you realize weight isn't a black science, it's just math and, well, cash. What does matter is the quality of the ride, that is if you're even attentive to the ride qualities. For us, at the end of the day, it's that ride quality that made us go for the Calfee and anytime we start taking those qualities for granted we just hop back on our steel tandem for a wake-up call.

Anyway, back in keeping with the thread I'll throw in another reference point and photo. Here's what our Calfee looks like right now with it's rear disc, saddle bag, mud guards, computers, pedals, frame pump, and water bottle cages attached. As indicated, the ride-out weight is 34.94 lbs. The saddle bag + frame pump add 1.5 lbs to the tandem's total weight. Our previous Erickson travel tandem in this same configuration was about 42 lbs.

http://www.thetandemlink.com/Images/Calfee/fulldress.jpg

Let me guess... You're running 700 x 28c Gatorskins?

Therefore, you've got an extra 1lb of wheel weight + another 480 grams for the extra caliper and heavier fork + another 220 grams for the pedals and I'd guess the rest of the weight difference is probably in the bottom brackets, but that's just a guess.



Nope, they're 700x25 Vredesteins that weigh 237 grams with 68 gram tubes. So, the bare wheels are a bit heavier.

One big difference that I see is the stoker stems. There is probably a difference of 3/4 lb. The other differences are probably small but add up.


What does matter is the quality of the ride, that is if you're even attentive to the ride qualities. For us, at the end of the day, it's that ride quality that made us go for the Calfee and anytime we start taking those qualities for granted we just hop back on our steel tandem for a wake-up call.


Riding our Cannondale, now, feels like were riding in an old schoolbus. It drives like a truck and we feel every bump especially in our shoulders. That wakes us up on a morning ride.

Nope, they're 700x25 Vredesteins that weigh 237

So, how do you like the Vredesteins?

One big difference that I see is the stoker stems.

Just curious, what cranks and bottom brackets are you using?

Riding our Cannondale, now, feels like were riding in an old schoolbus. It drives like a truck and we feel every bump especially in our shoulders.

The ride qualities of the Calfee frames really is pretty amazing. I still have to pinch myself now and again or jump back on the steel tandem to regain perspective and objectivity.

So, how do you like the Vredesteins?

Just curious, what cranks and bottom brackets are you using?


I think they're the best tire we have road on for handling, speed and comfort. We hardly ever ride on chip-seal pavement and most of the roads we ride on are fairly good. If we rode on chip-seal, I would switch to a lower pressure tire.

Unfortunately, we have not gotten over 700 miles on a tire yet. Two tires were defective but were quickly replaced by their US distributor. Also, they seem to attract large screws and sharp pieces of glass which have cut the cords on four more tires. Now, given the size of these holes and cuts they would have probably ruined most lightweight tires. However, I wonder if the high pressure makes them more susceptible. I may try Continental GP4000s next. They seem indestructible.

We're using da Vinci black anodized cranks and TA chainrings, with Phil Wood 113mm bottom brackets and SS ring set. (I tend to mangle alloy BB cups but these are so easy to install and adjust I may reconsider.) I used a Ti bottom bracket in front.

At first our tandem was 40 pounds, now is just less than 32 pounds. We really like the feeling of the lighter tandem much better especially on the climbs. We are very happy with our lighter tandem; if you can afford a lighter tandem go for it. You won't regret it.

Unfortunately, we have not gotten over 700 miles on a tire yet. Two tires were defective but were quickly replaced by their US distributor. Also, they seem to attract large screws and sharp pieces of glass which have cut the cords on four more tires. Now, given the size of these holes and cuts they would have probably ruined most lightweight tires.Bad luck. I run 23c Vredestein Tricomps on all my bikes, having put them on our tandem about 400 miles ago. About 25,000 miles with them on the singles. Don't have any more flats on my single than any one else. Don't yet have a glass cut on the tandem's tires. They are a lot more cut resistant when fairly new. After the tire is scubbed flat, they cut fairly easily. That's definitely a trade-off. The lower end Vredesteins are pretty much worthless IMO. Don't hold in the wet and flat more easily.

I have had a couple of sidewall cuts from sharp stones, but had at least as many of those with Contis.

I just weighted our our steel framed Santana. At the front it was 176 pounds. At the rear it was 214 pounds. Two years ago, when we were still working, it was 20 pounds heavier. The more we ride the lighter it gets!

Most tandems in the '90s weighed 'only' 40 pounds or slightly less . . .
Our first custom tandem, that we designed in 1976 (and took delivery of in Jan. 1977), weighed in at a then incredible 34 lbs (with pedals).
Matt Assenmacher (then in Mt. Pleasant, MI) built it for us.
We utilized Reynolds 531 double butted (single bike) racing tubing throughout except for the ovalized boom tube. It was a fully lugged silver brazed twicer.
We had an extremely short wheelbase of only 60 1/4 inches (yes we are a short/light duo). Achieved that by having lots of toeclip overlap for pilot and a bent rear seattube for stoker.
Tandems 'had to have' 48 spokes at that time; but, being unconventional, we opted for 36 spokes front and rear. Used the then new sealed bearing stuff from Phil Wood: BBs, hubs and (yes) pedals.
Had a custom (and then practically unheard of) adjustable stoker stem and a host of other nice features.
Recall attending the Kangaroo Baggs Tandem Rally in California in 1984 (Ventura to Santa Barbara) and Bill McCready wandering around with a notebook checking out all the tandems. He got to ours and asked if he could pick it up. He had a bit of an astonished look on his face and stated "it will break".
You know Bill, he is always right . . . and that frame did break after 'only' fifty thousand miles!
Sold that Assenmacher with 64,000 miles on the odometer.
Quality lasts . . .
Pedal on TWOgether!
Rudy and Kay/zonatandem

Most tandems in the '90s weighed 'only' 40 pounds or slightly less . . .
Our first custom tandem, that we designed in 1976 (and took delivery of in Jan. 1977), weighed in at a then incredible 34 lbs (with pedals).


Very interesting... our ex Burley (1999 Zydeco) was close to 45 pounds with pedals and loaded... our current Burley (2006 Rivazza) is close to 35 pounds with pedals and loaded. I guess production tandems are built beefier as team weights are not known which explains the added weight. It also looks like overall weight of tandems have not dropped much since the 90s compared to singles.

It also looks like overall weight of tandems have not dropped much since the 90s compared to singles.

Hmmmm. Not sure about that. If you check you'll find tandems tend to weigh about twice as much as single bikes and lose or gain weight in kind. Right now single bikes are flirting around with weights in the 12 - 15 lbs range and, not surprisingly, there are now tandems that will fall into the 24 - 30 lb range.

Of course, the average single road bike is more likely to be in the 18 - 20 lb range and, well, that also parallels a somewhat more average tandem that would weigh 36 - 40 lbs.

Lighter frame materials have played a part in reducing tandem frame weight. Extra light and oversized steel, heat treated aluminum, carbon fiber, magnesium and even baboo is being utilized for frames.
By spending more $$ you can lighten up componentry . . . interested in Zero Gravity brakes? A carbon fiber stoker stem/bars, crankset or even a c/f eccentric and shifters?
Wheels are now lighter and 48-spoke wheels are a rarity. There are ti or kevlar/carbon fiber spokes and spoke count has been drastically decreased.
Have 'hefted' a sub-20 pound racing tandem . . .
Production tandems are necessarily heavier as the manufacturers do not know who the consumer will be and how it will be used/abused. There are weight limitations on certain lightweight models.
In our 34 years as tandemistas we have seen huge changes!
Pedal on TWOgether!
Rudy and Kay/zonatandem

Hmmmm. Not sure about that. If you check you'll find tandems tend to weigh about twice as much as single bikes and lose or gain weight in kind. Right now single bikes are flirting around with weights in the 12 - 15 lbs range and, not surprisingly, there are now tandems that will fall into the 24 - 30 lb range.

I would not argue with you T'Geek. I was looking at it at a different angle... what tandem could I get for 4k and what single could I get for 3k cos those are my max limits. A new tandem for 4k will be probably weigh between 30-35 pounds where as a new single for 3k will be around 15 pounds.

If I could increase my tandem budget to 8k+ I could easily get a custom tandem built under 25 pounds. At this point I can only dream. Given my out of proportion upper body it will be nice get a custom tandem built instead of messing with stems and seatposts :(

I was looking at it at a different angle... what tandem could I get for 4k and what single could I get for 3k cos those are my max limits. A new tandem for 4k will be probably weigh between 30-35 pounds where as a new single for 3k will be around 15 pounds.

First of all, that's an unrealistic cost model for new bike / tandem cost comparisons. Excluding the mass-producers like C'dale & Trek, tandems from specialty builders tend to cost twice as much as single bikes of similar frame materials, component levels and quality until you hit about $4,500 - $5,000, at which point tandems become a bit less than 2x of a comparable single bike.

Secondarily, if anyone was so inclined, willing to do their homework and had the skills & tools needed to build-up a bike frame, they could probably end up with a sub-30 lb tandem for under $4k given certain constraints and a willingness to make a few compromises IF the sole criteria was having a superlight tandem. A willingness to start with either a used tandem frame or an inexpensive imported frame as the starting point would be necessary as would careful shopping of components to keep the cost down.

IMHO, there are just too many other things that have an influence on how well a tandem will perform and/or meet a team's needs that are far more important than weight unless a team is competing at an elite level and in peak fitness. In fact, it pains me to see or hear from folks who have clearly bought into the notion that they'd be better served by a certain type of tandem that was clearly the wrong choice for their needs.

I have a tandem that i ride in the winter that steers from the rear.
It is great in snow and here is the funny part.
It weighs 92 pounds and is a 1937 Colson with studded tires.
It feels like a tractor.

I finally weighed our Calfee Dragonfly (Small/Small) with pedals and cages and its 30.3 lbs. We do not have the lightest saddles and our pedals are XTR and Time ATAC pedels (so not the lightest) and we have the Avid mechanical disk for the rear brake. All in all we are VERY happy with our 30lb bike. I don't think I would change much if I were to do it all over.

We did load up our DaVinci for a 4 day mountain tour with about 55 lbs of panniers/racks etc. (bike was over 100lbs with water bottles) and it was really fun to get back on the Calfee the next week!

There is something to be said for having a bike that you are excited to ride. Comfort is key. I don't think you can put a $$$ value on the countless hours that you spend with your stoker. :)

So if you have the means to build a fancy new tandem - go for it!! Will you get some additional satisfaction? Likely. Will you go faster? maybe (partly placebo). Will you want to ride more to show of your new toy? Very likey.

Dan

I'm anticipating some upgrades to our Santana TeamTi700 and decided to get a "before" weight.

2000 model in large size. Some modifications from stock. 38.33lbs (17.37kg) as pictured.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/28639223@N07/3171930206/sizes/l/

At the other end of the tandem spectrum we have two Schwinn Twinns. These had to be weighed on the bathroom scale because they exceed the limit of my digital scale.

1969 Twinn (single speed) 60 pounds http://www.flickr.com/photos/28639223@N07/2676261650/

1979 Deluxe Twinn ( 5 speed) 63 pounds http://www.flickr.com/photos/28639223@N07/2873204373/

I'm anticipating some upgrades to our Santana TeamTi700 and decided to get a "before" weight.

2000 model in large size. Some modifications from stock. 38.33lbs (17.37kg) as pictured.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/28639223@N07/3171930206/sizes/l/Getting rid of that fork and puting on a Reynolds Carbon and Dura/Ace front brake would save a ton.
Our Team Scandium is at 33 pounds or maybe a little more, can't remember exactly.

Getting rid of that fork and puting on a Reynolds Carbon and Dura/Ace front brake would save a ton.
Our Team Scandium is at 33 pounds or maybe a little more, can't remember exactly.

The Reynolds fork arrived today , along with the carbon captain's handlebars and new stem.:love:

Sweet Sixteens should be back in stock late January. I'm looking to get a set soon after that.

Rick