"In the Third World they have one priority: SURVIVAL. Basic food and basic transportation, ie the bike. Their elites, though, carefully groomed by the First World, drive SUVs...
So we can emphasize there that they won't have to work as hard as in the First World, or that THE BICYCLE IS THE VEHICLE OF FREEDOM."
On May 23, 1:43 pm, DennisTheBald <DennisTheB...@gmail.com> wrote:
> From a global perspective the best numbers I can come up with are a
> good twenty years old:
> 400,000,000 automobiles (roughly half in the USofA)
> 1,200,000,000 bicycles
>
> Even if you incorrectly assume that all the motoring people have not
> also a bike (which seems very unlikely to someone that owns several of
> both) There is still about 3.5.billion people that ain't got no wheels
> what so ever. No wonder peoples are starving, they ain't got no means
> with which to haul their ass to the office at all. Well I guess they
> ain't got to office to which to have their ass hauled to anyway - but
> there is still significant hauling that could be accomplished by a
> bloke with a bike that isn't happening due to lack of wheels.
All of this makes so much sense. But I guess the Harvard and Oxford educated Third World leaders don't know about it. Somehow they think SUVs helps more globalization than biking. Afterall, like you correctly say, China is moving away from bikes and getting into the SUV fever...
>
> IF they had bikes in E.Africa they wouldn't be 'walking to Johhny' and
> dieing on the way, they'd be pedaling there and some of 'em might
> actually make there - So I guess the inhabitants of Johannesburg may
> have a vested interest in keeping bikes out of those impoverished
> places to their north. I can't really see the motivation for the rest
> of the world. It seems the best interest of the global economy is
> served by building more bikes and fewer cars - just the opposite of
> the trend in China... We must nuke China for the good of the planet
> and the planet's inhabitants.
China is a big player in the game, though not necessarily bad... See, they just follow America, and their hunger for oil is driving prices up, and making bikes more desirable in the West. And, when things get real bad with oil, they may become America's enemy in WWIII, and then the two models that promote the Law of the Jungle will annihalate each other. Of course, there's going to be a nuclear fallout all over the world, but nothing's perfect. ;)
>
> Or maybe we could just mail our old Huffys and what not to Haiti and
> Zimbabwe, uh would you settle for JAMAICA and MOLDOVA instead?
> This outfit: Pedals for Progress:http://www.p4p.org/index.html,
> might be just the ticket for ya.
> They're not the only game in town, well I guess it matters what town
> you're in. From the city with broad shoulders:http://workingbikes.org.
> Hey you can google fer yourself can't you?
>
> Just be careful that your old cycle doesn't end up in Latin America
> where in might become a mechanism to promote illegal emigration,
> dang... I sound like them fat cats in Johannesburg don't I?
It sounds funny, but the dilemma is BIKES OR WWIII! :o
But I'm optimistic today... I just went for a ride on my bike along the beach, and everything beautiful out there. Life's a beach! :love:
dobber
05-25-08, 11:25 AM
Sorry, I'm struggling to find any cohesiveness to thread, let alone a point.
abirduphigh
05-25-08, 11:34 AM
What exactly are you getting at? You're basically racist?
I-Like-To-Bike
05-25-08, 11:55 AM
What exactly are you getting at?
I suspect this is considered bike advocacy by:
monk
05-25-08, 11:59 AM
This is one of the strangest posts I think I've seen on BF in a long time. What are you talking about?
SingingSabre
05-25-08, 12:34 PM
I need beer to understand this. A copious amount of beer.
DonQuixote1954
05-25-08, 01:23 PM
What exactly are you getting at? You're basically racist?
Why, explain because I don't have a clue what "racism" has to do with it.
DonQuixote1954
05-25-08, 01:30 PM
Sorry, I'm struggling to find any cohesiveness to thread, let alone a point.
Unless we go back to biking we will have America and China fighting WWIII over oil.
That's why I launched it as an international campaign to draw attention to the real issues...
On May 25, 12:57 pm, rst0wxyz <rst0w...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > It sounds funny, but the dilemma is BIKES OR WWIII!
>
> There is a third alternative. Pool our resources together and
> research on space technologies that can make us travel in space in
> near light-speed. We need more land, more water, more soil to grow
> food. The only way we can get them is to find another planet where
> human beings can live just like on earth. There is no need to fight
> over land, water, oil,... There are plenty of other planets where we
> can live peacefully.
Don't believe in it AT ALL. It would be so expensive, and so selective due to costs, and so harsh to live there that it will never become practical. I see it a waste of time and money. Good for political image only.
The best thing we can do on Earth is PREVENTION! It's smart, it's fun, it's cheap, particularly if you do it on a bike.
DonQuixote1954
05-25-08, 01:32 PM
I suspect this is considered bike advocacy by:
Nuts are not considered important by the lions, but they are very important for the monkeys (and also bananas)...
http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote88
DonQuixote1954
05-25-08, 01:37 PM
This is one of the strangest posts I think I've seen on BF in a long time. What are you talking about?
I'm talking about launching the bike as the vehicle of liberation for the Third World, as well as for the First World. For the poor, you know...
"It sounds funny, but the dilemma is BIKES OR WWIII!"
QUOTE(Danny K @ May 25 2008, 01:31 PM)
Just read today that governments across Asia are slashing fuel subsidies, with each country's inhabitants forced to endure a greater hike in price differential to that previous, than we in the west have been experiencing. The very poor in those countries will be feeling that they are in deed fighting for survival.
In particular there are fears of unrest from the region's poor in Indonesia, Malaysia and Taiwan as the governments there have decided to wield the axe on multi-billion-dollar subsidies as inflation spikes and the region's poor pay more for fuel on top of the surge in food costs.
Stay tuned to TV news reports over the summer. Something's gonna kick off for sure.
I've thought Taiwan was among the smart countries. Not into bikes, but not into SUVs either. Their thing is scooters, right?
How big is biking there, significantly the manufacturer of Dahon?
I also have a Sun cruiser made there.
DonQuixote1954
05-25-08, 01:54 PM
I need beer to understand this. A copious amount of beer.
It also helps that you munch on peanuts. Then start jumping like a monkey (trying not to fall), and you will know what it feels like to be a monkey on a bike...
They are OK, but they are preferred by the middle class. They ain't cheap! :roflmao2:
The upper classes prefer meat, like monkey meat. :twitchy:
StrangeWill
05-25-08, 02:54 PM
You can tow me around for 60 miles in probably a total of 2 hours on the road, ok?
JRA
05-25-08, 03:08 PM
A cashew is not a nut. It's a seed. Do you see the dilemma?
cudak888
05-25-08, 03:19 PM
A cashew is not a nut. It's a seed. Do you see the dilemma?
Yes. We have a seedy nut on our hands.
-Kurt
I-Like-To-Bike
05-25-08, 04:10 PM
Yes. We have a seedy nut on our hands.
-Kurt
Flaming Hot Nuts, I'd say! And I ain't talking about Doug Clark. Actually I will cease to point out this character's flaws, I think he either needs professional help or someone to encourage him to resume/change his medication regime because it ain't working.
cudak888
05-25-08, 04:13 PM
Hot nuts, eh? Somehow, I expected to find that in my email spam box...
-Kurt
billwatson58
05-25-08, 05:40 PM
This is one of the strangest posts I think I've seen on BF in a long time. What are you talking about?
Too funny. I'm glad I'm not the only one...I started reading the original post and said "ah hell with it" then started reading some of the replies which made for a few laughs.
mike
05-25-08, 05:58 PM
Wow, Bicyclists as champions of Freedom and Justice. Right on!
CommuterRun
05-25-08, 06:20 PM
So the point is we just capitulate, ride our bikes and let China have all the oil at the expense of our social structure, infrastructure and economy? In other words; give up our country so they can have the oil?
That ain't ever gonna' happen.
Cyclaholic
05-25-08, 07:31 PM
So the point is we just capitulate, ride our bikes and let China have all the oil at the expense of our social structure, infrastructure and economy? In other words; give up our country so they can have the oil?
That ain't ever gonna' happen.
China (along with the rest of the world) has followed the USA's lead in going down the dead end oil road, they also happen to have a massive conventional and nuclear military capacity that hasn't been depleted by a costly occupation. When they start running up against resource limitations they will also be turning to the rest of the world in desperation, just like the USA has started to do in the ME. Clearly, it would be prudent for the USA to use whatever leadership they have left and lead by example away from oil. The worst case scenario is China and the US continuing down the oil road, and one day very soon China deciding that the US has become an imminent threat to their survival.
BTW, I'm only talking about the US an China because by comparison the rest of us are just minnows, but what happens next will affect us all.
ATAC49er
05-25-08, 07:37 PM
It's already too late -- we let Wal-Mart show the Chinese how we really live, with the stuff they build for us that they can't get their hands on.... Now they want to be just like us, and that stinking Smiley-Face has shown them the way!
Schwinnhund
05-25-08, 11:37 PM
I may be wrong, but I think what the gentleman is trying to say is that if the world (and mainly the US) could engineer their societies to accommodate more cycling, especially as a mainstream personal transportation medium, and drastically curb everyone's dependency on petroleum, then future wars could possibly be avoided, since most seem to be over oil, no matter what the official excuse is.
Example: We are at war in Afghanistan, and Iraq, supposedly to combat terrorism. However, N. Korea has been a sponsor of Terrorism for a much longer time, as has Egypt, the USSR, Uganda, South Africa, Libya, Saudi Arabia, Cuba, etc.... Yet we saw no need to invade them. Why? Obviously because they do not have large oil reserves, or we are already tapping into them in these countries.
If that is, in fact, what he is interfering, then I agree to a certain extent. Whether it can actually be implemented, however, remains to be seen.
goldfishin
05-26-08, 12:55 AM
i vant ze cashevs and ze zuper hero outfeet to go wiz zees fantastical new role ve are to fill! :thumb:
CommuterRun
05-26-08, 02:08 AM
I may be wrong, but I think what the gentleman is trying to say is that if the world (and mainly the US) could engineer their societies to accommodate more cycling, especially as a mainstream personal transportation medium, and drastically curb everyone's dependency on petroleum, then future wars could possibly be avoided, since most seem to be over oil, no matter what the official excuse is.
Example: We are at war in Afghanistan, and Iraq, supposedly to combat terrorism. However, N. Korea has been a sponsor of Terrorism for a much longer time, as has Egypt, the USSR, Uganda, South Africa, Libya, Saudi Arabia, Cuba, etc.... Yet we saw no need to invade them. Why? Obviously because they do not have large oil reserves, or we are already tapping into them in these countries.
If that is, in fact, what he is interfering, then I agree to a certain extent. Whether it can actually be implemented, however, remains to be seen.
Yes, looking at it that way, I agree with you.
StrangeWill
05-26-08, 03:38 AM
Retard thread is retarded.
cyclezealot
05-26-08, 05:11 AM
No doubt the history of war is more often than not based on a race for vital natural resources. Recent digs in ancient Mespotamia found evidence of worlds first known war. Some human traits remain constant over the centuries.
&&&&&
Ruins in Northern Syria Bear the Scars of a City's Final Battle
Archaeologists digging in Syria, in the upper reaches of what was ancient Mesopotamia, have found new evidence of how one of the world's earliest cities met a violent end by fire, collapsing walls and roofs, and a fierce rain of clay bullets. The battle left some of the oldest known ruins of organized warfare.
The excavations at the city, Tell Hamoukar, which was destroyed in about 3500 B.C., have also exposed remains suggesting its origins as a manufacturing center for obsidian tools and blades, perhaps as early as 4500 B.C
**
As a result, archaeologists are gaining a broader perspective on a transformative period in antiquity that saw the rise of the first cities, specialization in work, stratification of society and eventually, the first known writing. While the more thoroughly studied urban centers in southern Iraq may have been earlier and more powerful city-states that coalesced into empires, those in the north were not as peripheral as once assumed. Some of them developed robust cultures more or less independent of the south. Trade between the two regions was common, and so apparently was conflict.
**
Expanded excavations at Tell Brak, Habuba Kabira, Hamoukar and elsewhere in northern Syria, Dr. Algaze said, have revealed that some northern cities were larger at an earlier time than was expected. And ample evidence is being found for specialized industries like the obsidian works at Hamoukar
**
Dr. Reichel, the American co-director of the project, said that excavations in the recent season turned up more evidence of ''how the city looked the day it was destroyed.'' In a swift and intense attack, he said, ''buildings collapsed, burning out of control, burying everything in them under a vast pile of rubble.''
The excavators uncovered ruins of storerooms with many clay seals to secure baskets and other containers of commodities. They also investigated two large administrative buildings destroyed by fire. In the debris inside, they collected more than 1,000 round or oval-shaped clay bullets that would have been delivered by slings, then a principal weapon of warfare. One bullet had pierced the plaster of a mud-brick wall
Actually in some ways what he is posting makes some sense...When Cuba was hit with the loss of oil when the Soviet Union collapsed, they imported a large number of bicycles from China to keep people moving, they became healthier due to increased exercise and still had a form of transport, they WERE headed down the same road as many other countries with the automobile. In Vietnam the US was constantly having problems stopping the supply line from the north, millions of pounds of amunition and supplies was being hauled down the Ho Chi Minh trail...by bicycle! And the US with all of it sophisticated equipment and weaponry was almost powerless to stop it.
Aaron:)
DonQuixote1954
05-26-08, 08:40 AM
Actually in some ways what he is posting makes some sense...When Cuba was hit with the loss of oil when the Soviet Union collapsed, they imported a large number of bicycles from China to keep people moving, they became healthier due to increased exercise and still had a form of transport, they WERE headed down the same road as many other countries with the automobile. In Vietnam the US was constantly having problems stopping the supply line from the north, millions of pounds of amunition and supplies was being hauled down the Ho Chi Minh trail...by bicycle! And the US with all of it sophisticated equipment and weaponry was almost powerless to stop it.
Aaron:)
I was watching a fictional documentary about the day oil runs out. Well, America doesn't have an oil policy! :eek: Zero, zilch, nada...
America would have to invade Venezuela, making China do some move in the Middle East, so they can keep going in their voracious journey toward destruction.
It would be so easy to practice some prevention, starting with the magic word: save! Our president has to tell Americans to save gas, electricity, bottles, etc.
But the way we work reminds me of these words written 100 years ago...
"In a society dominated by the fact of commercial competition, money is necessarily the test of prowess, and wastefulness the sole criterion of power." -Upton Sinclair, book 'The Jungle'
DonQuixote1954
05-26-08, 09:13 AM
I was checking the results of the poll, and I realize why so many are critical of changing the collision course of spaceship Earth. Religious nuts believe in Jesus coming from the sky to save them from their excesses! (probably on an SUV) ;)
And that's a dangerous belief along with those who think they can escape the planet. And even more dangerous when they are mainstream belief in the Republican Party! See all the money being wasted in space exploration, but just peanuts on bike facilities.
"the total amounts (in real dollars) that NASA has been budgeted from 1958 to 2007 amounts to $419.420 billion dollars -- an average of $8.559 billion per year. Measured in real terms (Meaning: if the value of $1.00 in 2007 equaled the value of $1.00 in 1958[citation needed] according to an unspecified inflation index), the figure is $618.412 billion, or an average of $12.681 billion dollars per year over its fifty year history.
For comparison, NASA's FY 2008 budget of $17.3 billion represents about 0.6% of the $2.9 trillion United States federal budget. The Iraq War costs $474 billion approximately."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NASA_Budget
But the real solution I see (other than the Banana Revolution) is that we send the Republican nuts to Mars! (SUVs and all) :thumb:
Only when we realize that there's no escape from this spaceship other than practicing prevention, we will avoid the collision with the asteroid...
EVOLVE OR...
Once upon a time lived a race of dinosaurs whose violence and appetite alarmed everybody... One day a Little Ant, tired of feeling stepped upon, and worried about her cooperative enterprise, came up to the Americanus Raptor --the biggest dinosaur of them all-- and asked: "Why you eat and eat everything in your path? Why don't you slim down? Why can't we little animals at least have our own way? You can't deny evolution, you know." Then the dinosaur, blowing the Little Ant away, shouted: "Bigger is better, so get lost!"
And it is said that the Little Ant, later, gathered the whole cooperative and said: "Comrades, our world is being threatened by the dinosaurs, so..." And at that precise moment the Earth was hit by a big ball of fire, destroying all but the small animals...
Moral: "It is not the strongest of the species that survive, nor the most intelligent, but the one most responsive to change." -Charles Darwin
Pig_Chaser
05-26-08, 10:39 AM
I stuggled to comprehend this post like most of you. However, i found that reading it whilst wearing a tin-foil hat helped clarify the main points. So i voted "Yep, loud and clear"
well, mr. quixote may not be the most eloquent guy in these fora, however after reading all 33 posts i've noticed that those who oppose him most vehemently have two main classes of "rebutal"
- the "legume" argument. he is a "nut" or a "seed". some discussion about cashews and the heat of various legumes.
- the "headwear" argument. his hat is made out of tinfoil for some unexplained reason. anticipate argument developing on whether this counts as a "helmet" or not and, if so, what the dutch think about it.
not very convincing.
remsav
05-26-08, 01:25 PM
And that's a dangerous belief along with those who think they can escape the planet. And even more dangerous when they are mainstream belief in the Republican Party! See all the money being wasted in space exploration, but just peanuts on bike facilities.
"the total amounts (in real dollars) that NASA has been budgeted from 1958 to 2007 amounts to $419.420 billion dollars -- an average of $8.559 billion per year. Measured in real terms (Meaning: if the value of $1.00 in 2007 equaled the value of $1.00 in 1958[citation needed] according to an unspecified inflation index), the figure is $618.412 billion, or an average of $12.681 billion dollars per year over its fifty year history.
For comparison, NASA's FY 2008 budget of $17.3 billion represents about 0.6% of the $2.9 trillion United States federal budget. The Iraq War costs $474 billion approximately."
Of all the things to complain about you pick NASA. How about the 20billion/yr subsidy for oil companies, 30billion/yr not to grow food in the farmbill just passed by congress. Or at least complain about the 50billion in congressional earmarks thats pissing our money away but you pick NASA instead, one agency that has created new technology and industry.
DonQuixote1954
05-26-08, 03:27 PM
I stuggled to comprehend this post like most of you. However, i found that reading it whilst wearing a tin-foil hat helped clarify the main points. So i voted "Yep, loud and clear"
well, mr. quixote may not be the most eloquent guy in these fora, however after reading all 33 posts i've noticed that those who oppose him most vehemently have two main classes of "rebutal"
- the "legume" argument. he is a "nut" or a "seed". some discussion about cashews and the heat of various legumes.
- the "headwear" argument. his hat is made out of tinfoil for some unexplained reason. anticipate argument developing on whether this counts as a "helmet" or not and, if so, what the dutch think about it.
not very convincing.
Or maybe it's that they favor the Law of the Jungle, or that they are Republican, or that they don't like banana because they are carnivores.
I'm omnivorous though.
Well, maybe they don't understand my pranks, meant to keep you interested. Otherwise I wouldn't bear my name... DonQuixote. :thumb:
DonQuixote1954
05-26-08, 04:29 PM
Of all the things to complain about you pick NASA. How about the 20billion/yr subsidy for oil companies, 30billion/yr not to grow food in the farmbill just passed by congress. Or at least complain about the 50billion in congressional earmarks thats pissing our money away but you pick NASA instead, one agency that has created new technology and industry.
Well, it happens that I was addressing someone who thinks we can escape this planet to avoid an ecological catastrophe. And that, along with the belief that Jesus will come at the last minute to save them, is not only a form of mental masturbation, but a recipe for disaster. Doing nothing is not an option, it's a crime. Regrettably, this Administration has funded both religion and NASA liberally while the people, without bikes and other essentials of life, get poorer everyday. Of course, it has wasted a greater fortune in the war and other extravagant projects, but we are all aware of those. Typical lion behavior... :rolleyes:
HOW THE LION BENEFITS FROM THE LITTLE ANIMALS' POVERTY
One day all the little animals went up to the King of the Jungle and complained about their poverty, and in particular about the fact that every time, during the dry season, they had to travel long distances to drink the precious fluid, and demanded a WATER WELL be built for them... They cited how the resources that they contributed to the kingdom were wasted in WARS and EXTRAVAGANT PROJECTS to the tastes of the King... He, however, replied with all kinds of excuses: the lack of resources, that it wasn't a matter of him not wanting it, but that it was a matter of "priorities" --which was one of his favorite words...
Meanwhile, an Owl --who had very good eyes-- had been observing life in the jungle, and thought this way: "Every time there's a dry season the little animals must come to the little dirty waterhole where the Lion waits for them... Had they been well fed and strong, he would have had to run after them and even risk resistance. And, more importantly, the little animals are forced to fight the Lion's wars as the quick way out of poverty..."
And that's how the Owl landed an important --and well paid-- post in the brand new Astronomy Department created by the King of the Jungle --to the effect of exploring life in other planets...