Road Cycling - Cervelo vs. Litespeed ??

Well, after much investigating and research on road bikes I think I've narrowed my selection down to 2 bikes... :rolleyes: I think... :rolleyes: I'm 33 years old, 6'2" and 215 lbs. I'm somewhat aggressive on my rides and comfort is very important to me. I want a bike that will last a long time and that looks great!! (doesn't everyone!!). Budget $3500.00 canadian.
Bike #1 is the Cervelo (SuperProdigy) complete with Ultegra components and Steel tubeset.
Bike #2 is the Litespeed (Veneto) complete with Ultegra components and Titanium tubeset.

What do you think?
Which would you choose?
Any other suggestions?

Thanks for your time,
Clutch

Hi,
it might help if we knew what has brought you to this point. What is it you like about these two? Have you ridden them? Have tried the Litespeed Tuscany?

Oh, sure, someone has to try to get yet another rider on a Litespeed.

I'd say that you should test ride them and determine which fits best or gives you the geometry you desire. Don't think you can really go wrong with either one.

Hi,
not sure the Veneto is really a bike for an agressive rider. In fact, it would be a great bike for me,middle aged slow poke that I am.The Tuscany is more sporty ; but not race oriented. Which is why I wondered what he thought of it.

Titanium doesn't corrode .......

Even though I own and love a titanium bike I think that Cervelo is sweet. Litespeeds own ad says that the bike is designed for a more upright position which to me at least would translate to comfort/cruising. If you want to get aggressive and it fits I would look at the Cervelo.

The cervelo is a really nice ride.I've tested one and have been on a reg prodigy for a long ride.

What brought me to the Litespeed was a combination of titanium, components, durability and looks. What do you mean when you say the Tuscany is not race oriented? Any thoughts about the Cervelo? Carbon interests me but does it last? (especially with a big guy like myself).

Clutch

Steel doesn't corrode if you have a slight notion of what you're doing.

Steel doesn't corrode if you have a slight notion of what you're doing.


Agreed! The Prodigy steel frame is now completely nickel plated before painting which adds an extra layer of protection.

I have a 01 Prodigy frame (not nickel plated) and have ridden it in all weather conditions without a problem. It's my main training bike and has seen up-wards of 15,000 miles to date and I'd guess it has at least 30-40k more miles in it if I don't wreck it in a crash.

I'd also guess the Litespeed would be a fine bike too, I just don't have any first hand experience with them.

Hi,
Litespeed has a wide variety of bikes;you wil need to try them to get a feel as to how performance oriented you want to go, is racing something you plan on doing?

I don't think racing is something I'll be doing in the future. I do ride aggressively though. I race against myself all the time!!



Hi,
Litespeed has a wide variety of bikes;you wil need to try them to get a feel as to how performance oriented you want to go, is racing something you plan on doing?

Something else you might want to consider is the Marinoni Delta Xtra. I spent almost exactly that on mine. My price was about $3700 with everything. It's great because I got to pick whatever colour scheme and decals I wanted, as well as do all the components just how I liked them. I have:

Campy Centaur Double Group
Selle Italia SLR seat
Michelin Axial Carbon Tires
Tacx Tao Cage
Ksyrium Elite Wheelset
Speedplay X2 Pedals

That is what I specified to be different, the rest was a stock setup that came with that particular frame. Just an option if you're quite particular about what you want! Good luck!

If you are worried about carbon fiber and your weight, don't. I outweigh you by 60 lbs and have put close to 4000 miles on my Trek 5200 I bought this past spring. If I can't break it at my weight I seriously doubt you could.
Now with $3500 cdn to play with I bet you could get a 5200 or maybe a 5500 on 03 closeout.

Carbon's as strong as any material. Like any material, it depends on how the frame's built. For durability, the craziest light carbon bikes may not be the best route, but the same goes for every other material. It's not anything to be more concernec about with carbon fiber.

If you want to compare the properties of carbon fiber composits to titanium sign onthe Merlin Bike web site. They give a complete description on both. Remember carbon fiber composits are exactly that. Most are 50% carbon fiber and 50% resin. The resins used vary with every manufacturer. Over time these resins are subject to ultra violet radiation which can cause these resins to deterioate. Just think, even when you are not riding the resins may be deterioating!

Titanium is not subject to rust or any deterioation- in our lifetime! I ride a Litespeed Classic and absolutely love it. Pick the model you prefer and become another "Satisfied Litespeed Owner"

Yea I agree, carbon is strong,but nothing compared to Titanium. Any small scratch on a carbon frame means its a goner while a Ti frame will outlive you. Also, in the tour this year, Lance did break his 5900 frame from a crash in the Pyraness (sp?) and although we are not all Lances, we all still crash sometimes and I think thats where you have potential to screw up a carbon frame. I dont have anything against carbon, it just seems still in an experiment mode while Ti is not

Here we go again with lots of whacky carbon information. Now I'll agree that carbon fiber can't stack up against Ti in terms of outright longevity. But honestly, how many of us keep and ride constantly the same bike for 20 years?

Let's clear up some of the things mentioned in this thread;
- Lance did crack his frame in the tour. This is true, it's because somebody rode a bicycle over the top of it. And what exactly did this harm? Not a thing obviously as Lance got up and put down more power than probably any of us can for another 30-40 minutes with no ill effects. The effects of that crash could have had similiar effects on any bike.
- Scratching a carbon frame doesn't mean you have a junk frame. First you have to scratch through a few layers of resin, then the "visual" layer of fiber (this is the layer that gives you the pretty pattern), then more resin before you start to get into the real layers of fiber. Considering how hard the material is, this will take a LOT of effort. That's not to say you shouldn't be dilligent and not inspect your frame, but you should do that with any material.
- UV, yes UV does have detremental effects on some resin's. Who is to say if that is the resin used by manufactures, I certainly don't know. But I'd say that most manufactures probably aren't stupid enough to use materials that are going to deteriorate very quickly. Even if they offer short warranties there is still the possibility of liability if people are injured on a poorly made bike.

Carbon Fiber is not a flimsy - fragile material. Assuming that the process of building a CF frame is right the frame will be stronger than Ti, Al or Steel. It will survive bigger impacts as the pressure needed to break carbon fiber is WAY beyond the pressure needed to bend steel, Al or Ti. CF is used in lots of high stress applications, cars, boats, planes, etc and it's used very successfully.

Andrew

Thanks for the help everyone! You have certainly given me more to think about. I thought I was closing in on a final decision for a bike but there is more to research. I'll keep you updated.

Thanks

If looking at Cervelo then also consider the soloist or dualist. Both great bikes. I had similar thoughts to yours when I purchased my bike, and I have to recommend riding all of the bikes you consider for at least 30 minutes before making up your mind. Also, don't forget to give Campy components a thought.

I have been looking into the Campy components and I am really impressed! I'm now looking into the Look KG 361 Carbon frame with Campy Centaur components. Any comments on that??

All very nice! You have the exact same taste as me while shopping for bikes! If you go for camp make sure you get 2004 Centaur as it is very similar to the 2003 Chorus. I picked Chorus in the spring and a Litespeed Ultimate.

Wow. To say that carbon fiber is still in experiment mode while ti is not is just plain uneducated. Come on, folks, think for yourselves, don't let Merlin or Litespeed or Trek or anyone else do it for you. If you're buying any high end racing frame, you're not looking at a bike that's going to outlast you. If you're going to harp on carbon being fragile, why not do the same with aluminum? And, if you're such huge fans of ti, how can you ignore the qualities of steel that make it just as good of a material for a bike frame?

Clutch, I just made a move to Campy and am thrilled. I have to say, though, that it depends on which style of shifter you like as much as anything. I think Shimano and Campy are pretty much equal in terms of quality and durability. I really think that it's what you like better. Again, you'll have to ride some bikes with both to figure it out. Can't go wrong either way.

Hi,
who said racing? Clutch49 said
"I don't think racing is something I'll be doing in the future." IMO, A good bike ought to last 10 or 20 years if you're not racing.. This guy is 20 years younger than me. I just did my 4th week in a row commuting 4 days out of 5 on my bike.Wish I had been smart enough to buy a good bike when I was his age. I had a specific reason for not mentioning steel. At the moment I want
him to be learning how to find the bike he wants. Any good bike maker will have a good sporty model. But it seems to me the Veneto doesn't fall into that category.
And the Tuscany does. The Tuscany is also
an especially fine bicycle. That will give him a baseline he can use to compare against other bikes; including other Litespeeds. I don't think anyone can know what they're gonna like until they ride it.
I can think of several steel bikes I am sure would fit his criteria. If he wants to talk about them, we'll be here.

Sorry clutch and late, if I've misled anyone. It just irks me that people continue to call one material or another fragile when that's not the case. I mention race frames because those, typically, are the ones where durability becomes an issue. I fully realize that clutch isn't looking for a racing bike.

That said, I still believe that you're not getting your money's worth out of ti. Steel, anymore, is very close to ti in terms of weight and it rides very similarly, for a lot less money. But, if ti is something you're looking at, clutch, check out Airborne bikes. The more good I hear about them, the more I believe that they're good bikes.

But steal IS real, baby. If you're looking for a bike, you shouldn't rule it out as a material to look at.

I agree completely; actually I agree with you more than you agree with yourself :D I have 2 bikes, one is an Airborne, and the other is steel. Some of the new steel frames just blow me away they're so good. I recently decided that I need a new bike (after test riding a Gunnar)

I was close, very close to buying a Soloist until I saw that seatpost. I will not be tied to a propriatary seatpost shape.

If the bike took a standard round post I'd lay my money on the table in a heartbeat.

What, late, are you implying that I contradict myself or don't make sense much of the time? I can't imagine.

Hi,
just to be on the safe side, I was just kidding around. I try to avoid net bashing
and arguments. They get in the way of helping people. I figure a person will take what they need, and leave the rest. They're also real likely to buy the first really great bike they find that fits.

Thanks for the tip on Airborne "late". I looked into their product and am really impressed with their stuff. I called my local Airborne dealer and I am going to test ride a Zeppelin and Valkyrie with Ultegra components tomorrow. From what I read they make great Ti bikes and are much more reasonably priced than Litespeed. Looking forward to trying it out!!

Anyone else out there with an opinion on Airborne???

Thanks




I agree completely; actually I agree with you more than you agree with yourself :D I have 2 bikes, one is an Airborne, and the other is steel. Some of the new steel frames just blow me away they're so good. I recently decided that I need a new bike (after test riding a Gunnar)

Well, I suggested them here. Like I said, I've heard nothing but good about them. Glad we could help point you in a different direction. Not to bash Litespeed, but they're not worth the price you pay.

Clutch - I'm 6', a little over 200 and ride a Tuscany and love it. It's comfortable, responsive and fast. Give that one another look.

From the sound of it no one seems to like the Veneto here but has anyone ever ridden one? huh? Well I have one. The bike is comfortable, handles fine, and at the end of a century ride Im glad. Im in my mid 40's and in the club I'm concidered one of their strongest riders. I take on guys all the time and beat them; guys much younger than me too. The bike is such a small part of it, dont get so lost in marketing hype to forget about the engine. Easy just to sit back and figure if this material is used or this frame is used that or if a bike is 1/2 a pound lighter than another,,omg what a riot. The bike itself is such a small part of the big picture,,, It needs a good engine; funny how when we talk about cars that is the formost topic, easy when its not a personal reflection? hmmm.....Get an engine! geeesh......

For those who might be interested, here are some links:

http://www.lvrc.org/lnfr01.htm

'Manufacturers' for as many bike, frame and component makers I know,
'Custom builders' for some specialists, many of whom have truly expert opinions on choice of materials etc.

My 2p. If you're not racing, and especially if your heavy, then steel is your option. Less costs for the strength, and then spend the money on expert, custom building and super-trick finishes.

I'm not sure why the LITESPEED TUSCANY is being described as something not race-ready. The Tuscany has the same geometry as the VORTEX. It is basically a 3.25 Vortex-- meaning it is an awesome road racing frame.

Ti and carbon are premier building materials. Look at tensile/ elongation/ weight/ density and it becomes very clear that Ti and CF are at the top.

Carbon is not fragile. It's properties lend it perfectly to structural building- cost and size being the limiting factors.
Steel is great for many applications but has a weight penalty and cheap.
Aluminum is light, cheap but rock hard. Many of the new alloy mixes address this and aluminum frames are world class.

If I had my choice, my ideal bike would be the Litespeed Vortex. It is an amazing bike in every way.
Litespeed is not overrated or overpriced. It is a premier brand and handmade Ti in the USA. There is alot of technology that goes into building them and I really respect what they have done.
Litespeed's aluminum line of bikes is amazing too. The Avior blows me away- same geometry as the Vortex and Ti wrapped carbon stays. That bike rocks!

Both good bikes for various reasons. So to decide, I suggest you stay Canadian. "Made in Canada" has a nice ring to it.