Advocacy & Safety - Hi-Viz vest rant

OK, I am a newb here, and it's ten minutes before I have to pedal away from home for work so I have not done extensive research of the forum archives to ascertain if this topic has been covered before, so please accept my begging of pardon in advance. Here's my rant:

Why the heck does a decent hi-viz vest have to cost $65. ?!!! I went into REI in Tacoma, WA, and there they were.... (The cheezy bibs were $22.)

Now, I ride a motorcycle too, and I have tons of m/c specific gear, including a hi-viz, GoreTex rain jacket that didn't cost as much. And it is built just fine, and of good materials.

I just don't get it. A flimsy piece of mesh, a few square inches of light-weight nylon ( a VEST mind you) and a $65. price tag...and the other local bike shops where I have seen cycle-specific clothing sold, the prices are almost as outrageous -- $40.

Let's call this what it is -- a rip-off! This is important safety gear, not some designer fashion accessory with those who have more money than sense.

Anyone with similar sentiments?

I'm still trying to figure out how a styrofoam hat can cost anywhere from 45 to 160 bucks... freakin' strofoam man... I can buy a cooler at Kmart for under 10 bucks... but make a "helmet" and the price goes through the roof.

And don't get me started on bottled water.

BTW that bright yellow nylon costs less than $10 a square yard at the local fabric shop... make a whole suit.

Dave-

go to an industrial safety supply house and get an ANSI class II or III safety vest. 20 bucks or so.

yes, what kind of vest costs 65 bucks? Does it help you pedal?

the bike shop I work at sells safety vests starting at 15 bucks.

yes, what kind of vest costs 65 bucks? Does it help you pedal?


Here you go. For that kind of money it should help you fly!


http://www.pearlizumi.com/phpThumb.php?src=/data/uploads/products/NDc5MV9TWV9vcHRpa192ZXN0LmpwZw==&w=290&h=290


OpTik Vest
$69.99 • Style no. 4791
Ultra-lightweight and highly packable, this wind and water-resistant vest is an essential piece when the weather is questionable. Updated to have stretch side panels where you need them for optimum performance and fit. • Optik fabric is extremely lightweight and windproof • Optik-WxB fabric used on side panels provides stretch, waterproof, breathable protection for all conditions • Snug elasticized waist • Highly packable, interior mesh stuff pocket for compact storage • Full-length zippered front • Reflective logos front and back • Form Fit

that's not a 'safety vest', thats part of a 'clothing system!!!' :D

ANSI Class II or III, OP.

Check out alertshirt.com for reasonably priced hi-viz clothing and jackets. I have a couple of their alert shirts and have no complaints with them.

$12 plus shipping:
http://www.alertshirt.com/clas2safves.html

Al

Personally I own several long sleeve international orange shirts I got from KMart... they were on clearance. And yeah, I have a yellow vest I got from Performance. And on cool days, I layer it all with a red shirt...

So with orange sleeves, yellow vest, and red torso... Do ya think I am visible? I still see that look of "oh my gawd" ( :eek: ) when folks suddenly actually SEE me... after they have been looking right through me (while scoping out that right on red turn they are creeping through.)

I guess I better get that flashing strobe fire hat to finish the look... :rolleyes:

I'm still trying to figure out how a styrofoam hat can cost anywhere from 45 to 160 bucks... freakin' strofoam man... I can buy a cooler at Kmart for under 10 bucks... but make a "helmet" and the price goes through the roof.

the cooler doesn't need to conform to ansi. the cooler is not designed to fit your noggin or be vented for cooling. the cooler maker doesn't have a tonne of potential liability issues, nor did the cooler maker spend a lot of r&d money or miniaturization.

comparing a helmet to a cooler is like comparing an airbag to an air mattress.

The Class III safety vests are more like shirts. They have to have sleeves to be class III. The Class III I got at a local safety store cost $35, had two normal pockets with velcro flaps, a "pocket" for 4 pens, and a special little pocket for a cell phone. And three times the reflective tape of any other vest I've seen.

Go to Nashbar:
NA-HSV Hi Vis on Sale $9.99

Ah, but you see, cycling has become a middle class leisure activity par extrodinaire. This means wealthy consumers who will pay almost anything for the "right stuff" :rolleyes:

Many of us cheapskates go to Harbor Freight:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=94701
You might get what you pay for, though.

Keep your eyes peeled for a freebie by the side of the road. That's were i got my first one.

Google to the rescue:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=mesh+safety+vest

Many of us cheapskates go to Harbor Freight:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=94701
You might get what you pay for, though.



Why don't they make a small size, too? I swim in mine... :(

the cooler doesn't need to conform to ansi. the cooler is not designed to fit your noggin or be vented for cooling. the cooler maker doesn't have a tonne of potential liability issues, nor did the cooler maker spend a lot of r&d money or miniaturization.

comparing a helmet to a cooler is like comparing an airbag to an air mattress.

OK tell me then why there is such a large difference in the price between helmets that all conform to the specs you mentioned? I can buy helmets from $29 to $229 (and probably higher); what are the $29 helmets missing? (hmmmm, surprisingly close to the cost of a styrofoam ice chest... )

I picked up a perfectly serviceable yellow mesh vest with orange reflective stripping at one of my local hardware stores awhile back for less than $10.

Why does cycling specific gear cost so much?

For the same reason any gear specific to a certain activity is over priced. Because somebody will pay it.

OK tell me then why there is such a large difference in the price between helmets that all conform to the specs you mentioned? I can buy helmets from $29 to $229 (and probably higher); what are the $29 helmets missing? (hmmmm, surprisingly close to the cost of a styrofoam ice chest... )
You can get a helmet for $15. So why complain? Many folks find it worth paying more for the diminishing returns of a higher priced helmet - let them pay, it helps keep the cost of the basic models down.

Al

OK tell me then why there is such a large difference in the price between helmets that all conform to the specs you mentioned? I can buy helmets from $29 to $229 (and probably higher); what are the $29 helmets missing? (hmmmm, surprisingly close to the cost of a styrofoam ice chest... )

Now bought 6 from Goodwill: Prices from$1.75 to $5.00

I rode with one guy a few weeks ago.
He bragged a $500 Seat and $500 pedals.$10,000 bike.
We hit a bump and his $12 water bottle came out of his $75 carbon fiber holder.

Ah, but you see, cycling has become a middle class leisure activity par extrodinaire. This means wealthy consumers who will pay almost anything for the "right stuff" :rolleyes:


Think that's about right. Go to a safety wear suppliers or industrial suppliers. My suppliers at work have EN471 class 2 waistcoats for the equivalent of about $6, class 3 jackets for about $12, and class 2 polo shirts for about $12, and I'm sure they're not the cheapest.

Now bought 6 from Goodwill: Prices from$1.75 to $5.00

mmm, second hand helmet i dunno, they're only supposed to be good for one impact (if that) and you don't know the history.

Apparently all helmets conform to the same safety standards. Prices vary because of styling and comfort (mainly comfort ie more ventilation).

mmm, second hand helmet i dunno, they're only supposed to be good for one impact (if that) and you don't know the history.

Apparently all helmets conform to the same safety standards. Prices vary because of styling and comfort (mainly comfort ie more ventilation).

Which is sort of along the lines of the bikini... the less material, the more it costs. :D

Keep an eye on the sales at Performance. Their vest should be a lot cheaper, and might even have a zip pocket on the back.

OK, I am a newb here, and it's ten minutes before I have to pedal away from home for work so I have not done extensive research of the forum archives to ascertain if this topic has been covered before, so please accept my begging of pardon in advance. Here's my rant:

Why the heck does a decent hi-viz vest have to cost $65. ?!!! I went into REI in Tacoma, WA, and there they were.... (The cheezy bibs were $22.)

Now, I ride a motorcycle too, and I have tons of m/c specific gear, including a hi-viz, GoreTex rain jacket that didn't cost as much. And it is built just fine, and of good materials.

I just don't get it. A flimsy piece of mesh, a few square inches of light-weight nylon ( a VEST mind you) and a $65. price tag...and the other local bike shops where I have seen cycle-specific clothing sold, the prices are almost as outrageous -- $40.

Let's call this what it is -- a rip-off! This is important safety gear, not some designer fashion accessory with those who have more money than sense.

Anyone with similar sentiments?
Nahbar and Performance offer vests at reasonable prices.
links. plus discount codes on BF

http://www.performancebike.com/shop/Profile.cfm?SKU=10689&item=00-2003&slitrk=search&slisearch=true

OP doesn't have a legitimate complaint, in my opinion. The vest he's looking at is not simply a "safety vest". It is a legitimate piece of clothing that happens to be a safety color. I don't ***** about the price of my optic yellow jersey or jacket because they cost the same as the same items in regular colors. It's not unusual to pay $60 for a nicely featured vest. I'm not saying it's worth it for that vest, just that it isn't a "safety vest" that is only for the purpose of safety.

A "safety vest" is a minimalist item that is only for safety and indeed should, and does, cost very little.

Mine is pretty nice from Harbor freight tools for $4.

I appreciate the cogent replies, and especially the helpful links to places like Nashbar. I found something for $9.99, which is perfectly acceptable in every way, including the price.

Happy Riding!:)

Dave

Happy Riding!:)


And to you! Good to hear you're sorted.

Dave, check out your LBS, Old Town Bicycles..also a new store in Olympia.

the tacoma store is located underneath the SPAR Tavern... you know the place??

they will treat you right in the future with bike accessories... REI, not so much

eBay has a lot of reflective safety vests:

http://business.search.ebay.com/safety-vest_Industrial-Supply-MRO_W0QQcatrefZC12QQfbfmtZ1QQfobfmtZ1QQfromZR10QQfrtsZ0QQfsooZ1QQfsopZ1QQftrtZ1QQftrvZ1QQsabfmtsZ2QQ sacatZ1266QQsaobfmtsZinsifQQsascsZ2QQsbrsrtZl

the cooler doesn't need to conform to ansi. the cooler is not designed to fit your noggin or be vented for cooling. the cooler maker doesn't have a tonne of potential liability issues, nor did the cooler maker spend a lot of r&d money or miniaturization.

comparing a helmet to a cooler is like comparing an airbag to an air mattress.

I guess those things account for about a couple of bucks of the price

from
http://www.helmets.org/guide.htm

Most bicycle helmets do this with expanded polystyrene (EPS), the white picnic cooler foam.

http://www.astrofoam.com/images/coolers3.jpg

Different applications using much of the same material.

and as for the costs of manufacturing a bike helmet

http://www.helmets.org/helmcost.htm

**For starters, you need a design. That's probably a substantial part of the cost, since it involves a design staff or consultants, other development costs including prototypes, lab testing, some market research, use of focus groups, tooling for the design etc. That's a fixed cost that is spread over the number of that design to be manufactured. Assuming you can sell 250,000 of a design, that might be 50 cents.

Materials would be a tiny fraction: some EPS bead, a small sheet of PET, tape or glue to attach the shell, some plastic fittings for the straps including the buckle. Then there is the strap material, nylon or polypro or whatever. The total of all that is maybe in the range of 40 cents. Add another 25 cents for internal pads or more for a ring fit system.

Then you have to estimate how much in miscellaneous business overhead costs to assign to that helmet. You have to buy legal insurance, run a headquarters office staff, Web site, all that other stuff. That adds probably another dollar.**

Everything is market driven. They sold Pet Rocks once too. If someone wants to spend $200 for something that cost $5 to produce, that's their business (I guess).

good grief!!!!!!!

is that a styrofoam safety vest for amphibious mountain bikers, or is closetbiker lightly ranting?

any good ideas on inexpensive safety vests, closetbiker??

Spend what you you feel comfortable spending. If someone wants to pay lots for little, who am I to argue?

minimalist dave, if you get an ANSI classed safety vest, you could also use it on your motorcycle. I'd suspect you see a fair amount of servicemen down Tacoma way motoring with high viz safety vests? (I know it's a requirement for Air Force personnel, not so sure about Army)

You could get one vest, use it for both vehicles, and let double duty cut the virtual price in half!

to inject a bit of envy, since I work on the ramp at the airport, I get those vests for free.

I used one once for a while, but after hearing many comments over several months when I was using it, I stopped.

Are you that concerned about your image? you don't have to answer that.... at least they saw you!!

closetbiker is beginning to sound like the stereotypical unban ninja bicyclist.

REGARDING SAFETY VESTS,

any addition to a bicyclists' visibility profile is a good addition. The savvy rider, the seasoned commuter, the long mile tourist, understand the importance of visibility equipment.

talking heads disparaging safety equipment on the internet, not so much......

Are you that concerned about your image? you don't have to answer that.... at least they saw you!!......

actually, that was the thing. My co-workers passing said they couldn't see the vest. The vest clings to the torso, so if you're not sitting upright, it wasn't visable (at least that's what they told me). I just stick to a red blinky in the back and a white one in the front. I got lots of comments on those. They saw them very well.

... yes, I do a lot of riding laying down, so i guess i see your point. Listening to your co--workers disparage visibility enhancements endorsed by scads of everyday commuters and long distance riders? maybe they were just jealous you were using your FREE VEST outside of work....

I believe the organized Paris-Brest-Paris ride REQUIRES a safety sash or vest, those misguided randonneurs......

:D


safety vests don't cost 65 bucks, high visibility weather shell vests do. difference.

... maybe they were just jealous you were using your FREE VEST outside of work....

I think they were just jealous of me because I looked so great riding my bike when they're so miserable driving in their cars

probably both!

If I remember right, the Harbor Freight vest has "ANSI Approved Reflective Tape" on it, but the overall vest is not ANSI approved (per a label on the box). I assume that where this comes into play is that on certain jobs, OSHA or other authorities require an ANSI approved safety vest, and that one doesn't cut it.

I suspect that on this type of a product, half the price is liability insurance for the manufacturer. Everyone that gets run over while wearing one is going to look for the one with the deep pockets, and that's the vest manufacturer.

Another alternative:
http://www.cameravan.com/allabout/flashsuit.html

I just bought this one from Ebay (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=120266993291&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=002). $9.50 counting shipping.