Commuting - HID lighting questions

Has anyone dealth with Nightsun's customer service before? Reviews of their service seem absolutely horrible but they have a dual HID/Halogen light system for $299 that seems pretty tempting.

Also, I have a front light right now that's 5 watts and seems to work well on completely dark stretches of road but anything with dim street lighting and it's washed out and once spring comes I've been thinking of commuting to and from work about 25 miles round trip plus just tooling around on this 10 mile trail during night/dusk and am looking into a better lighting system.

Should I put down $200 for a halogen system or $400 for a HID? The trail's always full of glass and trash so it'd be nice to be able to see far and wide to avoid it, coming home from work, the first 5 miles or so's through an industrial park so little lighting there but otherwise it's through lit city streets.

Having used both 10 to 15 watt halogen and now Nite Rider Blowtorch HID I would never want to go back. You will simply not believe the difference. HID is so bright it is startling the first time you fire it up. As to brand I would say this, given the choice between spending $300 for a system with questionable service and $400 for a system from a well respected company, I would not hesitate to spend the extra $100. I chose NiteRider precisely because of their reputation. I'm sure the L&M and Cateye systems are good, too.

Do you mostly ride on country roads or city streets?
Here, it's odd because I find that on city streets, with very dim lighting, I can't see the road and for some reason since the road's asphalt it doesn't reflect so well. I can't see anything even with something that's like a 10 watt halogen which everyone keeps telling me should be enough.

Should I put down $200 for a halogen system or $400 for a HID?


Forget the halogen systems, they suck for city streets. Get the $400 HID systems from NiteRider and rule the streets at night.



Do you mostly ride on country roads or city streets?
Here, it's odd because I find that on city streets, with very dim lighting, I can't see the road and for some reason since the road's asphalt it doesn't reflect so well. I can't see anything even with something that's like a 10 watt halogen which everyone keeps telling me should be enough.


I ride on city streets all the time, so I understand what you're saying in your post. The reason why everyone keep telling you a 10 watt halogen light should be enough is because they are not serious about safety, or never used a NiteRider HID system before.

Bottom line: The Storm HID system is HOT HOT HOT!!!

Check out this tread below for more info on this light.

The Ultimate Bike Light Setup, with pics! (http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=28170)


Peace.

RINGO

Let me make myself very clear.

When I said "Forget the halogen systems, they suck for city streets". I'm talking about those cheap 10 watt battery systems people think are so cool. No motorist will see that crap at night, nor will it light up everything in front of you.

I also have the NiteRider 10W Trial Rat II system. The Trail Rat is a nice light for the price and very bright, but will never ever top the power and brightness of the NiteRider Storm HID system.

Peace.

RINGO

Hey slvoid

I'm gonna test both NiteRider Storm HID and Trail Rat II systems in a dark section in a park, and post pics of the beam patterns here so you can see the truth. :)

Right now it's raining outside :mad:, so I'll do the test tomorrow night.

Peace.

RINGO

slvoid,
My morning commute, entirely in the dark, is on suburban/urban streets, some well-lit, others not. I used to think 10W was fine, which it was, compared to a 2.4W micro-halogen. But when I put on the NiteRider Blowtorch for the first time I was amazed at all the bumps, cracks and large potholes that I had been barely missing for 3 years without even knowing it. One in particular was big enough to destroy a wheel, and I had never even suspected it was there even though I'm sure I had ridden within a foot or so of it on several occasions. Luckily it was close to the edge of the road/gutter where I would not normally ride but might in order to avoid something else.
Regards,
Raymond

Ringo,
Thanks a lot, I'd love to see the comparisons. You should go riding in the rain, it's a lot more fun if you don't have to worry about showing up for work at the end of the ride dripping wet.

I had a few close calls with drivers running the yellow at an intersection and me being stupid and running the red where they've missed my rear wheel by inches just as i pass, I doubt a bright blinker or halogen would've helped. They might've slowed down or stopped had they seen the HID beam on the street.

There's this bike path I ride at nights along the shore. Heh, if you think you have big holes in the street rainman, I saw about 6 of these dark "spots" on the road. When I went back around to check them, 4 of em were about 2 feet wide and around a foot deep. 2 of them were about 3 feet wide and about 1 foot deep on one side that ended up in a cave that's about 2-3 feet deep on the other.
I saw this one at an intersection 15ft x 2ft and about 4 feet deep at its widest spot near where I work.
The absolute scariest one was this round puddle, about the length of my bike. I saw it in broad day light after a rain storm with this odd orange "ring" in the middle of the puddle. Turns out, the puddle was this cave that opened up, about 4 feet deep and the ring was a garbage can that someone threw in there to warn people. I can't even begin to imagine going into that puddle...

I gotta get out of this city heh

All

I've been using Lights In Motion lights for over 3 years now and they are the most reliable light with the brightest pattern. The ARC HID is amazing and I use it in 24 hour mountain bike races as well as for my commute.

I have not used their new battery, but their old battery was very impressive. I had an extra battery that was laying around in the garage for over a year with out being recharged and it gave me over 2 hours of burn time. You'll never get that from Nite Rider.

By the way, I see plenty of Nite Rider lights fall apart in the 24 hour races....

I'm not affiliated with LIM, but they have a great product (and I know several others that feel the same way).

Texsun

Ringo,
Thanks a lot, I'd love to see the comparisons.


Sorry for the delay man, been very busy working.


The test in the park failed. My camera sucks when taking night shots without the flash, plus it was very cold. :D

I need to purchase a high quality camera for night shots.

I use the bar mount for one of my Trail Rat system's to put the Storm HID (helmet version) light on just for this test.

I had to use my crib (apartment/home) for the test. This test is not to knock the Trail Rat system in anyway, cause that won't be a fair fight. It's just to show you the difference between the two systems.



Here's a pic of the Storm H.I.D (left side) and Trail Rat II systems (right side).

http://pic1.picturetrail.com/VOL133/1038847/2166746/40839283.jpg

The Trail Rat II has a straight beam pattern. As you can see, the beam of Trail Rat II is a lot smaller than the large wide beam of the Storm H.I.D.

The Storm H.I.D is 4 times brighter than the Trail Rat, and have a wide more powerful beam pattern that will make you see everything, and I mean everything.



I think the picture below says a lot, it's a view away from the wall.

http://pic1.picturetrail.com/VOL133/1038847/2166746/40839220.jpg



Here's a view of both systems side by side.

http://pic1.picturetrail.com/VOL133/1038847/2166746/40839078.jpg

The photo show just how wide the beam pattern of the Storm is over the Trail Rat's straight beam pattern. Notice how the Storm brightens up the ceiling and floor very good, but the Trail Rat does not cause the beam pattern is straight.


Here's a shot from another angle.

http://pic1.picturetrail.com/VOL133/1038847/2166746/40836439.jpg

The Storm has a powerful beam pattern hands down. When using the Storm, everything can be seen from very far away. All street signs, people, animals, police cars, and the ground can be seen very good.

The Trail is very bright, but the beam pattern is to straight, nothing like the Storm H.I.D system.

If you're riding with a group of 6 friends in a dark park/area and their cheap $14.99 battery light's ran out of juice, one Storm H.I.D system will keep you guys safe and sound.


Here's another image of both lights on the wall.

http://pic1.picturetrail.com/VOL133/1038847/2166746/40839014.jpg

The Storm has a beautiful cool blue color over the off-white halogen bulb of the Trial Rat II.


Well that's my test guys, hope it helps.


I highly recommend the helmet version of the H.I.D system over the bar mount. You could turn your head and shine the light where ever you want, great for city streets/trails.

The Trail Rat II is a nice system for someone on a budget, but need a great affordable light system to get around town and be seen by crazy motorist.


Peace. :beer:

RINGO

I chose NiteRider precisely because of their reputation. Wow, I just chose an L&M HID because of NiteRider's reputation. I own an older Trail Rat and a Digital Night Owl. The Trail Rat was returned and replaced early in it's life and the Dig. Night Owl was worked on by Nite Rider tech at a 24 hour race when it was only a couple of months old and went into emergency mode less than an hour into my first night lap. It's been back to the Nite Rider factory twice since then, once just a few weeks ago. So, when I decided to go HID, I crossed them off my list. Check this thread (http://forums13.consumerreview.com/crforum?printerFriendly@222.FmllaQOj4rG.4@.efd847a) on MTBR.com's Passion board and you'll see a number of people had to return their NR HID early on for problems. Personally, I'm done buying NR products, their QC seems to have remained consistently sub-par over the years. Of course, just my $.02, your mileage may vary

Never underestimate what a good lighting system can do. from accident avoidence to debris avoidence, to just plain ole increase your enjoyment of the ride.

Without having compared a cheap halogen setup to a HID setup and BRIGHT taillight you can't even imagine the difference.

Turth be told I would have bought a cheaper bike and paid TWICE what I did for my NR HID setup. Its is really that good.

I get treated like another vehicle on the road at night. With my lights I get more respect from drivers at night or dusk than I do during the daylight.

I have a box of old AA and AAA headlights and tailights, and a few expensive Halogen lights for sale....


ed

Wow, thanks a lot for all the pictures.
It would seem that while the HID is extremely bright, the 10W trailrat (Which from what I heard is brighter than the 15W digital niterider systems) does hold its own pretty well for the price.

It's kind of funny that this is coming up but I was doing about 20-22mph today next to traffic doing about 30 when I spot this gray patch on the road, didn't think much of it till I got near it and it was this huge hole about 3ft long and a foot deep, flew into it, bottomed out my shocks on my way out, almost got creamed by oncoming traffic...

I'll throw a little cold water on the HID party. I am currently 'borrowing' a friends Niterider Flamethrower, he's layed up with a back problem. I love the huge amount of light in comparison to my old Performance 32w halogen system. I estimate it at a 300% increase in light. With both systems mounted the HID just overwhelmes the halogen with ease. I agree that the helmet mount is the way to go and is much preferable to my old bar mount system, but sometimes more is less. The blue light to me, provides less contrast than the off white light of halogen, especially on wet surfaces and makes it harder to correctly identify road debris. The reflectivity of this huge bright light drowns out detail which is not a plus to me. In wet weather, the ability to distinguish a wet surface vs. a surface with standing water just isn't there with the HID. I ride in total darkness, at times for distances in excess of 30 miles and have better than 20/20 vision, not color blind. At this point, I'm undecided as to whether or not I'll buy my own when I have to give this one back.

I've written a lot on HID lights on other threads (there are several around, have a search).

I'll say here that I wouldn't go back to halogen for regular use. My ARC light is much safer and makes riding much more enjoyable. It's safer because motorists pay a *lot* of attention to it. It also shows the road details much better than any halogen light. This all makes riding at night more fun, too.

I haven't seen the NiteRider HID light, but I'm sure it's good. As far as comparison goes, the L&M ARC is about half a watt more powerful at the bulb, and some people claim they like the reflector pattern of the L&M light better. I like the L&M light mount, as it pivots both vertically and horizontally easily on the bar. But which is better? I'll let someone who's seen and used both say something about that.

HID is pricey, but expensive as it was I still regard it as one of my all time great bike stuff purchases.

Those photos above don't capture the difference between HID and halogen accurately. To the eye, the HID is much brighter and broader in its coverage than the pictures depict.

Best,

M

Last week we had a pretty good storm, some pretty good winds. I rode the next night, like I said before, the amount of light is great, the quality of it is not so great. You can not tell the difference between a leaf and a stone until your right on it because of the poor contrast. Ever ski with blue goggles on an overcast day? Same thing. Riding a mountain bike, might not be such an issue, but riding a road bike with 23c or smaller tires at 18mph (which can be problematic with halogens as well) is not safe with this light for me.