Electronics, Lighting, & Gadgets - Total Geekiness

For any of you out there who use 55W lights, do oncoming vehicles ever flash their brights at you?
Quemazon, I think any light can irritate oncoming drivers if it's pointed too high. If you use a 55W (same as car light intensity,) point it low. You're moving slower than cars anyway, so you should have more than enough light to see obstacles in the dark.

The only problem is that I'm using a lead-acid cell that's only 2.3 AH. I foolishly thought that dividing AH by amps would get me hours of runtime. Well, lead-acid cells taper their voltage off pretty badly as they discharge, so even with 1.6A draw and 2.3 AH, by 40 minutes the headlight is pretty orange.
That's a truth. You'd think a 4.5 AH SLA would give you twice the run time of a 2.3 AH. But when you put a heavy drain (20W) on a 2.3 AH battery, your run time was only 40 minutes, while the 4.5 AH will give you about 2 hours.

SLA's don't like a fast drain. By the same token, they don't like a fast charge. So a smaller battery will not tolerate the same charger that a larger battery can use quite safely.

In either case, whether draining a battery, or charging it, too fast, the battery's capacity begins to dwindle. Make sure you get a charger that doesn't charge the battery too quickly for it's capacity. Also be sure not to run your battery so low that the light goes yellow (at least, not too often.)

Fortunately, SLA's are cheap compared to NiCd's and others. If you ruin one, you can get another for the price of pizza (but don't do it--waste pizza money on a battery, that is!)

LittleBigMan

I bought 4 single-wire amber trailer BeeHives (3.99 each) for the turn signals. Might be able to get away with just 2. We'll see.

For your various lights, did you wire them in a series? If so, do they all funnel down to 2 connection (pos and neg) to the battery? Or does each light have it's own connection to the battery?

vrkelley, how are you making your turn signals blink? I bought a 2 contact turn signal relay last night at AutoZone, but when I run the power for the LED turn light through it, the light didn't blick. I don't know if I had it setup wrong or if the LED was not drawing enough power to cause the relay to activate. Anybody have any suggestions on how to make low amp LEDs blink?

BTW, I got the low-cost LEDs in the mail yesterday. They were removed from a highway infomation signs, and have both red and yellow/green LEDs which can be powered seperately (I was thinking running/turning/stop light options). 10 for $12.50 at BG Micro on-line; look for sign language (http://www.bgmicro.com/pdf/page12.pdf). They appear to be new or fairly new and should be bright enough for the job. I'll report back when I get them installed.

vrkelley, how are you making your turn signals blink? I bought a 2 contact turn signal relay last night at AutoZone, but when I run the power for the LED turn light through it, the light didn't blick. I don't know if I had it setup wrong or if the LED was not drawing enough power to cause the relay to activate. Anybody have any suggestions on how to make low amp LEDs blink?


MapTester,
Mine's not hooked up cuz, I couldn't figure out how to waterproof-seal the contact points. It's a basic flasher like the one pictured (except mine has battery, Pos, and Neg)

The bulbs are just the regular trailer bulbs (and no amp rating on the bulb!). I went low-tech, cuz shop owners didn't seem to know how to answer my basic questions and it was time to get going on this.

MapTester,
Mine's not hooked up cuz, I couldn't figure out how to waterproof-seal the contact points. It's a basic flasher like the one pictured (except mine has battery, Pos, and Neg).

I used 1½ “ PVC pipe to do essentially the same thing in order to give my headlights flashing capabilities. Reference post #173-179 on this thread.

OhioOH,

RE: Post #173 (page 7), You're a genius! I can probably stuff the flasher inside one hive. If not, your PVC idea will work a-OK!

LittleBigMan,
Next to Ohio's old post, you mentioned that you switched to Auto Zone LED hives because, regular bulbs drew too much power. No AutoZones around here. So what sort of mounting bracket did those come with?

VR, make sure the flasher works with LED lights. Regular flasher units won't because they require a certain load. There area flasher units that will work with LEDs.

Kudos for salvaging old but capable equipment. A slightly more modern variation is to use one of those multimeters that has serial ouput. I have one from radio shack that cost $50. Automating the whole charge, discharge routine would be cool, but a lot work. I used to trickle charge all of my cells, then discharge them one by one with a 1 ohm power resistor, and monitor the voltage on the computer. I would then overlay all of the current vs. time plots, and could easily pick off matching cells. Going through multiple cycles, though was a lot of work!

I finally broke down and purchased a Triton battery charger. I never thought I'd pay $120 for a charger, but it was worth every penny. I'm a rechargeable battery junkie with everything from nicad and NIMH to LION and SLA. It handles them all very well. Now I just pop a cell onto the triton and tell it to cycle 4 or 5 times and it tells me the capacity and average discharge voltage at a given current. I can then match it to other cells or toss it in the recycle bin.

Don't get me wrong, though, working out a custom battery carger/cycler would be really cool and if you have the time and patience to work it out, you would have complete control over the charging process. Good luck, and keep us posted.



OK ,

Now Battery Charging. I have been charging my Ni-cad cells for years using a Basic Trickle charger. A couple of years ago I moved up to a "RC Car" Quick Battery charger.
...
Long term I plan to take some of my Older Battery packs that have one or 2 dead chells take them apart and charge Battery cells indivually to Make Pcks of Matched cells.

Thoughts ?

Hi all!
been reading these posts I am pumbped about building my own system..
quick question for the field. i didn't find any comments on this in the threds, so here goes:

Has anyone tried to use a LED-cluster headlight instead of the single halogen spot that everyone seems to be using?

This company:

http://www.superbrightle ds.com/cgi-bin/store/commerce.cgi?product=MR16

..sells a MR16 size lights with a cluster of 24 LEDs that can output the same as a 20watt halogen but use a fraction of the power...

I'm thinking it might be possible to build a killer system with 2 of these babys one on spot, and 1 on flood and an array of NiMH batteries built into a bottle cage..

thoughts?

Hi all!

Has anyone tried to use a LED-cluster headlight instead of the single halogen spot that everyone seems to be using?


See post 381 on this thread. I did try the cluster as well:

(MR16-WHO White LED bulb
MR16 bulb with 6 High Output White LEDs
12 Volt AC or DC operation
60 Degree Beam Pattern, draws 200ma @ 12VDC )

But had problems with getting it to work through my flasher. I didn’t pursue it real hard after field tests showed the beam was too wide.

VR, make sure the flasher works with LED lights. Regular flasher units won't because they require a certain load. There area flasher units that will work with LEDs.

Rainman is right, you do need to be careful. There is a rating on the flasher. The one I have is 2 amps and works fine with my 1 watt LED headlight, unlike the 20 amp one I tried to use.

Eric, look back a couple of pages. I tried an MR16 replacement with 48 LEDs and was not impressed enough to continue using it. However, the LEDs did not seem to be particularly high intensity so the ones from SuperbrightLEDs might be much better. If anyone has or plans to try the ones from SuperbrightLEDs let me know. I will send this bulb for comparison. In fact if anyone wants it I will send it anyway - free to good home. The light is certainly more than the small Cateye headlights. It doesn't seem any brighter than the Cateye EL300 5-LED light, but it covers more area so I guess it does put out "more" light in total.

EricMorin, I use a LED cluster just as a backup and a "be seen" light.

Ohio, Did you use Ohm's law to figure out which flasher? like R = V/I (Resistance = Volts/Amps)?? I'm going to probably go with the Low Tech turns signals because Auto-Zone doesn't seem to see the LED Hives online.

Ohio, Did you use Ohm's law to figure out which flasher? like R = V/I (Resistance = Volts/Amps)?? I'm going to probably go with the Low Tech turns signals because Auto-Zone doesn't seem to see the LED Hives online.

No I'm not that smart. I just went to the auto store and bought the lowest amp one I could find that would fit into the PVC pipe.

You might check http://superbrightleds.com/led_prods.htm the LED Truck Lights section for a nice LED.

Eric, look back a couple of pages. I tried an MR16 replacement with 48 LEDs and was not impressed enough to continue using it. However, the LEDs did not seem to be particularly high intensity so the ones from SuperbrightLEDs might be much better. If anyone has or plans to try the ones from SuperbrightLEDs let me know. I will send this bulb for comparison. In fact if anyone wants it I will send it anyway - free to good home. The light is certainly more than the small Cateye headlights. It doesn't seem any brighter than the Cateye EL300 5-LED light, but it covers more area so I guess it does put out "more" light in total.

I'm gonna try it.. maybe combine the 10 deg. spot and the flood.. sure, if you want to send me the light for comparison.. private Msg me and we'll hook up.
-e

I'm gonna try it.. maybe combine the 10 deg. spot and the flood.. sure, if you want to send me the light for comparison.. private Msg me and we'll hook up.
-e

Just make sure you vote.

Eric,
That would be perfect. If you are going to set up two lights you can give us a report, perhaps a pic of the two beams on a wall side by side. PM or email me your address and I will send the lamp.
Regards,
Raymond

LittleBigMan

For your various lights, did you wire them in a series? If so, do they all funnel down to 2 connection (pos and neg) to the battery? Or does each light have it's own connection to the battery?
Each device has it's own connection to the battery. That way, if one device fails, the rest still operate.

VR,
I think you mean parallel. My setup for instance has one set of wires coming off the battery, P and N. Then there is a Y off the P and Y off the N with one each P and N going to the taillight and one each to the headlight. If you had two headlights you would have another set of Ys, even if you wanted them switched on and off together. Series would have one continuous loop from battery to light to light back to battery with no Ys. I'm pretty sure the former is the preferred method. That's pretty much how houses are wired.
Regards,
Raymond

Update on the turn signal flasher project. I got a small clearance-type light last night and hooked it up with the LED lights and the flasher unit (Triton EL12, variable load, two contacts, works in forward or reverse polarity). Combined they draw enough current to get the flasher to work. :D So this weekend I will try to get the whole system installed and working. The clearance light will be mounted near the switch to show that the signal lights are on--sure don't want to ride down the road with my blinkers going and me being unaware.

Update on the turn signal flasher project. I got a small clearance-type light last night and hooked it up with the LED lights and the flasher unit (Triton EL12, variable load, two contacts, works in forward or reverse polarity). Combined they draw enough current to get the flasher to work. :D So this weekend I will try to get the whole system installed and working. The clearance light will be mounted near the switch to show that the signal lights are on--sure don't want to ride down the road with my blinkers going and me being unaware.

Maptester,
Awesome! How did you know which flasher unit would work on the LEDs?

I was afraid someone was going ask! I thought I read about it here, but I can't seem to find the exact place. I know I did some searchs for motorcycle LED flasher and found some links/threads where they are having the same problems we have--that the replacement LEDs don't draw enough amps to make the flasher work. Some recommend using a resistor to draw enough power, but they get hot and that means wasted power (which I don't have). Then somewhere else someone used one regular light (LittleBigMan?) and the flasher worked. If I understand correctly, inside the flasher is a bimetal strip that heats up when current is applied. When it reaches a certain temp, it bends and breaks the circuit. Then it cools and bends back to complete the circuit. I saw some total electronic flashers that work with just LEDs, but they start at $20 and go up from there. The flasher I have cost $8.

A couple logic chips and a transistor should make an LED blink in any old pattern/speed you can dream up, without wasting too many electrons.

I have been pondering how to add turn signal lights, plus a good brake light to my bike. I think I have found a good source for cheap LED lights, but I have not figured out exactly how to mount the switches for both the turn lights and to actuate the brake light. I admit the brake light is not all that necessary, but I think the turn lights, especially when waiting at a intersection, would be most helpful. I would appreciate any comments on how to mount switches on handlebars.

Map Tester,
Sorry, I didn't answer this sooner. See post ~#223-226 for brake sensor info, pictures, and urls to buy. When I had my brake lights on my (stolen) bike. They worked great. No slip ups or lights stuck in the ON position problems.

The brake switch is automatic when you press the brake lever. But if you need room for other switches, maybe a narrow aluminum bar to suspend the switches below the handle bars would work.

A couple logic chips and a transistor should make an LED blink in any old pattern/speed you can dream up, without wasting too many electrons.

why go that complicated , 2 transistors , a resistor aand a capacitor is all you need

For those of you looking for turn signals, this might be the configuration you need. On a flat handlebar you could just rig them to mount in the handlebar ends so they would be visible from both front & rear. Of course they are big & probably heavy.
http://www.vehiclelight.com/3805.html

why go that complicated , 2 transistors , a resistor aand a capacitor is all you need

A microcontroller is actually even easier and more flexible. OK, a LITTLE more expensive, I'm paying $2 for Atmel Tiny12V processors. But they can do a HELL of a lot, really anything you can think of, and they can control 6 lights (or whatever) or more. For just blinking one LED it might be overkill, but as soon as you start doing anything more complicated, microcontrollers are the way to go.

True confesssions, I snuck out the kids' Radio Shack basic electronics kit (untouched from Christmas) MAWA HAW HAW HAW Yeah, I'm still thinking about the turn signals:

Stuff that failed:
*Yellow 12V beehives draw too much power (for my 18V drill battery) Housing is perfect tho!
* On a 6LED Vista light, unable bypass the rubber power button to an external switch. Radio Shack said it can't be done. (I'll bet a guru can figure that out!)
* On the Vista, unable to disable all of the other blinking modes to run JUST simple ON-blinking and OFF.

The simple LED flasher on a bread board, works great. If the only way to get an simple BIG turn signal is to run it off AA, I may sacrifice the Vistas battery housing.

how bright is bright enough?
i use a white LED headlight super spot made by planet bike that runs 30hrs on 4-AA bateries $35.00 it does double duty as a flashlight if I had 2 I swear I could see in a black hole! I recharge the Ni-mh bateries in my solar charger maybe once a month.
and all my commuting is at night.
but I will conceed that making your own system RULES!
now if we only could get cars to SEE our blinding lights.

how bright is bright enough?

Pitts,
Sounds like you're already set. If you're still wondering, it might be good to measure the width of the beam (beam pattern) and distance (throw). And then calculate the number of feet/second that you normally cycle. Then guess a comfort range. So if you need a 3 second reaction time. It'd be:

feet/second * 3 = the distance that light needs to shine for you to react.

Is it possible to use a Li-Ion laptop battery for driving a lighting system? I'm thinking about driving a 12v/20w mr16 with my laptop battery, which is a 14.4v 4.3Ah Li-Ion battery. Before I dig out the multimeter and some thin wires, was wondering if anyone has tried this with the smart batteries on modern laptops. How smart are these batteries in general? Does the onboard circuitry regulate voltage? Will it even supply power when the three 'comm' pins are not connected to the laptop? If it is possible (without serious risk of me becoming a 20 mph fireball... which i guess would provide some wide area illumination), it is certainly appealing, as it provides a very nice battery and i already have a smart charger for it! the battery is an 8-cell li-ion pack for a thinkpad.

Is it possible to use a Li-Ion laptop battery for driving a lighting system? I'm thinking about driving a 12v/20w mr16 with my laptop battery, which is a 14.4v 4.3Ah Li-Ion battery.


Well, let's do some math...12V, 20W, means the resistance should be about 12^2/20 = 7.2 Ohms. You will be driving it at 14.4 V though, so your current should be 14.4/7.2 = 2 Amps. The power should now be 14.4^2/7.2 = 28.8 Watts. Lithium Ions don't like high rates of discharge, but 2 Amps should be fine for a 4.3Ah pack. On a full charge your run time could be as high as 2 hours, BTW. Sound like a pretty good setup. Let us know how it works. Don't worry about frying your battery pack, BTW. Those packs have a lot of safeguards in them to prevent damage from a full on short.

Nathan

Well, let's do some math...12V, 20W, means the resistance should be about 12^2/20 = 7.2 Ohms. You will be driving it at 14.4 V though, so your current should be 14.4/7.2 = 2 Amps. The power should now be 14.4^2/7.2 = 28.8 Watts. Lithium Ions don't like high rates of discharge, but 2 Amps should be fine for a 4.3Ah pack. On a full charge your run time could be as high as 2 hours, BTW. Sound like a pretty good setup. Let us know how it works. Don't worry about frying your battery pack, BTW. Those packs have a lot of safeguards in them to prevent damage from a full on short.

Nathan

Yeah... I was wondering how far those safeguards went (i.e. safeguards to prevent power when not connected to correct computer model would suck). I do not think the rate should be a problem... I am just hoping the discharge safeguards are on the battery rather than the computer... i can burn DVDs on battery while doing photoshop actions, so i don't think a few amps should be a problem.

I'd also really like to find a U.S. supplier of the 20W osram sylvania ir (high efficiency) mr16s too. if i can get the battery & charger at effectively no cost, i'm willing to splurge on a nice bulb... interested to see if the high efficiency bulbs respond as well to overvoltage as the standard ones... if so, should be able to get nearly 50w/12v worth of mr16 light for around 25w.

shouldn't the current be lower when the bulb is operating at a higher efficiency (voltage)???

if this chart (http://www.myra-simon.com/bike/lights.html#overvolting) is correct, the power req'd should be about 25w... which would result in 1.74A. So 2 hrs seems well within reach. I am a little concerned with overvolting 20% without any voltage regulation though... although i've read conflicting opinions on whether the soft starting will actually lengthen bulb life significantly. i guess we'll find out!

Well, this may be tame, but...

I had an old NiteRider system kicking around. The battery was shot, but everything else was fine.

I picked it apart the other day - two Mr16s, a 10w and a 20w.

Hmmm...

So, I bought a 9500Mah battery pack from battery space.

And I'm about to hook up a 35w narrow spot, a 20w narrow spot, and I have a 12w HID. The HID is just about enough, but why not go overkill?

The last half of my night ride is dark - and I mean dark, as in *no* lights I don't provide.

So we'll see!

Well, this may be tame, but...

I had an old NiteRider system kicking around. The battery was shot, but everything else was fine.

I picked it apart the other day - two Mr16s, a 10w and a 20w.

Hmmm...

So, I bought a 9500Mah battery pack from battery space.

And I'm about to hook up a 35w narrow spot, a 20w narrow spot, and I have a 12w HID. The HID is just about enough, but why not go overkill?

The last half of my night ride is dark - and I mean dark, as in *no* lights I don't provide.

So we'll see!
Overkill is better than get'n killed! Sounds like you're on your way! Well how much is a replacement battery for the NiteRider?

anyone been able to source high efficiency 20w MR16s??? either the osram decostar IR (narrow flood) or the philips masterline es (spot)??? would rather use a source someone here has dealt with before if i have to order internationally.

bulbs.com

thanks! i guess that's what happens when i get too specific with a search (philips masterline es 20w mr16). now if i osram sylvania would just start shipping the narrow flood (24 degree) to the U.S. i'd know for sure which light i like better... may save $ by ordering both from the u.k. talked to william (lvr maker) about regulation... he said not to bother with a regulator on a 14.4v system with 12v mr16s... said if i was using a 19.2v pack (which he recommends for what i'm doing) he'd say use a voltage regulator. alot of help that guy. thanks again.

OK, I did my first hook up.

Old RideRider system, new battery.

I soldered everything, and used heat shrink tubing on top of that.

At the end of the day, I had the HID light, plus 20w on high and 12w on low,

~32w, on top of the HID.

AWESOME!

Sloth, Very cool!
Ditto, I"m hooked up on the 18V 30W and rode in yesterday with it. That extra weight of the rack, battery bag, and battery is noticable. But doable.

The LED on the breadboard was no where near bright enough for a turn signal...The beehive spreads out the light...not sure how far back they can be seen. More LED's Watson! More LEDs!

vrkelley, these are the LEDs I am using now for "running lights" and will be turn signals after I get the wiring done this weekend (I hope!).

The first image shows the LED module and my LED beehive.
http://monarch.gsu.edu/jeff/bike/turn_led/images/DSCF000201.jpg

The white pipe is 1" id plastic.
http://monarch.gsu.edu/jeff/bike/turn_led/images/DSCF000504.jpg

This is the LED sign module I bought from BG Micro (http://www.bgmicro.com/pdf/page12.pdf). They had a plastic hood I cut off.

http://monarch.gsu.edu/jeff/bike/turn_led/images/DSCF0005.jpg

I just discovered they get warm--I don't think that will be a problem if I just use them as turn signals. I have trying to figure out a way to use them as running/tail lights and as turn signals, just don't know if I can do it without re-wiring the entire bike! The wiring has gotten so complicated I had to draw a wiring diagram to keep things straight. Anyway, hope this helps. BTW, these LED modules are rated 12 - 15 volts and draw 90mAh.

i just came across this thing..
instead of using a landscaping light housing,
$33 for a real head for a bike light that mounts to your helmet..
http://www.trailheadlights.com/details.html

Ya, I saw that too, and it looks pretty nice. Try to purchase one, though, and you'll find out the rest of the story...he's not making them any more.



i just came across this thing..
instead of using a landscaping light housing,
$33 for a real head for a bike light that mounts to your helmet..
http://www.trailheadlights.com/details.html

vrkelley, these are the LEDs I am using now for "running lights" and will be turn signals after I get the wiring done this weekend (I hope!).

BTW, these LED modules are rated 12 - 15 volts and draw 90mAh.

Wow awesome lights. 90mAh is getting up there in power but probably worth it!
I got side tracked on a couple of other projects for a few more days.

Well, I *finally* got the wiring on the turn signals straighten out. I couldn't make the flasher work using one common indicator light, so I just added a two small clearance lights to both sides the front bar/turn lights and it works just fine. I am using the lights now and will report back on how effective they are in traffic (still a question about that). Also, I hooked up one LED module with both colors (red and yellow/green) to a wall wart and just let it run. The yellow/green got too hot and shutdown but the red keep burning. After I let the module cool off, the yellow/green LEDs came back on. So I think these modules will work for turn flashers or running flashers, but not as full-time running lights.

The whole mounting light structure is looking almost a bit too geek--I'll be thinking of ways to streamline the headlight/signal thing, if the turn flashers seem to make a difference.
http://monarch.gsu.edu/jeff/bike/working_flashers/images/Working_flashers_03.jpg

I put some pictures and windows avi files here. (http://monarch.gsu.edu/jeff/bike/working_flashers/index.htm)

vrkelley, my commute photos just started when it gets light enough to take pictures--we (my wife, son and I) usually leave the house about 7 am (in the dark). I have added the same headlight to my wife's bike, along with a rear strobe and car horn :D. My son has two Cateye TL-LD500 rear led blinkies and one Cateye HL-EL200 3-led headlight flasher. He rides between my wife and me. Sometimes I think all the blinking lights and strobes cause some people to go into a trance--I've seen people just sit (fortunately not moving!) and stare at the lights. :eek:

Well, I *finally* got the wiring on the turn signals straighten out.
The whole mounting light structure is looking almost a bit too geek

Sometimes I think all the blinking lights and strobes cause some people to go into a trance--I've seen people just sit (fortunately not moving!) and stare at the lights. :eek:

Awesome setup! Yeah maybe a housing for the lights might finish it off - like a motorcycle. The PVC pipe could get painted black some other color *since visibility probably isn't an issue* :D

For anyone who's interested here's Chris' Home lights and LED comparisons.
Chris started out with Geek-bike light, then decided to market LEDs that can do the same thing. He's been developing for 1 yr and here's his light comparisons.

http://www.solidlights.co.uk/features/bright.php

btw I may post this on the LED comparison thread also

interesting... what kind of halogen does he compare it to? an MR16 will appear brighter than an MR11, and better brands will appear brighter still, and higher efficiency brands higher still... there is no debating the bulb life, obviously. at over $300 USD for the 10W version (that is claimed to provide 30W worth of halogen light), it is still tough to compete on a cost basis with a 20W high efficiency MR16 halogen overvolted... should be able to get around 50W of "halogen light", a few hundred hours of bulb life, and at minimal cost (<$50 plus < $10 per bulb). At $450 USD for the 10W system, the comparison should be to professionally manufactured 10W HID systems. now, if he wants to post plans on how to DIY (no CMC or optics lab required) the 30W equivalent LED system for <$100, i'll be interested :)