Commuting - A GOOD commuter Road Tire?

I just went for a test ride (12 miles) to my work place, just testing my new
700x25C Vittoria Courier TT25 Kevlar 3D Compound tires. Never made it, I had to turn back after 3.5 miles when going dowm hill at "warp" speed - got a flat on the rear one, it was enough that the rear tire hit a small elevated road crack to
go down flat. These tires proved not suitable at all for commuting, especially here in Northern Jersey where there are lot of rough road imperfections on the side of the roads. Thank goodness I didn't use them on weekdays (real commuting time).

What tires are GOOD (in the 700x25C and/or 700x28C size) for commuting??? Enough to take the roughness and imperfection on most roads?
What's your experience folks? Although I'd prefer in the 700x25C size???
Corsaire :(

From your description sounds like you got a pinch flat, which can be caused by not having enough air in the tire. Common consensus for the most flat proof is normaly the specialized armadillo tires, but it will protect you from thorns.. glass etc in the road..

Before going out I inflated my tires to 100PSI with my
new JoeBlow, the recommended pressure. The tires were tightly inflated.
The rubber on this tires are buttery soft, that was did it.
How about the Continental Ultragator Skin?
which I hear so much about
Corsaire

I insist on Kevlar lined tires. Particularily on commuter bikes where I hope I can demand reliability.
My touring bike takes 35mm. I can find only Performance brand Touring tires that are Kevlar lined..I think they are pretty good tires. Anyone use 35 mm. Kevlar lined touring tires...Any recommendations.

I insist on Kevlar lined tires. Particularily on commuter bikes where I hope I can demand reliability.
My touring bike takes 35mm. I can find only Performance brand Touring tires that are Kevlar lined..I think they are pretty good tires. Anyone use 35 mm. Kevlar lined touring tires...Any recommendations.

There are lots. The aforementioned Specialized Armadillo tires are all Kevlar belted. The Panaracer Pasela TG. The Continental Top Touring 2000 (which is my personal favorite). Note that Aramid and Kevlar are the same thing.

RichC

Rich.. Again are all those tires you mentioned in 35 mm? Not sure a rim for a 35 mm. tire will accomodate a smaller sized tire?

What tires are GOOD (in the 700x25C and/or 700x28C size) for commuting??? Enough to take the roughness and imperfection on most roads?
What's your experience folks? Although I'd prefer in the 700x25C size???
Corsaire :(

I would look at Specialized's Armadillo line as well. Their new "All-Condition Armadillo" looks like it's as close to a commuter tire as you're likely to get onto a racing frame. Available at Specialized dealers or at www.specialized.com. The website seems to be out of stock at the moment.

You might also want to look into the Rivendell Ruffy Tuffy or Roll-y Pol-y tires, which are very highly regarded. http://www.rivendellbicycles.com/html/parts.html

My own commuters run wider tires -- 700x32 -- and so my personal experience probably isn't directly transferable to your situation.

However, I agree with the assessment that you had what sounds like a pinch flat. You can prevent them only by increasing tire pressure or going to a bigger tire, if one will clear your brakes and frame.

RichC

Rich.. Again are all those tires you mentioned in 35 mm? Not sure a rim for a 35 mm. tire will accomodate a smaller sized tire?

The Conti is, I believe. And yes, any rim that can take a 35 will take a 32 or a 37. 35 is a sort of unusual size.

RichC

I purchased my new commuter road bike at the beginning of April this year. Continental Top Touring 2000 tires 700 x 28c were spec'd and were installed. To date I have put on 4,200 kms on these tires. And have had no problem except for the one flat which was in June after two and a half months of riding. I cycle over sections of rough roads to and from work plus I've gone over broken glass, run over small stones and branches, etc. My commute is 22km one way.

It is very important for me not to have any downtime on my commute, especially to work. So having good tires is very important. Since I started cycle commuting in June 2001, I have had numerous flats on the two types of bikes I used before my current model - one was a MTB converted to commuting with slimmer tires and the other was a twenty year old road bike. I normally spent no more than $ 15 CDN per tire. I experienced on average 3 to 5 flats per month. I don't know what the TT 2000's cost (they came with the bike and I didn't get a cost breakdown of each component) but they are worth the price.

I highly recommend the Continental TT 2000's and I will replace only with the same.

I have Continental Grand Prix 3000 on my road bike. Average mileage between flats ~2000 miles.
I have Vittoria Rubino Intrepid PRB Kevlar 3D Compound on my commuter. Haven't had a flat yet.
700x25 size available in both tires.

I checked the 04 All Conditions Armadillo 700x25C, looks strong and good.
The Nimbus Armadillo looks strong also, but only 28C
How about performance on these tires?
has anybody notice improved performance as well?
besides the flat protection feature?
Corsaire

Hi,
take a look at the Rivendell Ruffy Tuffy.
It is very rugged without weighing a ton.
http://rivendellbicycles.com/webalog/tires_tubes/10043.html

You know, if it WAS a pinch flat, you could have had a defective tube.

I've got 2002 Specialized Armadillos on my commuter. It's a mid-90s heavy steel road bike, and the heavy tires roll VERY smoothly when I'm going. The older Armadillos had a bad shoulder corner that impeded fast cornering, but the 2004 tires have a redesigned tread/shoulder that's much better. If the Specialized Rep ever will give my LBS 700X23s, I'll have a new set. The rated pressure for the Armadillos is 125, and I keep them there. The ride is supposed to be rougher, but with my heavy frame I don't notice it.
I use the Continental Gatorskins on my Lemond Zurich. They have a Kevlar belt, and roll very nicely.

It WAS a pinched flat caused by a strong blow/impact of the rear tire by going down hill at high speed. The rear tire hit strongly a little part of raised pavement. (roughed out road side) The Vittoria tire is ok, but the tube pretty much blew inside. It's not the first time I ride this road, it's my commuting route.
I had switched from Specialized Nimbus EX, these tires took very well all this road imperfections. But I changed to Vittoria just to gain for speed and lightness, only to realized I had sacrificed strenght and durability.
That's why I'm looking for a strong, dependable, highly puncture resistance tire, enought to take a blow over an imperfect road.
The All Condition Armadillo looks like the ticket so far @ 700x25C, hopefully it can take it.
Corsaire

It WAS a pinched flat caused by a strong blow/impact of the rear tire by going down hill at high speed. The rear tire hit strongly a little part of raised pavement. (roughed out road side) The Vittoria tire is ok, but the tube pretty much blew inside. It's not the first time I ride this road, it's my commuting route.
I had switched from Specialized Nimbus EX, these tires took very well all this road imperfections. But I changed to Vittoria just to gain for speed and lightness, only to realized I had sacrificed strenght and durability.
That's why I'm looking for a strong, dependable, highly puncture resistance tire, enought to take a blow over an imperfect road.
The All Condition Armadillo looks like the ticket so far @ 700x25C, hopefully it can take it.
Corsaire

Just keep in mind that the change to a smaller tire may have more to do with the flat than anything else. Armadillos are very puncture resistant, but not really any more pinch-flat resistant than any other tire the same size on the same rim.

RichC

After having 4 flats in 200 miles along my route, I put on Performance Forte Kevlars in 700x23 size about 800 miles ago. I've had one flat since then. They run about $22.

Before going out I inflated my tires to 100PSI with my
new JoeBlow, the recommended pressure. The tires were tightly inflated.
The rubber on this tires are buttery soft, that was did it.
How about the Continental Ultragator Skin?
which I hear so much about
Corsaire

My husband puts 100-150 miles a week in commuting and loves those Continental Ultrgator Skins.

I have just invested in a set of Continental Gator/Dura skin tires to compare against the Hutchinson Excel Kevlar types that have been a mainstay for a while. I run 700x23. The Hutch's have good puncture resistance but are prone to failure of the fabric at the sidewall, close to the bead, always on the rear tire.

The Conti's seem to ride better, although I managed to flat them first day out. I think this was exceptional bad luck though - I pulled out a 3/4 in thorn from the very edge of the tread that was like a hypodermic needle.
I hope they will last better than the Hutchinsons - I like them very much so far.

Cheers,

Ed

Hi,
the Gatorskins look really tough. I bought a pair, went for one ride, and had my dealer swap them out for something else. They rode like a truck. The problem is the belt goes up the sidewall, so it doesn't absorb as much shock as a regular tire would. I think the Rivendell Ruffy Tuffy would make a good tire for commuting. My wife has been having good luck with her 25c Fortezzas , and the ride quality is excellent. I don't run them at high pressure. I put in just a few more pounds
than is neccesary to let the tire roll on the flat without the sides bulging. This gives a very nice ride qulaity; with the Fortezza it's especially nice.

I've got about 4000 miles on my Conti TT2000's (700x28)

Only one puncture and that was a huge thorn.

Does anybody know HOW the Armadillos ride?
Does it roll easily, smooth or is it rough??
Corsaire

Does anybody know HOW the Armadillos ride?
Does it roll easily, smooth or is it rough??
Corsaire


I have 700X23 2003 Armadillos. They have a stiff sidewall. I keep them at the max, 125 psi. They roll very, very smoothly, but transmit a little more vibration than other tires I've used. That's on an older steel bike that weieghs about 25 pounds.

I guess it's a trade off, a mix of smoothness with some road vibration....hey! it's not a perfect world I guess...

I hear people raving about these RUFFY TUFFY tires , what gives I wonder....?
Corsaire

Got it! made a decision:
I'm getting the All Condition Armadillo 700x25C for the rear tire and the Ultra Gatorskin for the front, also @ 700x25C. I hope this combo will give me the best of both world, given that all my experience with flats/pinch or puncture have always been on the REAR tire.
What about it?
Corsaire :)

Interesting decision.

I while ago I replaced my TT2K's (the rear was worn out) with Pasela TG's. The TG is a much lighter, thin-sidewall, kevlar-belted and -beaded foldable tire.

I immediately started getting rear flats. So I put the old front TT2K on the rear, and left a TG on the front. This combo is working quite well, and the lighter front tire is a noticeable improvement.

Good luck with your plan!

RichC

Thanks, Rich.

Yeah, it just dawned on me the fact why should I have two tires of the same kind, if I could combine the best of both worlds: Gators & Armadillos (sounds like strange bed fellows, doesn't it?)
My overall flat experiences have ALWAYS been the rear tire (the *****y one because of the chain), maybe because of my riding style, I'm always checkin the road ahead - what's coming on to me, almost always I hop over spotted pavement problems, but the rear gets to go over what the front got over.
I'll keep it posted how it worked out.
Corsaire :)

I'm very happy with my Continentals.

I went this morning for a 26 mile ride on my newly acquired Nimbus Armadillo 700x28C.
It rolled smooth on flawless pavement, although got a bit rough on less than perfect parts of the road (my bike is a Chromoly hybrid), just like the name states Nimbus, it felt nimble feeling almost any road roughness; by mile 16 I bumped into a group of road bikers, I trailed behind them for two miles until we got to a steep hill, I got on my toes and passed three of them, couldn't beat the faster guys, my gears didn't live up to the challenge either, like I said not a road bike, can't wait to get me one, but that's another story.
I have perused and examined these tires closely, inflated and deflated, and seems like Specialized have fixed the stiff wall problems, the red color walls doen't feel stiff, but only time will tell, but so far so good. I'll get me the 25C version of the Armadillos once they come out, at least for rear tire, the front I'll use the Gator, also 25C.

Corsaire ;)

LBM what kind of contis?

After trying many tires over the years and living season after commuting season with the short commings of each, the continuous flats, the premature tread wear, the poor handling characteristics whe loaded, the sliding around on wet roads. I decided to try the Conti top touring 2000 on the commuter, I bought the 26" X 1.75, I run them at 50 PSI, I now have 5561 flat free miles on these tires, the tread is still 50% there and they handle loaded as well as they do unloaded, they ride soft and present very little rolling resistance. They haven't slipped on wet roads and do quite well on hard packed dirt roads. I liked them so well I bought a second set fo my touring bike and a set of ultra 2000's for my road bike, none of these tires have ever flatted, I guess I'm a conti fan.

Like Mrfix. After about 4,000 miles on my Conti top touring 2000, I was begining to think they were practicly indestructable. But this morning riding into work I recieved my first flat, thanks to a sharp metal object wich I failed to see till it was to late. On inspection the tyre was badly slit so I called in at the L.b.s for a replacement, only to be disappointed when told there were non in. I was shown many other tyres, but I declined all of them, Insisting on ordering a new conti so pleased had I been with them. So John The bike shop owner patched up my present tyre hopefully to get me by until the new tyre arrives,

That is how enthusiastic I am towards the CONTI TOP TOURING 2000.....

I've been riding Vittoria Zaffiro Aramid 700x25c and I love them. The best thing about this tire: they run $25/pair.

Kevlar is great but I've yet to see a tire that can withstand glass. To decrease the likelihood of a puncture I routinely remove the tire and dig any and all glass shards out with an sharp implement. Sure it's time consuming but I'll trade the comfort of my garage over the side of the road any day!

I used Ritchey Cross 700x38 for about two years solid.....NOT ONE FLAT!
I was very pleased and I did 20 miles per day commute on this particular bike. I also use Green Slime tire liners.....worth it and not too pricey.

The Specialize Armadillo actually use 3 flat protection layers, the following was copied from their web site:

"Race Across America (RAAM) two time winner and 6 podium positions. Our most flat resistant tire with bead to bead flat protection. Co-developed with engineers from DuPont®, the next-generation Specialized Armadillo tire family combines the smooth, long-wearing ride of a performance tire with three proven flat-protection technologies.

A DuPont aramid subtread barrier provides bead-to-bead protection. A second aramid barrier impregnated with an aramid-engineered elastomer seals all gaps in the fabric weave. Finally, a new synthetic cap ply material uses a lightweight version of the latest offroad motorcycle racing technology to prevent sidewall cuts. The result is the most effective flat-prevention technology on the market. Available in both Mountain, Road, BMX and Ergo/RTB versions. Just look for the Armadillo Icon."

So even though these tires are made more for commuting and light touring there are some people racing on them. I commute plus ride for excercise and light touring, I use to get at least 1 flat per ride or destroy the tire before switching to the Armidillo's, I feel they are the best for that because they have eliminated flats. Note, this flat problem was not a large issue before I moved to Bakersfield when I averaged about 4-5 flats a month on racing tires, but when I moved to Bakersfield that ratio went to 3-5 per week! Thus my search of many tires to reduce the flat issue here eventually after about 12 sets of tires and never getting more than 750 miles out of a tire led me to the Armidillo.

Another vote against the Hutchinson Kevlar excel I'm afraid. Yet another of these just "let go" at the sidewall, close to the bead. It seems the fabric casing cannot deal with the wear and tear where they meet the rim (not just one set of wheels either). The tread would have stood a great deal more milage, which is frustrating.

After a few months using Conti "ultra gatorskins" on my other bike, I decided I like them enough to invest in a second set. They do seem to ride better than the Hutchinsons IMO, which is interesting, since others contributing to this thread have made negative comments about this aspect of their performance.

Cheers,


Ed

I've used Specialized Infinity (700 x 32) for the last eight months and like them a lot. They aren't Armadillos but have something Specialized calls "Flak Jacket" protection. I've had two flats in approximately 3000 miles and they were both "stealth flats"-- flat after returning to a parked the bike.

I just put on some Ruffy Tuffys (700 x 28) today. My rear Infinity was looking a little worn so I figured I'd try the Ruffy Tuffys. I'm hoping they're as good as the Specialized. I'll chime in again when I know.

Chuckie

the Gatorskins look really tough. I bought a pair, went for one ride, and had my dealer swap them out for something else. They rode like a truck. The problem is the belt goes up the sidewall, so it doesn't absorb as much shock as a regular tire would. I think the Rivendell Ruffy Tuffy would make a good tire for commuting. My wife has been having good luck with her 25c Fortezzas , and the ride quality is excellent. I don't run them at high pressure. I put in just a few more pounds
than is neccesary to let the tire roll on the flat without the sides bulging. This gives a very nice ride qulaity; with the Fortezza it's especially nice.

Before I put on Gatorskin Ultras, I got a flat when a piece of glass went around the side of my kevlar lining. So I like having the belt go up the sidewall. As "Late" pointed out, the downside is that the Gatorskins don't absorb as much shock as other tires. (I can only compare them to non-kevlar tires, so take this comment with a grain of salt.) You can mitigate some of the harshness by getting wider tires. I use 700x28's when I could have gone narrower. I've only had the Gatorskins on for a few hundred miles, so I can't judge their durability. But I like the way they deal with rain and the way they corner.

I have commuted over 15,000 miles on Specialize Turbo Aramadillos and only have had 2 flats, one from a faulty tube and the other because I let the tire wear down to far where cord was showing in some small parts of the tire and a piece of glass went thru the cord. But normally I crunch glass without fear of flats. These are the best tires on the market for flat protection. Are they heavy? yes, but you can counter some of that by using ultralight Specialize 65grm tubes or Mich 70gram tubes. Are they stiff? yes, because the sidewalls also have flat protection there as well-no other tire I know of does that. Great tire for commuting because you will have very little to worry about getting flats anymore.

Conti Ultra Gators, appx 2k miles so far.

As for ride, I went from Michelin Axial Pro's,
which I LOVED, and initially felt like the Cont's
were going to slip out from under me, but I
adapted quickly and like them a lot.
So far so good.

Bryan,

It is interesting that you mention the slippery feel of the Conti Gators - This concurs with my experience. In the wet they seem to have slightly poorer grip than the Hutchinson kevlar Excel tires used previously. This is especially noticable when riding over iron-work (covers, railway tracks etc.).

I have also suffered a couple of punctures recently but then, nothing is puncture proof....

Cheers,

Ed

I gotta mention my Nokians. I love these suckers. Every season they go on and carry me through some fun stuff that an ordinary tyre just can't handle. Of course I wouldn't try a road tyre out on a frozen lake, but I trusted the Nokians to give it a try.
I haven't flatted them yet. I can't imagine what it would be like to change them at the side of the road with numb fingers. There'd be a good deal of cursing I'm sure.
I'm still deciding on tyres for the rest of the season. I've had the side walls of Contis shed on me, the fabric was fraying, and wrapped around the hubs. It was a poor experience. I've got Sefras 700x23s, which were great until the first flat created hole in the inner lining and continues to abraid the tube to where it goes flat, I've got several tubes with the same hole in the same place. Yes, I checked to make sure there wasn't a forien object inbedded in the tyre.
Specialized I like, I have a set of Michelins now that I like, and some off road cycle cross(Vittoria) that have been phenominal. I'm still a whimp when it comes to putting out bucks for a set of tyres, on the promise that they'll improve my ride. I'd rather go inexpensive, than lay out the cash for something that'll last. That's flying in the face of the Nokians I know.
But since I've gotten rid of the steel coffin, I figure wtf, let's get some good tyres.

I wonder if there is really much of a difference between Gators, Armadillos, or other similar tires when it comes to wet pavement. Maybe one of the engineering-types in this forum could jump in, but given that the treads on these tires don't differ by much, I'd think the only thing that would matter would be the size of the tires. So 700x32's would hold better than 700x23's, but Gators and Armadillo's would hold about the same.

I wonder if there is really much of a difference between Gators, Armadillos, or other similar tires when it comes to wet pavement. Maybe one of the engineering-types in this forum could jump in, but given that the treads on these tires don't differ by much, I'd think the only thing that would matter would be the size of the tires. So 700x32's would hold better than 700x23's, but Gators and Armadillo's would hold about the same.
I have Conti Gatorskins on my Zurich for rec riding, and Armadillos on my Trek 1000 for commuting or shorter rides. The tread compound on the Armadillo actually feels softer to me than the Gatorskins. This is the 2004 Armadillo. The older ones were fairly hard also.

Naisme, I agree with you on the Nokians. They are the only tires I have used that have never flatted. Of course, there may be other factors -- snow and ice cover some road debris and the cold may keep some folks from drinking outside ans smashing their bottles. Still, I am impressed. They are really quality tires.

Either this weekend or next, I will be taking them off and putting on Schwalbe Marathon Plus (622-40). I'll kinda miss the buzz and crackle of the studs.

Paul

I wonder if there is really much of a difference between Gators, Armadillos, or other similar tires when it comes to wet pavement.

Some people think that when it rains this or that tire is slippery, usually thats false and here's why. When it first starts raining the roads are slippery anyway due to the oil that comes to the surface and any bicycle tire will slip if pushed on that situation. After it has rained for an hour or so than most tires will respond adequately. I have rode the Specialize Armadillos during a rain storm that hit while on a bike path; of course you need to slow down in the rain which is what I did to be prudent. On the path the tires worked great with no issues of slipping, however about 20 minutes later I had to get on a surface street and thats when I notice quite a difference and had to ride very cautiously due to the slippery conditions. What was the difference between the bike path and the street? Cars don't drive on the bike path so the oil was not there whereas on the street the oil was there causing the slippery conditions.

I have rode numerious of high performance tires over the past 35 years in the rain and I can tell you the experience that happened above is above is virtually the same!!! Maybe a Conti Top Touring tire or something similar won't behave that way, but I have never tried those so cannot attest to that.