Fifty Plus (50+) - HR Monitor questions

After a couple of rides with my new Polar F6 HR monitor I have a couple of questions. I noticed a few times that it went into the stratosphere with the reading...at least I hope that's what happened. :eek: I looked down and it was reading 171, ( I was pumping pretty hard ) and the next thing I know it said 218! Then it fell back to the low 170's almost immediately so I'm inclined to believe it was an anomaly. Should I expect a few unnatural spikes with these?

Also, I have a hard time keeping an eye on it while it's on my wrist and decided to mount it to my bars which are now starting to resemble a car. Is there a good "clean" way to do this?

Mine (not a Polar) does that every now and again. It said I maxed at 229 on the way to work this morning. With an average of 142 on the 50 minute ride, I had only three minutes in Zone 4 and 15 seconds in Zone 5, so I figure it's safe to assume a fault of some sort.

Mine (not a Polar) does that every now and again. It said I maxed at 229 on the way to work this morning.

High stress job or bad traffic? :D

High stress job or bad traffic? :D Sorry don't meant to change the subject. Just notice your have the same bike 2007 Trek 1600 SLR I have. Just want to say Hi & see how you like yours, upgrades? I got mine for 2 months now & only have 100 miles on it. I love my bike!

Sorry don't meant to change the subject. Just notice your have the same bike 2007 Trek 1600 SLR I have. Just want to say Hi & see how you like yours, upgrades? I got mine for 2 months now & only have 100 miles on it. I love my bike!

I like it. It was a good bang for the $$ but all it did was wet my appitite for some carbon fiber. I've had it since September and with the exception of a couple of flats I've put about 1300 trouble free miles on it since. I did upgrade the saddle, added Speedplay X pedals and put on the Cateye Enduro but that's all. Currently I'm thinking of getting a shorter stem to get a better position on the bike.

looked down and it was reading 171, ( I was pumping pretty hard ) and the next thing I know it said 218! Then it fell back to the low 170's almost immediately so I'm inclined to believe it was an anomaly. Should I expect a few unnatural spikes with these?


This normally happens when its too dry between your skin and the strap, make sure you dampen the strap really well before putting it on

High stress job or bad traffic? :D

Lust.

Another possibility is electircal signals nearby which you can't do anything about other than change your route.

besides electrical interference which someone else mentioned a flapping jersey or jacket will cause it too.

Thanks for the input...at least I know my ticker isn't about to blow!! :eek::D

it would be nice if you could program an upper limit into these things. I came home yesterday with a 232 for a max which is utterly bogus. My real max is currently 183. If I could tell it to discard anything over say 185 I'd have better data.

The one I have supposedly has an algorithim to discard spurious readings but clearly it could use some work.

I find I have more problems with jersey flap when I don't wear an undershirt (er, Base Layer). I guess I should have bought smaller jerseys :(

This normally happens when its too dry between your skin and the strap, make sure you dampen the strap really well before putting it on

If the humidity is low (dry day) with wind, syntheic jershey material causes static charges that makes peaks happen. Your instructions say to dampen your shirt before wearing it out.

Last thing that I want to do is alarm anybody, but it is possible that the heart monitor is working properly - and that your heart rate really was 218 for a moment.

One of the most important things about heart monitors is that they provide information relevant to how hard you and your heart is working. From the information that you receive from monitors, you can then modify your workout to maintain your target heart rate (THR). Conventional thinking is that when you work out, your THR should be 75%-85% of your maximum heart rate.

Your maximum heart rate is determined by subtracting your age from 225. For example, I'm 56 y.o., so my maximum heart rate is (225 - 56 =) 169 My THR range is 75%-85% of that or 126 (75%) to 143 (85%). So, when I workout, my THR is between 126 - 143 beats per minute. Depending on my level of fitness, I might be able to workout comfortably with my pulse in the 140 - 150 range.

But, for a 50 y.o. the Maximum heart rate is 175. What happens sometimes when someone consistently exercises at or near their maximum heart rate is that the heart delivers a few extra beats - called premature ventricular contractions (PVCs). When that happens, the heart monitor picks up the extra beats, calculates them and shows a pulse of 218 or something like that. Because the PVCs occur infrequently, the very high pulse over 200 can be mis-interpreted as heart monitor error and attributed to some of the things that it's been attributed to in this thread.

I'm not a physician, and I don't really know what the problem with your monitor is, but I do know that what you described can occur because of abnormal heart beats or PVCs. And, if you're posting this in the 50 plus forum, then your maximum heart rate is in the 170 range - higher than the American Heart Association recommends for working out.

More about THR can be found here:

http://www.americanheart.org/presenter.jhtml?identifier=4736

Thanks for the heads up Hearty. My son in-law is a Doctor I'll hit him up on this. Based on my weight and age I have a max HR of 168 so I try to keep it around 145 or so for my 80 or 90 minute ride.

Mine does the same thing as yours. First I thought it was the cold, then it warmed up and it still did it. Then I thought it was the wind, same thing. Anyhow, when I get a pretty steady reading, I just go by that. Sometimes when the readings are all over the place, I just turn it off.

This normally happens when its too dry between your skin and the strap, make sure you dampen the strap really well before putting it on

Exactly! :rolleyes:

As for mounting the wrist HRM on your handlebars, you might try a 1-2" section of grey foam pipe insulation underneath.

Thanks Old School. I ended up using a piece of handlebar foam I had leftover from my MTB and it seems to be good.

There are many formulas for calculating maximum heart rate and workout target heart rates.

The old standard for determining maximum heart rate is 220-age. Others that I have read are: 208 - (.7 * age); 205 - (.5 * age); 210 - (.5 * age) +4 (for men)... the list can go on. A very accurate method to determine your maximum heart rate is via a field test. This can be performed on one's own or by a professional, e.g., a sports medicine clinic.

For determining target workout heart rates there are also a number of formulas for calculating heart rates. For example: maximum heart rate * a percentage (170 * .85). Another uses one's resting heart rate in the calculation. If you have access to a sports medicine clinic you can schedule a VO2 max and related tests. These are very accurate methods to determine how hard to work out.

Each max heart rate and training heart rate formula has its adherents. There is no 'right' or 'wrong' since each person's physiology is unique. One of my riding buddies is 61 and his maximum heart rate is 177 determined via a field test. I'm 50 and my MHR is in the low 170's. His resting heart rate is 45 and mine is 38. I do interval sessions with a target heart rate of between 150-162 (approx. 85-92% of max).

While boiler plate formulas give a person a place to start, effective training comes with education and experimentation to find what is right for you.

Thanks Old School. I ended up using a piece of handlebar foam I had leftover from my MTB and it seems to be good.

Polar actually do a bar mount for bikes. The early mounts stayed on the bike with a couple of Zip ties- but my later one is just a semi rigid Moulded lump of plastic that goes on the bars with the monitor. I prefer the old type though.

On the "Interference"- it could be that. Riding with other HRM users could cause cross interference- and High Voltage cables do the same (Overhead or in the road). There is one area on out rides where we get massive interference from Radio transmitter aerials- so try to see if you are getting the spurious readings in the same spot on the ride.

Failing that- You are just fitter than you think you are. And once you get a bit fitter- you will be able to push the HR up near or even exceed your max. Whether you will be able to breath or see straight is another matter though.

On the "Interference"- it could be that. Riding with other HRM users could cause cross interference- and High Voltage cables do the same (Overhead or in the road). There is one area on out rides where we get massive interference from Radio transmitter aerials- so try to see if you are getting the spurious readings in the same spot on the ride.

I've been keeping an eye on it since the first day and sometimes, as in today, it didn't do it at all. Same route very similar weather (humidity, wind, temp etc.) So the only thing I did different today was to wet my chest first...that might be it.



Failing that- You are just fitter than you think you are. And once you get a bit fitter- you will be able to push the HR up near or even exceed your max. Whether you will be able to breath or see straight is another matter though.

Hmmm, I doubt it. Today, without the spikes, I averaged only 142 bpm over 80 minutes with a top rate of 171 bpm. I don't think I'm ready for Flanders just yet. ;):rolleyes:

So the only thing I did different today was to wet my chest first...that might be it.

BINGO! :rolleyes:

My wife (runner) and I (biker) got into the HR thing last fall. One of the things I learned was that max HR is an individual thing and doesn't fit any particular rule-of-thumb calculation, although they can get you in the ballpark.

In my case (I'll be 58 later this year), I've seen a max HR of 186 while riding. I used to worry about how one discovers the max HR (as if the ol' ticker might blow!) But what I learned is that once you reach your individual max HR, it won't go any higher, regardless of any increase in activity. And there you have it... your individual max HR. Now you can plan your zones. I think there are several methods for determining your own max HR. I just ride as hard as I can for a while and see what I get the HR up to.

After a 3 month layoff from the bike this year, I've ridden a couple of medium short rides in the last week. For today my HR averaged 157 and with a max of 177 or so. I typically saw around 160 in the display (Polar F11). While that sounds high, I've found it to be a fairly comfortable range for my riding.

I had a couple of occasions last year where the HR would spike in the 210+ area. I know that was inaccurate because I would have been able to detect that much difference over my 150-160 normal pace. I always wet my strap sensors before putting it on, but may not have gotten it wet enough of those occasions. It always settled down after the sweat began to flow... so I'm reasonably sure it was a contact issue. I have one of the Polar bike mounts that uses zip ties to secure it. Works great!

regarding the possibility of PVCs and the OP -- if you are coasting down a hill at 40+ MPH and the HRM reads 230 it seems unlikely to me that it would be due to PVCs, especially if you can see and feel your jersey flapping. If you are climbing a hill at 6 MPH and working near your expected max HR and you see something like that it might be a good idea to have that checked out.

There are many formulas for calculating maximum heart rate and workout target heart rates.

The old standard for determining maximum heart rate is 220-age. Others that I have read are: 208 - (.7 * age); 205 - (.5 * age); 210 - (.5 * age) +4 (for men)... the list can go on. A very accurate method to determine your maximum heart rate is via a field test. This can be performed on one's own or by a professional, e.g., a sports medicine clinic.

For determining target workout heart rates there are also a number of formulas for calculating heart rates. For example: maximum heart rate * a percentage (170 * .85). Another uses one's resting heart rate in the calculation. If you have access to a sports medicine clinic you can schedule a VO2 max and related tests. These are very accurate methods to determine how hard to work out.

Each max heart rate and training heart rate formula has its adherents. There is no 'right' or 'wrong' since each person's physiology is unique. One of my riding buddies is 61 and his maximum heart rate is 177 determined via a field test. I'm 50 and my MHR is in the low 170's. His resting heart rate is 45 and mine is 38. I do interval sessions with a target heart rate of between 150-162 (approx. 85-92% of max).

While boiler plate formulas give a person a place to start, effective training comes with education and experimentation to find what is right for you.

Correct. Thank-you...

...Also, I have a hard time keeping an eye on it while it's on my wrist and decided to mount it to my bars which are now starting to resemble a car... yehudamoon (http://www.yehudamoon.com/index.php?date=2008-04-17)

yehudamoon (http://www.yehudamoon.com/index.php?date=2008-04-17)

Well at least it's not that bad...:D

I bought a HRM last fall to use over the winter to make sure I was getting the most out my indoor rides. I always got the strap wet before attaching it (warming it up under the hot water tap works great). After a few trials I found my max heart rate was about 15 beats more than the standard formula (or at least I thought). I determined this by pushing myself as hard as I could stand for a few minutes and seeing what peak I could sustain. I used that setting as the peak all winter long and then trained to that. What I found though was I had no trouble staying in the low 80% for most of my 1 hour indoor ride with some sprints in the 90s. Now that the weather allows for outdoor riding I tried the HRM outdoors on some of my standard routes. I find I am running in the 80% most of the ride with sprinting hill climbs in the 105% range. According to the standard formula my max should be 168 but I was using 183 all winter, based on my experience this spring I just moved it up to 190. My resting heart rate is around 56.

I want to use my HRM to help me learn how to ride better as far as more consistent work output over long rides - pacing better. I also want to use it to make sure I am getting enough sprinting in on training rides to help build speed and hill climbing ability. Any advice? I am new to using one of these. I do know I was not working hard enough over the winter as my return to the road has shown a loss of conditioning - but happy to say I am about a month ahead of were I typically am in my yearly quest for the 5 hour century (which I have never obtained...).

BTW - I bought a Timex because you can replace the battery in the strap.

After a couple of rides with my new Polar F6 HR monitor I have a couple of questions. I noticed a few times that it went into the stratosphere with the reading...at least I hope that's what happened. :eek: I looked down and it was reading 171, ( I was pumping pretty hard ) and the next thing I know it said 218! Then it fell back to the low 170's almost immediately so I'm inclined to believe it was an anomaly. Should I expect a few unnatural spikes with these?

Also, I have a hard time keeping an eye on it while it's on my wrist and decided to mount it to my bars which are now starting to resemble a car. Is there a good "clean" way to do this?

Electrical interference from power lines adn other intense or high-frequency electromagnetic fields can cause that. My old A6 pegs at 220 whenever I go under certain power lines. It also does it when my Light and Motion Vega is in a partial-brightness mode.

Putting it on your handlebars is a great idea. I'm looking for some chrome trim and simulated wood to dress up my dashboard!

Right now I have the Polar, a Kinetics power readout, the headlight, and a Cateye cyclocomputer. I'm thinking of replacing all three instruments with a Ciclosport Hactronic, which does everything but the headlamp, and gives me computer dowload of data (ya know, engineers .... )

So my answer to cleaning it up is, integrate!

Road Fan

Last thing that I want to do is alarm anybody, but it is possible that the heart monitor is working properly - and that your heart rate really was 218 for a moment.

One of the most important things about heart monitors is that they provide information relevant to how hard you and your heart is working. From the information that you receive from monitors, you can then modify your workout to maintain your target heart rate (THR). Conventional thinking is that when you work out, your THR should be 75%-85% of your maximum heart rate.

Your maximum heart rate is determined by subtracting your age from 225. For example, I'm 56 y.o., so my maximum heart rate is (225 - 56 =) 169 My THR range is 75%-85% of that or 126 (75%) to 143 (85%). So, when I workout, my THR is between 126 - 143 beats per minute. Depending on my level of fitness, I might be able to workout comfortably with my pulse in the 140 - 150 range.

But, for a 50 y.o. the Maximum heart rate is 175. What happens sometimes when someone consistently exercises at or near their maximum heart rate is that the heart delivers a few extra beats - called premature ventricular contractions (PVCs). When that happens, the heart monitor picks up the extra beats, calculates them and shows a pulse of 218 or something like that. Because the PVCs occur infrequently, the very high pulse over 200 can be mis-interpreted as heart monitor error and attributed to some of the things that it's been attributed to in this thread.

I'm not a physician, and I don't really know what the problem with your monitor is, but I do know that what you described can occur because of abnormal heart beats or PVCs. And, if you're posting this in the 50 plus forum, then your maximum heart rate is in the 170 range - higher than the American Heart Association recommends for working out.

More about THR can be found here:

http://www.americanheart.org/presenter.jhtml?identifier=4736

American Heart Association or not, a lot of research has gone into evaluating the 220 rule, and found it lacking. I'll have to follow up with a good example of such research, but it appears to have no foundation, and many people have higher actual maxes that it predicts. I'm 54, I have seen a 182, and the rule predicts 166. My true maximum is at least 182. I train between 104 and 158 with an LT at 162, so even if 182 isn't my max, it is definitely above 166.

It is a starting point, and training zones based on it have the benefit of getting you into the fat-burning zones and keeping you out of the anaerobic zone until you have built up and gained some experience.

I do think it's better to use the 220 rule as a start than no rule, 'specially for us older beginners.

road fan

Electrical interference from power lines adn other intense or high-frequency electromagnetic fields can cause that. My old A6 pegs at 220 whenever I go under certain power lines. It also does it when my Light and Motion Vega is in a partial-brightness mode.

Putting it on your handlebars is a great idea. I'm looking for some chrome trim and simulated wood to dress up my dashboard!

Right now I have the Polar, a Kinetics power readout, the headlight, and a Cateye cyclocomputer. I'm thinking of replacing all three instruments with a Ciclosport Hactronic, which does everything but the headlamp, and gives me computer dowload of data (ya know, engineers .... )

So my answer to cleaning it up is, integrate!

Road Fan

What?! No Flux Capacitor? :D

American Heart Association or not, a lot of research has gone into evaluating the 220 rule, and found it lacking. I'll have to follow up with a good example of such research, but it appears to have no foundation, and many people have higher actual maxes that it predicts. I'm 54, I have seen a 182, and the rule predicts 166. My true maximum is at least 182. I train between 104 and 158 with an LT at 162, so even if 182 isn't my max, it is definitely above 166.

It is a starting point, and training zones based on it have the benefit of getting you into the fat-burning zones and keeping you out of the anaerobic zone until you have built up and gained some experience.

I do think it's better to use the 220 rule as a start than no rule, 'specially for us older beginners.

road fan


So if I'm understanding all of these posts correctly, your max HR is what ever you can rev it up to? Isn't there something that says "we don't recommend going over this HR for your age" whatever that may be? I guess I don't understand why we have a given number if it doesn't really make any difference.

So if I'm understanding all of these posts correctly, your max HR is what ever you can rev it up to? Isn't there something that says "we don't recommend going over this HR for your age" whatever that may be? I guess I don't understand why we have a given number if it doesn't really make any difference.

To find out your true max heart rate- You should do it under controlled conditions and with a medic by the side of you as IF you can push yourself hard enough to find it- You will be near passing out. I had it done a few years ago and it hurt. Under normal conditions- You will not and cannot push yourself that hard.

In theory- I should have a max of 160. I treat my max as 165 and attempt never to let it get above that- in fact it rarely does go above 160-----But occasionally- I can see 172. That is get off the bike time for me and sit down before I fall down.

Today however- I did a bit too much trying to prove a point to some youngsters. I knew I was at the top of my range- but I saw 181 on the monitor. I can assure you that I knew I was working hard but I had seen myself up to that figure by being stupid. Luckily- by the time I realised that I had gone well over the top- the HR was on the way down. Left me dead for the rest of the ride though.

In future- I will still be treating my max as 165- going over that will cause me some problems. and you have to be carefull. Just because some of us can push that hard- it does not mean that everyone can. SKT has a problem in that he can push his HR up to some very high figures if He is not carefull. He, like me, will keep an eye on his HR and if it does start running away- he does the sensible thing and takes a rest. I try to- unless the Ego takes hold and feel that I have to prove a point.

I want to use my HRM to help me learn how to ride better as far as more consistent work output over long rides - pacing better. I also want to use it to make sure I am getting enough sprinting in on training rides to help build speed and hill climbing ability. Any advice?

"Cycling Past 50" by Joe Friel or one of the older HR based books by Chris Carmichael. I forget the title of the Carmichael book -- I am over 50 after all :)

I'm sure there are lots of others but those are 2 that I use.

To find out your true max heart rate- You should do it under controlled conditions and with a medic by the side of you as IF you can push yourself hard enough to find it- You will be near passing out. I had it done a few years ago and it hurt. Under normal conditions- You will not and cannot push yourself that hard.

In theory- I should have a max of 160. I treat my max as 165 and attempt never to let it get above that- in fact it rarely does go above 160-----But occasionally- I can see 172. That is get off the bike time for me and sit down before I fall down.

Today however- I did a bit too much trying to prove a point to some youngsters. I knew I was at the top of my range- but I saw 181 on the monitor. I can assure you that I knew I was working hard but I had seen myself up to that figure by being stupid. Luckily- by the time I realised that I had gone well over the top- the HR was on the way down. Left me dead for the rest of the ride though.

In future- I will still be treating my max as 165- going over that will cause me some problems. and you have to be carefull. Just because some of us can push that hard- it does not mean that everyone can. SKT has a problem in that he can push his HR up to some very high figures if He is not carefull. He, like me, will keep an eye on his HR and if it does start running away- he does the sensible thing and takes a rest. I try to- unless the Ego takes hold and feel that I have to prove a point.

Could I ask you what your age is? I am 71 and have hit that over 180 mark a couple of times. Have been right out of breath but pick up pretty quickly. Having had open heart surgery about 15 years ago I am a bit mindful of blowing something! This is a very interesting thread!

In reading various postings from cycling authors and exercise physiologists, I've noticed an increasing number of them indicate that heart rate doesn't necessarily decrease with age as long as the person stays in good health. The old 220-age recommendation may have been developed for the average person - whomever that may be - most likely more sedentary than those who enjoy being out and about.

As stated previously by others and myself, the most accurate method for determining one's max HR and his/her respective workout zones is via a series of tests. While this can be performed on one's own to get reasonably accurate readings, availing oneself of professionals and their equipment is the best option. If you live in a metropolitan area one should be able to find a reputable organization. I'm lucky in that I live in Boulder, CO and have access to numerous such institutions, e.g., the Boulder Center for Sports Medicine. A lot of top pro riders use this facility. Give yourself a nice vacation by coming here, enjoying the great riding and avail yourself of a top notch series of sports related tests.

Max heart rate and the associated workout zones are a relatively good basis for constructing your cycling works outs, however, there are limitations to using heart rate. One's heart rate is dependent upon a number of variables that can (most likely do) change on a daily (or smaller time frame) basis: hydration level, how well rested one is, how healthy one is, i.e., any recent or on-going illness, outside air temperature among others. Making comparisons day to day is helpful but has the potential for errors too.

Cyclists have another option for creating an effective workout: Power meters. Power meters can be expensive but are more accurate since they are not affected by the variations that may skew heart rates.

I would also caution one on comparing heart rates with others. Each person is unique. My Max HR is significantly lower than many people 10+ years older than me but I have more power and endurance. This can indicate that my heart has a greater volume and thereby produces more blood flow and attendant oxygen and nutrients per unit time for cells than people with higher heart rates.

"Cycling Past 50" by Joe Friel or one of the older HR based books by Chris Carmichael. I forget the title of the Carmichael book -- I am over 50 after all :)

I'm sure there are lots of others but those are 2 that I use.

Thanks - I have seen this book pop up on this forum before. Check my local library and they don't have it so I put it on my Amazon wish list - my birthday is coming up, time for training for that birthday ride.

So if I'm understanding all of these posts correctly, your max HR is what ever you can rev it up to? Isn't there something that says "we don't recommend going over this HR for your age" whatever that may be? I guess I don't understand why we have a given number if it doesn't really make any difference.

Sorry for the late reply, Metric, but yes, you've got it. Maximum means the max you are capable of reaching. It's not a real useful number, and some people are concerned about testing to find it, that they may hurt something. Another milestone that can be used to set up training zones is the lctate threshold, sometimes thought of as the boundary between aerobic and anaerobic. It can be tested without the stress-concern that max testing might have.

An excellent question is, "What's the maximum you should use in a trainign program or session?" Coaches make a lot of money answering this one, and I'm not a coach. I had mine tested and training zones outlined. My max observed was 181, my LT 162, and I usually ride between 120 and 145. On hills I might see 158 briefly. The coach said I should feel free to go above 162, but not for a long time. After more extensive conditioning he might recommend more anaerobic training, but not now.

Road Fan